Required space on iPad for photos library

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Majeur New Member • Posts: 7
Required space on iPad for photos library

I am thinking about to quit with lightroom and start with Raw Power in combination with the mac photos library. So far I do like the app (eventually in combination with Affinity).

What I just cant figure out is the following. For example, I take the 2Tb iCloud storage option. Lets say the Photos Library will take 500Gb. That should be no problem so far on

Raw Power has also an app for the iPad.my iMac.
What if I want to see and edit the photos on my iPad with 256Gb storage? Will that be possible or does the storage on the iPad also have to be at least 500Gb?

ChrisLumix Veteran Member • Posts: 3,133
Re: Required space on iPad for photos library

Majeur wrote:

I am thinking about to quit with lightroom and start with Raw Power in combination with the mac photos library. So far I do like the app (eventually in combination with Affinity).

What I just cant figure out is the following. For example, I take the 2Tb iCloud storage option. Lets say the Photos Library will take 500Gb. That should be no problem so far on

Raw Power has also an app for the iPad.my iMac.
What if I want to see and edit the photos on my iPad with 256Gb storage? Will that be possible or does the storage on the iPad also have to be at least 500Gb?

You don't have to have the same storage on iPad as you have on either Mac or iCloud. Just make sure you don't sync from either to the iPad. To see your pictures, just go to iCloud on the iPad and view them normally. When you want to edit a photo on your iPad you can download the picture, and work on it.

What I'm not sure about is whether your changes are saved back to iCloud automatically, or whether you have to do this separately. Probably automatic with 'hand off'?.

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Andy Hewitt Veteran Member • Posts: 4,274
Re: Required space on iPad for photos library

Majeur wrote:

I am thinking about to quit with lightroom and start with Raw Power in combination with the mac photos library. So far I do like the app (eventually in combination with Affinity).

What I just cant figure out is the following. For example, I take the 2Tb iCloud storage option. Lets say the Photos Library will take 500Gb. That should be no problem so far on

Raw Power has also an app for the iPad.my iMac.
What if I want to see and edit the photos on my iPad with 256Gb storage? Will that be possible or does the storage on the iPad also have to be at least 500Gb?

I’ve got a similar set up, about 600GB of photos in my 2TB storage, using Raw Power.

My Photos Library takes up 9.6GB on the iPad and 75GB on my iMac. Raw Power is using about 3GB on the iPad (don’t use it on the iMac, although it’s installed). Both devices have 500GB of storage. My iPad is only using about 25% of its storage overall.

The iCloud system automatically manages the space requirements for each device, downloading, storing and deleting local caches as needed. All the originals are kept in the cloud, so you can view your entire library on almost any size of mobile device.

You can use the edits from Raw Power on both devices, only images being worked on are downloaded locally, which is handled by the OS.

I’ve been viewing my full collection between the 512GB iPad Pro, my 512GB iMac and a 64GB iPhone.

There’s even my old Lightroom library still syncing at the moment too.

So no, you don’t need to worry about space (to a certain degree anyway) between the devices, as long as you have sufficient cloud space for the library to upload, and local storage for editing at least some images at a time.

Raw Power also enables you to sync its edits across the devices too, so you can edit on a mobile device, and then re-edit, or continue editing on a desktop (as an example).

Cheers

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Andy H

 Andy Hewitt's gear list:Andy Hewitt's gear list
Nikon D5100 Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 18-135mm f/3.5-5.6G ED-IF Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 35mm F1.8G Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 55-300mm f/4.5-5.6G ED VR Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6G VR II +6 more
OP Majeur New Member • Posts: 7
Re: Required space on iPad for photos library

Andy Hewitt wrote:

Majeur wrote:

I am thinking about to quit with lightroom and start with Raw Power in combination with the mac photos library. So far I do like the app (eventually in combination with Affinity).

What I just cant figure out is the following. For example, I take the 2Tb iCloud storage option. Lets say the Photos Library will take 500Gb. That should be no problem so far on

Raw Power has also an app for the iPad.my iMac.
What if I want to see and edit the photos on my iPad with 256Gb storage? Will that be possible or does the storage on the iPad also have to be at least 500Gb?

I’ve got a similar set up, about 600GB of photos in my 2TB storage, using Raw Power.

My Photos Library takes up 9.6GB on the iPad and 75GB on my iMac. Raw Power is using about 3GB on the iPad (don’t use it on the iMac, although it’s installed). Both devices have 500GB of storage. My iPad is only using about 25% of its storage overall.

The iCloud system automatically manages the space requirements for each device, downloading, storing and deleting local caches as needed. All the originals are kept in the cloud, so you can view your entire library on almost any size of mobile device.

You can use the edits from Raw Power on both devices, only images being worked on are downloaded locally, which is handled by the OS.

