Buying the X-T4 - but which kit lens

Started 11 months ago | Discussions
Greg7579
Greg7579 Forum Pro • Posts: 12,442
Re: Umm, not really
1

Alan_Hogg wrote:

I have owned both lenses, but replaced the 18-55 with the 16-55 years ago. My own experience (and frankly most others documented here over the last few years) vastly differed from yours, which raises the question as to whether the copy of the 16-55 you had was acceptable, or perhaps had issues. Even setting aside the obvious advantages of constant f/2.8 aperture, I found the end-to-end IQ of the 16-55 to be far more consistent than the 18-55, and, particularly on the long end, hardly "marginal" as you put it.

Hi Folks

OK I give up. But I am definitely not the only one who has owned a mediocre 16-55. See the current ‘Fuji 16-55 2.8 experience’ thread. I don’t think it hurts for prospective buyers to be reminded that variations are alive and well even within high end and highly recommended lenses. I have 4 excellent Fuji primes as well as two zooms so can recognise good (and not so good) lenses when I use them ( in case anyone thinks my bad experience on the 16-55 was due to lack of other lenses to compare with).

Greg. Happy to show you around my neck of the woods if you come to NZ. Just google me for contact details. I live only 10 km from Hobbiton so great not having hordes of tourists crawling along our rural road!

Hamilton, New Zealand.

Don't give up!  It would take all the fun out of lens arguments!

If we can't argue about lenses on this Fuji camera equipment board, what good to Mankind are we?

And what the Heck would I do during quarantine?

What we need is for a really skilled Sony Troll to come on here and tell us our Fuji gear sucks!

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Jerry-astro
Jerry-astro Forum Pro • Posts: 16,774
Re: Umm, not really

Greg7579 wrote:

Alan_Hogg wrote:

I have owned both lenses, but replaced the 18-55 with the 16-55 years ago. My own experience (and frankly most others documented here over the last few years) vastly differed from yours, which raises the question as to whether the copy of the 16-55 you had was acceptable, or perhaps had issues. Even setting aside the obvious advantages of constant f/2.8 aperture, I found the end-to-end IQ of the 16-55 to be far more consistent than the 18-55, and, particularly on the long end, hardly "marginal" as you put it.

Hi Folks

OK I give up. But I am definitely not the only one who has owned a mediocre 16-55. See the current ‘Fuji 16-55 2.8 experience’ thread. I don’t think it hurts for prospective buyers to be reminded that variations are alive and well even within high end and highly recommended lenses. I have 4 excellent Fuji primes as well as two zooms so can recognise good (and not so good) lenses when I use them ( in case anyone thinks my bad experience on the 16-55 was due to lack of other lenses to compare with).

Greg. Happy to show you around my neck of the woods if you come to NZ. Just google me for contact details. I live only 10 km from Hobbiton so great not having hordes of tourists crawling along our rural road!

Hamilton, New Zealand.

Don't give up! It would take all the fun out of lens arguments!

If we can't argue about lenses on this Fuji camera equipment board, what good to Mankind are we?

And what the Heck would I do during quarantine?

What we need is for a really skilled Sony Troll to come on here and tell us our Fuji gear sucks!

Let’s not, Greg. You’ll probably want to practice your anti-troll strategies somewhere else. We have plenty enough conflict in the forum to deal with as it is, thank you. And, what’s more, with all that gear you’re hauling around, I have a feeling that staying occupied will be one of your lesser issues.

And, Alan, if only I knew, I could have waved at you during our visit to NZ (which included Hobbiton) a few years back. What a beautiful, friendly, and hospitable country. Can’t wait to return once travel becomes practical again.

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Jerry-Astro
Fujifilm X Forum Co-Mod

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Alan_Hogg Regular Member • Posts: 116
Re: Umm, not really

Greg7579 wrote:

Alan_Hogg wrote:

I have owned both lenses, but replaced the 18-55 with the 16-55 years ago. My own experience (and frankly most others documented here over the last few years) vastly differed from yours, which raises the question as to whether the copy of the 16-55 you had was acceptable, or perhaps had issues. Even setting aside the obvious advantages of constant f/2.8 aperture, I found the end-to-end IQ of the 16-55 to be far more consistent than the 18-55, and, particularly on the long end, hardly "marginal" as you put it.

Hi Folks

OK I give up. But I am definitely not the only one who has owned a mediocre 16-55.

Don't give up! It would take all the fun out of lens arguments!

If we can't argue about lenses on this Fuji camera equipment board, what good to Mankind are we?

And what the Heck would I do during quarantine?

What we need is for a really skilled Sony Troll to come on here and tell us our Fuji gear sucks!

