Pentax K-1 II (or successor) vs Fuji X-T4

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tugatomsk
tugatomsk New Member • Posts: 22
Pentax K-1 II (or successor) vs Fuji X-T4

I've always liked Pentax's ergonomic philosophy of their cameras; in fact, I like them the most. But things such as old video tech and live view usage have always put me off. I really hope the sensor of the new K-3 III (and the new K-1 III?) includes phase-detection.

But recently, I've grown fond of the Fujis X-T4 and the X-S10. However, the Fujis are still very expensive (the K-1 II can be purchased at roughly the same price as the X-T4), and I'm still concerned about battery life of mirrorless cameras. So the Pentax offerings are still worth considering to me.

On the other hand, I considered the Pentax K-1 II because I just love its ergonomics: the buttons placement and many dials while still retaining the top plate LCD. I'd look the other way regarding its larger size just for that. I find it even better than the Pentax K-3 III ergonomics.

But upon comparing image quality between the X-T4 and the fullframe K-1 II on DPReview's Studio, apparently the APS-C sensor of the X-T4 is better than the one found in the K-1 II, even though the latter is FF, especially at higher ISO. Is the X-T4 sensor that good or is the K-1 II that bad, or is it just old?

Here's the comparison:

https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/image-comparison?attr18=daylight&attr13_0=fujifilm_xt4&attr13_1=pentax_k1ii&attr13_2=apple_iphonex&attr13_3=apple_iphonex&attr15_0=jpeg&attr15_1=jpeg&attr15_2=jpeg&attr15_3=jpeg&attr16_0=12800&attr16_1=12800&attr16_2=32&attr16_3=32&attr126_0=1&attr126_1=1&normalization=full&widget=1&x=0.7301575279832506&y=-0.6396732532216064

 tugatomsk's gear list:tugatomsk's gear list
Canon EOS 60D Canon EF-S 17-85mm f/4-5.6 IS USM
Fujifilm X-T4 Pentax K-1 Pentax K-3
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Mark Sloe Regular Member • Posts: 361
Re: Pentax K-1 II (or successor) vs Fuji X-T4

tugatomsk wrote:

I've always liked Pentax's ergonomic philosophy of their cameras; in fact, I like them the most. But things such as old video tech and live view usage have always put me off. I really hope the sensor of the new K-3 III (and the new K-1 III?) includes phase-detection.

But recently, I've grown fond of the Fujis X-T4 and the X-S10. However, the Fujis are still very expensive (the K-1 II can be purchased at roughly the same price as the X-T4), and I'm still concerned about battery life of mirrorless cameras. So the Pentax offerings are still worth considering to me.

On the other hand, I considered the Pentax K-1 II because I just love its ergonomics: the buttons placement and many dials while still retaining the top plate LCD. I'd look the other way regarding its larger size just for that. I find it even better than the Pentax K-3 III ergonomics.

But upon comparing image quality between the X-T4 and the fullframe K-1 II on DPReview's Studio, apparently the APS-C sensor of the X-T4 is better than the one found in the K-1 II, even though the latter is FF, especially at higher ISO. Is the X-T4 sensor that good or is the K-1 II that bad, or is it just old?

Here's the comparison:

https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/image-comparison?attr18=daylight&attr13_0=fujifilm_xt4&attr13_1=pentax_k1ii&attr13_2=apple_iphonex&attr13_3=apple_iphonex&attr15_0=jpeg&attr15_1=jpeg&attr15_2=jpeg&attr15_3=jpeg&attr16_0=12800&attr16_1=12800&attr16_2=32&attr16_3=32&attr126_0=1&attr126_1=1&normalization=full&widget=1&x=0.7301575279832506&y=-0.6396732532216064

choose with your heart rather than head, i do not think you can go wrong with either.

k-1ii will have better image quality than x-t4 - higher resolution with more than twice as large sensor will allow you to capture significantly more detail. on top of that, you will get higher dynamic range and better high iso performance. purely for photography, k-1 (ii) is still a killer camera and the entire system with lenses is an excellent value for money, if you do not require top of the class autofocus for fast action. on video front it falls behind the mirrorless competition. people are concerned about the future of pentax, but i would not worry too much, they will be around for some time. i would personally go with k-1 mark i, but they are difficult to come by.