I’ve been viewing my full collection between the 512GB iPad Pro, my 512GB iMac and a 64GB iPhone.

There’s even my old Lightroom library still syncing at the moment too.

So no, you don’t need to worry about space (to a certain degree anyway) between the devices, as long as you have sufficient cloud space for the library to upload, and local storage for editing at least some images at a time.

Raw Power also enables you to sync its edits across the devices too, so you can edit on a mobile device, and then re-edit, or continue editing on a desktop (as an example).

Cheers

Ah this is good to know. When you view your images on the iPad pro, does it have full resolution?
I am using now Lightroom classic with the 20Gb storage option. Via smart albums, the (edited) raw images on my mac are synced to the adobe cloud. So I can view them on my iPad, however these are smart previews with a low resolution which I don't like to view at my iPad pro. Especially with macro photos you loose a lot of details.

How do you like Raw Power? I think its a great app and I do miss a few things (spot removal, watermarks, dehaze).
I am looking at Affinity now to see if this combination will meets my need.
So far, I'm getting more and more enthusiastic about the combination of Raw Power and Photos!

Andy Hewitt Veteran Member • Posts: 4,274
Re: Required space on iPad for photos library

Majeur wrote:

Andy Hewitt wrote:

I’ve got a similar set up, about 600GB of photos in my 2TB storage, using Raw Power.

My Photos Library takes up 9.6GB on the iPad and 75GB on my iMac. Raw Power is using about 3GB on the iPad (don’t use it on the iMac, although it’s installed). Both devices have 500GB of storage. My iPad is only using about 25% of its storage overall.

The iCloud system automatically manages the space requirements for each device, downloading, storing and deleting local caches as needed. All the originals are kept in the cloud, so you can view your entire library on almost any size of mobile device.

You can use the edits from Raw Power on both devices, only images being worked on are downloaded locally, which is handled by the OS.

I’ve been viewing my full collection between the 512GB iPad Pro, my 512GB iMac and a 64GB iPhone.

There’s even my old Lightroom library still syncing at the moment too.

So no, you don’t need to worry about space (to a certain degree anyway) between the devices, as long as you have sufficient cloud space for the library to upload, and local storage for editing at least some images at a time.

Raw Power also enables you to sync its edits across the devices too, so you can edit on a mobile device, and then re-edit, or continue editing on a desktop (as an example).

Cheers

Ah this is good to know. When you view your images on the iPad pro, does it have full resolution?

Just by doing a side by side zoom-in comparison, it’s hard to tell, but they look similar. Trouble is I have a Retina display iPad Pro, and an old non-Retina iMac, so the resolution is better on the iPad anyway, and the iPad version can zoom in further than the desktop version.

Viewing the Info in Raw Power, they all have full resolution - indeed Raw Power does operate on the original Raw file, where as I understand it, Photos works on the JPEG preview when editing (although it saves as non-destructive edits). In practice, I can’t tell the difference.

I use Raw Power mainly because Photos on the iPad lacks a histogram, and the Raw Process tools in Raw Power work very nicely as a pre-edit workflow.

I am using now Lightroom classic with the 20Gb storage option. Via smart albums, the (edited) raw images on my mac are synced to the adobe cloud. So I can view them on my iPad, however these are smart previews with a low resolution which I don't like to view at my iPad pro. Especially with macro photos you loose a lot of details.

Yes, the Lightroom Classic only syncing does limit things somewhat. I think it’s designed more for doing quick edits in the field, and maybe some quick viewing of batches of images.

How do you like Raw Power? I think its a great app and I do miss a few things (spot removal, watermarks, dehaze).

Yeah, it does lack those for sure, although it’s actually quite nice to learn editing without some of those tools. I never use watermarks, and other things like spot removal, dehaze and red-eye can be done either back in Photos, or another app (of course you lose the non-destructive workflow, but if you plan the workflow right, it’s a generally acceptable way to do it.

I am looking at Affinity now to see if this combination will meets my need.
So far, I'm getting more and more enthusiastic about the combination of Raw Power and Photos!

Yeah, I’m still mulling over Affinity, it does break the integrated workflow somewhat, but as you say, does have a lot of excellent features.

I’d think that a Raw Power + Affinity workflow would be a good option, using Photos as the central storage point. Although I’d personally only use it for doing some creative edits. I tend to edit for a fairly neutral look, and enhance only where I think it will add to the look of the photo, and only fix stuff if it really annoys me, or detracts from the subject of the photo.

Also check our Pixelmator, it’s so cheap on the iPad it’s a no-brainer to just install it, and have it handy - it does have some fairly decent AI stuff, and intranets fairly well with photos, although it does create a secondary file that’s as big as the original, so will eat storage space if you use it a lot - similarly with Affinity too, if you use non-destructive editing, it also creates a huge secondary file.

