Recent M6 Mark II shutter shock study / M50 upgrade path rant

http://cameraergonomics.blogspot.com/2020/09/canon-eos-m62-does-it-produce-shutter.html

Here's another interesting study that came out recently. It really is baffling why Canon decided to remove EFCS from the M6 m2.

As much as I love stills photography on my M50, there doesn't seem to be an upgrade path that seems satisfactory to me for a lightweight system from Canon.

The M6 almost fitted the bill when it was released. I want more controls and the higher resolution sensor also seemed to promise better dynamic range. The lack of EVF I could live with, but then I really hesitated at the thought of having to worry about avoiding about focal lengths and shutter speeds that suffer from shutter shock.

Going full-frame with the RP also seemed like an option, but then I wouldn't feel happy about compromising on low-ISO dynamic range, much slower burst mode, and on top of that having to get new bigger lenses to replace my mainly EF-Ms.

Aanomalous deutan wrote:

http://cameraergonomics.blogspot.com/2020/09/canon-eos-m62-does-it-produce-shutter.html

Here's another interesting study that came out recently. It really is baffling why Canon decided to remove EFCS from the M6 m2.

It would indeed be nice to have the option.

As much as I love stills photography on my M50, there doesn't seem to be an upgrade path that seems satisfactory to me for a lightweight system from Canon.

That's unfortunate. Like many others here I'd still like an M5 Mark II to pair with my M6 Mark II. The M5ii would become my permanent Macro camera.

The M6 almost fitted the bill when it was released. I want more controls and the higher resolution sensor also seemed to promise better dynamic range.

It definitely provides all of those, plus a truly remarkable AF system that often gives me nearly a 100% hit rate, shooting some of the toughest subjects possible. Some more info found here...

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/64108171

The lack of EVF I could live with, but then I really hesitated at the thought of having to worry about avoiding about focal lengths and shutter speeds that suffer from shutter shock.

I really wouldn't worry about shutter shock. Seriously, it hasn't affected any of my shooting thus far (through tens of thousands of shots over the past year). Other M6ii owners here have had similar experiences.

In fact, I just performed the exact same test as the author of the blog you linked to here, using the same camera (M6ii), same lens (EF-M 18-150), same focal length (122 mm), same shutter speed (1/60 sec), same IS (on), same ISO (100), etc etc etc.

I took two shots in a row, handheld, using the 2-second self-timer. The first was with the Mechanical shutter, and the second was with the Electronic shutter. I can detect a difference in the images, but it's quite small and only when viewed at 100%. I'd really consider it inconsequential (for anything I'd like to shoot with this lens), and it certainly is nothing like what the tester posted in the blog above!

mShutter. 100% crops (very large files). Click on "original size"

eShutter. Zero sharpening or noise reduction applied at any stage. RAW files converted in DPP to 16-bit TIFFs, then to JPEGs in Photoshop.

Add this test to the other data you have collected. Hopefully it'll help others make a (more) informed decision too.

Good luck in your quest!

R2

I did a lot of research and read all the SS threads before I bought my M6II.

I sure did not buy a 32MP cropped sensor to use with cheap zooms.

Aanomalous deutan wrote:

http://cameraergonomics.blogspot.com/2020/09/canon-eos-m62-does-it-produce-shutter.html

Here's another interesting study that came out recently. It really is baffling why Canon decided to remove EFCS from the M6 m2.

As much as I love stills photography on my M50, there doesn't seem to be an upgrade path that seems satisfactory to me for a lightweight system from Canon.

The M6 almost fitted the bill when it was released. I want more controls and the higher resolution sensor also seemed to promise better dynamic range. The lack of EVF I could live with, but then I really hesitated at the thought of having to worry about avoiding about focal lengths and shutter speeds that suffer from shutter shock.

Going full-frame with the RP also seemed like an option, but then I wouldn't feel happy about compromising on low-ISO dynamic range,

high iso performance is much better and frankly I haven’t noticed that bad dynamic range outside, but then on the other hand I used 10D with good results for many years

much slower burst mode,

10 times bigger buffer

and on top of that having to get new bigger lenses to replace my mainly EF-Ms.

RF 50/1.8 is small

I tried a EF-S 18-55MM STM SS test with IS on.

Canon sells that lens with the 90D.

Sure not seeing it.

Electronic shutter

Mechanical shutter

raw files converted in DPP with sharpening and noise reduction in DPP set to zero, !6 bit TIFF sent to photoshop then cropped in photoshop then converted by photoshop to JPEG.

