Autofocus most likely limitations, my camera or lens? (Or me!)

I’ve been shooting BiF, namely puffins. They are small and shoot about like little bullets. My T7i and Tamron 100-400 struggle, i feel i follow them and say get an AF point on a wing or something with a decent DoF, but seems to miss focus most times. I appreciate this could be my technique, but i was wondering from a technology side, which would be the limitation in my setup?

Body or lens? Or both?    I have a t7i and Tamron 100-400.    Would using a Canon 100-400 L II  autofocus better? Or do i need a 7dii or 1dx? Or both? My camera has no way to alter any AF settings in terms of sensitivity and things like the 80d allows.

Digirame wrote:

It's hard to say, without samples. How many AF points are you using?

Hello. I noticed this thread wasn’t getting traction so i made a thread in the camera buying advice forum. I added samples there.

Ad12 wrote:

I’ve been shooting BiF, namely puffins. They are small and shoot about like little bullets. My T7i and Tamron 100-400 struggle, i feel i follow them and say get an AF point on a wing or something with a decent DoF, but seems to miss focus most times. I appreciate this could be my technique, but i was wondering from a technology side, which would be the limitation in my setup?

Body or lens? Or both? I have a t7i and Tamron 100-400. Would using a Canon 100-400 L II autofocus better? Or do i need a 7dii or 1dx? Or both? My camera has no way to alter any AF settings in terms of sensitivity and things like the 80d allows.

please check my earlier photos at my flickr site.. Plenty of Good BIFS with the t7i.  90D better but not really that much

Digirame wrote:

A lot of us are taking pictures on the weekend, so we may not be as active on the forums. If you want to show your Puffin photos on the Show Your Snaps thread, there are a couple of fellows that do a great job taking BIFs. One has (or had) a Canon T7i and Canon 90D. The other has a Canon T6, Canon 80D and Canon 90D. They love taking pictures of birds in flight. I would expect that they would comment today or tomorrow. I don't do that much, so that would be better for them to help you. That would be Rocket and CD. There may be others that I can't remember without checking. Rocket has a Tamron 100-400, Tamron 150-600 and Canon 100-400 - II lenses.

Because that thread is so popular I had to start a Part II version today. Tomorrow I'll start a new weekly thread for that. So post as much as you want. It's getting those kinds of details and feedback that would help.

Thanks for the feedback. I added samples and details to the thread in the camera buying help forum (I asked do I need a new camera or lens). Apologies for duplication, it just seemed to get more feedback! But I do appreciate people have lives!  I will have a look at the thread you mention.

Ad12 wrote:

I’ve been shooting BiF, namely puffins. They are small and shoot about like little bullets. My T7i and Tamron 100-400 struggle, i feel i follow them and say get an AF point on a wing or something with a decent DoF, but seems to miss focus most times. I appreciate this could be my technique, but i was wondering from a technology side, which would be the limitation in my setup?

Body or lens? Or both? I have a t7i and Tamron 100-400. Would using a Canon 100-400 L II autofocus better? Or do i need a 7dii or 1dx? Or both? My camera has no way to alter any AF settings in terms of sensitivity and things like the 80d allows.

Both pieces of technology mentioned above are entry level for BIF especially for fast targets

hello, i appreciate the responses. Half way down or more this thread I've added two examples (there are more of course I have), of the issues I'm facing.

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4505509

I also just read Canon won't be replacing their 90d/7dii with DSLR's and the line may have ended. My lens can be used on mirrorless, but i'd want a used body I think based on this information. Or i bankrupt myself and commit to Fujifilm. I do enjoy the DSLR though for this as it also acts like binoculars in that I can see the animals myself and their behavior.

Have you tried single AF point?  I’m not a BIF specialist as some other people here but I do a lot of birding and CDMazoff, one of our kingpins around here told me to stick with single AF point.

I have no experience with your tamron lens but BIF require fast lens.

I’m using the original 7D from 2009 and it’s doing a good job except for ISO noise at 1600 and over but for the rest, it works fine. I stick to the single AF point 99% of the time along with the AI servo function. Basically I created a custom function at 1/1600, f5.6, AI servo, and Auto ISO. In some occasions I will slow speed to 1/1000 and/or aperture at f5.6 or 6.3 (my lens combo is limited at f5.6) but I always stick to these values. I also have a second setup with automatic exposure compensation at 1/3 and it often helps.

benjilafouine wrote:

Have you tried single AF point? I’m not a BIF specialist as some other people here but I do a lot of birding and CDMazoff, one of our kingpins around here told me to stick with single AF point.

I have no experience with your tamron lens but BIF require fast lens.

