RX1Rii users: does the ZX1 look like an upgrade?

Started 5 months ago | Discussions
OP Digital Nigel Forum Pro • Posts: 13,503
Re: RX1Rii users: does the ZX1 look like an upgrade?

tbcass wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

Digital Nigel wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

I’m curious why you think a camera from a different manufacturer would be an upgrade for a Sony camera.

Why not? It's a newer, more expensive model in exactly the same niche. They even both have Zeiss-branded lenses with the same spec.

I bought a Sony RX10M3 as an upgrade on my Panasonic FZ1000, and an RX100M6 as an upgrade on my Panasonic TZ100 I bought a Canon G7X as an upgrade on my RX100.

It’s just flat not a Sony camera. A whole different approach. The lens is not the same spec. It was developed to match the Zeiss in house developed sensor. The Sony RXIRIII is a rehashed lens from the earlier cameras. I’ve used both and there is no comparison.

A camera does not need to have anything in common with another camera to be an upgrade. I am defining upgrade to mean any product that is superior to another.

I wonder who actually makes the ZX1?  As with the 'Zeiss' lens on the RX1, it's unlikely to be Zeiss itself.  It will be interesting if any reviews mention the country of manufacture. And I wonder if Sony makes the sensor?

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JDLaing50 Senior Member • Posts: 2,351
Re: RX1Rii users: does the ZX1 look like an upgrade?

tbcass wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

Digital Nigel wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

I’m curious why you think a camera from a different manufacturer would be an upgrade for a Sony camera.

Why not? It's a newer, more expensive model in exactly the same niche. They even both have Zeiss-branded lenses with the same spec.

I bought a Sony RX10M3 as an upgrade on my Panasonic FZ1000, and an RX100M6 as an upgrade on my Panasonic TZ100 I bought a Canon G7X as an upgrade on my RX100.

It’s just flat not a Sony camera. A whole different approach. The lens is not the same spec. It was developed to match the Zeiss in house developed sensor. The Sony RXIRIII is a rehashed lens from the earlier cameras. I’ve used both and there is no comparison.

A camera does not need to have anything in common with another camera to be an upgrade. I am defining upgrade to mean any product that is superior to another.

It’s superior.

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JDLaing50 Senior Member • Posts: 2,351
Re: RX1Rii users: does the ZX1 look like an upgrade?

Digital Nigel wrote:

tbcass wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

Digital Nigel wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

I’m curious why you think a camera from a different manufacturer would be an upgrade for a Sony camera.

Why not? It's a newer, more expensive model in exactly the same niche. They even both have Zeiss-branded lenses with the same spec.

I bought a Sony RX10M3 as an upgrade on my Panasonic FZ1000, and an RX100M6 as an upgrade on my Panasonic TZ100 I bought a Canon G7X as an upgrade on my RX100.

It’s just flat not a Sony camera. A whole different approach. The lens is not the same spec. It was developed to match the Zeiss in house developed sensor. The Sony RXIRIII is a rehashed lens from the earlier cameras. I’ve used both and there is no comparison.

A camera does not need to have anything in common with another camera to be an upgrade. I am defining upgrade to mean any product that is superior to another.

I wonder who actually makes the ZX1? As with the 'Zeiss' lens on the RX1, it's unlikely to be Zeiss itself. It will be interesting if any reviews mention the country of manufacture. And I wonder if Sony makes the sensor?

Zeiss makes it. It’s an in house Zeiss designed sensor. Designed in Germany assembled in China.

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OP Digital Nigel Forum Pro • Posts: 13,503
Re: RX1Rii users: does the ZX1 look like an upgrade?

JDLaing50 wrote:

Digital Nigel wrote:

tbcass wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

Digital Nigel wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

I’m curious why you think a camera from a different manufacturer would be an upgrade for a Sony camera.

Why not? It's a newer, more expensive model in exactly the same niche. They even both have Zeiss-branded lenses with the same spec.

I bought a Sony RX10M3 as an upgrade on my Panasonic FZ1000, and an RX100M6 as an upgrade on my Panasonic TZ100 I bought a Canon G7X as an upgrade on my RX100.

It’s just flat not a Sony camera. A whole different approach. The lens is not the same spec. It was developed to match the Zeiss in house developed sensor. The Sony RXIRIII is a rehashed lens from the earlier cameras. I’ve used both and there is no comparison.

