Pix for the Week Ending April 10th to 12th, 2020

Started 7 months ago | Photos
furtle
furtle Senior Member • Posts: 1,127
Re: Pix for the Week Ending April 10th to 12th, 2020

xpatUSA wrote:

furtle wrote:

xpatUSA wrote:

furtle wrote:

xpatUSA wrote:

The Quince on the other hand only slightly here and there and looks fine.

A couple of saturation maps for you (white=100% saturated):

Happy Easter Sunday - I've a fridge full of IPA ...

Blimey, I thought the red Tuplip wasn’t blown. I didn’t see any whiteouts in the red petals and I think I set EV TO -1.0 or -1.7. I’ll try again if the sun shines tomorrow.

No, I didn't mean blown in the exposure sense, which is why I put it in inverted commas. If the original tulip shot was raw, I'll bet it can be processed without clipping the sRGB gamut.

In SPP set the working space to sRGB, not Adobe, not ProPhoto. Set the color mode to Standard or even Neutral. Starting with all sliders in the middle, run the color-picker around the petals and look for greens and/or blues at zero. If a lot found, like in your posted image, lower the saturation slider to say -0.2 and look again. What happens is that subtle color detail and constrast re-appears to the discerning eye (I do mean subtle).

Ok, I've reprocessed using your suggestions.

Original first and underneath with Ted's adjustments (only if I understood). I think this is better

Hmmm ....

The original (left) looks better! I am distraught with puzzlement!

Any chance of posting the X3F downloadable? I'd like to try it in SPP 5.5.3 ...

Ah, that'll no doubt me be who messed up.

This may be a downloadable link

https://www.dropbox.com/s/pkz5hpya1klfcuc/SDIM3668.X3F?dl=0

-- hide signature --

Best, Steve

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Joris1632 Senior Member • Posts: 2,789
Re: It can only get better .....

D Cox wrote:

Joris1632 wrote:

SigmaChrome wrote:

Good to see your face again, George!

Thanks Vitee, must say I was shocked to see my own face in that huge mirror ...

I must be a quite a relief to be out of hospital and back in lock down (irony).

in fact, lockdown pretty well corresponds to my lifestyle for the last 6 months or so, no problem there. More limiting is that I've now got an internal tube/catheter from near my heart to an exit at upper arm and the infusion pump has to be changed daily. For ever.

That's the bit that is totally depressing at the moment but given a few more days ... we'll see

It's not easy keep trying to find photos to work on or re-work. For me it's like cooking up new ways to prepare food. And it's been cold and wet here.

My philosophy is that we are surrounded by subjects, we just have to see them..........

Yes indeed. There are forms, colours and light everywhere.

A photo from 1964 or 1965:

Thanks Don. Coincidentally I'd been considering  going back to macro when your shot arrived,- the more abstract sort of thing. Think I still have a Nikon bellows somewhere don't you use that on the sdQ for your copying?

To be honest I've been quite ill the last 6mths or so.   At least I'll b able to get back to drawing and snapping soon and as to depression - isn't everyone depressed just now?

OT I'm sure we'll be looking back soon at some really great coronavirus photography ...

George

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Joris1632

D Cox Forum Pro • Posts: 27,097
Re: It can only get better .....

Joris1632 wrote:

D Cox wrote:

Joris1632 wrote:

SigmaChrome wrote:

Good to see your face again, George!

Thanks Vitee, must say I was shocked to see my own face in that huge mirror ...

I must be a quite a relief to be out of hospital and back in lock down (irony).

in fact, lockdown pretty well corresponds to my lifestyle for the last 6 months or so, no problem there. More limiting is that I've now got an internal tube/catheter from near my heart to an exit at upper arm and the infusion pump has to be changed daily. For ever.

That's the bit that is totally depressing at the moment but given a few more days ... we'll see

It's not easy keep trying to find photos to work on or re-work. For me it's like cooking up new ways to prepare food. And it's been cold and wet here.

My philosophy is that we are surrounded by subjects, we just have to see them..........

Yes indeed. There are forms, colours and light everywhere.

