ISO Bracketing in Z system

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PankajDubey Senior Member • Posts: 1,450
ISO Bracketing in Z system

Hi,

I was wondering if there is a possibility of just varying the ISO to Auto-bracket shots.

I can manage this in Sony A6400 with Manual mode+ Auto ISO- where just the ISO changes to bracket the exposure.

In Z5 in Manual mode the Auto ISO stays put and either S or A changes or nothing happens - even if the Auto ISO limit is not reached.

Thanks

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ANSWER:
topg Forum Member • Posts: 75
Re: ISO Bracketing in Z system
2

PankajDubey wrote:

Hi,

I was wondering if there is a possibility of just varying the ISO to Auto-bracket shots.

I can manage this in Sony A6400 with Manual mode+ Auto ISO- where just the ISO changes to bracket the exposure.

In Z5 in Manual mode the Auto ISO stays put and either S or A changes or nothing happens - even if the Auto ISO limit is not reached.

Thanks

If you click on the little green icon next to 'Exposure Bracketing' on this page of the manual, you'll see more guidance on what is varied in each mode: https://onlinemanual.nikonimglib.com/z5/en/09_menu_guide_03_28.html , and about ISO in Manual mode:

  1. [snip]
  2. If [On] is selected for [ISO sensitivity settings] > [Auto ISO sensitivity control] in the photo shooting menu, the camera will first use auto ISO sensitivity control to bring exposure as close as possible to the optimum and then bracket this exposure by varying shutter speed.
  3. Use Custom Setting e6 [Auto bracketing (mode M)] to choose whether the camera varies shutter speed, aperture, or both shutter speed and aperture.

But ISO is not part of exposure so it doesn't really make sense to include it in 'exposure bracketing'.

OP PankajDubey Senior Member • Posts: 1,450
Re: ISO Bracketing in Z system

topg wrote:

PankajDubey wrote:

Hi,

I was wondering if there is a possibility of just varying the ISO to Auto-bracket shots.

I can manage this in Sony A6400 with Manual mode+ Auto ISO- where just the ISO changes to bracket the exposure.

In Z5 in Manual mode the Auto ISO stays put and either S or A changes or nothing happens - even if the Auto ISO limit is not reached.

Thanks

If you click on the little green icon next to 'Exposure Bracketing' on this page of the manual, you'll see more guidance on what is varied in each mode: https://onlinemanual.nikonimglib.com/z5/en/09_menu_guide_03_28.html , and about ISO:

  1. If [On] is selected for [ISO sensitivity settings] > [Auto ISO sensitivity control] in the photo shooting menu, the camera will automatically vary ISO sensitivity for optimum exposure when the limits of the camera exposure system are exceeded.
  2. If [On] is selected for [ISO sensitivity settings] > [Auto ISO sensitivity control] in the photo shooting menu, the camera will first use auto ISO sensitivity control to bring exposure as close as possible to the optimum and then bracket this exposure by varying shutter speed.
  3. Use Custom Setting e6 [Auto bracketing (mode M)] to choose whether the camera varies shutter speed, aperture, or both shutter speed and aperture.

But ISO is not part of exposure so it doesn't really make sense to include it in 'exposure bracketing'.

thanks 😊

I did read the manual .

the last paragraph is a minefield that takes away the the third point of the triangle.

nikon does use the auto iso for varying exposure- just that it doesn’t allow only the ISO to change in bracketing mode.

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topg Forum Member • Posts: 75
Re: ISO Bracketing in Z system
4

PankajDubey wrote:

nikon does use the auto iso for varying exposure- just that it doesn’t allow only the ISO to change in bracketing mode.

No it uses ISO to adjust output image brightness, not exposure. This has been much discussed here in other threads, but see: https://petapixel.com/2020/03/05/iso-has-nothing-to-do-with-exposure-an-explanation-for-beginners/

It makes even less sense to bracket ISO when you have ISO invariance beyond a certain range like with the Zs.

OP PankajDubey Senior Member • Posts: 1,450
Re: ISO Bracketing in Z system

topg wrote:

PankajDubey wrote:

nikon does use the auto iso for varying exposure- just that it doesn’t allow only the ISO to change in bracketing mode.

No it uses ISO to adjust output image brightness, not exposure. This has been much discussed here in other threads, but see: https://petapixel.com/2020/03/05/iso-has-nothing-to-do-with-exposure-an-explanation-for-beginners/

It makes even less sense to bracket ISO when you have ISO invariance beyond a certain range like with the Zs.

Thanks again,

when I said - it is a minefield- I meant that I have read all that and seen some videos of the Angry photographer( Theoria Apophasis) too 😊 and whether larger sensors gather more light.