A camera does not need to have anything in common with another camera to be an upgrade. I am defining upgrade to mean any product that is superior to another.

I wonder who actually makes the ZX1? As with the 'Zeiss' lens on the RX1, it's unlikely to be Zeiss itself. It will be interesting if any reviews mention the country of manufacture. And I wonder if Sony makes the sensor?

Zeiss makes it. It’s an in house Zeiss designed sensor.

Made by Sony?

Designed in Germany assembled in China.

That reduces its value compared to actually making it in Germany.

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OP Digital Nigel Forum Pro • Posts: 13,503
Re: RX1Rii users: does the ZX1 look like an upgrade?

JDLaing50 wrote:

tbcass wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

Digital Nigel wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

I’m curious why you think a camera from a different manufacturer would be an upgrade for a Sony camera.

Why not? It's a newer, more expensive model in exactly the same niche. They even both have Zeiss-branded lenses with the same spec.

I bought a Sony RX10M3 as an upgrade on my Panasonic FZ1000, and an RX100M6 as an upgrade on my Panasonic TZ100 I bought a Canon G7X as an upgrade on my RX100.

It’s just flat not a Sony camera. A whole different approach. The lens is not the same spec. It was developed to match the Zeiss in house developed sensor. The Sony RXIRIII is a rehashed lens from the earlier cameras. I’ve used both and there is no comparison.

A camera does not need to have anything in common with another camera to be an upgrade. I am defining upgrade to mean any product that is superior to another.

It’s superior.

In what way?  The sensor is lower resolution and seems quite old in its specification. The lens also seems to have a cheaper, simpler design than the RX1 lens.

So, is there any area where it beats the RX1Rii?

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JDLaing50 Senior Member • Posts: 2,351
Re: RX1Rii users: does the ZX1 look like an upgrade?

YDigital Nigel wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

tbcass wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

Digital Nigel wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

I’m curious why you think a camera from a different manufacturer would be an upgrade for a Sony camera.

Why not? It's a newer, more expensive model in exactly the same niche. They even both have Zeiss-branded lenses with the same spec.

I bought a Sony RX10M3 as an upgrade on my Panasonic FZ1000, and an RX100M6 as an upgrade on my Panasonic TZ100 I bought a Canon G7X as an upgrade on my RX100.

It’s just flat not a Sony camera. A whole different approach. The lens is not the same spec. It was developed to match the Zeiss in house developed sensor. The Sony RXIRIII is a rehashed lens from the earlier cameras. I’ve used both and there is no comparison.

A camera does not need to have anything in common with another camera to be an upgrade. I am defining upgrade to mean any product that is superior to another.

It’s superior.

In what way? The sensor is lower resolution and seems quite old in its specification. The lens also seems to have a cheaper, simpler design than the RX1 lens.

So, is there any area where it beats the RX1Rii?

Many. And resolution at that level is not everything. It seems you’re one of the folks stuck in the pixel race for quantity and not quality.

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OP Digital Nigel Forum Pro • Posts: 13,503
Re: RX1Rii users: does the ZX1 look like an upgrade?

JDLaing50 wrote:

YDigital Nigel wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

tbcass wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

Digital Nigel wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

I’m curious why you think a camera from a different manufacturer would be an upgrade for a Sony camera.

Why not? It's a newer, more expensive model in exactly the same niche. They even both have Zeiss-branded lenses with the same spec.

I bought a Sony RX10M3 as an upgrade on my Panasonic FZ1000, and an RX100M6 as an upgrade on my Panasonic TZ100 I bought a Canon G7X as an upgrade on my RX100.

It’s just flat not a Sony camera. A whole different approach. The lens is not the same spec. It was developed to match the Zeiss in house developed sensor. The Sony RXIRIII is a rehashed lens from the earlier cameras. I’ve used both and there is no comparison.

A camera does not need to have anything in common with another camera to be an upgrade. I am defining upgrade to mean any product that is superior to another.

It’s superior.

In what way? The sensor is lower resolution and seems quite old in its specification. The lens also seems to have a cheaper, simpler design than the RX1 lens.

So, is there any area where it beats the RX1Rii?

Many. And resolution at that level is not everything. It seems you’re one of the folks stuck in the pixel race for quantity and not quality.

In what way is it better, then?  And surely an A7Riv with a 35mm f/1.8 lens would beat both of these cameras? Amazingly, it even has a smaller body, despite having much better controls, better AF, IBIS, EVF, etc!

