5DS - Low light file handling

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jkgal Regular Member • Posts: 111
5DS - Low light file handling

Would it be better, from the noise performance, to shoot in MRAW (28MP). Or shoot the full 50MP and then downsize to roughly 28MP in post.

Talking live music gigs where 28MP is enough for my application.  Would rather ingest the smaller RAW files on the MAC, but noise performance is paramount.

Apologies if already discussed elsewhere.

Canon EOS 5DS
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MitchAlsup Veteran Member • Posts: 5,140
Re: 5DS - Low light file handling

jkgal wrote:

Would it be better, from the noise performance, to shoot in MRAW (28MP). Or shoot the full 50MP and then downsize to roughly 28MP in post.

Post is always better, at least you have every bit from every pixel to work with.

Talking live music gigs where 28MP is enough for my application. Would rather ingest the smaller RAW files on the MAC, but noise performance is paramount.

I haven't shot anything but as-big-as-camera-does RAW since about 2004.

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Mitch

Jon555 Veteran Member • Posts: 7,018
Re: 5DS - Low light file handling

jkgal wrote:

Would it be better, from the noise performance, to shoot in MRAW (28MP). Or shoot the full 50MP and then downsize to roughly 28MP in post.

Talking live music gigs where 28MP is enough for my application. Would rather ingest the smaller RAW files on the MAC, but noise performance is paramount.

Apologies if already discussed elsewhere.

Always 50MP, MRAW should IMHO be avoided.

Also Neat Image 8 or DXO Photolab's Prime can do amazing things (the former much more, once learned, especially re analysis patch placement).

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1Dx4me Veteran Member • Posts: 9,644
Re: 5DS - Low light file handling

jkgal wrote:

Would it be better, from the noise performance, to shoot in MRAW (28MP). Or shoot the full 50MP and then downsize to roughly 28MP in post.

Talking live music gigs where 28MP is enough for my application. Would rather ingest the smaller RAW files on the MAC, but noise performance is paramount.

Apologies if already discussed elsewhere.

glad you asked about RAW file here! i use my 5DsR camera to generate full RAW files--true it is 50+MB files but then when you try to make it usable for print, post on the net, etc, etc....you have to convert it to jpeg, which will give you 24-28MB. although still a large file, but not the same resolution as the RAW and you can see that the detail is not the same between RAW and jepg, as expected.

so, the useless RAW files are only good for viewing and conversion to jpeg, and you have to have huge amount of HHD storage to store those huge RAW files

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Guillermo Shashte Contributing Member • Posts: 921
Re: 5DS - Low light file handling

so, the useless RAW files are only good for viewing and conversion to jpeg, and you have to have huge amount of HHD storage to store those huge RAW files

RAW files are good for viewing, processing, and conversion to other formats, and you have to have huge amount of HHD storage to store those huge RAW files

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GS

1Dx4me Veteran Member • Posts: 9,644
Re: 5DS - Low light file handling

Guillermo Shashte wrote:

so, the useless RAW files are only good for viewing and conversion to jpeg, and you have to have huge amount of HHD storage to store those huge RAW files

RAW files are good for viewing, processing, and conversion to other formats, and you have to have huge amount of HHD storage to store those huge RAW files

that is not a solution, how are you gonna post a DNG online? how are you gonna open a DNG file if you don't have Adobe software? .tiff can be a solution, sort of, but .tiff files are even much bigger than RAW. it is all because rotten .jpeg was agreed on as standard years ago when they couldn't see passed their noses (who ever they were)!

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John Sheehy Forum Pro • Posts: 23,819
Re: 5DS - Low light file handling
1

jkgal wrote:

Would it be better, from the noise performance, to shoot in MRAW (28MP). Or shoot the full 50MP and then downsize to roughly 28MP in post.

Talking live music gigs where 28MP is enough for my application. Would rather ingest the smaller RAW files on the MAC, but noise performance is paramount.

Apologies if already discussed elsewhere.

MRAW doesn't do anything better than what you can do in software, yourself. Do not consider it or any intermediate downsampling as a "method" of noise reduction; it only yields smaller files.

Your best bet is always to capture full resolution, turn down sharpening, apply any noise reduction appropriate for the size you plan to resample to (the more you're going to downsample, the harder you can hit the full res with noise reduction), resample to the target pixel count, and then apply any sharpening. Sometimes an independent "Edge sharpen" can make the result look sharper without emphasizing noise as much as a normal sharpening.

Having the MRAW pixel count in the chain of processing only bakes in artifacts of the resampling to the MRAW.

OP jkgal Regular Member • Posts: 111
Re: 5DS - Low light file handling

John Sheehy wrote:

jkgal wrote:

Would it be better, from the noise performance, to shoot in MRAW (28MP). Or shoot the full 50MP and then downsize to roughly 28MP in post.

Talking live music gigs where 28MP is enough for my application. Would rather ingest the smaller RAW files on the MAC, but noise performance is paramount.

Apologies if already discussed elsewhere.

Your best bet is always to capture full resolution, turn down sharpening, apply any noise reduction appropriate for the size you plan to resample to (the more you're going to downsample, the harder you can hit the full res with noise reduction), resample to the target pixel count, and then apply any sharpening. Sometimes an independent "Edge sharpen" can make the result look sharper without emphasizing noise as much as a normal sharpening.

Thank you all for the replies. I will probably be shying away from MRAW, and make some English Breakfast whilst Mac is chugging in post.

"the more you're going to downsample, the harder you can hit the full res with noise reduction., resample to the target pixel count, and then apply any sharpening"

So, can apply more NR if, say, downsizing to 10MP, as opposed to say 20MP - is that what you mean John?

Also, I would have thought it to be more appropriate to sharpen the full res prior to down-sampling

John Sheehy Forum Pro • Posts: 23,819
Re: 5DS - Low light file handling

jkgal wrote:

John Sheehy wrote:

jkgal wrote:

Would it be better, from the noise performance, to shoot in MRAW (28MP). Or shoot the full 50MP and then downsize to roughly 28MP in post.

Talking live music gigs where 28MP is enough for my application. Would rather ingest the smaller RAW files on the MAC, but noise performance is paramount.

Apologies if already discussed elsewhere.

Your best bet is always to capture full resolution, turn down sharpening, apply any noise reduction appropriate for the size you plan to resample to (the more you're going to downsample, the harder you can hit the full res with noise reduction), resample to the target pixel count, and then apply any sharpening. Sometimes an independent "Edge sharpen" can make the result look sharper without emphasizing noise as much as a normal sharpening.

Thank you all for the replies. I will probably be shying away from MRAW, and make some English Breakfast whilst Mac is chugging in post.

"the more you're going to downsample, the harder you can hit the full res with noise reduction., resample to the target pixel count, and then apply any sharpening"

So, can apply more NR if, say, downsizing to 10MP, as opposed to say 20MP - is that what you mean John?

Yes. Converters don't really help much with this, because their sharpening/NR sense of scale is for 100% crops; not for the image or your desired output dimensions or size.

Also, I would have thought it to be more appropriate to sharpen the full res prior to down-sampling

So do a lot of other people, but that is a compulsion, not a useful procedure. The original resolution has noise, detail, and aliasing at fine resolutions that can't even be shown after downsampling, but they can show anyway in aliased form as nonsense information, or more noise than you really needed to see.

PhotonCanvas Regular Member • Posts: 200
Re: 5DS - Low light file handling

Always surprised with the concern/anxiety expressed by 5DS prospective owners or current owners about its low light capability. I find no issues; are you shooting in the dark?

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