I just wanted to know if it can be done in Nikon or not.

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karlreed Senior Member • Posts: 2,355
Re: ISO Bracketing in Z system

PankajDubey wrote:

topg wrote:

PankajDubey wrote:

nikon does use the auto iso for varying exposure- just that it doesn’t allow only the ISO to change in bracketing mode.

No it uses ISO to adjust output image brightness, not exposure. This has been much discussed here in other threads, but see: https://petapixel.com/2020/03/05/iso-has-nothing-to-do-with-exposure-an-explanation-for-beginners/

It makes even less sense to bracket ISO when you have ISO invariance beyond a certain range like with the Zs.

Thanks again,

when I said - it is a minefield- I meant that I have read all that and seen some videos of the Angry photographer( Theoria Apophasis) too 😊 and whether larger sensors gather more light.

I just wanted to know if it can be done in Nikon or not.

Actually, ISO bracketing is a good idea. I can imagine situation, eg sports, where I want to fix my aperture (to control DOF) and my shutter speed, but, my targets are moving through areas with different lighting, eg., the shadow of a stadium on a sunny day. (not quite so good when they are moving, but,perhaps when they have moved)

It's possible that Active D lighting bracketing may have a better result than simple ISO bracketing. The existence of ADL bracketing may be why there is no ISO bracketing.

Can't see Autolighting bracketing easily in the R6 menu.

Karl

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OP PankajDubey Senior Member • Posts: 1,450
Re: ISO Bracketing in Z system

karlreed wrote:

PankajDubey wrote:

topg wrote:

PankajDubey wrote:

nikon does use the auto iso for varying exposure- just that it doesn’t allow only the ISO to change in bracketing mode.

No it uses ISO to adjust output image brightness, not exposure. This has been much discussed here in other threads, but see: https://petapixel.com/2020/03/05/iso-has-nothing-to-do-with-exposure-an-explanation-for-beginners/

It makes even less sense to bracket ISO when you have ISO invariance beyond a certain range like with the Zs.

Thanks again,

when I said - it is a minefield- I meant that I have read all that and seen some videos of the Angry photographer( Theoria Apophasis) too 😊 and whether larger sensors gather more light.

I just wanted to know if it can be done in Nikon or not.

Actually, ISO bracketing is a good idea. I can imagine situation, eg sports, where I want to fix my aperture (to control DOF) and my shutter speed, but, my targets are moving through areas with different lighting, eg., the shadow of a stadium on a sunny day. (not quite so good when they are moving, but,perhaps when they have moved)

It's possible that Active D lighting bracketing may have a better result than simple ISO bracketing. The existence of ADL bracketing may be why there is no ISO bracketing.

Can't see Autolighting bracketing easily in the R6 menu.

Karl

Thanks,

Recently, I went for a Tiger safari and the Tigers come out either in the morning or near the sunset to get to the water body.

The Min aperture gets decided by costly/cheap the lens is and you need the shutter speed for the active cubs.The Auto ISO gives one reading - often high . I had the A6400 and it is not good beyond 800.So, rather than change the ISO every time or switch back and forth between AUTO ISO and fixed ISO or fiddling the exposure comp button each time, I thought the ISO bracketing at continuous high(5 shots) gave me at least two manageably exposed shots.

But that was Sony .

I would try the ADL bracket in Nikon.

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PLShutterbug Contributing Member • Posts: 937
Re: ISO Bracketing in Z system
1

PankajDubey wrote:

Hi,

I was wondering if there is a possibility of just varying the ISO to Auto-bracket shots.

I can manage this in Sony A6400 with Manual mode+ Auto ISO- where just the ISO changes to bracket the exposure.

In Z5 in Manual mode the Auto ISO stays put and either S or A changes or nothing happens - even if the Auto ISO limit is not reached.

Thanks

Reading through this thread I wonder if you really mean “bracketing” or if what you want is auto-adjustment.

Bracketing means to take multiple images of the same scene while varying a single setting to ensure you get one image with the “best” exposure. In post, you choose which is the best and discard the rest. Or maybe you stack to increase the dynamic range of the finished image. You can also do focus bracketing by keeping all exposure parameters the same but changing focus through a series of images.

Reading here, it sounds like you really don’t want bracketing as I define above but automatic adjustment: the camera automatically adjusts aperture, or shutter speed, or ISO of a single shot to provide one image that is best exposed.

Nikon can do either, with ISO, aperture or shutter speed as the variable.

Are you looking for auto-bracketing, or auto-adjustment?

