Just pulled the trigger on M6II + 32 f1.4

Started 4 months ago | Discussions
Mongrel
Mongrel Senior Member • Posts: 1,527
Thanks Guys!

This ^^^^

Is ALL good stuff, thanks guys.

Admittedly my flash skills are pretty rusty and letting the camera dictate ISO in order to maintain shutter speed may be contributing to what I am seeing. These are not 200 ISO shots with 1/60th sync speeds.

The auto ISO has been putting these shots between 800 ISO and 3200 ISO (before I set the limit at 1600 anyway).

Even at 1000-1250 ISO the noise in the faces especially is bad. Need to look into that setting tying face tracking and exposure.

After hearing about how good the “high ISO” performance with the new sensors was I thought “certainly by now 1600 should be fine?” Apparently, not without some effort! Lol

I am in a re-learning phase helping out some friends so I need to do some more homework.

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Mongrel
Mongrel Senior Member • Posts: 1,527
Thanks MAC!

Yea, I am shooting in a church sanctuary into a baptismal pool “window”.

The ceiling is +20 ft high with stage lighting, the baptism area is like a puppet show-lit by fluorescent lighting overhead, with a deep red ‘shimmery’ curtain background. Not the prettiest sight for sure.

So far I have used a Lumiquest Pocket Bouncer, a Stofen Omni-Bounce, on board flash, and no flash.

Best shots so far were with the Stofen Omni bounce in a direct position.

White balance is a story for another day.

Appreciate all the help and I am enjoying reading about your experience with the M6-2.

After seeing you mention the RP again, I’m thinking that may be the best solution of all.

RP with a 50mm, the 580 EX and Stofen…

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23speaker23 Regular Member • Posts: 457
Re: The 32 F1.4 is sharp and accurate wide open @ F1.4

MAC wrote:

23speaker23 wrote:

MAC wrote:

I plan to extensively use this lens at f1.4

I have ruined quite a few shots shooting wide open with this lens (e.g. one eye out of focus). I am learning to stop down. This is no easy exercise as the IQ at 1.4 is perfect for me. The same goes for sigma 56.

I like some of your shots btw

Thanks!

A DOF calculator APP can help get your bearings

Yes I remember the dof number roughly... It's not my first camera nor my first 1.4 lens.

I have this 'problem' when using face detect af with the person not looking straght at me. I figure it depends on where the camera actually puts focus when it detects a face.

I do not have this problme when using the focus box. I guess eye detect af shall eliminate this problem as well...

Or may be it's just my skills (or lack of them )

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thunder storm Senior Member • Posts: 7,686
Re: Just pulled the trigger on M6II + 32 f1.4

MAC wrote:

thunder storm wrote:

Mongrel wrote:

EDWARD ARTISTE wrote:

M50 - image quality was all over the place, ridiculous noise at low iso…..

I wouldn't call it ridiculous, but it can be a bit on the noisy side....

Interesting observation. I have been shooting a refurb M50 for a couple months now. Outdoors in good light it rivals some of the best images I’ve ever taken (or seen).

In good light it's great, but that's true for a lot of cameras.

I have used it for three indoor events with my 580EX speed light and good lenses and the pics look like mush. Like no matter what I do they look about on par my with my twenty year old 20D…

I think my SL1 sensor may actually be better for event usage.

The trick is you shouldn't set the ISO any higher than 200. With a big bouncing speed light and a large aperture lens ( I prefer the sigma 18-35mm f/1.8) for the AF you can still make good pictures.

If it's not possible to do bouncing you're hitting the limits of the system.

radio triggers and off camera Speedlight's if you can't bounce as I've shown in the beagle example in this thread

Not flexible enough for my shooting, but it's an option.

The M50 is a good camera with nice colors, but it's not made for high ISO values.

keeping my m6II at near base iso is an objective I've set also. above iso 1600 I'll be using my RP

I don't like to go beyond 400.  With a 15-15mm it probably doesn't matter al that much, but with the good glass the difference is noticeable.

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I love 50mm (equivalence)

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OP MAC Forum Pro • Posts: 16,433
Re: The 32 F1.4 is sharp and accurate wide open @ F1.4

23speaker23 wrote:

MAC wrote:

23speaker23 wrote:

MAC wrote:

I plan to extensively use this lens at f1.4

I have ruined quite a few shots shooting wide open with this lens (e.g. one eye out of focus). I am learning to stop down. This is no easy exercise as the IQ at 1.4 is perfect for me. The same goes for sigma 56.

I like some of your shots btw

Thanks!

A DOF calculator APP can help get your bearings

Yes I remember the dof number roughly... It's not my first camera nor my first 1.4 lens.

I have this 'problem' when using face detect af with the person not looking straght at me. I figure it depends on where the camera actually puts focus when it detects a face.