x-t4 is a lovely camera, i had fuji x-h1 in the past and really liked it. x-t4 will give you excellent video capabilities, features like eye af, generally better, more flexible af system and ultimately a smaller package to carry around. fuji glass is generally very good and they recently opened the x-mount to third party manufacturers, so there will be plenty to choose from. image quality is definitely sufficient unless you stretch the print too much.

if autofocus is not your top priority, have a look at the x-h1. it has a larger, stronger body, better grip, two axis tilt screen (which some prefer to fully articulating screen), dampened mechanical shutter, nice top lcd screen, image stabilisation, reasonable video spec and it can be had for half the price of x-t4.

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 Mark Sloe's gear list:Mark Sloe's gear list
Sony a7R III Sony FE 24-105mm F4
tugatomsk
OP tugatomsk New Member • Posts: 22
Re: Pentax K-1 II (or successor) vs Fuji X-T4
1

Mark Sloe wrote:

choose with your heart rather than head, i do not think you can go wrong with either.

k-1ii will have better image quality than x-t4 - higher resolution with more than twice as large sensor will allow you to capture significantly more detail. on top of that, you will get higher dynamic range and better high iso performance. purely for photography, k-1 (ii) is still a killer camera and the entire system with lenses is an excellent value for money, if you do not require top of the class autofocus for fast action. on video front it falls behind the mirrorless competition. people are concerned about the future of pentax, but i would not worry too much, they will be around for some time. i would personally go with k-1 mark i, but they are difficult to come by.

x-t4 is a lovely camera, i had fuji x-h1 in the past and really liked it. x-t4 will give you excellent video capabilities, features like eye af, generally better, more flexible af system and ultimately a smaller package to carry around. fuji glass is generally very good and they recently opened the x-mount to third party manufacturers, so there will be plenty to choose from. image quality is definitely sufficient unless you stretch the print too much.

if autofocus is not your top priority, have a look at the x-h1. it has a larger, stronger body, better grip, two axis tilt screen (which some prefer to fully articulating screen), dampened mechanical shutter, nice top lcd screen, image stabilisation, reasonable video spec and it can be had for half the price of x-t4.

I did research the X-H1, but I think I'd rather wait for the X-H2 and hope for some cool innovation and features.

I know there's no such thing as the perfect camera, but I'm trying my best to make my future upgrade from my Canon 60D as best as possible for me.

With that said, there are some features I have become accustomed to using the Nikon D7000 (two years) and the current 60D (since 2013), like top-plate LCD, articulated screen (although I'd prefer a simpler tilting screen), good viewfinder, and long battery life. On the other hand, I crave features like auto-ISO, good live-view functionality, forward&rear exposure control dials, and the most bang for the buck in the form of features (after all, if I pay over 1000€ for a dedicated camera, I kinda have high expectations).

To me, the problem with the vast majority of mirrorless is the lack of top-plate LCD as well as battery life. It's a shame the Fuji X-H1 is the only one including amongst the rest of the Fujis. However, I'm willing to ignore them for the smaller size and great live-view functionality. And yet, the smaller size is not that of a deal-breaker.

The Pentax is not perfect, though. As you mentioned, their AF is not the best at moment, quite the contrary. I'm hoping the new K-3 III (and hopefully a new K-1 III) brings a much-needed upgrade in that regard. I'm not talking about eye-AF and object tracking AF, though; I'm referring to fast and accurate AF, something the 60D is not very good at. Eye-AF and subject tracking are nice features but not essential to me.

I also like dedicated buttons very much. That's why I like both Fuji and Pentax over Canon and even Nikon; there's something about their ergonomy that I really like, especially the Pentax.

