STD (Provia) vs Velvia

I decided to set my new X100S up for Film Simulation Bracketing. I set it for STD (Provia), Velvia, and B&W. Then I took some shots at the fairly new Wahlburgers at MGM Grand in Springfield, Massachusetts today.

WB and DR were set to Auto. ISO set to Auto 200, 800,100/s and everything else at zero. Aperture priority at ISO 200, f5.6, 0 EV, ¼ sec.

Looking on my monitor and even before I downloaded these, on the LCD I don't see any significant difference between the two color shots except going back and forth, the overall Provia image is a hair darker overall than the Velvia image, but the colors, especially the green chairs, look identical. If I didn't know the order in the Film Simulation Bracketing, which I double checked after seeing the results, I would not know the difference between the two. Am I missing something here?

bs1946 wrote:

I decided to set my new X100S up for Film Simulation Bracketing. I set it for STD (Provia), Velvia, and B&W. Then I took some shots at the fairly new Wahlburgers at MGM Grand in Springfield, Massachusetts today.

WB and DR were set to Auto. ISO set to Auto 200, 800,100/s and everything else at zero. Aperture priority at ISO 200, f5.6, 0 EV, ¼ sec.

Looking on my monitor and even before I downloaded these, on the LCD I don't see any significant difference between the two color shots except going back and forth, the overall Provia image is a hair darker overall than the Velvia image, but the colors, especially the green chairs, look identical. If I didn't know the order in the Film Simulation Bracketing, which I double checked after seeing the results, I would not know the difference between the two. Am I missing something here?

I’m looking on my phone and the color looks significantly more saturated in the second color shot to me.

I'm seeing two very different shades of green (MacBook Pro, basic Color LCD display profile). The Provia green is a bit more bluish, and less saturated to my eyes. The Velvia green (again, to my eyes), is more yellowish, and punchier.

In general, I've noticed the biggest 'Provia-vs-Velvia' differences in the purples and pinks, with Velvia sometimes shifting everything, or at least neutral colors, a bit magenta. Greens get punched up a good bit as well.

Here is a SUPER interesting read – more of a novel – about how each Film Sim shifts colors from their 'natural' look. Really opened my eyes to how much goes into each simulation.

Erik Baumgartner wrote:

bs1946 wrote:

I decided to set my new X100S up for Film Simulation Bracketing. I set it for STD (Provia), Velvia, and B&W. Then I took some shots at the fairly new Wahlburgers at MGM Grand in Springfield, Massachusetts today.

WB and DR were set to Auto. ISO set to Auto 200, 800,100/s and everything else at zero. Aperture priority at ISO 200, f5.6, 0 EV, ¼ sec.

Looking on my monitor and even before I downloaded these, on the LCD I don't see any significant difference between the two color shots except going back and forth, the overall Provia image is a hair darker overall than the Velvia image, but the colors, especially the green chairs, look identical. If I didn't know the order in the Film Simulation Bracketing, which I double checked after seeing the results, I would not know the difference between the two. Am I missing something here?

I’m looking on my phone and the color looks significantly more saturated in the second color shot to me.

Same here.  Second shot is much more green

I actually took 3 slightly different photos, all bracketed the same and on my monitor they all look the same. I'm using a 2020 MackBook Pro with a 49 Inch Sony Monitor and downloaded the jpegs from the SD card onto the MacBook and opened in Apple Photos with zero post processing. The colors look the same on the MacBook's screen and the Sony monitor. The only difference I can see is if I swap back and forth between the two color images, the over all provia darkens by a hair and that's it. I also looked at both images in Affinity Photo and Color Efex Pro and they are the same. Maybe something is wanky with the film simulation bracketing on my X100S. I'll have to play around some more.

bs1946 wrote:

I actually took 3 slightly different photos, all bracketed the same and on my monitor they all look the same. I'm using a 2020 MackBook Pro with a 49 Inch Sony Monitor and downloaded the jpegs into Apple Photos with zero post processing. The colors look the same on the MacBook's screen and the Sony monitor. The only difference I can see is if I swap back and forth between the two color images, the over all provia darkens by a hair and that's it. I also looked at both images in Affinity Photo and Color Efex Pro and they are the same. Maybe something is wanky with the film simulation bracketing on my X100S. I'll have to play around some more.

If there was something wrong with your bracketing/camera, the pics wouldn’t look distinctly different to everyone viewing them here.

I suggest you do another test under daylight of a scene with a wider range of colors and see if there is a more pronounced difference.