I do not have this problme when using the focus box. I guess eye detect af shall eliminate this problem as well...

Or may be it's just my skills (or lack of them )

Your skills are good

you bring up a good point about face detect - if I’m not able to get eye focus engaged I will switch to spot af

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m100 Contributing Member • Posts: 910
ISO 12800
2

SOOC JPEG

with about 1 min of clicking DXO auto settings

UFO shots.

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OP MAC Forum Pro • Posts: 16,433
Re: Just pulled the trigger on M6II + 32 f1.4

thunder storm wrote:

MAC wrote:

thunder storm wrote:

Mongrel wrote:

EDWARD ARTISTE wrote:

M50 - image quality was all over the place, ridiculous noise at low iso…..

I wouldn't call it ridiculous, but it can be a bit on the noisy side....

Interesting observation. I have been shooting a refurb M50 for a couple months now. Outdoors in good light it rivals some of the best images I’ve ever taken (or seen).

In good light it's great, but that's true for a lot of cameras.

I have used it for three indoor events with my 580EX speed light and good lenses and the pics look like mush. Like no matter what I do they look about on par my with my twenty year old 20D…

I think my SL1 sensor may actually be better for event usage.

The trick is you shouldn't set the ISO any higher than 200. With a big bouncing speed light and a large aperture lens ( I prefer the sigma 18-35mm f/1.8) for the AF you can still make good pictures.

If it's not possible to do bouncing you're hitting the limits of the system.

radio triggers and off camera Speedlight's if you can't bounce as I've shown in the beagle example in this thread

Not flexible enough for my shooting, but it's an option.

with off camera lights you can control and avoid those awful flash shadows when no wall to bounce.

The M50 is a good camera with nice colors, but it's not made for high ISO values.

keeping my m6II at near base iso is an objective I've set also. above iso 1600 I'll be using my RP

I don't like to go beyond 400. With a 15-15mm it probably doesn't matter al that much, but with the good glass the difference is noticeable.

Depends on if you are going for closeups and eye sharpness

zoomed out, iso 1600 with software corrections is fine

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OP MAC Forum Pro • Posts: 16,433
Re: Thanks MAC!
3

Mongrel wrote:

Yea, I am shooting in a church sanctuary into a baptismal pool “window”.

The ceiling is +20 ft high with stage lighting, the baptism area is like a puppet show-lit by fluorescent lighting overhead, with a deep red ‘shimmery’ curtain background. Not the prettiest sight for sure.

So far I have used a Lumiquest Pocket Bouncer, a Stofen Omni-Bounce, on board flash, and no flash.

Best shots so far were with the Stofen Omni bounce in a direct position.

most modifiers are a waste and impact recycle time - direct Ettl flash can be better if the backdrop absorbs the harsh shadows.  That said I use the mag mod globe on my off camera flash in the Rembrandt position

White balance is a story for another day.

Appreciate all the help and I am enjoying reading about your experience with the M6-2.

After seeing you mention the RP again, I’m thinking that may be the best solution of all.

RP with a 50mm, the 580 EX and Stofen…

well it depends

if you are taking zoomed out shots where eye sharpness is not the thing needed, then RP + RF 50 stm.  But if you need closeup eye sharpness, then you need to stop down the RF 50 stm to F2.5/2.8 to get the eyes sharp.  Whereas the eyes are sharp on the m32 at F1.4.  That is a two stop differential and all of a sudden you’ve lost the high iso advantage of the RP.

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Mongrel
Mongrel Senior Member • Posts: 1,527
Re: ISO 12800
1

m100 wrote:

SOOC JPEG

with about 1 min of clicking DXO auto settings

UFO shots.

Hard to really appreciate those on a cell phone, but I will take your word for it!

Do you have any shots of the Aliens under stage lighting taken with a flash? Don’t want to have to buy yet another software program without assurances!

lol

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m100 Contributing Member • Posts: 910
Re: ISO 12800

Mongrel wrote:

m100 wrote:

SOOC JPEG

with about 1 min of clicking DXO auto settings

UFO shots.

Hard to really appreciate those on a cell phone, but I will take your word for it!

Do you have any shots of the Aliens under stage lighting taken with a flash? Don’t want to have to buy yet another software program without assurances!

lol

Unexpected Flare Occurrence for real.

The last picture is from a M6II raw file straight into DXO and PP for about 1 min. using auto settings.

Get the trial version and wait for a really good coupon.

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Mongrel
Mongrel Senior Member • Posts: 1,527
Re: ISO 12800
2

Just got home....

I would have posted sooner but I had to pick my jaw up off the floor...

Noise is one thing-but the recovery of detail in the tree leaves near the streetlamp?

Wowzer!

Thanks for the tip.

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ex human Regular Member • Posts: 139
Re: Thanks Guys!
2

Low light/high ISO is where FF kills it.

I was a bit surprised here as well.