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OP PankajDubey Senior Member • Posts: 1,450
Re: ISO Bracketing in Z system

PLShutterbug wrote:

PankajDubey wrote:

Hi,

I was wondering if there is a possibility of just varying the ISO to Auto-bracket shots.

I can manage this in Sony A6400 with Manual mode+ Auto ISO- where just the ISO changes to bracket the exposure.

In Z5 in Manual mode the Auto ISO stays put and either S or A changes or nothing happens - even if the Auto ISO limit is not reached.

Thanks

Reading through this thread I wonder if you really mean “bracketing” or if what you want is auto-adjustment.

Bracketing means to take multiple images of the same scene while varying a single setting to ensure you get one image with the “best” exposure.

In post, you choose which is the best and discard the rest. Or maybe you stack to increase the dynamic range of the finished image.

This is what I want and get with the Sony set up in A6400.

You can also do focus bracketing by keeping all exposure parameters the same but changing focus through a series of images.

Reading here, it sounds like you really don’t want bracketing as I define above but automatic adjustment: the camera automatically adjusts aperture, or shutter speed, or ISO of a single shot to provide one image that is best exposed.

Not sure how you got that impression.

Nikon can do either, with ISO, aperture or shutter speed as the variable.

Are you looking for auto-bracketing, or auto-adjustment?

Auto bracketing, then I pick and choose or merge.

Thank you for your help, I was looking for pound for pound thing in Nikon.

The ADL bracket would light up the shadows in otherwise bright scene but won't work in cloudy or not good light setup.

-

ISO Bracketing is #6 in the list:

https://digital-photography-school.com/6-types-bracketing-camera-can-use/

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OP PankajDubey Senior Member • Posts: 1,450
Re: ISO Bracketing in Z system- Managed it 😎

Thanks everyone who chipped in.

I worked out that if you put the Z5 in manual mode, AUto ISO and e6 Mode M to flash only - then only thing that changes is ISO.

There is one catch- if Auto ISO is too low for +1.0 then it will lower shutter speed.

If Auto ISO range is is high enough then it will vary only the ISO and keep the shutter and aperture constant.

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selected answer This post was selected as the answer by the original poster.
karlreed Senior Member • Posts: 2,355
And for z6ii? ISO Bracketing in Z system- Managed it 😎

PankajDubey wrote:

Thanks everyone who chipped in.

I worked out that if you put the Z5 in manual mode, AUto ISO and e6 Mode M to flash only - then only thing that changes is ISO.

There is one catch- if Auto ISO is too low for +1.0 then it will lower shutter speed.

If Auto ISO range is is high enough then it will vary only the ISO and keep the shutter and aperture constant.

I couldn't get this to work for my Z6ii. In fact, it has now decided not to bracket at all.

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OP PankajDubey Senior Member • Posts: 1,450
Re: And for z6ii? ISO Bracketing in Z system- Managed it 😎

karlreed wrote:

PankajDubey wrote:

Thanks everyone who chipped in.

I worked out that if you put the Z5 in manual mode, AUto ISO and e6 Mode M to flash only - then only thing that changes is ISO.

There is one catch- if Auto ISO is too low for +1.0 then it will lower shutter speed.

If Auto ISO range is is high enough then it will vary only the ISO and keep the shutter and aperture constant.

I couldn't get this to work for my Z6ii. In fact, it has now decided not to bracket at all.

I am travelling out of my home city so don’t have the Z5 with me ( I do have the canon 1200D with Magic lantern)

The Z6ii is not supposed to have a mind of its own- 😊what you say happened to me as well when all three shots were of the same exposure settings.

the e6 settings to flash only and Auto ISO settings max value allowed are the two important settings

e6

e1

e2

M MODE

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OP PankajDubey Senior Member • Posts: 1,450
Re: And for z6ii? ISO Bracketing in Z system- Managed it 😎

karlreed wrote:

PankajDubey wrote:

Thanks everyone who chipped in.

I worked out that if you put the Z5 in manual mode, AUto ISO and e6 Mode M to flash only - then only thing that changes is ISO.

There is one catch- if Auto ISO is too low for +1.0 then it will lower shutter speed.

If Auto ISO range is is high enough then it will vary only the ISO and keep the shutter and aperture constant.

I couldn't get this to work for my Z6ii. In fact, it has now decided not to bracket at all.

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karlreed Senior Member • Posts: 2,355
I can't get this to work..Re: And for z6ii? ISO Bracketing in Z system- Managed it 😎

PankajDubey wrote:

karlreed wrote:

PankajDubey wrote:

Thanks everyone who chipped in.