I like video but more on the amateur side, not on the pro aspect. I'd be happy with good auto-focus during video, something that I loath on my 60D and which forces me to manually focus using the back LCD, which is a pain and very inaccurate... The Fuji, as you mentioned, is a no-brainer on that aspect, but I kinda hope the new Pentax K-3 III at least reaches Fuji AF quality. Hope springs eternal...

I'm not a fan of fullframe ecosystem pricing, it's just too high, especially the lenses. The Pentax FF, however, has a great price for what it is compared to the

I mentioned earlier the future X-H2 because, as the X-H1 on its time, it should be one of the most advanced dedicated cameras of all time. However, its size and especially price will rival most fullframe options, which is a pity, because then I'd wonder "What if I had chosen a FF instead? How much am I missing? Did I misspent my money?"

So, as you can see, it is indeed a tough choice for me... :/ I'll wait for the next evolution of cameras to make a final decision. So, to sum up, at this stage, my main choices are:

- As the mirrorless without top-plate LCD: Fuji X-T5

- As the mirrorless with a top-palte LCD: Fuji X-H2

- As the crop sensor "classic" choice: Pentax K-3 III

- As the fullframe "classic" choice: Pentax K-1 III

I have a lot to look forward to in the world of photography.

 tugatomsk's gear list:tugatomsk's gear list
Canon EOS 60D Canon EF-S 17-85mm f/4-5.6 IS USM
Mark Sloe Regular Member • Posts: 361
Re: Pentax K-1 II (or successor) vs Fuji X-T4

tugatomsk wrote:

Mark Sloe wrote:

choose with your heart rather than head, i do not think you can go wrong with either.

k-1ii will have better image quality than x-t4 - higher resolution with more than twice as large sensor will allow you to capture significantly more detail. on top of that, you will get higher dynamic range and better high iso performance. purely for photography, k-1 (ii) is still a killer camera and the entire system with lenses is an excellent value for money, if you do not require top of the class autofocus for fast action. on video front it falls behind the mirrorless competition. people are concerned about the future of pentax, but i would not worry too much, they will be around for some time. i would personally go with k-1 mark i, but they are difficult to come by.

x-t4 is a lovely camera, i had fuji x-h1 in the past and really liked it. x-t4 will give you excellent video capabilities, features like eye af, generally better, more flexible af system and ultimately a smaller package to carry around. fuji glass is generally very good and they recently opened the x-mount to third party manufacturers, so there will be plenty to choose from. image quality is definitely sufficient unless you stretch the print too much.

if autofocus is not your top priority, have a look at the x-h1. it has a larger, stronger body, better grip, two axis tilt screen (which some prefer to fully articulating screen), dampened mechanical shutter, nice top lcd screen, image stabilisation, reasonable video spec and it can be had for half the price of x-t4.

I did research the X-H1, but I think I'd rather wait for the X-H2 and hope for some cool innovation and features.

I know there's no such thing as the perfect camera, but I'm trying my best to make my future upgrade from my Canon 60D as best as possible for me.

With that said, there are some features I have become accustomed to using the Nikon D7000 (two years) and the current 60D (since 2013), like top-plate LCD, articulated screen (although I'd prefer a simpler tilting screen), good viewfinder, and long battery life. On the other hand, I crave features like auto-ISO, good live-view functionality, forward&rear exposure control dials, and the most bang for the buck in the form of features (after all, if I pay over 1000€ for a dedicated camera, I kinda have high expectations).

To me, the problem with the vast majority of mirrorless is the lack of top-plate LCD as well as battery life. It's a shame the Fuji X-H1 is the only one including amongst the rest of the Fujis. However, I'm willing to ignore them for the smaller size and great live-view functionality. And yet, the smaller size is not that of a deal-breaker.

The Pentax is not perfect, though. As you mentioned, their AF is not the best at moment, quite the contrary. I'm hoping the new K-3 III (and hopefully a new K-1 III) brings a much-needed upgrade in that regard. I'm not talking about eye-AF and object tracking AF, though; I'm referring to fast and accurate AF, something the 60D is not very good at. Eye-AF and subject tracking are nice features but not essential to me.

I also like dedicated buttons very much. That's why I like both Fuji and Pentax over Canon and even Nikon; there's something about their ergonomy that I really like, especially the Pentax.

