My next step - OMD 5.3 or Pen F

I'm not sure what BBF is, but once focussing has been acquired, I can turn it off with the Movie button.

Peter Del

I have set the function button on the front as back-button-focus on my Pen-F. No good for one handed operation but when steadying the camera with the left hand you can use your index finger to operate the BBF a bit strange at first but fine once use to it.

Edward Lowy wrote:

Many thanks - I rarely if ever use C-AF on the EP5 - so I guess that would not be a deal breaker for me.

You don't use Hi Res, Pro Cap, Live Composite, 5 stop IBIS, or PDAF on the EP5 either.

I never buy anything based on how it looks, am only interested in how it functions. Except the EP5 which I just had to buy on style alone!

Except for the looks, what does the PEN-F do that the E-M5 III doesn't?

Since you've quoted prices in £, I'll assume you live in the UK, where, I've heard, it occasionally rains. So, what does the PEN-F do that the E-M5 III doesn't in the rain?

Bassam Guy wrote:

Edward Lowy wrote:

Many thanks - I rarely if ever use C-AF on the EP5 - so I guess that would not be a deal breaker for me.

You don't use Hi Res, Pro Cap, Live Composite, 5 stop IBIS, or PDAF on the EP5 either.

I never buy anything based on how it looks, am only interested in how it functions. Except the EP5 which I just had to buy on style alone!

Except for the looks, what does the PEN-F do that the E-M5 III doesn't?

Since you've quoted prices in £, I'll assume you live in the UK, where, I've heard, it occasionally rains. So, what does the PEN-F do that the E-M5 III doesn't in the rain?

Hmmm.... I think you are assuming that the decision process to buy into a Pen F is a Logical one, Not so, in my experience, the Pen F is more an of an emotional decision.

Bassam Guy wrote:

Edward Lowy wrote:

Many thanks - I rarely if ever use C-AF on the EP5 - so I guess that would not be a deal breaker for me.

You don't use Hi Res, Pro Cap, Live Composite, 5 stop IBIS, or PDAF on the EP5 either.

I never buy anything based on how it looks, am only interested in how it functions. Except the EP5 which I just had to buy on style alone!

Except for the looks, what does the PEN-F do that the E-M5 III doesn't?

Since you've quoted prices in £, I'll assume you live in the UK, where, I've heard, it occasionally rains. So, what does the PEN-F do that the E-M5 III doesn't in the rain?

PenF has a own dedicated wheel on the front to choose the art-programms. On every programm you can adjust easily many things, eg. b/w the gradiation-curve, you can simulate different colour-filters as you could do with the old analog cameras+colour filters, you can make b/w with different coulors that stay (e.g. only red: you get a b/w picture with only the one point/flower in red), you can influence coulors in different intensities etc. The PenF is made to be very creative and to adjust everything BEFORE pushing the shutter so you can get very different creative looks without doing that on your computer. And the PenF looks soooo much retro - love it! And it's realy small. And it's a rangefinder-style. Advantage: your nose does not lean towards the screen, your nose is exactly beside the camera when you look through your viewfinder. You have to love and enjoy taking photos, maybe it's a camera that forces you to think before and to celebrate photographing a little bit slower - althoug you can use it fast (but the EM5.3 is faster). But if speed is not what you want and feeling is more what you want, than the PenF is yours.

And yes, if there were a Pen-F 2 I would order it immediatley.

PenF is an emoitonal decision

If you’re considering a used Pen F, you might want to consider a used EM1.2. Better CAF and larger buffer than the the EM5.3.....just saying

Rmark wrote:

If you’re considering a used Pen F, you might want to consider a used EM1.2. Better CAF and larger buffer than the the EM5.3.....just saying

Many thanks, but the size and weight don't work for me.

Bassam Guy wrote:

Edward Lowy wrote:

Many thanks - I rarely if ever use C-AF on the EP5 - so I guess that would not be a deal breaker for me.

You don't use Hi Res, Pro Cap, Live Composite, 5 stop IBIS, or PDAF on the EP5 either.

I never buy anything based on how it looks, am only interested in how it functions. Except the EP5 which I just had to buy on style alone!

Except for the looks, what does the PEN-F do that the E-M5 III doesn't?

Since you've quoted prices in £, I'll assume you live in the UK, where, I've heard, it occasionally rains. So, what does the PEN-F do that the E-M5 III doesn't in the rain?

No I don't use Hi Res, don't know what Pro Cap is. EP5 has decent IBIS, don't particularly photograph moving subjects so benefits of PDAF not high on my list.

What does the PEN F do that the 5.3 doesn't? Only thing I am aware of, as mentioned in my OP, is that it doesn't intrude so much into photo taking situations. What does the hump on the 5.3 do? Just a hangover from redundant pentaprisms that make users feel they have a "serious" camera?