If you can nail focus, files from my 6D are perfectly useable at 3200 and beyond.

In my experience the crop sensors (even the newest tech) aren’t even close in this department.

Mongrel wrote:

This ^^^^

Is ALL good stuff, thanks guys.

Admittedly my flash skills are pretty rusty and letting the camera dictate ISO in order to maintain shutter speed may be contributing to what I am seeing. These are not 200 ISO shots with 1/60th sync speeds.

The auto ISO has been putting these shots between 800 ISO and 3200 ISO (before I set the limit at 1600 anyway).

Even at 1000-1250 ISO the noise in the faces especially is bad. Need to look into that setting tying face tracking and exposure.

After hearing about how good the “high ISO” performance with the new sensors was I thought “certainly by now 1600 should be fine?” Apparently, not without some effort! Lol

I am in a re-learning phase helping out some friends so I need to do some more homework.

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OP MAC Forum Pro • Posts: 16,433
Golden!
2

MAC wrote:

ex human wrote:

MAC wrote:

...took me almost 2 years, but finally decided to take the plunge...

I'll wait til black Friday to get the 11-22 - but I have two portrait shoots coming up and wanted the 32

My main cameras are RP + RF 24-105 F4 IS L with nano focus and control ring for EC which I love for the colors, relatively small size, SOOC jpgs. Also the RF 85 F2 IS for portraits. I also carry the 6d with EF 35 f2 IS and EF 100L. These and the 70-200 f2.8 L serve on commissioned shoots.

But I have been totally upset with Canon FOR YEARS in not giving a sub $500 50 mm that was sharp wide open without the CA.

Thus enter the m 32 F1.4 on the 32 mpxl m6 II -- it will be my 50 mm go to (hopefully).

Also Canon RF 14-35 is being introduced at such a high price, I will get the m 11-22 instead. The new R6 is only 20 mpxl and also too expensive for me. I'll rely on the 32 mpxl M6II and 11-22

I resisted the m6II because no internal EVF (since I use triggers all the time), but with the 32 and 11-22 I'll be using the back screen and not buying that lame EVF thingy. I use Odin triggers extensively during portrait shoots.

The 35 F2 IS will sit on the 6d. The 32 f1.4 will sit on the M6II. And the RF 85 F2 will sit on the RP during portrait shoots. For me I don't like changing lenses

so we shall see how I do on this specific use m setup. If I'm happy with it, I may also eventually get a 56 and a long tele... Canon IGNORING the m line is very upsetting to me and about their fear that m will impact their R system

Enjoy.

This combo is the finest thing I’ve experienced in photography in quite some time. So much to love: small; light; fast; sharp; great colours; accurate AF; relatively cheap; beautiful, detailed files; smooth bokeh; I could go on.

thanks!

that is my hope!

Even at F2.8, with the 9 inch MFD, it is thin DOF (0.3 inches) because I could get so close, sweep out the background, and so very sharp!

I'm beginning to agree with you: I'd say it is a golden combo

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R2D2 Forum Pro • Posts: 23,772
Re: ISO 12800

m100 wrote:

Mongrel wrote:

m100 wrote:

SOOC JPEG

with about 1 min of clicking DXO auto settings

UFO shots.

Hard to really appreciate those on a cell phone, but I will take your word for it!

Do you have any shots of the Aliens under stage lighting taken with a flash? Don’t want to have to buy yet another software program without assurances!

lol

Unexpected Flare Occurrence for real.

The last picture is from a M6II raw file straight into DXO and PP for about 1 min. using auto settings.

Get the trial version and wait for a really good coupon.

Yeah, DxO Deep Prime NR is unbelievably good.

Is the flare from a filter?

R2

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Mongrel
Mongrel Senior Member • Posts: 1,527
Re: ISO 12800
1

At the risk of pulling MAC’s thread further off course…

What are you guys using with Deep Prime?

I have been using DPP4, ACDsee Pro, and the beta Gemstone RAW.

Tonight I downloaded the trial Deep Raw and was playing with that. Took the jpegs and DNGs into ACDsee to finalize. Seemed to work ok. That way. Files looked great, very impressed with ancient 20D files from stage plays I took way back.

I got used to using DPP4 “all the way” from RAW to jpeg….

Thanks, and sorry MAC

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R2D2 Forum Pro • Posts: 23,772
Re: ISO 12800
1

Mongrel wrote:

At the risk of pulling MAC’s thread further off course…

What are you guys using with Deep Prime?

I have been using DPP4, ACDsee Pro, and the beta Gemstone RAW.

Tonight I downloaded the trial Deep Raw and was playing with that. Took the jpegs and DNGs into ACDsee to finalize. Seemed to work ok. That way. Files looked great, very impressed with ancient 20D files from stage plays I took way back.

I got used to using DPP4 “all the way” from RAW to jpeg….