I’m using the original 7D from 2009 and it’s doing a good job except for ISO noise at 1600 and over but for the rest, it works fine. I stick to the single AF point 99% of the time along with the AI servo function. Basically I created a custom function at 1/1600, f5.6, AI servo, and Auto ISO. In some occasions I will slow speed to 1/1000 and/or aperture at f5.6 or 6.3 (my lens combo is limited at f5.6) but I always stick to these values. I also have a second setup with automatic exposure compensation at 1/3 and it often helps.

I’m not sure I could follow them with a single point at the speeds and size of them! I can give it a try. My camera has no custom function buttons on the top or anything and not many buttons so it’s tough to set that stuff up.  Good advice though thank you

benjilafouine wrote:

Have you tried single AF point? I’m not a BIF specialist as some other people here but I do a lot of birding and CDMazoff, one of our kingpins around here told me to stick with single AF point.

I have no experience with your tamron lens but BIF require fast lens.

I’m using the original 7D from 2009 and it’s doing a good job except for ISO noise at 1600 and over but for the rest, it works fine. I stick to the single AF point 99% of the time along with the AI servo function. Basically I created a custom function at 1/1600, f5.6, AI servo, and Auto ISO. In some occasions I will slow speed to 1/1000 and/or aperture at f5.6 or 6.3 (my lens combo is limited at f5.6) but I always stick to these values. I also have a second setup with automatic exposure compensation at 1/3 and it often helps.

Thanks for the compliment Benji, although everything I learned (mostly) I learned on this forum!!! Way to go Digi an my old friend Mocha (wherever he is)

Basically thsi is what I've found.  The 90D makes a BIG difference to me because I get my shots at either end of the burst and not the middle. Go figger. It think is has to do with my brain lag rhythm... So, for instance the Purple Martin's in flight?  Wow,, but I took those after he stopped flying.. (or so I thought)

On the ground here in Victoria I have been mentored by Kip Hutchison and Gary Woodburn among others...

My basic setup is use a MONOPOD..... If possible use 9 point but focus on centre point.  Always test shots for EC.   If glarey use partial metering; if not, use evaluative (thanks Rocket)

If birds are on a perch or a nest (like the Osprey coming in...PRE-FOCUS... Use either 9 point or SPOT focus of center point of 9

If you have enough light, put the shutter speed up!!!!

ISO on the 90D is VARIABLE depending on time of year and angle of sun...Not all 6400s work.. Ask Digi about this. He's the high ISO king..

MOST IMPORTANT;  Study your birds.... and then prefocus the area if you can.. You don't want to chase them; you want to capture them when they enter your zone.

Last rule.. All great shot happen by accident!!!

cdmazoff wrote:

benjilafouine wrote:

Have you tried single AF point? I’m not a BIF specialist as some other people here but I do a lot of birding and CDMazoff, one of our kingpins around here told me to stick with single AF point.

I have no experience with your tamron lens but BIF require fast lens.

I’m using the original 7D from 2009 and it’s doing a good job except for ISO noise at 1600 and over but for the rest, it works fine. I stick to the single AF point 99% of the time along with the AI servo function. Basically I created a custom function at 1/1600, f5.6, AI servo, and Auto ISO. In some occasions I will slow speed to 1/1000 and/or aperture at f5.6 or 6.3 (my lens combo is limited at f5.6) but I always stick to these values. I also have a second setup with automatic exposure compensation at 1/3 and it often helps.

Thanks for the compliment Benji, although everything I learned (mostly) I learned on this forum!!! Way to go Digi an my old friend Mocha (wherever he is)

Basically thsi is what I've found. The 90D makes a BIG difference to me because I get my shots at either end of the burst and not the middle. Go figger. It think is has to do with my brain lag rhythm... So, for instance the Purple Martin's in flight? Wow,, but I took those after he stopped flying.. (or so I thought)

On the ground here in Victoria I have been mentored by Kip Hutchison and Gary Woodburn among others...

My basic setup is use a MONOPOD..... If possible use 9 point but focus on centre point. Always test shots for EC. If glarey use partial metering; if not, use evaluative (thanks Rocket)

If birds are on a perch or a nest (like the Osprey coming in...PRE-FOCUS... Use either 9 point or SPOT focus of center point of 9

If you have enough light, put the shutter speed up!!!!

ISO on the 90D is VARIABLE depending on time of year and angle of sun...Not all 6400s work.. Ask Digi about this. He's the high ISO king..

MOST IMPORTANT; Study your birds.... and then prefocus the area if you can.. You don't want to chase them; you want to capture them when they enter your zone.

Last rule.. All great shot happen by accident!!!