Ha ha yes indeed. All good fun!

Alan Hogg

Hamilton, New Zealand.

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Michael Berg
OP Michael Berg Contributing Member • Posts: 874
Bundled lens -no, just bought the body only.
2

Hi Marcos,

Thanks for your detailed reply, I appreciate it. I still haven't quite made up my mind about this.

- My GAS is solutely screaming for the 16-55/2.8 for its optical quality paired with the X-T4 IBIS. I want it, badly.

- My arms and back are telling me to stop this silly nonsense and get the 18-55/2.8-4. My smallish photo backpack concurs. Also will I really bring this anvil of a lens along for a family trip? If I ask anyone to take a group photo of us, they won't be able to lift the camera. Oh dear.

- My brain is distracted by the 16-80 which is more versatile than the 18-55, and of probably mostly similar optical quality. That focus wobble though...

- My creativity is saying screw those lenses and think about all the nice M42 vintage stuff I have in my drawer already.

- My wallet is not saying much. I think it's dead.

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ricktachtig Forum Member • Posts: 85
Re: I'm Late to This Thread; When You Buy X-T4 You Get One Chance...

I bought just the X-T4 body. I recently purchased the 18-55mm for $280 used. That lens can be found for amazing prices, and I just really like the size of that lens for travel purposes.

I have the Samyang 12mm f2.0 when I want to go really wide and have the 35mm f2.0 for lower light. I'm considering buying the Viltrox 23mm f1.4 or switching from 35mm f2.0 to the 35mm f1.4.

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Jimmmy
Jimmmy Forum Member • Posts: 60
Re: Buying the X-T4 - but which kit lens

I am very weight conscious. Actually purchased the 16-80mm last week as part of a heavily marked-down X-T3 kit. After a few days use on the streets (all stills, no video -- I am not a video shooter), retired it to my bag. I love the 18-55, and also the f/2 and 2.8 primes. Was out shooting yesterday with the 28mm, ordered a 16mm today. Unless you do not mind lugging around a big heavy lens on your new X-T4, my advice is to go back to the 18-55, and add an f/2 or 2.8 prime or two.

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baobob
baobob Forum Pro • Posts: 15,758
Re: Buying the X-T4 - but which kit lens
1

If budget is not a concern the 16-55mm f2.8 definitly If budget is a concern 18-55mm and with part of the mioney saved 55-200mm

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Experience comes from bad judgment

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Marcos Villaroman Veteran Member • Posts: 6,337
Re: Bundled lens -no, just bought the body only.

Michael Berg wrote:

Hi Marcos,

Thanks for your detailed reply, I appreciate it. I still haven't quite made up my mind about this.

- My GAS is solutely screaming for the 16-55/2.8 for its optical quality paired with the X-T4 IBIS. I want it, badly.

The 16-55 is not for everyone.  It is big and heavy compared to other options.  I do believe the 18-55 is fine for most people's needs.   However, if you really want that f/2.8 constant, optical quality which is top-notch for zooms and gets closed enough to prime performance to be an acceptable trade-off vs. swapping primes, I think the 16-55 is worth it.

16-55 goes for $600 to $700 used.

- My arms and back are telling me to stop this silly nonsense and get the 18-55/2.8-4. My smallish photo backpack concurs. Also will I really bring this anvil of a lens along for a family trip? If I ask anyone to take a group photo of us, they won't be able to lift the camera. Oh dear.

The true test for carrying heavy gear is going on vacation where you are going to spend 6+ hours per day walking around for many days in a row.  It's day three or so, where my back and neck scream.  When that happens to me, I find myself carrying my heavy lens (Canon 70-200/2.8L II back then) attached to the camera body so I can cradle it along my arm like cradling a babe in order to reduce the weight around my neck and back.

Backpacks really help until they too give you problems.  It is a reason why I consider using my framed hiking backpack and putting my camera gear into it using soft-sided lens pouches or camera bag inserts (e.g., Tenba BYOB).

Where I am at now is on my last trip to Japan (14-days), my favorite daily carry was the 16-55 permanently attached to my X-H1, my 10-24 on my X-T30 (because I love shooting wide), with a 16/1.4 or 23/2 and a small flash (for bounce and fill flash) in my Peak Design 10L Sling.  That's my personal limit.  If I did it again, I would probably use the 16-80 instead of the 16-55.

Last thought:  with Fujifilm you should always consider having a lightweight set of lenses.  For me, that's usually the f/2 primes.  The 16-80 is an acceptable single heavy lens in a slightly heavier bag.

So if you are really worried about the 16-55 weight, do get either a 18-55 or 16-80.  Again I recommend buying a bundle with your new X-T4 for the hundreds of dollars in savings.  In this respect, I think the 18-55 used is very easy to find.  The 16-80, not so much.