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JDLaing50 Senior Member • Posts: 2,351
Re: RX1Rii users: does the ZX1 look like an upgrade?

Digital Nigel wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

YDigital Nigel wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

tbcass wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

Digital Nigel wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

I’m curious why you think a camera from a different manufacturer would be an upgrade for a Sony camera.

Why not? It's a newer, more expensive model in exactly the same niche. They even both have Zeiss-branded lenses with the same spec.

I bought a Sony RX10M3 as an upgrade on my Panasonic FZ1000, and an RX100M6 as an upgrade on my Panasonic TZ100 I bought a Canon G7X as an upgrade on my RX100.

It’s just flat not a Sony camera. A whole different approach. The lens is not the same spec. It was developed to match the Zeiss in house developed sensor. The Sony RXIRIII is a rehashed lens from the earlier cameras. I’ve used both and there is no comparison.

A camera does not need to have anything in common with another camera to be an upgrade. I am defining upgrade to mean any product that is superior to another.

It’s superior.

In what way? The sensor is lower resolution and seems quite old in its specification. The lens also seems to have a cheaper, simpler design than the RX1 lens.

So, is there any area where it beats the RX1Rii?

Many. And resolution at that level is not everything. It seems you’re one of the folks stuck in the pixel race for quantity and not quality.

In what way is it better, then? And surely an A7Riv with a 35mm f/1.8 lens would beat both of these cameras? Amazingly, it even has a smaller body, despite having much better controls, better AF, IBIS, EVF, etc!

Image quality, features, file transfer, storage, screen, build quality, lens. IBIS is a crutch and not necessary. It has a far better evf.  Auto focus is better and more accurate.

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sybersitizen Forum Pro • Posts: 19,300
Re: RX1Rii users: does the ZX1 look like an upgrade?

JDLaing50 wrote:

Digital Nigel wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

Digital Nigel wrote:

... So, is there any area where it beats the RX1Rii?

Many. And resolution at that level is not everything. It seems you’re one of the folks stuck in the pixel race for quantity and not quality.

In what way is it better, then? And surely an A7Riv with a 35mm f/1.8 lens would beat both of these cameras? Amazingly, it even has a smaller body, despite having much better controls, better AF, IBIS, EVF, etc!

Image quality, features, file transfer, storage, screen, build quality, lens. IBIS is a crutch and not necessary. It has a far better evf. Auto focus is better and more accurate.

I still have a couple of unanswered questions from earlier:

sybersitizen wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

The lens is not the same spec. It was developed to match the Zeiss in house developed sensor. The Sony RXIRIII is a rehashed lens from the earlier cameras.

What RX1RIII? Are you talking about the RX1RII?

You seem to be saying the lens for the RX1 series should have been redesigned when the sensor resolution changed from 24MP to 42MP. Is that your point?

I’ve used both and there is no comparison.

You've used both what? You're saying you've used an RX1R model and the ZX1? How were you able to use the ZX1?

JDLaing50 Senior Member • Posts: 2,351
Re: RX1Rii users: does the ZX1 look like an upgrade?

sybersitizen wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

Digital Nigel wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

Digital Nigel wrote:

... So, is there any area where it beats the RX1Rii?

Many. And resolution at that level is not everything. It seems you’re one of the folks stuck in the pixel race for quantity and not quality.

In what way is it better, then? And surely an A7Riv with a 35mm f/1.8 lens would beat both of these cameras? Amazingly, it even has a smaller body, despite having much better controls, better AF, IBIS, EVF, etc!

Image quality, features, file transfer, storage, screen, build quality, lens. IBIS is a crutch and not necessary. It has a far better evf. Auto focus is better and more accurate.

I still have a couple of unanswered questions from earlier:

sybersitizen wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

The lens is not the same spec. It was developed to match the Zeiss in house developed sensor. The Sony RXIRIII is a rehashed lens from the earlier cameras.

What RX1RIII? Are you talking about the RX1RII?

You seem to be saying the lens for the RX1 series should have been redesigned when the sensor resolution changed from 24MP to 42MP. Is that your point?

I’ve used both and there is no comparison.

You've used both what? You're saying you've used an RX1R model and the ZX1? How were you able to use the ZX1?

I was able to try it and test for a week. I own an RXIRII. To my earlier post I meant the II not III. The lens is different from the Sony camera. It has been redesigned for the Zeiss camera.

