Auto ISO Behavior

Erik Baumgartner wrote:

DirkPeh wrote:

Yes, I guess so. Call me stupid, but has it such an impact?

Well yeah, 4 full stops in the V.

In other words, exhibited ISO 1250 would most probably be at ISO 160 without the ND filter (being as low as it goes, base ISO), which is exactly what you expected.

What kind of photography are you doing and which exposure mode are you in? Also, if you would please upload a sample photo with EXIF intact that illustrates the issue, that would be helpful.

So maybe the thread-starter made the same mistake. I guess on my Fuji, it was initially set to "on" or maybe I just played with the lever on the front.

Thank you Eric!

DirkPeh wrote:

So maybe the thread-starter made the same mistake. I guess on my Fuji, it was initially set to "on" or maybe I just played with the lever on the front.

Hardly, as thread-starter said he uses X-T2, and that one does not have an ND filter to be engaged in-camera. Forgetting an ND filter on a lens is a possibility, though, but I guess that was not the case (as having a black filter should be rather visible on the lens front element)...?

Indeed, seeing some sample images (straight-out-of-camera, SOOC, with EXIF intact) might shed some more light on it.

To Martin, Erik and Longo0,

Thx.  It's true that I learned to use manual ISO before auto-ISO became available and therefore that I'm used to it, but I suspect that many people who do use auto ISO also learned photography in the same era.  After many years, I simply internalize the thinking about the exposure triangle and know what my camera is set to - these days it's even displayed in the EVF for you.

There are some reasons.  I never have to turn auto-ISO off for situations when it's not the ideal setting. Another reason is probably coming from an XT1 where higher ISO IQ fell away fairly quickly compared to later sensors, so containing auto ISO to a relatively narrow band seemed a bit pointless.  I've yet to experiment with the high ISO IQ of my new XT4.  One's personal approach to photography probably also matters....  I'm a contemplative shooter and thinking about ISO has never limited the attention I can give to composition.  Perhaps if I was shooting in some fast and furious situation I'd find auto-ISO a great benefit.

As always, it simply comes down in the end to what you like.  I guess it's like cars.  Some people like automatic transmissions, some prefer manual.

Cheers, Rod

DirkPeh wrote:

So maybe the thread-starter made the same mistake. I guess on my Fuji, it was initially set to "on" or maybe I just played with the lever on the front.

Thank you Eric!

No problemo. IMO, the built-in ND is probably best avoided in any case. It flares like crazy in bright direct light (see the significant loss of contrast in the image on the right). Unless you need to use flash, you'd probably be better off with the electronic shutter most of the time for bright light/wide apertures,, or a high quality screw-in ND for long exposures.

X100V, Electronic Shutter (L), Built-in ND (R)

DirkPeh wrote:

it raises the ISO to values up to 1000 or even higher, sometimes with a higher Aperture up to 6400

I take pictures in Aperture Priority, the ISO is set to Auto, DR to Auto and I control the shutter speed as part of the Auto Iso setting.

DR to Auto

There's your problem ^

Erik Baumgartner wrote:

DirkPeh wrote:

So maybe the thread-starter made the same mistake. I guess on my Fuji, it was initially set to "on" or maybe I just played with the lever on the front.

It's easy to switch on accidentally – isn't the ND filter on/off set by default to a long pull of the lever?

Rod McD wrote:

To Martin, Erik and Longo0,

Thx. It's true that I learned to use manual ISO before auto-ISO became available and therefore that I'm used to it, but I suspect that many people who do use auto ISO also learned photography in the same era. After many years, I simply internalize the thinking about the exposure triangle and know what my camera is set to - these days it's even displayed in the EVF for you.

There are some reasons. I never have to turn auto-ISO off for situations when it's not the ideal setting. Another reason is probably coming from an XT1 where higher ISO IQ fell away fairly quickly compared to later sensors, so containing auto ISO to a relatively narrow band seemed a bit pointless. I've yet to experiment with the high ISO IQ of my new XT4. One's personal approach to photography probably also matters.... I'm a contemplative shooter and thinking about ISO has never limited the attention I can give to composition. Perhaps if I was shooting in some fast and furious situation I'd find auto-ISO a great benefit.

Thank you for your contribution. My main impuls to start with photography more seriously was birth of my daughter 4 years ago. So she is my main subject. And I wanted to focus on composition and what she do etc., not camera setting. So maybe this is the main difference - sometimes it's really the fast action, on the trips also with changing conditions shade/sun etc., when autoISO comes really handy.

My reasoning is also, that ISO is the only exposure parameter without artistic meaning. You just wanted as low as possible. Well, automatic setting do it best without hesitation! 😁

The only one feature I miss on today's cameras - custom setting of minSS on the wheel instead of SS! It would be perfect for my style of exposure control.

As always, it simply comes down in the end to what you like. I guess it's like cars. Some people like automatic transmissions, some prefer manual.

Well I drive with manual transmission. The difference for me is, that automatic transmission sometimes do what I don't want...but autoISO I can set exactly like I want.

Cheers, Rod

Rod McD wrote:

To Martin, Erik and Longo0,

Thx. It's true that I learned to use manual ISO before auto-ISO became available and therefore that I'm used to it, but I suspect that many people who do use auto ISO also learned photography in the same era. After many years, I simply internalize the thinking about the exposure triangle and know what my camera is set to - these days it's even displayed in the EVF for you.