I see a difference.  The electronic is slightly sharper.

hathawayep wrote:

I see a difference. The electronic is slightly sharper.

This is with DPP NR and sharpening.

Electronic shutter wth DPP added NR and sharpening

Mechanical shutter with DPP added NR and sharpening.

This is what it did to both of them.

With DLO added with DPP.

Electronic shutter with DLO

Mechanical shutter with DLO

You need to really zoom in to see a difference ?

Electronic on the left

Agree the difference is very small and would make little difference in a final image after processing.  (print or screen use)

R2D2 wrote:

I really wouldn't worry about shutter shock. Seriously, it hasn't affected any of my shooting thus far (through tens of thousands of shots over the past year). Other M6ii owners here have had similar experiences.

In fact, I just performed the exact same test as the author of the blog you linked to here, using the same camera (M6ii), same lens (EF-M 18-150), same focal length (122 mm), same shutter speed (1/60 sec), same IS (on), same ISO (100), etc etc etc.

I took two shots in a row, handheld, using the 2-second self-timer. The first was with the Mechanical shutter, and the second was with the Electronic shutter. I can detect a difference in the images, but it's quite small and only when viewed at 100%. I'd really consider it inconsequential (for anything I'd like to shoot with this lens), and it certainly is nothing like what the tester posted in the blog above!

I wonder what accounts for the difference.  He shows a very pronounced doubling of the image.  (Or maybe it's even a multiple image.)  You show just a slight vertical motion.

ThrillaMozilla wrote:

R2D2 wrote:

I really wouldn't worry about shutter shock. Seriously, it hasn't affected any of my shooting thus far (through tens of thousands of shots over the past year). Other M6ii owners here have had similar experiences.

In fact, I just performed the exact same test as the author of the blog you linked to here, using the same camera (M6ii), same lens (EF-M 18-150), same focal length (122 mm), same shutter speed (1/60 sec), same IS (on), same ISO (100), etc etc etc.

I took two shots in a row, handheld, using the 2-second self-timer. The first was with the Mechanical shutter, and the second was with the Electronic shutter. I can detect a difference in the images, but it's quite small and only when viewed at 100%. I'd really consider it inconsequential (for anything I'd like to shoot with this lens), and it certainly is nothing like what the tester posted in the blog above!

I wonder what accounts for the difference. He shows a very pronounced doubling of the image. (Or maybe it's even a multiple image.) You show just a slight vertical motion.

https://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2017/02/things-you-didnt-want-to-know-about-zoom-lenses/

For a real good test you would need several lenses and bodies ?

I just noticed this discussion. I took four pictures with 18-150 lens at 150mm, 1/60s, iOS 6400, 2 with E-shutter, 2 with M-shutter. Both pictures with M-shutter are blurry. Here is a side by side comparision. The left one is using E-shutter. It seems that I have to use E-shutter for most of times.

m100 wrote:

ThrillaMozilla wrote:

R2D2 wrote:

I really wouldn't worry about shutter shock. Seriously, it hasn't affected any of my shooting thus far (through tens of thousands of shots over the past year). Other M6ii owners here have had similar experiences.

In fact, I just performed the exact same test as the author of the blog you linked to here, using the same camera (M6ii), same lens (EF-M 18-150), same focal length (122 mm), same shutter speed (1/60 sec), same IS (on), same ISO (100), etc etc etc.

I took two shots in a row, handheld, using the 2-second self-timer. The first was with the Mechanical shutter, and the second was with the Electronic shutter. I can detect a difference in the images, but it's quite small and only when viewed at 100%. I'd really consider it inconsequential (for anything I'd like to shoot with this lens), and it certainly is nothing like what the tester posted in the blog above!

I wonder what accounts for the difference. He shows a very pronounced doubling of the image. (Or maybe it's even a multiple image.) You show just a slight vertical motion.

https://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2017/02/things-you-didnt-want-to-know-about-zoom-lenses/

For a real good test you would need several lenses and bodies ?

Some people have tried with different lenses (but one copy of each lens), but I don't know if anyone has done the test with multiple bodies.  Maybe someone can interest Roger Cicala in doing this kind of testing.

I'm kind of bummed out about this, actually.

It is only lenses with IS that do this ?

I don't have a prime with IS or a zoom without IS to test.

Looking at all my car show photos I think I should have done more of them using my 22MM.

I was being lazy and used a zoom. Most all have been sold and it really freed up a lot of room in my dry box.