To be clear, my photos are all amateur, and only used for my own pleasure, and for the family. I don’t sell any, or display many publicly, so I have different priorities to, say a ‘pro’, or such like.

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Andy H

 Andy Hewitt's gear list:Andy Hewitt's gear list
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robgendreau Veteran Member • Posts: 7,617
Re: Required space on iPad for photos library

Majeur wrote:

Ah this is good to know. When you view your images on the iPad pro, does it have full resolution?
I am using now Lightroom classic with the 20Gb storage option. Via smart albums, the (edited) raw images on my mac are synced to the adobe cloud. So I can view them on my iPad, however these are smart previews with a low resolution which I don't like to view at my iPad pro. Especially with macro photos you loose a lot of details.

How do you like Raw Power? I think its a great app and I do miss a few things (spot removal, watermarks, dehaze).
I am looking at Affinity now to see if this combination will meets my need.
So far, I'm getting more and more enthusiastic about the combination of Raw Power and Photos!

Photos and iCloud Photo Library do some sophisticated work to optimize storage, but they too don't just download all your raws to other devices. It can work quite well, but note you don't have the same manual control you do with Lr Classic. Indeed, Lr non-Classic is a more apt comparison, as it is like iCloud Photo Library in that it manages the storage in the background. Both try to not send originals unless you need them (in the background), and make use of caches that can grow and synch.

A good explanation is here: https://www.macworld.com/article/3385041/how-to-cope-with-a-photos-library-too-big-to-fit-on-an-internal-mac-drive.html

As for resolution, Classic sends a smart preview that is max 2560 IIRC on the long side, which is just a hair short of the max resolution of the 12.9" iPad Pro. Not sure if Apple's are any bigger.

But as Andy noted, RAW Power is for raw and it wants the RAW file anyway. Before you commit read this carefully about the complex world of raw editing with Photos: https://tidbits.com/2019/06/14/the-ins-and-outs-of-non-destructive-editing-in-photos-for-mac-and-ios/ Bottom line, be VERY careful not to edit images in Photos first.

And note that Apple's raw conversion hasn't caught up with newer cameras (and there seem to be quite a few, at least one bright spot in 2020).

Andy Hewitt Veteran Member • Posts: 4,274
Re: Required space on iPad for photos library

robgendreau wrote:

Majeur wrote:

Ah this is good to know. When you view your images on the iPad pro, does it have full resolution?
I am using now Lightroom classic with the 20Gb storage option. Via smart albums, the (edited) raw images on my mac are synced to the adobe cloud. So I can view them on my iPad, however these are smart previews with a low resolution which I don't like to view at my iPad pro. Especially with macro photos you loose a lot of details.

How do you like Raw Power? I think its a great app and I do miss a few things (spot removal, watermarks, dehaze).
I am looking at Affinity now to see if this combination will meets my need.
So far, I'm getting more and more enthusiastic about the combination of Raw Power and Photos!

Photos and iCloud Photo Library do some sophisticated work to optimize storage, but they too don't just download all your raws to other devices. It can work quite well, but note you don't have the same manual control you do with Lr Classic. Indeed, Lr non-Classic is a more apt comparison, as it is like iCloud Photo Library in that it manages the storage in the background. Both try to not send originals unless you need them (in the background), and make use of caches that can grow and synch.

A good explanation is here: https://www.macworld.com/article/3385041/how-to-cope-with-a-photos-library-too-big-to-fit-on-an-internal-mac-drive.html

As for resolution, Classic sends a smart preview that is max 2560 IIRC on the long side, which is just a hair short of the max resolution of the 12.9" iPad Pro. Not sure if Apple's are any bigger.

I’ve just been hunting through the EXIF data as I’m trying out ‘Investigator’. I’ve noticed a tag in the data on a Raw NEF file titled FullSizeRender.jpg. So I’m guessing that there are indeed full res versions used by Photos.

However, I’m not completely sure if that’s due to me editing them with Raw Power, or whether that’s the standard. Viewing the data for an unedited image shows information that it’s the full size original being used.

But as Andy noted, RAW Power is for raw and it wants the RAW file anyway. Before you commit read this carefully about the complex world of raw editing with Photos: https://tidbits.com/2019/06/14/the-ins-and-outs-of-non-destructive-editing-in-photos-for-mac-and-ios/ Bottom line, be VERY careful not to edit images in Photos first.

Thanks for adding that, I should have included that detail a bit more.

Although it is relevant to editing Raws in general, and not specific to Photos.

And note that Apple's raw conversion hasn't caught up with newer cameras (and there seem to be quite a few, at least one bright spot in 2020).