A photo from 1964 or 1965:

Thanks Don. Coincidentally I'd been considering going back to macro when your shot arrived,- the more abstract sort of thing. Think I still have a Nikon bellows somewhere don't you use that on the sdQ for your copying?

There's a useful adapter called "Macro Nikon F mount Nikkor AI lens to Pentax K PK adapter" available for a low price on eBay, which is ideal for connecting the sdQ or sdQH to a Nikon bellows.

I used a Nikon bellows for copying film to start with, but then found a cheap Durst/Sickles ChromaPro film duplicator which has its own bellows.

The big Nikon PB-4 bellows is still in use for macro. But the pic above would have been shot on an Exakta, with perhaps a Novoflex Exakta mount bellows and a 400mm lens.

To be honest I've been quite ill the last 6mths or so. At least I'll be able to get back to drawing and snapping soon and as to depression - isn't everyone depressed just now?

Sounds like your pump works wonders ! Yes, I think we are all a bit anxious. Extraverts are suffering most.

OT I'm sure we'll be looking back soon at some really great coronavirus photography

I hope so.

...

George

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xpatUSA
xpatUSA Forum Pro • Posts: 17,902
Re: Pix for the Week Ending April 10th to 12th, 2020

furtle wrote:

xpatUSA wrote:

furtle wrote:

xpatUSA wrote:

Any chance of posting the X3F downloadable? I'd like to try it in SPP 5.5.3 ...

Ah, that'll no doubt me be who messed up.

This may be a downloadable link

https://www.dropbox.com/s/pkz5hpya1klfcuc/SDIM3668.X3F?dl=0

Thanks, Steve, downloading over my slow link as we speak ...

... meanwhile it seems that DropBox now tries to put up a preview of X3Fs - look'ee here:

Teal & Orange !!??

Best shot for detail so far in this sub-discussion ...

Later ...

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Pardon any correct nomenclature or credible references in this post ...
Ted

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xpatUSA
xpatUSA Forum Pro • Posts: 17,902
Found the problem, Steve!
1

Basically, the capture was well under-exposed. Contrary to intuition this can increase saturation in the capture.

Here's the X3F raw histogram for the whole image:

The red channel is 3EV underexposed.

For some petals:

I'd say less than 2EV DR for the reds - does not bode well for detail contrast.

Couldn't resist a go. In SPP 5.5.3 and viewing only the red histogram, I increased the exposure slider until the brightest red was around 245 according to the color picker. Everything else at default. Saved half-size sRGB JPEG Q9:

Not a lot of detail contrast, for which I blame the under-exposure, sorry.

Off to RawTherapee as a 16-bit TIFF only gained a slight improvement:

It is often thought that brightly-lit flowers are more saturated that those in lower lighting, and people cut back on exposure for that reason. But the opposite is usually the case.

So ETTR still rules OK especially with the low-sensitivity red layer in the Merrill sensors ...

-- hide signature --

Pardon any correct nomenclature or credible references in this post ...
Ted

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furtle
furtle Senior Member • Posts: 1,127
Re: Found the problem, Steve!

xpatUSA wrote:

Basically, the capture was well under-exposed. Contrary to intuition this can increase saturation in the capture.

Here's the X3F raw histogram for the whole image:

The red channel is 3EV underexposed.

For some petals:

I'd say less than 2EV DR for the reds - does not bode well for detail contrast.

Couldn't resist a go. In SPP 5.5.3 and viewing only the red histogram, I increased the exposure slider until the brightest red was around 245 according to the color picker. Everything else at default. Saved half-size sRGB JPEG Q9:

Not a lot of detail contrast, for which I blame the under-exposure, sorry.

Off to RawTherapee as a 16-bit TIFF only gained a slight improvement:

It is often thought that brightly-lit flowers are more saturated that those in lower lighting, and people cut back on exposure for that reason. But the opposite is usually the case.

So ETTR still rules OK especially with the low-sensitivity red layer in the Merrill sensors ...

