Photographer Sues Hilary Duff Over “Creep” Claim on Instagram(article)

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lbuclk= Veteran Member • Posts: 4,329
Photographer Sues Hilary Duff Over “Creep” Claim on Instagram(article)
1
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Teila Day
Teila Day Veteran Member • Posts: 5,350
cops should've picked her up+ fine + lawsuit
3

Tale as old as time.  People assuming they deserve a veil of privacy while in public.

Once stating his business he should've ignored her.  If she continued to harass him, the cops should've been summoned and her behind taken to jail for 90 days.  Otherwise, you won't get it through people's head that in general.. public property, isn't the same as their private property.

Have a problem with law abiding folks operating according to the law of the land?  Change then change the applicable legislation.   Fine her $10k + any real damages that he may proove, and call it a day.

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Rich42 Senior Member • Posts: 2,063
Re: cops should've picked her up+ fine + lawsuit

Teila Day wrote:

Tale as old as time. People assuming they deserve a veil of privacy while in public.

Once stating his business he should've ignored her. If she continued to harass him, the cops should've been summoned and her behind taken to jail for 90 days. Otherwise, you won't get it through people's head that in general.. public property, isn't the same as their private property.

Have a problem with law abiding folks operating according to the law of the land? Change then change the applicable legislation. Fine her $10k + any real damages that he may proove, and call it a day.

Teila,

If he had called the police. He would have been arrested. Or worse.

Rich

Jacques Cornell
Jacques Cornell Forum Pro • Posts: 13,661
Re: cops should've picked her up+ fine + lawsuit

Rich42 wrote:

Teila Day wrote:

Tale as old as time. People assuming they deserve a veil of privacy while in public.

Once stating his business he should've ignored her. If she continued to harass him, the cops should've been summoned and her behind taken to jail for 90 days. Otherwise, you won't get it through people's head that in general.. public property, isn't the same as their private property.

Have a problem with law abiding folks operating according to the law of the land? Change then change the applicable legislation. Fine her $10k + any real damages that he may proove, and call it a day.

Teila,

If he had called the police. He would have been arrested. Or worse.

Rich

I doubt that. The police know they need to have probable cause to arrest someone. They also know that photographing in public is not a crime. I have been approached by police (who were sicked on me by some unseen paranoiac with a phone) while simply photographing scenery on a sidewalk. The officer seemed sheepish (knowing his task was ridiculous but having, nonetheless, to investigate), he was utterly pleasant and professional, and after I explained what I was doing, he wished me a good day and left me alone.

Then again, I'm white. But, I was traveling with a couple of Japanese photographers, which is probably what prompted the call, as we were in a small farming town in the rural south where there probably wasn't another Asian person for 100 miles.

It's easy to have one's view of our society distorted by media reporting and the issues of the day. In the face of grotesque misbehavior by some officers and problems with transparency, incentives, common practices, and simple racial bias - implicit and explicit - in policing, it's easy to assume the worst about all police. And, hesitance on the photographer's part about calling the police would be perfectly understandable under the circumstances. However, the above characterization seems to me both distorted and unhelpful. In my experience, it's the vigilantes, brownshirts, and paranoiacs who have been far more likely than police to infringe my First-Amendment rights when I've been photographing in public, and it has been police who've restored order in such confrontations.

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Teila Day
Teila Day Veteran Member • Posts: 5,350
Re: cops should've picked her up+ fine + lawsuit

Rich42 wrote:

Teila Day wrote:

Tale as old as time. People assuming they deserve a veil of privacy while in public.

Once stating his business he should've ignored her. If she continued to harass him, the cops should've been summoned and her behind taken to jail for 90 days. Otherwise, you won't get it through people's head that in general.. public property, isn't the same as their private property.

Have a problem with law abiding folks operating according to the law of the land? Change then change the applicable legislation. Fine her $10k + any real damages that he may proove, and call it a day.

Teila,

If he had called the police. He would have been arrested. Or worse.

Rich

That's a presupposition, especially in light of more than one "Karen" being arrested after the police were called on a non-white person(s).    However, I do acknowledge how racist this nation is (U.S.) which is sickening and it should be a national embarrassment.

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Michael Thomas Mitchell Forum Pro • Posts: 12,158
Re: Photographer Sues Hilary Duff Over “Creep” Claim on Instagram(article)

What bothered me the most is how she actually tells him that she has a large online audience to which she will portray him as a "creep". Her lawyer is probably not happy with her..

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IR1234 Senior Member • Posts: 1,816
Re: cops should've picked her up+ fine + lawsuit

Jacques Cornell wrote:

The officer seemed sheepish (knowing his task was ridiculous but having, nonetheless, to investigate), he was utterly pleasant and professional, and after I explained what I was doing, he wished me a good day and left me alone.

Then again, I'm white. But, I was traveling with a couple of Japanese photographers, which is probably what prompted the call, as we were in a small farming town in the rural south where there probably wasn't another Asian person for 100 miles.

Knock it off with the race thing. Cop wasn't interested because you were doing nothing wrong. And I've no idea which south you mean, but there are plenty of Asians all over the US. This isn't the 1850s.

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Jacques Cornell
Jacques Cornell Forum Pro • Posts: 13,661
Re: cops should've picked her up+ fine + lawsuit

IR1234 wrote:

Jacques Cornell wrote:

The officer seemed sheepish (knowing his task was ridiculous but having, nonetheless, to investigate), he was utterly pleasant and professional, and after I explained what I was doing, he wished me a good day and left me alone.

Then again, I'm white. But, I was traveling with a couple of Japanese photographers, which is probably what prompted the call, as we were in a small farming town in the rural south where there probably wasn't another Asian person for 100 miles.