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sybersitizen Forum Pro • Posts: 19,300
Re: RX1Rii users: does the ZX1 look like an upgrade?

JDLaing50 wrote:

sybersitizen wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

The lens is not the same spec. It was developed to match the Zeiss in house developed sensor. The Sony RXIRIII is a rehashed lens from the earlier cameras.

What RX1RIII? Are you talking about the RX1RII?

You seem to be saying the lens for the RX1 series should have been redesigned when the sensor resolution changed from 24MP to 42MP. Is that your point?

I’ve used both and there is no comparison.

You've used both what? You're saying you've used an RX1R model and the ZX1? How were you able to use the ZX1?

I was able to try it and test for a week. I own an RXIRII. To my earlier post I meant the II not III. The lens is different from the Sony camera. It has been redesigned for the Zeiss camera.

I'm sure the ZX1 lens design is different from the Sony lens design. Is it correct that you think the RX1 series lens should have been redesigned when the sensor resolution changed from 24MP to 42MP? Is that why you used the word rehashed?

JDLaing50 Senior Member • Posts: 2,351
Re: RX1Rii users: does the ZX1 look like an upgrade?

sybersitizen wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

sybersitizen wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

The lens is not the same spec. It was developed to match the Zeiss in house developed sensor. The Sony RXIRIII is a rehashed lens from the earlier cameras.

What RX1RIII? Are you talking about the RX1RII?

You seem to be saying the lens for the RX1 series should have been redesigned when the sensor resolution changed from 24MP to 42MP. Is that your point?

I’ve used both and there is no comparison.

You've used both what? You're saying you've used an RX1R model and the ZX1? How were you able to use the ZX1?

I was able to try it and test for a week. I own an RXIRII. To my earlier post I meant the II not III. The lens is different from the Sony camera. It has been redesigned for the Zeiss camera.

I'm sure the ZX1 lens design is different from the Sony lens design. Is it correct that you think the RX1 series lens should have been redesigned when the sensor resolution changed from 24MP to 42MP? Is that why you used the word rehashed?

Yes.

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OP Digital Nigel Forum Pro • Posts: 13,503
Re: RX1Rii users: does the ZX1 look like an upgrade?

JDLaing50 wrote:

sybersitizen wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

Digital Nigel wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

Digital Nigel wrote:

... So, is there any area where it beats the RX1Rii?

Many. And resolution at that level is not everything. It seems you’re one of the folks stuck in the pixel race for quantity and not quality.

In what way is it better, then? And surely an A7Riv with a 35mm f/1.8 lens would beat both of these cameras? Amazingly, it even has a smaller body, despite having much better controls, better AF, IBIS, EVF, etc!

Image quality, features, file transfer, storage, screen, build quality, lens. IBIS is a crutch and not necessary. It has a far better evf. Auto focus is better and more accurate.

I still have a couple of unanswered questions from earlier:

sybersitizen wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

The lens is not the same spec. It was developed to match the Zeiss in house developed sensor. The Sony RXIRIII is a rehashed lens from the earlier cameras.

What RX1RIII? Are you talking about the RX1RII?

You seem to be saying the lens for the RX1 series should have been redesigned when the sensor resolution changed from 24MP to 42MP. Is that your point?

I’ve used both and there is no comparison.

You've used both what? You're saying you've used an RX1R model and the ZX1? How were you able to use the ZX1?

I was able to try it and test for a week. I own an RXIRII. To my earlier post I meant the II not III. The lens is different from the Sony camera. It has been redesigned for the Zeiss camera.

Yes, it's certainly a different lens:

RX1: Sonnar, 8 elements in 7 groups, including three aspherical elements

ZX1: Distagon, 8 elements in 5 groups, including two double-sided aspherical elements.

But which is better?  The Sony lens sounds like it's more expensive to make. And how do these lenses compare with the Sony FE 35/1.8 lens?

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Tiffles Veteran Member • Posts: 5,042
Re: RX1Rii users: does the ZX1 look like an upgrade?

Still on rx1r first gen - does its job

will go for an rx1rii once it falls apart

the Q2 is tempting but I‘d rather take a 24mm fixed lens sony tbh

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tbcass
tbcass Forum Pro • Posts: 48,554
Re: RX1Rii users: does the ZX1 look like an upgrade?