Thanks, Ted !  I took a series of photos of the garden in bright light and noticed the red flowers were really susceptible to clipping highlights leaving whiteout patches.  Reducing the EV to expose for the highlights solved that issue.  Obvs it seems to mess with other areas of exposure.  ETTR just blows the highlights on red and yellow petals.  For each exposure I bracket three shots at 0.3 EV difference, so, will go back and look at the other pics and see if any are better exposed

-- hide signature --

Best, Steve

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xpatUSA
xpatUSA Forum Pro • Posts: 17,902
Re: Found the problem, Steve!

furtle wrote:

So ETTR still rules OK especially with the low-sensitivity red layer in the Merrill sensors ...

Thanks, Ted ! I took a series of photos of the garden in bright light and noticed the red flowers were really susceptible to clipping highlights leaving whiteout patches. Reducing the EV to expose for the highlights solved that issue. Obvs it seems to mess with other areas of exposure. ETTR just blows the highlights on red and yellow petals.

Too much TTR, at a guess ...

For each exposure I bracket three shots at 0.3 EV difference ...

Maybe try 0.7 EV or even 1 EV next time?

... so, will go back and look at the other pics and see if any are better exposed.

Probably teaching Granny to suck eggs but do you look at the RGB channel histograms in the camera LCD after the shot? It would be especially beneficial if you could take a test shot where the entire flower fills the frame without worrying too much about focus. Then the amount of "rightness" in the red channel histogram (for a red flower) would be as meaningful as the brightness adjustment I made to your X3F in SPP.

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Good luck,
Ted

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TN Args
TN Args Veteran Member • Posts: 9,735
Re: Found the problem, Steve!

furtle wrote:

xpatUSA wrote:

Basically, the capture was well under-exposed. Contrary to intuition this can increase saturation in the capture.

Here's the X3F raw histogram for the whole image:

The red channel is 3EV underexposed.

For some petals:

I'd say less than 2EV DR for the reds - does not bode well for detail contrast.

Couldn't resist a go. In SPP 5.5.3 and viewing only the red histogram, I increased the exposure slider until the brightest red was around 245 according to the color picker. Everything else at default. Saved half-size sRGB JPEG Q9:

Not a lot of detail contrast, for which I blame the under-exposure, sorry.

Off to RawTherapee as a 16-bit TIFF only gained a slight improvement:

It is often thought that brightly-lit flowers are more saturated that those in lower lighting, and people cut back on exposure for that reason. But the opposite is usually the case.

So ETTR still rules OK especially with the low-sensitivity red layer in the Merrill sensors ...

Thanks, Ted ! I took a series of photos of the garden in bright light and noticed the red flowers were really susceptible to clipping highlights leaving whiteout patches. Reducing the EV to expose for the highlights solved that issue. Obvs it seems to mess with other areas of exposure. ETTR just blows the highlights on red and yellow petals. For each exposure I bracket three shots at 0.3 EV difference, so, will go back and look at the other pics and see if any are better exposed

A grey card is your friend when shooting strongly colour-biased material, which sometimes fools meters. For instance, the above exposure was EC-1.7EV on your camera's meter, yet the actual exposure of 1/640 ƒ/7.1 is within 0.3 stops of the 'standard daylight ƒ/16 rule' exposure of 1/100 ƒ/16 (or 1/500 ƒ/7.1) at ISO100.

ETTR will never blow any highlights. If highlights are blown, it was not ETTR.

I 'default processed' your raw file in SPP6.7 with 'Standard' and 'Neutral' colour modes and got the following sRGB results:-

Standard

and

Neutral

The Neutral has that bit of orange that you were looking for in a natural representation.

cheers

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TN Args
TN Args Veteran Member • Posts: 9,735
Fireplace

Ruins of an old colonial prison mine

dp0 Quattro 1/80s ƒ/6.3 ISO100

X3F=>SPP=>TIFF=>PP

Slightest of motion blur, but some nice detail.

cheers

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TN Args
TN Args Veteran Member • Posts: 9,735
Re: Fireplace

TN Args wrote:

Ruins of an old colonial prison mine

dp0 Quattro 1/80s ƒ/6.3 ISO100

X3F=>SPP=>TIFF=>PP

Slightest of motion blur, but some nice detail.

cheers

Funny thing. I looked at the 'original size' upload of the above image at 100%, and to my surprise it lacks a bit of the detail and 3D-ness of the processed file from which I uploaded.