Knock it off with the race thing.

Why?

Cop wasn't interested because you were doing nothing wrong.

No kidding. I said as much.

And I've no idea which south you mean, but there are plenty of Asians all over the US. This isn't the 1850s.

Read again. I never suggested race had anything to do with the officer's behavior. He was perfectly professional. I do find it interesting, though, that he was called by some paranoiac when two Japanese photographers were photographing the scenery on a public sidewalk. Whether the caller was prompted by my colleagues' race or simply by the use of a camera in public, we can only speculate. When photographing in public alone, I have never had the police called to investigate me, though I have been confronted by vigilantes who tried to stop me and threatened to call the police.

As for the South, I wasn't singling out the region. It's just a fact that that's where we were. could have just as easily been the Midwest. Point is, it was a small farming town with a downtown area just a few blocks long, and I saw not a single non-white person around. We traveled extensively in the area over a period of a week and encountered exactly zero other asians.

Also, note that hate crimes against asians in the US have increased by over 100% in the past year, with even octogenarians being violently assaulted. So, knock it off with the "knock it off with the race thing". If you think there isn't an issue, you have your head in the sand.

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IR1234 Senior Member • Posts: 1,816
Re: cops should've picked her up+ fine + lawsuit

Jacques Cornell wrote:

IR1234 wrote:

Jacques Cornell wrote:

The officer seemed sheepish (knowing his task was ridiculous but having, nonetheless, to investigate), he was utterly pleasant and professional, and after I explained what I was doing, he wished me a good day and left me alone.

Then again, I'm white. But, I was traveling with a couple of Japanese photographers, which is probably what prompted the call, as we were in a small farming town in the rural south where there probably wasn't another Asian person for 100 miles.

Knock it off with the race thing.

Why?

Cop wasn't interested because you were doing nothing wrong.

No kidding. I said as much.

And I've no idea which south you mean, but there are plenty of Asians all over the US. This isn't the 1850s.

Read again. I never suggested race had anything to do with the officer's behavior.

You absolutely said race had something to do with it - your own words "he wished me a good day and left me alone. Then again, I'm white.". You assumed the cop didn't make anything of it because you're white and you assumed the cop was racist.

You also assumed that the cops were called because you were with some Asian people and because the person who called was racist. Because of course, farming towns in the rural south are racist apparently. You have literally jumped to the race card on two assumptions.

The only person here thinking that everything is down to race is you - and you eloquently describe what you think are other people's prejudices.

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Jacques Cornell
Jacques Cornell Forum Pro • Posts: 13,661
Re: cops should've picked her up+ fine + lawsuit
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IR1234 wrote:

Jacques Cornell wrote:

IR1234 wrote:

Jacques Cornell wrote:

The officer seemed sheepish (knowing his task was ridiculous but having, nonetheless, to investigate), he was utterly pleasant and professional, and after I explained what I was doing, he wished me a good day and left me alone.

Then again, I'm white. But, I was traveling with a couple of Japanese photographers, which is probably what prompted the call, as we were in a small farming town in the rural south where there probably wasn't another Asian person for 100 miles.

Knock it off with the race thing.

Why?

Cop wasn't interested because you were doing nothing wrong.

No kidding. I said as much.

And I've no idea which south you mean, but there are plenty of Asians all over the US. This isn't the 1850s.

Read again. I never suggested race had anything to do with the officer's behavior.

You absolutely said race had something to do with it - your own words "he wished me a good day and left me alone. Then again, I'm white."

I also made it clear that he was addressing myself and my two Japanese colleagues. Race seems to have played no role in his interaction with us.

As for "Then again, I'm white", note the beginning of a new paragraph. I was standing up for the professionalism of a particular officer and that of police in general while acknowledging that, as a white person, I have a particular perspective and set of experiences that may not be shared by non-white people. The topic under discussion is not whether police are racist, but whether citizens ought to be concerned about police involvement in their affairs. Obviously, that's a matter of perspective, and I was just adding mine as a counterexample to another poster's expressed notion that police would unquestionably have arrested a non-white photographer.

Clearly, you've lost the thread of this conversation.

You assumed the cop didn't make anything of it because you're white and you assumed the cop was racist.

Wrong. I noted that he was professional, that I'm white, and that my colleagues were Japanese. Readers can make of that what they will.

If you want to know what I actually assumed at the time, it was that someone out there was fearful of cameras, asians, men with long hair, or some combination of the three, and that the officer would either leave us alone or tell us that the grain silos were "security infrastructure" or some such and could not be photographed.

You also assumed that the cops were called because you were with some Asian people and because the person who called was racist.

Wrong again. I said it was an interesting coincidence.

Because of course, farming towns in the rural south are racist apparently. You have literally jumped to the race card on two assumptions.

It's entirely possible the paranoiac would have called even if it was just me. But, if you think asians don't face a higher level of bias and hostility, you haven't been paying attention to the news.

Also, you're ignoring my previous clarification that I wouldn't have assumed anything different had I been in the Midwest. The point was that it was a small, rural community where people seemed to have few encounters with non-white, and particularly asian, folks. I grew up in a small town in New Hampshire with very similar demographics and would have the same expectations there. I have lived as a racial minority in various parts of the world for much of my adult life. I understand how implicit bias works, and a lot has to do with isolation and lack of experience in interacting with "others".

The only person here thinking that everything is down to race is you - and you eloquently describe what you think are other people's prejudices.

Everyone has prejudices. If you think any acknowledgement of racial bias in policing or society in general is "playing the race card", you're part of the problem.

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