- My brain is distracted by the 16-80 which is more versatile than the 18-55, and of probably mostly similar optical quality. That focus wobble though...

Focus wobble?

- My creativity is saying screw those lenses and think about all the nice M42 vintage stuff I have in my drawer already.

- My wallet is not saying much. I think it's dead.

Spend money.  Only way to be sure your wallet is truly dead. 

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Marcos Villaroman Veteran Member • Posts: 6,337
Re: I'm Late to This Thread; When You Buy X-T4 You Get One Chance...

ricktachtig wrote:

I bought just the X-T4 body. I recently purchased the 18-55mm for $280 used. That lens can be found for amazing prices, and I just really like the size of that lens for travel purposes.

Yup.  Given how small/light the 18-55 is, it is a no-brainer for $280.  I don't use mine; but, I realize it is a great lens to attach to my old bodies that I loan out to friends.

I have the Samyang 12mm f2.0 when I want to go really wide and have the 35mm f2.0 for lower light. I'm considering buying the Viltrox 23mm f1.4 or switching from 35mm f2.0 to the 35mm f1.4.

I had an old Samyang/Rokinon with my Canon 5D3. It's great bang for the buck.  May not last as long; but, at that price, who cares?

If you don't miss the slightly faster AF and WR of the 35/2, going to a 35/1.4 is interesting.  I use my 35/1.4 more often than my 35/2 because when I use it over my 23mm primes, I do like shooting at f/1.4 option.  It is not that much bigger than the 35/2 in your camera bag.

If it was up to me, I'd get the Viltrox 23mm over the 35/1.4.  Play with a 23mm prime focal length.  I personally prefer having a 23mm and 56mm prime in my bag; I can get so much done with just those two focal lengths.

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ne beginner Senior Member • Posts: 2,249
Re: Buying the X-T4 - but which kit lens

baobob wrote:

If budget is not a concern the 16-55mm f2.8 definitly If budget is a concern 18-55mm and with part of the mioney saved 55-200mm

+1 on the 55-200. Just picked one up last week; it's not too big for heavy, can fit in a small camera bag, and performs very well.  The AF is fast, and the IS works great too.

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ne beginner Senior Member • Posts: 2,249
Re: Bundled lens -no, just bought the body only.

I'm thinking that, IMHO, your assumptions and expectations regarding the 16-55 might be a little exaggerated.

Visually, it might look like a monster on an X body. Like a Canon or Nikon 24-70 f2.8 on one their small FF bodies.

I don't know what you are used to carrying around. Have you spent a lot of time walking around with one of those Nikon or Canon kits?

If you have, and then picked up 16-55 on an X body, you'll realize that the whole Fuji kit (lens and body) is about the same size as just the Canon or Nikon lens itself, and weights less too.

The 16-55 is not much bigger\heavier than the 16-80 on an X. And while the 18-55 is a lot lighter and few inches shorter, that still is not a P&S set up. It's not going to fit in any pocket.

I've carried the Nikon and Canon set up on many family vacations and outings. I never would have let someone use it to take a group shot: this is not an inexpensive P&S that if dropped would likely survive the fall, or could be easily replaced at a nearby Best Buy or Walmart.

The X T bodies are a step down in weight from full size DSLR's, especially with their fast zooms. But they are a lot bigger than some other options.

So the way I view these, the X T4 with a 16-55 or 16-80 in reality is not be much of an issue in weight and size, and neither combination is going to be of much if any notice as far as size and weight walking around.  You'd need to go to the 18-55 to really notice a difference.

I started with an X T2 and the 18-55. Now have the X T4 and 16-55. If I pick up one and then the other, sure the difference is noticeable at the moment. Walking around, even the 16-55 is negligible compared to a Canon or Nikon set up.

Neither your back or neck (unless you hang it off your neck) is going to notice.

Michael Berg wrote:

Hi Marcos,

Thanks for your detailed reply, I appreciate it. I still haven't quite made up my mind about this.

- My GAS is solutely screaming for the 16-55/2.8 for its optical quality paired with the X-T4 IBIS. I want it, badly.

- My arms and back are telling me to stop this silly nonsense and get the 18-55/2.8-4. My smallish photo backpack concurs. Also will I really bring this anvil of a lens along for a family trip? If I ask anyone to take a group photo of us, they won't be able to lift the camera. Oh dear.

- My brain is distracted by the 16-80 which is more versatile than the 18-55, and of probably mostly similar optical quality. That focus wobble though...

- My creativity is saying screw those lenses and think about all the nice M42 vintage stuff I have in my drawer already.