Maybe DPR does that.

See if you can spot the difference, looking at a 100% clip from the above photo. (Hoping that DPR doesn't smooth over this difference, too.)

DPR upload left; original file right.

cheers

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furtle
furtle Senior Member • Posts: 1,127
Re: Found the problem, Steve!

TN Args wrote:

furtle wrote:

xpatUSA wrote:

Basically, the capture was well under-exposed. Contrary to intuition this can increase saturation in the capture.

Here's the X3F raw histogram for the whole image:

The red channel is 3EV underexposed.

For some petals:

I'd say less than 2EV DR for the reds - does not bode well for detail contrast.

Couldn't resist a go. In SPP 5.5.3 and viewing only the red histogram, I increased the exposure slider until the brightest red was around 245 according to the color picker. Everything else at default. Saved half-size sRGB JPEG Q9:

Not a lot of detail contrast, for which I blame the under-exposure, sorry.

Off to RawTherapee as a 16-bit TIFF only gained a slight improvement:

It is often thought that brightly-lit flowers are more saturated that those in lower lighting, and people cut back on exposure for that reason. But the opposite is usually the case.

So ETTR still rules OK especially with the low-sensitivity red layer in the Merrill sensors ...

Thanks, Ted ! I took a series of photos of the garden in bright light and noticed the red flowers were really susceptible to clipping highlights leaving whiteout patches. Reducing the EV to expose for the highlights solved that issue. Obvs it seems to mess with other areas of exposure. ETTR just blows the highlights on red and yellow petals. For each exposure I bracket three shots at 0.3 EV difference, so, will go back and look at the other pics and see if any are better exposed

A grey card is your friend when shooting strongly colour-biased material, which sometimes fools meters. For instance, the above exposure was EC-1.7EV on your camera's meter, yet the actual exposure of 1/640 ƒ/7.1 is within 0.3 stops of the 'standard daylight ƒ/16 rule' exposure of 1/100 ƒ/16 (or 1/500 ƒ/7.1) at ISO100.

ETTR will never blow any highlights. If highlights are blown, it was not ETTR.

I 'default processed' your raw file in SPP6.7 with 'Standard' and 'Neutral' colour modes and got the following sRGB results:-

Standard

and

Neutral

The Neutral has that bit of orange that you were looking for in a natural representation.

cheers

Hi Ted,

With some trepidation... I re-took the shot this afternoon using the DP2M as before but used spot focus/exposure and set the EV to +0.3 end ensuring the RHS of the screen's histogram was near the edge. I think the focus of DoF is a bit off but I'm more interested in getting the colour right.

Everything in SPP was middle except the Saturation which was -0.1. I used the colour picker to mess about to try and get the Red histogram not to blow on the right hand side.

Here is the result.

I also tried the shot with my dpQ0 and got this

Best, Steve

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xpatUSA
xpatUSA Forum Pro • Posts: 17,902
Re: Found the problem, Steve!

furtle wrote:

TN Args wrote:

furtle wrote:

xpatUSA wrote:

Basically, the capture was well under-exposed. Contrary to intuition this can increase saturation in the capture.

Here's the X3F raw histogram for the whole image:

The red channel is 3EV underexposed.

For some petals:

I'd say less than 2EV DR for the reds - does not bode well for detail contrast.

Couldn't resist a go. In SPP 5.5.3 and viewing only the red histogram, I increased the exposure slider until the brightest red was around 245 according to the color picker. Everything else at default. Saved half-size sRGB JPEG Q9:

Not a lot of detail contrast, for which I blame the under-exposure, sorry.

Off to RawTherapee as a 16-bit TIFF only gained a slight improvement:

It is often thought that brightly-lit flowers are more saturated that those in lower lighting, and people cut back on exposure for that reason. But the opposite is usually the case.

So ETTR still rules OK especially with the low-sensitivity red layer in the Merrill sensors ...