From what I read the OP is trying to track smaller birds so the 9 point center focus is interesting. I’ll try it too with hummingbirds.

benjilafouine wrote:

cdmazoff wrote:

benjilafouine wrote:

Have you tried single AF point? I’m not a BIF specialist as some other people here but I do a lot of birding and CDMazoff, one of our kingpins around here told me to stick with single AF point.

I have no experience with your tamron lens but BIF require fast lens.

I’m using the original 7D from 2009 and it’s doing a good job except for ISO noise at 1600 and over but for the rest, it works fine. I stick to the single AF point 99% of the time along with the AI servo function. Basically I created a custom function at 1/1600, f5.6, AI servo, and Auto ISO. In some occasions I will slow speed to 1/1000 and/or aperture at f5.6 or 6.3 (my lens combo is limited at f5.6) but I always stick to these values. I also have a second setup with automatic exposure compensation at 1/3 and it often helps.

Thanks for the compliment Benji, although everything I learned (mostly) I learned on this forum!!! Way to go Digi an my old friend Mocha (wherever he is)

Basically thsi is what I've found. The 90D makes a BIG difference to me because I get my shots at either end of the burst and not the middle. Go figger. It think is has to do with my brain lag rhythm... So, for instance the Purple Martin's in flight? Wow,, but I took those after he stopped flying.. (or so I thought)

On the ground here in Victoria I have been mentored by Kip Hutchison and Gary Woodburn among others...

My basic setup is use a MONOPOD..... If possible use 9 point but focus on centre point. Always test shots for EC. If glarey use partial metering; if not, use evaluative (thanks Rocket)

If birds are on a perch or a nest (like the Osprey coming in...PRE-FOCUS... Use either 9 point or SPOT focus of center point of 9

If you have enough light, put the shutter speed up!!!!

ISO on the 90D is VARIABLE depending on time of year and angle of sun...Not all 6400s work.. Ask Digi about this. He's the high ISO king..

MOST IMPORTANT; Study your birds.... and then prefocus the area if you can.. You don't want to chase them; you want to capture them when they enter your zone.

Last rule.. All great shot happen by accident!!!

From what I read the OP is trying to track smaller birds so the 9 point center focus is interesting. I’ll try it too with hummingbirds.

If you can fill your frame with 9 points and a hummer flies in there, you got him.. If you wait to try to nail him with one point you might just get dizzy

cdmazoff wrote:

benjilafouine wrote:

cdmazoff wrote:

benjilafouine wrote:

Have you tried single AF point? I’m not a BIF specialist as some other people here but I do a lot of birding and CDMazoff, one of our kingpins around here told me to stick with single AF point.

I have no experience with your tamron lens but BIF require fast lens.

I’m using the original 7D from 2009 and it’s doing a good job except for ISO noise at 1600 and over but for the rest, it works fine. I stick to the single AF point 99% of the time along with the AI servo function. Basically I created a custom function at 1/1600, f5.6, AI servo, and Auto ISO. In some occasions I will slow speed to 1/1000 and/or aperture at f5.6 or 6.3 (my lens combo is limited at f5.6) but I always stick to these values. I also have a second setup with automatic exposure compensation at 1/3 and it often helps.

Thanks for the compliment Benji, although everything I learned (mostly) I learned on this forum!!! Way to go Digi an my old friend Mocha (wherever he is)

Basically thsi is what I've found. The 90D makes a BIG difference to me because I get my shots at either end of the burst and not the middle. Go figger. It think is has to do with my brain lag rhythm... So, for instance the Purple Martin's in flight? Wow,, but I took those after he stopped flying.. (or so I thought)

On the ground here in Victoria I have been mentored by Kip Hutchison and Gary Woodburn among others...

My basic setup is use a MONOPOD..... If possible use 9 point but focus on centre point. Always test shots for EC. If glarey use partial metering; if not, use evaluative (thanks Rocket)

If birds are on a perch or a nest (like the Osprey coming in...PRE-FOCUS... Use either 9 point or SPOT focus of center point of 9

If you have enough light, put the shutter speed up!!!!

ISO on the 90D is VARIABLE depending on time of year and angle of sun...Not all 6400s work.. Ask Digi about this. He's the high ISO king..

MOST IMPORTANT; Study your birds.... and then prefocus the area if you can.. You don't want to chase them; you want to capture them when they enter your zone.

Last rule.. All great shot happen by accident!!!

From what I read the OP is trying to track smaller birds so the 9 point center focus is interesting. I’ll try it too with hummingbirds.

If you can fill your frame with 9 points and a hummer flies in there, you got him.. If you wait to try to nail him with one point you might just get dizzy

I nail them all right with one point when they’re hovering around the feeder but not in flight. I doubt I will be able to follow them in flight at all!