Since Velvia is mentioned, it is often just too vivid. In that case, I take the JPEG into PS and add a layer.  I then turn the new layer to monochrome, then adjust its opacity so it just takes the edge off the oversaturated image.

bs1946 wrote:

I actually took 3 slightly different photos, all bracketed the same and on my monitor they all look the same. I'm using a 2020 MackBook Pro with a 49 Inch Sony Monitor and downloaded the jpegs from the SD card onto the MacBook and opened in Apple Photos with zero post processing. The colors look the same on the MacBook's screen and the Sony monitor. The only difference I can see is if I swap back and forth between the two color images, the over all provia darkens by a hair and that's it. I also looked at both images in Affinity Photo and Color Efex Pro and they are the same. Maybe something is wanky with the film simulation bracketing on my X100S. I'll have to play around some more.

The contrast and saturation difference is immediately apparent even at small size on my monitor.

bs1946 wrote:

I actually took 3 slightly different photos, all bracketed the same and on my monitor they all look the same. I'm using a 2020 MackBook Pro with a 49 Inch Sony Monitor and downloaded the jpegs from the SD card onto the MacBook and opened in Apple Photos with zero post processing. The colors look the same on the MacBook's screen and the Sony monitor. The only difference I can see is if I swap back and forth between the two color images, the over all provia darkens by a hair and that's it. I also looked at both images in Affinity Photo and Color Efex Pro and they are the same. Maybe something is wanky with the film simulation bracketing on my X100S. I'll have to play around some more.

My iPad Pro looks like on the phone.  Second is definitely different BUT on my 2015 MacBook Pro I’m in fact seeing the same image colors from both. Weird.i haven’t downloaded the original only through the safari browser.

rla1022 wrote:

bs1946 wrote:

I actually took 3 slightly different photos, all bracketed the same and on my monitor they all look the same. I'm using a 2020 MackBook Pro with a 49 Inch Sony Monitor and downloaded the jpegs from the SD card onto the MacBook and opened in Apple Photos with zero post processing. The colors look the same on the MacBook's screen and the Sony monitor. The only difference I can see is if I swap back and forth between the two color images, the over all provia darkens by a hair and that's it. I also looked at both images in Affinity Photo and Color Efex Pro and they are the same. Maybe something is wanky with the film simulation bracketing on my X100S. I'll have to play around some more.

My iPad Pro looks like on the phone. Second is definitely different BUT on my 2015 MacBook Pro I’m in fact seeing the same image colors from both. Weird.i haven’t downloaded the original only through the safari browser.

This is definitely interesting. My Panasonic GX8 and GX9 both have what Panasonic calls Photo Styles, which are similar to Film Simulations plus art filters and those work fine using my MacBook Pro to display them. This sounds like it's something unique between Fuji's film simulations and the MacBook Pro. When I had my previous X100F, X100Ts, and even the original X100, I was using a Mac mini and before that a 27" iMac. I only discovered this because the X100S doesn't have Classic Chrome, which just about all I ever used with my other Fuji cameras and I wanted to see all five X100S color film simulations to pick a something else to use with the X100S.

I'm going to take some photos switching between Provia, Velvia, and Astia and use my HMDI cable to look at them on my Sony Monitor before anything gets downloaded anywhere.

First of all, when viewing the images on my iPad Pro I definitely see a difference in the color images. The second image is clearly more saturated.

It is quite difficult to know what could cause the effect that you see the images not different, but let me ask a few question.

First of all, at least that’s what I know from my X-T3 (and I don’t think that your camera acts differently in here), the bracketing function uses the selected film simulations as set up and stored in your camera.

So a very simple test could be to shoot a scene with the bracketing function, selecting in there for example Provia, Velvia and maybe CC, and then shoot the same scene as normal, means selecting manually one by one the same film simulations with unchanged (!) settings in the film simulations. If the both images shot with the same film simulation, means the bracketed image and the normal shot image, look identical then you at least know that you bracketing function works as it is supposed to do.

Another interesting information could be how you have set up and stored each film simulation, means which settings do you use for them?

Herbert

When RLA1022 said he couldn't see a difference between the Provia and Velvia images when looking at them on his 2015 MacBook Pro and I'm using a 2020 MacBook Pro, but he could see the difference on his iPhone or iPad, I thought we were onto something.  But yesterday, I took a bunch of photos at a local farm, using the same Film Simulation Bracketing (STD, Velvia, B&W) and I can clearly see a difference between them. The one difference is the farm photos were outdoors and the restaurant photos were indoors. These are the farm photos, Provia and then Velvia in each pair.

So we have pairs of photos, one using STD (Provia) film simulation and one using Velvia film simulation, shot with the same Fujifilm X100S using film simulation bracketing and being displayed on a 2020 13" MacBook Pro. I can see a difference in all the outdoors shots but the two indoor shots, under artificial lighting look the same.

Being used to the more radical Ricoh film simulations and owning a Fuji X100V just for a few weeks, I have to admit that I had a problem seeing the difference between standard and Velvia, too. I simply expected the difference to be greater. Watching the pics here on the thread (M1 Mac Mini and a 34" ultra-wide screen, but just in a smaller browser window), I immediately identified the second picture as Velvia.