I worked out that if you put the Z5 in manual mode, AUto ISO and e6 Mode M to flash only - then only thing that changes is ISO.

There is one catch- if Auto ISO is too low for +1.0 then it will lower shutter speed.

If Auto ISO range is is high enough then it will vary only the ISO and keep the shutter and aperture constant.

I couldn't get this to work for my Z6ii. In fact, it has now decided not to bracket at all.

Well, I have tried your suggestion, and, on my Z6ii 1.10 firmware it doesn't work.

And, reading the manual, neither t should!

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OP PankajDubey Senior Member • Posts: 1,450
Re: Correction -works in Aperture priority with rest of the settings as described.

karlreed wrote:

PankajDubey wrote:

karlreed wrote:

PankajDubey wrote:

Thanks everyone who chipped in.

I worked out that if you put the Z5 in manual mode, AUto ISO and e6 Mode M to flash only - then only thing that changes is ISO.

There is one catch- if Auto ISO is too low for +1.0 then it will lower shutter speed.

If Auto ISO range is is high enough then it will vary only the ISO and keep the shutter and aperture constant.

I couldn't get this to work for my Z6ii. In fact, it has now decided not to bracket at all.

Well, I have tried your suggestion, and, on my Z6ii 1.10 firmware it doesn't work.

And, reading the manual, neither t should!

Just checked and re-checked my settings -It is Aperture priority on mode dial - rest of the settings as above.Only when it crosses the ISO set threshold that is decreases the shutter speed.But it works in limited circumstances- you have to define the minimum shutter speed with flash in the Phot shooting menus - ISO sensitivity-> minimum shutter speed with flash.

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karlreed Senior Member • Posts: 2,355
Re: Correction -works in Aperture priority with rest of the settings as described.

PankajDubey wrote:

karlreed wrote:

PankajDubey wrote:

karlreed wrote:

PankajDubey wrote:

Thanks everyone who chipped in.

I worked out that if you put the Z5 in manual mode, AUto ISO and e6 Mode M to flash only - then only thing that changes is ISO.

There is one catch- if Auto ISO is too low for +1.0 then it will lower shutter speed.

If Auto ISO range is is high enough then it will vary only the ISO and keep the shutter and aperture constant.

I couldn't get this to work for my Z6ii. In fact, it has now decided not to bracket at all.

Well, I have tried your suggestion, and, on my Z6ii 1.10 firmware it doesn't work.

And, reading the manual, neither t should!

Just checked and re-checked my settings -It is Aperture priority on mode dial - rest of the settings as above.Only when it crosses the ISO set threshold that is decreases the shutter speed.But it works in limited circumstances- you have to define the minimum shutter speed with flash in the Phot shooting menus - ISO sensitivity-> minimum shutter speed with flash.

The manual is pretty clear about what should happen in your clip.

It's possible that your work around is only effective for the R5.

I spent a lot of time on this..

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OP PankajDubey Senior Member • Posts: 1,450
Re: Correction -works in Aperture priority with rest of the settings as described.

karlreed wrote:

PankajDubey wrote:

karlreed wrote:

PankajDubey wrote:

karlreed wrote:

PankajDubey wrote:

Thanks everyone who chipped in.

I worked out that if you put the Z5 in manual mode, AUto ISO and e6 Mode M to flash only - then only thing that changes is ISO.

There is one catch- if Auto ISO is too low for +1.0 then it will lower shutter speed.

If Auto ISO range is is high enough then it will vary only the ISO and keep the shutter and aperture constant.

I couldn't get this to work for my Z6ii. In fact, it has now decided not to bracket at all.

Well, I have tried your suggestion, and, on my Z6ii 1.10 firmware it doesn't work.

And, reading the manual, neither t should!

Just checked and re-checked my settings -It is Aperture priority on mode dial - rest of the settings as above.Only when it crosses the ISO set threshold that is decreases the shutter speed.But it works in limited circumstances- you have to define the minimum shutter speed with flash in the Phot shooting menus - ISO sensitivity-> minimum shutter speed with flash.

The manual is pretty clear about what should happen in your clip.

It's possible that your work around is only effective for the R5.

I spent a lot of time on this..

Three photos in sequence with Exif showing bracketing.

and only ISO varies.

over +0.3 ISO 640

Exposure Bias 0 ISO 500

Exposure Bias -0.3 ISO 450

The logic is: The Aperture mode fixes the Aperture.

That leaves shutter speed- which is fixed by enforcing -the flash only bracketing and fixing the minimum shutter speed in AUTO ISO bracketing.

only when the highest level set for Auto ISO is reached does the system do anything with shutter speed.

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