Ad12 wrote:

benjilafouine wrote:

Have you tried single AF point? I’m not a BIF specialist as some other people here but I do a lot of birding and CDMazoff, one of our kingpins around here told me to stick with single AF point.

I have no experience with your tamron lens but BIF require fast lens.

I’m using the original 7D from 2009 and it’s doing a good job except for ISO noise at 1600 and over but for the rest, it works fine. I stick to the single AF point 99% of the time along with the AI servo function. Basically I created a custom function at 1/1600, f5.6, AI servo, and Auto ISO. In some occasions I will slow speed to 1/1000 and/or aperture at f5.6 or 6.3 (my lens combo is limited at f5.6) but I always stick to these values. I also have a second setup with automatic exposure compensation at 1/3 and it often helps.

I’m not sure I could follow them with a single point at the speeds and size of them! I can give it a try. My camera has no custom function buttons on the top or anything and not many buttons so it’s tough to set that stuff up. Good advice though thank you

I looked at the specs of the t7i and some videos online and technically, it has what it takes to shoot birds in flight. However, I could not find any custom shooting mode buttons. As per the Canon website, the t7i seems to be targeting beginners as it has a lot of creative buttons instead (something a pro will never use). Someone already wrote in this thread I think that the t7i was a beginner camera.

That being said, you camera is as capable as mine to take birds in flight as per specs (maybe even better!) but since it is lacking custom mode buttons it can get very painful programming it each time you turn it on.

However, there is still the Manual Mode that pretty much remembers your settings when you turn the camera ON/OFF. Your camera has it. If you could make a good setup in the Manual Mode and use Auto-ISO setting I think you could get very decent birds in flight shots with your t7i. Of course, you would be better off with a 80D, 90D or 7DII. I am keeping my original 7D because I am waiting to see what will happen with that line of cameras. Hopefully there will be a successor for the 7DII, mirror or mirrorless that would enable me to keep using my EF mount as successfully as I do now.

Good luck!

benjilafouine wrote:

Ad12 wrote:

benjilafouine wrote:

Have you tried single AF point? I’m not a BIF specialist as some other people here but I do a lot of birding and CDMazoff, one of our kingpins around here told me to stick with single AF point.

I have no experience with your tamron lens but BIF require fast lens.

I’m using the original 7D from 2009 and it’s doing a good job except for ISO noise at 1600 and over but for the rest, it works fine. I stick to the single AF point 99% of the time along with the AI servo function. Basically I created a custom function at 1/1600, f5.6, AI servo, and Auto ISO. In some occasions I will slow speed to 1/1000 and/or aperture at f5.6 or 6.3 (my lens combo is limited at f5.6) but I always stick to these values. I also have a second setup with automatic exposure compensation at 1/3 and it often helps.

I’m not sure I could follow them with a single point at the speeds and size of them! I can give it a try. My camera has no custom function buttons on the top or anything and not many buttons so it’s tough to set that stuff up. Good advice though thank you

I looked at the specs of the t7i and some videos online and technically, it has what it takes to shoot birds in flight. However, I could not find any custom shooting mode buttons. As per the Canon website, the t7i seems to be targeting beginners as it has a lot of creative buttons instead (something a pro will never use). Someone already wrote in this thread I think that the t7i was a beginner camera.

That being said, you camera is as capable as mine to take birds in flight as per specs (maybe even better!) but since it is lacking custom mode buttons it can get very painful programming it each time you turn it on.

However, there is still the Manual Mode that pretty much remembers your settings when you turn the camera ON/OFF. Your camera has it. If you could make a good setup in the Manual Mode and use Auto-ISO setting I think you could get very decent birds in flight shots with your t7i. Of course, you would be better off with a 80D, 90D or 7DII. I am keeping my original 7D because I am waiting to see what will happen with that line of cameras. Hopefully there will be a successor for the 7DII, mirror or mirrorless that would enable me to keep using my EF mount as successfully as I do now.

Good luck!

Hello, thanks for the reply. Indeed, it has the same bones as the 80d, sensor/af etc, just no customisation of tracking or custom buttons. So I cannot tell it to be more or less sensitive or tell it the subject type for example. I have got some great shots before. Seems therefore I can either get a better body for maybe more keeper, just simply shoot more.

I used to shoot in TV mode at 1/1250, but lately i shoot in manual with 1/1600s, auto ISO, and between f8/10 DoF/light depending. For the puffins i added more DoF as I’ve had issues having a wing in focus and nothing else before at f6.3. Obviously for stationary things where I’m more confident with DoF and when lights low I open up the aperture and drop the shutter a tad. This sensor produces great results at ISO3200 really good, and with a tad of Lightroom i think ISO6400 is great too.

It is for sure the bodies for Canon that will become old and none replaceable. The lenses can always be adapted to R or M mount I think.