I want to be zoom free so it is not a bummer for me.

ThrillaMozilla wrote:

R2D2 wrote:

I really wouldn't worry about shutter shock. Seriously, it hasn't affected any of my shooting thus far (through tens of thousands of shots over the past year). Other M6ii owners here have had similar experiences.

In fact, I just performed the exact same test as the author of the blog you linked to here, using the same camera (M6ii), same lens (EF-M 18-150), same focal length (122 mm), same shutter speed (1/60 sec), same IS (on), same ISO (100), etc etc etc.

I took two shots in a row, handheld, using the 2-second self-timer. The first was with the Mechanical shutter, and the second was with the Electronic shutter. I can detect a difference in the images, but it's quite small and only when viewed at 100%. I'd really consider it inconsequential (for anything I'd like to shoot with this lens), and it certainly is nothing like what the tester posted in the blog above!

I wonder what accounts for the difference. He shows a very pronounced doubling of the image. (Or maybe it's even a multiple image.) You show just a slight vertical motion.

Only a couple of possibilities. Either testing inconsistencies, or equipment variability.

I check every image I shoot at the pixel level for sharpness and focus, and maybe my particular copy of the M6ii is just more immune to shutter shock than others. I shoot a lot of frames, and many (most actually) are at high fps, so perhaps my shutter is just broken-in better, if there is such a thing. I’m also pretty adept at handholding at the lower shutter speeds where shutter shock would be more prevalent, so maybe the blur that some are attributing to shutter shock might instead be simple camera shake. Who knows?

In any case, I’ve never had shutter shock ruin any of my images. It doesn’t even receive any consideration. I indeed hope all are as lucky!

R2

ThrillaMozilla wrote:

R2D2 wrote:

I really wouldn't worry about shutter shock. Seriously, it hasn't affected any of my shooting thus far (through tens of thousands of shots over the past year). Other M6ii owners here have had similar experiences.

In fact, I just performed the exact same test as the author of the blog you linked to here, using the same camera (M6ii), same lens (EF-M 18-150), same focal length (122 mm), same shutter speed (1/60 sec), same IS (on), same ISO (100), etc etc etc.

I took two shots in a row, handheld, using the 2-second self-timer. The first was with the Mechanical shutter, and the second was with the Electronic shutter. I can detect a difference in the images, but it's quite small and only when viewed at 100%. I'd really consider it inconsequential (for anything I'd like to shoot with this lens), and it certainly is nothing like what the tester posted in the blog above!

I wonder what accounts for the difference. He shows a very pronounced doubling of the image. (Or maybe it's even a multiple image.) You show just a slight vertical motion.

Hmmm.  I know that I can handhold pretty darn well (lots of practice!).  Maybe a lot of the shock that's been experienced by others is from pressing the shutter perhaps?

R2

I can’t understand why they still hasn’t fixed this serious issue in m62 by new FW.

R2D2 wrote:

ThrillaMozilla wrote:

R2D2 wrote:

I really wouldn't worry about shutter shock. Seriously, it hasn't affected any of my shooting thus far (through tens of thousands of shots over the past year). Other M6ii owners here have had similar experiences.

In fact, I just performed the exact same test as the author of the blog you linked to here, using the same camera (M6ii), same lens (EF-M 18-150), same focal length (122 mm), same shutter speed (1/60 sec), same IS (on), same ISO (100), etc etc etc.

I took two shots in a row, handheld, using the 2-second self-timer. The first was with the Mechanical shutter, and the second was with the Electronic shutter. I can detect a difference in the images, but it's quite small and only when viewed at 100%. I'd really consider it inconsequential (for anything I'd like to shoot with this lens), and it certainly is nothing like what the tester posted in the blog above!

I wonder what accounts for the difference. He shows a very pronounced doubling of the image. (Or maybe it's even a multiple image.) You show just a slight vertical motion.

Hmmm. I know that I can handhold pretty darn well (lots of practice!). Maybe a lot of the shock that's been experienced by others is from pressing the shutter perhaps?

R2

Unfortunately, there is definitely a significant shutter shock.  I did a lot of tests handheld.  I don't have time to post my images, but it's not imaginary.  My images were all fine with electronic shutter, but alas not with the mechanical shutter.  In my tests it wasn't as bad as one might think, and it can be mitigated very well with a monopod, but I try to avoid 1/60 to 1/250 second with the EF-M 15-45.  I had better luck with EF-S lenses.