But the difference is subtle, it's not like you change from a standard color science to Disney world or so.

bs1946 wrote:

When RLA1022 said he couldn't see a difference between the Provia and Velvia images when looking at them on his 2015 MacBook Pro and I'm using a 2020 MacBook Pro, but he could see the difference on his iPhone or iPad, I thought we were onto something. But yesterday, I took a bunch of photos at a local farm, using the same Film Simulation Bracketing (STD, Velvia, B&W) and I can clearly see a difference between them. The one difference is the farm photos were outdoors and the restaurant photos were indoors. These are the farm photos, Provia and then Velvia in each pair.

So we have pairs of photos, one using STD (Provia) film simulation and one using Velvia film simulation, shot with the same Fujifilm X100S using film simulation bracketing and being displayed on a 2020 13" MacBook Pro. I can see a difference in all the outdoors shots but the two indoor shots, under artificial lighting look the same.

So caveats.  I’m 100% on my iPad Pro for 95% of everything i do and 0% usage of 2015 MacBook Pro for anything photo related.  With that out of the way I do not see anything different between each color shot on Safari on my 2015 MBP.  iPad Pro i do.  You’ve piqued my curiosity now as to why I’m not seeing a difference.

bs1946 wrote:

When RLA1022 said he couldn't see a difference between the Provia and Velvia images when looking at them on his 2015 MacBook Pro and I'm using a 2020 MacBook Pro, but he could see the difference on his iPhone or iPad, I thought we were onto something. But yesterday, I took a bunch of photos at a local farm, using the same Film Simulation Bracketing (STD, Velvia, B&W) and I can clearly see a difference between them. The one difference is the farm photos were outdoors and the restaurant photos were indoors. These are the farm photos, Provia and then Velvia in each pair.

So we have pairs of photos, one using STD (Provia) film simulation and one using Velvia film simulation, shot with the same Fujifilm X100S using film simulation bracketing and being displayed on a 2020 13" MacBook Pro. I can see a difference in all the outdoors shots but the two indoor shots, under artificial lighting look the same.

As a side not. I love the second barn shot and like the series as a whole

rla1022 wrote:

bs1946 wrote:

When RLA1022 said he couldn't see a difference between the Provia and Velvia images when looking at them on his 2015 MacBook Pro and I'm using a 2020 MacBook Pro, but he could see the difference on his iPhone or iPad, I thought we were onto something. But yesterday, I took a bunch of photos at a local farm, using the same Film Simulation Bracketing (STD, Velvia, B&W) and I can clearly see a difference between them. The one difference is the farm photos were outdoors and the restaurant photos were indoors. These are the farm photos, Provia and then Velvia in each pair.

So we have pairs of photos, one using STD (Provia) film simulation and one using Velvia film simulation, shot with the same Fujifilm X100S using film simulation bracketing and being displayed on a 2020 13" MacBook Pro. I can see a difference in all the outdoors shots but the two indoor shots, under artificial lighting look the same.

So caveats. I’m 100% on my iPad Pro for 95% of everything i do and 0% usage of 2015 MacBook Pro for anything photo related. With that out of the way I do not see anything different between each color shot on Safari on my 2015 MBP. iPad Pro i do. You’ve piqued my curiosity now as to why I’m not seeing a difference.

Is your MBP a retina display or the older style?  The older display had pretty limited/inaccurate color rendering and may already be fully saturated with the Provia.

CrashTestHuman wrote:

rla1022 wrote:

bs1946 wrote:

When RLA1022 said he couldn't see a difference between the Provia and Velvia images when looking at them on his 2015 MacBook Pro and I'm using a 2020 MacBook Pro, but he could see the difference on his iPhone or iPad, I thought we were onto something. But yesterday, I took a bunch of photos at a local farm, using the same Film Simulation Bracketing (STD, Velvia, B&W) and I can clearly see a difference between them. The one difference is the farm photos were outdoors and the restaurant photos were indoors. These are the farm photos, Provia and then Velvia in each pair.

So we have pairs of photos, one using STD (Provia) film simulation and one using Velvia film simulation, shot with the same Fujifilm X100S using film simulation bracketing and being displayed on a 2020 13" MacBook Pro. I can see a difference in all the outdoors shots but the two indoor shots, under artificial lighting look the same.

So caveats. I’m 100% on my iPad Pro for 95% of everything i do and 0% usage of 2015 MacBook Pro for anything photo related. With that out of the way I do not see anything different between each color shot on Safari on my 2015 MBP. iPad Pro i do. You’ve piqued my curiosity now as to why I’m not seeing a difference.

Is your MBP a retina display or the older style? The older display had pretty limited/inaccurate color rendering and may already be fully saturated with the Provia.

2015 pro retina. Here’s what it looks like on my MBP.

rla1022 wrote:

2015 pro retina. Here’s what it looks like on my MBP.

They look noticeably different here too.