I like video but more on the amateur side, not on the pro aspect. I'd be happy with good auto-focus during video, something that I loath on my 60D and which forces me to manually focus using the back LCD, which is a pain and very inaccurate... The Fuji, as you mentioned, is a no-brainer on that aspect, but I kinda hope the new Pentax K-3 III at least reaches Fuji AF quality. Hope springs eternal...

I'm not a fan of fullframe ecosystem pricing, it's just too high, especially the lenses. The Pentax FF, however, has a great price for what it is compared to the

I mentioned earlier the future X-H2 because, as the X-H1 on its time, it should be one of the most advanced dedicated cameras of all time. However, its size and especially price will rival most fullframe options, which is a pity, because then I'd wonder "What if I had chosen a FF instead? How much am I missing? Did I misspent my money?"

So, as you can see, it is indeed a tough choice for me... :/ I'll wait for the next evolution of cameras to make a final decision. So, to sum up, at this stage, my main choices are:

- As the mirrorless without top-plate LCD: Fuji X-T5

- As the mirrorless with a top-palte LCD: Fuji X-H2

- As the crop sensor "classic" choice: Pentax K-3 III

- As the fullframe "classic" choice: Pentax K-1 III

I have a lot to look forward to in the world of photography.

maybe another suggestion to mix things up a bit more - panasonic s1 - solid body, excellent evf, best image stabilisation in ff, many buttons and controls, vari-angle tilting screen similar to k-1, top plate lcd. lumix 24-105 f4 is a superb lens and good value when bought as a kit and you have plenty of decent and reasonably priced sigma glass in l-mount to choose from.

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 Mark Sloe's gear list:Mark Sloe's gear list
Sony a7R III Sony FE 24-105mm F4
tugatomsk
OP tugatomsk New Member • Posts: 22
Re: Pentax K-1 II (or successor) vs Fuji X-T4

Mark Sloe wrote:

maybe another suggestion to mix things up a bit more - panasonic s1 - solid body, excellent evf, best image stabilisation in ff, many buttons and controls, vari-angle tilting screen similar to k-1, top plate lcd. lumix 24-105 f4 is a superb lens and good value when bought as a kit and you have plenty of decent and reasonably priced sigma glass in l-mount to choose from.

Good point. I forgot about Panasonic.

 tugatomsk's gear list:tugatomsk's gear list
Canon EOS 60D Canon EF-S 17-85mm f/4-5.6 IS USM
robgendreau Veteran Member • Posts: 8,096
Re: Pentax K-1 II (or successor) vs Fuji X-T4
1

I don't think the DPReview comparison tool does the K-1ii justice. Not sure why.

I'd pick the X-T4 over the K-1ii for action or AF for sure. But OTOH if one likes an OVF the K-1ii rules. And it's still one of the best sensors for DR; look over at photons to photos.

But where the K-1ii really excels is landscape. Short of a medium frame, it really is one of the best. And with pixel shift it can compete with MF. One needs static images, or the ability to stack to remove motion artifacts, but still, it's amazing. And there's no better landscape night camera—no one has anything like Astrotracer. Indeed, fewer cameras sport even GPS these days, and the K-1ii also has great night lights for operation and some of the best weatherproofing out there. For a night oriented review, https://www.lonelyspeck.com/pentax-k-1-mark-ii-astrophotography-review/

As for the K-3iii, we'll see. Meanwhile, the XT-4 is a great camera. Hard to go wrong.

I like Pentax lenses as well, and like that some old model lenses are still some of the best out there, like the 31mm even, or older 50mms. The new 85mm is fantastic. It's true though that one can use these lenses on mirrorless with adapters, but not usually with the same functionality of the Pentax bodies.

So the Pentax is also very good for a retro-type DSLR experience; sort of like how the Fujifilm cameras are that way with mirrorless. I can see why it would be tough making the choices. I've often thought Pentax wants to go kind of niche as Fujifilm does. They even both have rangefinder type cameras in the X100 and GR (well, parent company Ricoh anyway).