- My wallet is not saying much. I think it's dead.

 ne beginner's gear list:ne beginner's gear list
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gonzophoto New Member • Posts: 6
Re: Buying the X-T4 - but which kit lens

While the clear winner is the 16-55, the question at hand is which kit lens to go with. I just bought a barely used X-T3 with 16-80mm lens. Build quality is very good. Yes, there are some issues but overall it is a much better lens than the 18-55.

The kit is $2200 vs $1700 for body alone. The lens sells for over $700 used on ebay. Buy the kit, sell the lens and you've got some extra cash to buy the 16-55 which is probably what I'll be doing.

Jostian
Jostian Veteran Member • Posts: 4,551
Re: Bundled lens -no, just bought the body only.
1

Michael Berg wrote:

Hi Marcos,

Thanks for your detailed reply, I appreciate it. I still haven't quite made up my mind about this.

- My GAS is solutely screaming for the 16-55/2.8 for its optical quality paired with the X-T4 IBIS. I want it, badly.

- My arms and back are telling me to stop this silly nonsense and get the 18-55/2.8-4. My smallish photo backpack concurs. Also will I really bring this anvil of a lens along for a family trip? If I ask anyone to take a group photo of us, they won't be able to lift the camera. Oh dear.

- My brain is distracted by the 16-80 which is more versatile than the 18-55, and of probably mostly similar optical quality.

Comparisons I've seen show the difference to be rather marked, the 16 80 though versatile is not that great optically, more a do all type lens where the 16-55 is a specialist lens optically and construction wise.

That focus wobble though...

- My creativity is saying screw those lenses and think about all the nice M42 vintage stuff I have in my drawer already.

- My wallet is not saying much. I think it's dead.

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Jacaustin Forum Member • Posts: 99
Re: Buying the X-T4 - but which kit lens
2

I finally got around to actually testing my 16-80 that I hastily bought for a day at the Grand Canyon last December.

I started this thread:

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4479023

and updated it yesterday with a summary of my take-always after testing different focal lengths and apertures at 100%.

Im no authority and I’m too lazy to post actual files, but, long story short:

“I’m satisfied that my copy will produce solid results 16-70 mm f5.6-f11 and nice enough flower shots and portraits at 80 mm and f4. I can confirm build quality and OIS is truly excellent. That said, I’m going try NOT to use it in favor of my primes except when I need the convenience and flexibility.“

paulo menge Regular Member • Posts: 314
Re: Buying the X-T4 - but which kit lens

16-55 or 16-80? I have both. without a doubt the optical quality of the 16-55 is superior. but the weight too. the 18-80 suffers a little bit at 16mm, but in general it is very sharp. only loses for not being f2.8. but for travel, where weight matters and the additional focal length, give you an advantage.

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Jacaustin Forum Member • Posts: 99
Re: Buying the X-T4 - but which kit lens
1

...and the OIS for when you don’t carry a tripod.

paulo menge Regular Member • Posts: 314
Re: Buying the X-T4 - but which kit lens

although at xh1 or XT4F with Ibis, it makes no difference!

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Jacaustin Forum Member • Posts: 99
Re: Buying the X-T4 - but which kit lens
1

True. Though I have neither yet. Planning on holding out for the XT-5 with the new sensor/processor. The XH-2 will be tempting but I love the form factor of my XT-2.

Jimmmy
Jimmmy Forum Member • Posts: 60
Re: Buying the X-T4 - but which kit lens
1

My experience with the 16-80 has not been wonderful. I ordered an X-T3 with the 16-80 kit, love the body, and have got some great results, but not with the 16-80. Did way better with my 16mm f/1.4 prime, the 23mm f/2 prime, and my trusty 18-55mm "kit" lens. So I'm returning the X-T3 kit with the 16-80 lens and looking for an X-T3 or X-T4 body. Was not satisfied with detail, color, contrast, and dynamic range of the 16-80 lens. Noticed it is made in the Philippines, not Japan -- not sure whether that is a factor or concern, or I just did not get a wonderful specimen. YMMV.

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astonehouse
astonehouse Regular Member • Posts: 301
Re: Buying the X-T4 - but which kit lens

Jimmmy wrote:

Noticed it is made in the Philippines, not Japan -- not sure whether that is a factor or concern, or I just did not get a wonderful specimen. YMMV.

At one point I thought that made a difference but looking at Fuji's factory in the Philipines it looks very new and sophisticated. I have the 50mm and 23mm f2, the 23mm is an earlier version made in Japan, while the 50mm is a newer version and it's made in the Philippines. The 50mm has a nicer finish, feels better put together, and gives much sharper results. I think the Philipines is one of the better Fuji factories.

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