JDLaing50 wrote:

tbcass wrote:

A camera does not need to have anything in common with another camera to be an upgrade. I am defining upgrade to mean any product that is superior to another.

It’s superior.

Not having used either camera all things said the RX1Rii seems superior to me.

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Tom

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OP Digital Nigel Forum Pro • Posts: 13,503
Re: RX1Rii users: does the ZX1 look like an upgrade?

tbcass wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

tbcass wrote:

A camera does not need to have anything in common with another camera to be an upgrade. I am defining upgrade to mean any product that is superior to another.

It’s superior.

Not having used either camera all things said the RX1Rii seems superior to me.

I think what's amazing is the sheer bulk of the ZX1. The body is larger than the A7Riv, yet it has hardly any physical controls. An A7Riv with a suitable prime lens would be superior in just about every way to the ZX1, and well as smaller and much cheaper. For example, one could use the excellent FE 24mm f/1.4 G Master lens, or dozens of other prime and zoom lenses. Indeed, for the price of the ZX1, you could probably buy the A7Riv and a couple of very good prime lenses. That would be a far superior solution.
https://camerasize.com/compare/#826,806

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sybersitizen Forum Pro • Posts: 19,300
Re: RX1Rii users: does the ZX1 look like an upgrade?
1

Digital Nigel wrote:

tbcass wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

tbcass wrote:

A camera does not need to have anything in common with another camera to be an upgrade. I am defining upgrade to mean any product that is superior to another.

It’s superior.

Not having used either camera all things said the RX1Rii seems superior to me.

I think what's amazing is the sheer bulk of the ZX1. The body is larger than the A7Riv, yet it has hardly any physical controls. An A7Riv with a suitable prime lens would be superior in just about every way to the ZX1, and well as smaller and much cheaper. For example, one could use the excellent FE 24mm f/1.4 G Master lens, or dozens of other prime and zoom lenses. Indeed, for the price of the ZX1, you could probably buy the A7Riv and a couple of very good prime lenses. That would be a far superior solution.
https://camerasize.com/compare/#826,806

The use of the word superior in this discussion comes down to personal judgment. Different cameras and camera systems almost always have both pros and cons, making one superior in some ways and inferior in other ways. And two different people looking at the same factor can consider it either superior or inferior.

If you like one overall for your use case more than you like the other overall for your use case, that's the one that's superior to you. There's not much else to say about it.

OP Digital Nigel Forum Pro • Posts: 13,503
Re: RX1Rii users: does the ZX1 look like an upgrade?

sybersitizen wrote:

Digital Nigel wrote:

tbcass wrote:

JDLaing50 wrote:

tbcass wrote:

A camera does not need to have anything in common with another camera to be an upgrade. I am defining upgrade to mean any product that is superior to another.

It’s superior.

Not having used either camera all things said the RX1Rii seems superior to me.

I think what's amazing is the sheer bulk of the ZX1. The body is larger than the A7Riv, yet it has hardly any physical controls. An A7Riv with a suitable prime lens would be superior in just about every way to the ZX1, and well as smaller and much cheaper. For example, one could use the excellent FE 24mm f/1.4 G Master lens, or dozens of other prime and zoom lenses. Indeed, for the price of the ZX1, you could probably buy the A7Riv and a couple of very good prime lenses. That would be a far superior solution.
https://camerasize.com/compare/#826,806

The use of the word superior in this discussion comes down to personal judgment. Different cameras and camera systems almost always have both pros and cons, making one superior in some ways and inferior in other ways. And two different people looking at the same factor can consider it either superior or inferior.

If you like one overall for your use case more than you like the other overall for your use case, that's the one that's superior to you. There's not much else to say about it.

True, but I struggle to think of any single area where the ZX1 is superior to existing cameras on the market.

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OP Digital Nigel Forum Pro • Posts: 13,503
Re: RX1Rii users: does the ZX1 look like an upgrade?

JDLaing50 wrote:

I was able to try it and test for a week. I own an RXIRII. To my earlier post I meant the II not III. The lens is different from the Sony camera. It has been redesigned for the Zeiss camera.

One thought occurs to me: maybe Zeiss had to create a new lens for the ZX1, as Sony almost certainly builds and owns the rights to the RX1 lens?

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mike geier
mike geier Senior Member • Posts: 2,040
Re: RX1Rii users: does the ZX1 look like an upgrade?

I agree, and the 7C does look very tempting

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