ChelseaPhotographer
ChelseaPhotographer Contributing Member • Posts: 843
Re: Pentax K-1 II (or successor) vs Fuji X-T4

tugatomsk wrote:

I've always liked Pentax's ergonomic philosophy of their cameras; in fact, I like them the most. But things such as old video tech and live view usage have always put me off. I really hope the sensor of the new K-3 III (and the new K-1 III?) includes phase-detection.

But recently, I've grown fond of the Fujis X-T4 and the X-S10. However, the Fujis are still very expensive (the K-1 II can be purchased at roughly the same price as the X-T4), and I'm still concerned about battery life of mirrorless cameras. So the Pentax offerings are still worth considering to me.

On the other hand, I considered the Pentax K-1 II because I just love its ergonomics: the buttons placement and many dials while still retaining the top plate LCD. I'd look the other way regarding its larger size just for that. I find it even better than the Pentax K-3 III ergonomics.

But upon comparing image quality between the X-T4 and the fullframe K-1 II on DPReview's Studio, apparently the APS-C sensor of the X-T4 is better than the one found in the K-1 II, even though the latter is FF, especially at higher ISO. Is the X-T4 sensor that good or is the K-1 II that bad, or is it just old?

Here's the comparison:

https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/image-comparison?attr18=daylight&attr13_0=fujifilm_xt4&attr13_1=pentax_k1ii&attr13_2=apple_iphonex&attr13_3=apple_iphonex&attr15_0=jpeg&attr15_1=jpeg&attr15_2=jpeg&attr15_3=jpeg&attr16_0=12800&attr16_1=12800&attr16_2=32&attr16_3=32&attr126_0=1&attr126_1=1&normalization=full&widget=1&x=0.7301575279832506&y=-0.6396732532216064

Get the Pentax.

Unfortunately the bad image that you are seeing is due to DPReview not taking a good photo. It is out of focus. That is not the camera's fault. Look for the elements that are a little bit closer to the camera and you will see that they are in focus and look great!

 ChelseaPhotographer's gear list:ChelseaPhotographer's gear list
SeaLife DC2000 Ricoh GR III Pentax 645Z Canon EOS 5DS Nikon D850 +1 more
tugatomsk
OP tugatomsk New Member • Posts: 22
Re: Pentax K-1 II (or successor) vs Fuji X-T4

ChelseaPhotographer wrote:

Get the Pentax.

Unfortunately the bad image that you are seeing is due to DPReview not taking a good photo. It is out of focus. That is not the camera's fault. Look for the elements that are a little bit closer to the camera and you will see that they are in focus and look great!

I found that some users also complain about the controversial cooked RAWs after NR on the Pentax K-1 II is forcefully applied. Is it really true? If it is, does it really eat stars or other nefarious side effects like that?

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4371769?page=2

 tugatomsk's gear list:tugatomsk's gear list
Canon EOS 60D Canon EF-S 17-85mm f/4-5.6 IS USM
ChelseaPhotographer
ChelseaPhotographer Contributing Member • Posts: 843
Re: Pentax K-1 II (or successor) vs Fuji X-T4

tugatomsk wrote:

ChelseaPhotographer wrote:

Get the Pentax.

Unfortunately the bad image that you are seeing is due to DPReview not taking a good photo. It is out of focus. That is not the camera's fault. Look for the elements that are a little bit closer to the camera and you will see that they are in focus and look great!

I found that some users also complain about the controversial cooked RAWs after NR on the Pentax K-1 II is forcefully applied. Is it really true? If it is, does it really eat stars or other nefarious side effects like that?

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4371769?page=2

The K-1 II does cook the RAW files a bit, but I don't know if it eats stars... I had the camera for a while, and I was happy with it but in the end I went with the Nikon D850.

You get a lot more resolution out of the K1 than out of the X-T4

 ChelseaPhotographer's gear list:ChelseaPhotographer's gear list
SeaLife DC2000 Ricoh GR III Pentax 645Z Canon EOS 5DS Nikon D850 +1 more
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