Thanks, Ted ! I took a series of photos of the garden in bright light and noticed the red flowers were really susceptible to clipping highlights leaving whiteout patches. Reducing the EV to expose for the highlights solved that issue. Obvs it seems to mess with other areas of exposure. ETTR just blows the highlights on red and yellow petals. For each exposure I bracket three shots at 0.3 EV difference, so, will go back and look at the other pics and see if any are better exposed

A grey card is your friend when shooting strongly colour-biased material, which sometimes fools meters. For instance, the above exposure was EC-1.7EV on your camera's meter, yet the actual exposure of 1/640 ƒ/7.1 is within 0.3 stops of the 'standard daylight ƒ/16 rule' exposure of 1/100 ƒ/16 (or 1/500 ƒ/7.1) at ISO100.

ETTR will never blow any highlights. If highlights are blown, it was not ETTR.

I 'default processed' your raw file in SPP6.7 with 'Standard' and 'Neutral' colour modes and got the following sRGB results:-

Standard

and

Neutral

The Neutral has that bit of orange that you were looking for in a natural representation.

cheers

Hi Ted,

With some trepidation... I re-took the shot this afternoon using the DP2M as before but used spot focus/exposure and set the EV to +0.3 end ensuring the RHS of the screen's histogram was near the edge. I think the focus of DoF is a bit off but I'm more interested in getting the colour right.

Everything in SPP was middle except the Saturation which was -0.1. I used the colour picker to mess about to try and get the Red histogram not to blow on the right hand side.

Here is the result.

I also tried the shot with my dpQ0 and got this

Best, Steve

Good job with the Merrill, Steve:

Saturation map now implies some color contrast ...

Arg's conversions were good, too!

-- hide signature --

There is more than one way to skin a cat ...
Ted

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furtle
furtle Senior Member • Posts: 1,127
Re: Found the problem, Steve!

TN Args wrote:

furtle wrote:

xpatUSA wrote:

Basically, the capture was well under-exposed. Contrary to intuition this can increase saturation in the capture.

Here's the X3F raw histogram for the whole image:

The red channel is 3EV underexposed.

For some petals:

I'd say less than 2EV DR for the reds - does not bode well for detail contrast.

Couldn't resist a go. In SPP 5.5.3 and viewing only the red histogram, I increased the exposure slider until the brightest red was around 245 according to the color picker. Everything else at default. Saved half-size sRGB JPEG Q9:

Not a lot of detail contrast, for which I blame the under-exposure, sorry.

Off to RawTherapee as a 16-bit TIFF only gained a slight improvement:

It is often thought that brightly-lit flowers are more saturated that those in lower lighting, and people cut back on exposure for that reason. But the opposite is usually the case.

So ETTR still rules OK especially with the low-sensitivity red layer in the Merrill sensors ...

Thanks, Ted ! I took a series of photos of the garden in bright light and noticed the red flowers were really susceptible to clipping highlights leaving whiteout patches. Reducing the EV to expose for the highlights solved that issue. Obvs it seems to mess with other areas of exposure. ETTR just blows the highlights on red and yellow petals. For each exposure I bracket three shots at 0.3 EV difference, so, will go back and look at the other pics and see if any are better exposed

A grey card is your friend when shooting strongly colour-biased material, which sometimes fools meters. For instance, the above exposure was EC-1.7EV on your camera's meter, yet the actual exposure of 1/640 ƒ/7.1 is within 0.3 stops of the 'standard daylight ƒ/16 rule' exposure of 1/100 ƒ/16 (or 1/500 ƒ/7.1) at ISO100.

ETTR will never blow any highlights. If highlights are blown, it was not ETTR.

I 'default processed' your raw file in SPP6.7 with 'Standard' and 'Neutral' colour modes and got the following sRGB results:-

Standard

and

Neutral

The Neutral has that bit of orange that you were looking for in a natural representation.

cheers

Thanks, TN Args.  I'm learning about exposure!

-- hide signature --

Best, Steve

 furtle's gear list:furtle's gear list
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furtle
furtle Senior Member • Posts: 1,127
Re: Found the problem, Steve!
1

xpatUSA wrote:

Good job with the Merrill, Steve:

Saturation map now implies some color contrast ...

Arg's conversions were good, too!

Phew!  Looks like I got there.  So.... now I need to read up about this grey card recommendation and find out how not to have a, umm, bit of grey card in my photo.

-- hide signature --

Best, Steve

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