Thanks, and sorry MAC

My fave RAW converter was DPP up until recently. It's kind of kludgy, but does a good job in the end. I've used quite a few other programs too (Adobe, C1, Luminar, Topaz, etc) but still liked DPP's results best.

Until DxO released Photolab 4 with its Deep Prime NR. The interface is a better fit to how I like to edit, and the colors are beautiful. Plus there's Deep Prime too.

Now I simply have no fear of high ISO's. Certainly, I always try to keep ISO as low as possible, so that I can maximize my exposures, but when I have to go high, I go there fearlessly.

R2

ps. I finalize in Photoshop.

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Mongrel
Mongrel Senior Member • Posts: 1,527
Re: ISO 12800
1

R2D2 wrote:

Mongrel wrote:

At the risk of pulling MAC’s thread further off course…

What are you guys using with Deep Prime?

I have been using DPP4, ACDsee Pro, and the beta Gemstone RAW.

Tonight I downloaded the trial Deep Raw and was playing with that. Took the jpegs and DNGs into ACDsee to finalize. Seemed to work ok. That way. Files looked great, very impressed with ancient 20D files from stage plays I took way back.

I got used to using DPP4 “all the way” from RAW to jpeg….

Thanks, and sorry MAC

My fave RAW converter was DPP up until recently. It's kind of kludgy, but does a good job in the end. I've used quite a few other programs too (Adobe, C1, Luminar, Topaz, etc) but still liked DPP's results best.

Until DxO released Photolab 4 with its Deep Prime NR. The interface is a better fit to how I like to edit, and the colors are beautiful. Plus there's Deep Prime too.

Now I simply have no fear of high ISO's. Certainly, I always try to keep ISO as low as possible, so that I can maximize my exposures, but when I have to go high, I go there fearlessly.

R2

ps. I finalize in Photoshop.

THANKS R2….

Right now I am just using the deep prime stand alone. I may take a look at Photolab 4 as a package.

I’ve made some mistakes lately buying software that I am not even using (cataloguing software Breezebrowser and Photoethica). If I hadn’t spent that I would be in a better position to jump on Photolab 4 if you guys recommend it…

Thanks for the help.

ps-still thinking about that M6-2! Lol

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R2D2 Forum Pro • Posts: 23,772
Re: ISO 12800
1

Mongrel wrote:

R2D2 wrote:

Mongrel wrote:

At the risk of pulling MAC’s thread further off course…

What are you guys using with Deep Prime?

I have been using DPP4, ACDsee Pro, and the beta Gemstone RAW.

Tonight I downloaded the trial Deep Raw and was playing with that. Took the jpegs and DNGs into ACDsee to finalize. Seemed to work ok. That way. Files looked great, very impressed with ancient 20D files from stage plays I took way back.

I got used to using DPP4 “all the way” from RAW to jpeg….

Thanks, and sorry MAC

My fave RAW converter was DPP up until recently. It's kind of kludgy, but does a good job in the end. I've used quite a few other programs too (Adobe, C1, Luminar, Topaz, etc) but still liked DPP's results best.

Until DxO released Photolab 4 with its Deep Prime NR. The interface is a better fit to how I like to edit, and the colors are beautiful. Plus there's Deep Prime too.

Now I simply have no fear of high ISO's. Certainly, I always try to keep ISO as low as possible, so that I can maximize my exposures, but when I have to go high, I go there fearlessly.

R2

ps. I finalize in Photoshop.

THANKS R2….

Right now I am just using the deep prime stand alone. I may take a look at Photolab 4 as a package.

I’ve made some mistakes lately buying software that I am not even using (cataloguing software Breezebrowser and Photoethica). If I hadn’t spent that I would be in a better position to jump on Photolab 4 if you guys recommend it…

Thanks for the help.

ps-still thinking about that M6-2! Lol

At risk of hijacking, here's an ISO 12,800 shot from the R5 (I don't have any high ISO M6ii shots handy).  This photo was also underexposed by a stop (due to subject's sudden appearance... spun the ISO dial, clicked, gone)...

River otter popped up right up next to me.  ISO 12,800 (effectively ISO 25,000).  Deep Prime Noise Reduction.  Click on "original size"

R2

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Mongrel
Mongrel Senior Member • Posts: 1,527
Re: ISO 12800

Wow! Just “wow”…incredible shot R2.

Shows your skills well.

Reminds me of when people say “well you have a good camera so how hard can it be?” Lol…

Of they only knew…

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R2D2 Forum Pro • Posts: 23,772
Re: ISO 12800

Mongrel wrote:

Wow! Just “wow”…incredible shot R2.

Shows your skills well.

Reminds me of when people say “well you have a good camera so how hard can it be?” Lol…

Of they only knew…

Well thanks for your kind words, but it really was the Camera!  And The Software!  

R2

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