There are some reasons. I never have to turn auto-ISO off for situations when it's not the ideal setting. Another reason is probably coming from an XT1 where higher ISO IQ fell away fairly quickly compared to later sensors, so containing auto ISO to a relatively narrow band seemed a bit pointless. I've yet to experiment with the high ISO IQ of my new XT4. One's personal approach to photography probably also matters.... I'm a contemplative shooter and thinking about ISO has never limited the attention I can give to composition. Perhaps if I was shooting in some fast and furious situation I'd find auto-ISO a great benefit.

As always, it simply comes down in the end to what you like. I guess it's like cars. Some people like automatic transmissions, some prefer manual.

Cheers, Rod

I appreciate your position. If your shooting methodology works for you then great, who's to say you're doing anything wrong, but I would point out that I never really have to “turn auto-ISO off” for situations when it's not the ideal setting either. Just like you, I simply turn the same knobs to manually adjust a particular parameter.

While the X-T1's sensor is no longer state of the art, It is still very, very good. I would argue that the higher ISO IQ does not fall away fairly quickly at all. It is certainly usable to ISO 6400 (hardly a narrow band) where it can still manage very usable results if you're careful with processing. Your X-T4 is good for a stop more. Setting a high auto-ISO limit does not mean you are going to always shoot that high, but it will give you a shot at a good image that would be likely be lost to motion blur otherwise.

There are always going to be people who prefer manual ISO, but I honestly don't see any downsides to auto-ISO instead (other than sorting out the best way to use it), but there are lots of upsides.

...and as I generally do prefer doing things manually, I do still drive stick.

X-T1 in crap light at ISO 6400

Martin_99 wrote:

Rod McD wrote:

To Martin, Erik and Longo0,

Thx. It's true that I learned to use manual ISO before auto-ISO became available and therefore that I'm used to it, but I suspect that many people who do use auto ISO also learned photography in the same era. After many years, I simply internalize the thinking about the exposure triangle and know what my camera is set to - these days it's even displayed in the EVF for you.

There are some reasons. I never have to turn auto-ISO off for situations when it's not the ideal setting. Another reason is probably coming from an XT1 where higher ISO IQ fell away fairly quickly compared to later sensors, so containing auto ISO to a relatively narrow band seemed a bit pointless. I've yet to experiment with the high ISO IQ of my new XT4. One's personal approach to photography probably also matters.... I'm a contemplative shooter and thinking about ISO has never limited the attention I can give to composition. Perhaps if I was shooting in some fast and furious situation I'd find auto-ISO a great benefit.

Thank you for your contribution. My main impuls to start with photography more seriously was birth of my daughter 4 years ago. So she is my main subject. And I wanted to focus on composition and what she do etc., not camera setting. So maybe this is the main difference - sometimes it's really the fast action, on the trips also with changing conditions shade/sun etc., when autoISO comes really handy.

My reasoning is also, that ISO is the only exposure parameter without artistic meaning. You just wanted as low as possible. Well, automatic setting do it best without hesitation! 😁

The only one feature I miss on today's cameras - custom setting of minSS on the wheel instead of SS! It would be perfect for my style of exposure control.

As always, it simply comes down in the end to what you like. I guess it's like cars. Some people like automatic transmissions, some prefer manual.

Well I drive with manual transmission. The difference for me is, that automatic transmission sometimes do what I don't want...but autoISO I can set exactly like I want.

Agree 100%. I've been wanting an option to assign min. SS to a dial since day one with Fuji, it would make the auto-ISO implementation complete - with no 1/500" shutter speed limit, of course.

fujiian wrote:

Erik Baumgartner wrote:

DirkPeh wrote:

So maybe the thread-starter made the same mistake. I guess on my Fuji, it was initially set to "on" or maybe I just played with the lever on the front.

It's easy to switch on accidentally – isn't the ND filter on/off set by default to a long pull of the lever?

Long pull to the right.

Cliffruddle wrote:

Hi. I just but fuji xs10 with 23mm f1.4 lm wr. When input the lens. And set the auto iso. Base iso is 160 and maximum is 12800. Minimum shutter speed is auto

now. The minimum shutter speed is always 1/100

according what i read on manual. If min shutter speed set to auto, camera will set min shutter speed 1/… according to the lens attached. So it must be 1/20 if i put a 23mm lens

has anybody ever experienced this

What is your issue anyway? SS 1/100 is reasonable general setting. I would keep it. 1/20 is way too slow for many subjects. Maybe try other also SS auto settings.

Cliffruddle wrote:

Hi. I just but fuji xs10 with 23mm f1.4 lm wr. When input the lens. And set the auto iso. Base iso is 160 and maximum is 12800. Minimum shutter speed is auto

now. The minimum shutter speed is always 1/100

according what i read on manual. If min shutter speed set to auto, camera will set min shutter speed 1/… according to the lens attached. So it must be 1/20 if i put a 23mm lens

has anybody ever experienced this

I rarely shoot below 1/125" at 23mm if anything is moving in the frame (people). The Auto minimum SS mode actually tends to choose too low a SS in many situations. I recommend three presets, all at base ISO to 12800, each with a different minimum SS setting - typically 1/80", 1/160", 1/320" for my X100V (23mm). IBIS is swell, but it won't help with subject motion. If you're shooting static subjects in low light then, sure, set lower SS presets, but I would avoid very low shutter speeds for general purpose shooting.

The Auto min. SS feature is too unreliable in its current implementation, IMO.

What kind of photography will you be doing?

Please try to set "D Range Priority" to "OFF".
At least this was the fix on my X-H2 to avoid unnecessary high ISO's calculated by the camera "auto iso" feature.