I seem to remember that someone did some research on this a few years ago, and found that generally the Apple Raw updates were as frequent as others, albeit perhaps a little further behind. It’s probably not as good since they stopped support for Aperture though.

There’s plenty of messages on the Adobe forums requesting new camera and/or lens updates.

Sometimes converting to DNG can be a workaround too, although there are caveats with that.

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Andy H

 Andy Hewitt's gear list:Andy Hewitt's gear list
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OP Majeur New Member • Posts: 7
Re: Required space on iPad for photos library

Thanks for the comments so far, its very helpful for me.
Yeah I do realize that i have to be careful when using the Photos Library as my main source. There are a few reasons that I am thinking about quitting with Adobe. The latest issue happened last week. I imported images from an sd card to Lightroom on the iPad. No problems thus far. The next day I opened Lightroom classic on my macbook. I could see the imported images there. But then I noticed that the total images account was quit a bit lower than the day before. About 200 images where missing. Not the images I just imported but images in different maps. Not all images in one map but a few in a lot of different maps. I do have a backup of all my images. But it took me a lot off time to find out which images, in which maps where missing. After that i decided to seriously spend time to find out, how and what the way is to move from Lightroom to another solution.
One of this solutions is moving to Photos Library which seams to be the most logical for my needs.
So I am figuring out now what should be a good workflow.
I would like to hear if you have any tips about a good workflow or any other solution:)

Andy Hewitt Veteran Member • Posts: 4,274
Re: Required space on iPad for photos library
1

Majeur wrote:

Thanks for the comments so far, its very helpful for me.
Yeah I do realize that i have to be careful when using the Photos Library as my main source. There are a few reasons that I am thinking about quitting with Adobe. The latest issue happened last week. I imported images from an sd card to Lightroom on the iPad. No problems thus far. The next day I opened Lightroom classic on my macbook. I could see the imported images there. But then I noticed that the total images account was quit a bit lower than the day before. About 200 images where missing. Not the images I just imported but images in different maps. Not all images in one map but a few in a lot of different maps. I do have a backup of all my images. But it took me a lot off time to find out which images, in which maps where missing. After that i decided to seriously spend time to find out, how and what the way is to move from Lightroom to another solution.
One of this solutions is moving to Photos Library which seams to be the most logical for my needs.

Yeah, in truth, I wouldn’t be relying on any cloud service for your entire backup of data. None of them have proven to be 100% reliable.

Indeed, data security/integrity is very hard to get 100%, regardless of the medium you choose (there’s always a chance of some kind of failure, whether it be network outages, bugs, change to services provided, or hardware failures).

I have seen similar issues with Photos in the past, although fortunately that was just missing images in albums (not sure what you mean by ‘maps’?), and they were still available in the main library.

So I am figuring out now what should be a good workflow.
I would like to hear if you have any tips about a good workflow or any other solution:)

I’m still kind of working on the ideal solution for the iPad, as I’m quite new to this environment.

However, I have always imported twice off my SD cards from the camera. First I import into Photos (or it could have been Lightroom, Aperture, or a n other). I have dabbled with using a temporary working folder for culling prior to importing (using FastRawViewer). I then import a second time onto a separate external hard drive, which is my archive of untouched images in a standard date based folder structure (I use the iMac to do this at the moment, but can be handled using Files on the iPad if needed). This is included in my Time Machine backup too.

I also still have my Lightroom libraries (both the old Classic one, and the Lightroom cloudy local storage) on separate hard drives.

So, overall I have plenty of redundant copies in case I screw up, or the worst happens to any services or equipment.

As I have fairly decent unlimited broadband here, I don’t actually bother culling prior to importing to Photos. I arrange the photos into a new Album, which are files in year order, named for the even with the date appended, then sorted as ‘oldest first’. It doesn’t matter if I use the iMac or the iPad, the end result is the same.

I let them sync fully to the cloud, as that improves workflow if they’re not using processor speed with the updating that’s done.

Then I do all my editing in Raw Power (up to now I am working through re-editing my collection after migrating from Lightroom, so have been using a short and sweet workflow to just get basic editing done).

If I need anything doing more than Raw Power can manage, I might use Photos to apply things like noise reduction, red-eye, spot removal etc. I haven’t started using other apps as yet, but have Pixelmator available, and might buy Affinity Photo when I feel it can serve a purpose for me.

That’s it really. Although I sometimes do some organising using my iMac as it’s just a little easier to manage, but eventually I’m intending to be iPad only.

This is of course just my take on it, there are plenty of options for how to go about this.


Andy H

 Andy Hewitt's gear list:Andy Hewitt's gear list
Nikon D5100 Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 18-135mm f/3.5-5.6G ED-IF Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 35mm F1.8G Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 55-300mm f/4.5-5.6G ED VR Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6G VR II +6 more
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