Yes I live in the UK as mentioned in my OP, yes it does rain. Don't tend to take photos in the rain, hasn't been an issue on my previous Olympus cameras. Not sure I have any weather sealed lenses in any event.

Thank you for the questions, good to be challenged.

I think you need to handle both and go with the one that feels best to you personally. Either will work well for your needs although the EM5.3 will presumably have all kinds of performance improvements even though the sensor is essentially the same. Some of those may enable you to get images that'd be more of a struggle with the Pen, but probably not for the uses you've described.

I am increasingly drawn to rangefinder style cameras and do think that people respond to them differently and find them less intimidating. I also just like the feel and perceived build quality of the Pen F... If the tactile stuff is important to you then that may be an issue.

And if you are a raw plus JPEG person then the Pen F is fabulous. When it came out I thought that dial on the front was such a waste but now I've seen how you can customise what you get out of it, and I've seen the black and white results in particular, it's become a major plus. Did a portrait session last weekend and the black and white JPEGs from the camera were easily the subject's favourites. Raw files left untouched on my hard drive.....

It was (too) expensive when it came out but I think worth a look at the prices you can find them for now. And yes, MPB are excellent in my experience.

Good luck! I'm sure you'll be delighted with either of them.

Many thanks for responding Jon

You do not use CAF. You do not need WS. You have no old FT lenses that would work better with PDAF. You prefer the rangefinder look.

Simple diagnosis: you have fallen in love with the Pen-F. She is calling you. Now you seek a rational confirmation. I try to help you with that:

- She looks gorgeous

- She has a very premium finish and build quality, with no visible screws

- She is made of solid durable metal

- She has that magic art wheel that lets you play with black and white nostalgia

- You already own a set of prime lenses that will suit her perfectly

- She will keep her value longer than others, as she is collectable. But you will keep her for life, of course

- She is less intimidating to her victims, particularly in black

The only caveat, if you are left eyed you will have to get used to her, as your nose will want rub with her touch screen. You may find setting the focus area with your nose an interesting possibility though.

cba_melbourne wrote:

You do not use CAF. You do not need WS. You have no old FT lenses that would work better with PDAF. You prefer the rangefinder look.

Simple diagnosis: you have fallen in love with the Pen-F. She is calling you. Now you seek a rational confirmation. I try to help you with that:

- She looks gorgeous

- She has a very premium finish and build quality, with no visible screws

- She is made of solid durable metal

- She has that magic art wheel that lets you play with black and white nostalgia

- You already own a set of prime lenses that will suit her perfectly

- She will keep her value longer than others, as she is collectable. But you will keep her for life, of course

- She is less intimidating to her victims, particularly in black

The only caveat, if you are left eyed you will have to get used to her, as your nose will want rub with her touch screen. You may find setting the focus area with your nose an interesting possibility though.

You make the finest Counsellor! Thank you very much indeed for posting, hopefully I have found my one true love (until the next time), and saved £350!

Helen wrote:

Edward Lowy wrote:

cba_melbourne wrote:

You do not use CAF. You do not need WS. You have no old FT lenses that would work better with PDAF. You prefer the rangefinder look.

Simple diagnosis: you have fallen in love with the Pen-F. She is calling you. Now you seek a rational confirmation. I try to help you with that:

- She looks gorgeous

- She has a very premium finish and build quality, with no visible screws

- She is made of solid durable metal

- She has that magic art wheel that lets you play with black and white nostalgia

- You already own a set of prime lenses that will suit her perfectly

- She will keep her value longer than others, as she is collectable. But you will keep her for life, of course

- She is less intimidating to her victims, particularly in black

The only caveat, if you are left eyed you will have to get used to her, as your nose will want rub with her touch screen. You may find setting the focus area with your nose an interesting possibility though.

You make the finest Counsellor! Thank you very much indeed for posting, hopefully I have found my one true love (until the next time), and saved £350!

I too have a Pen-F (amongst *cough* several other Olympuses!) and feel I should reiterate what some others have said - it is the slowest, least confident autofocuser of the recent/current range - although its weaknesses are most apparent in continuous AF, it will hunt and fail more readily in S-AF too, if any of the following apply: you are using a lens with only a modest maximum aperture, the light or contrast is getting low, or artificial (particularly warm) light is the source. As pointed out, it is CDAF-only, but the 16MP CDAF-only models including those as far back as the E-P5 (actually, any of the 16MP Olympus models from any date) are better at AF, whilst the 20MP CDAF/PDAF hybrid models are considerably faster and more decisive than those and especially than the Pen-F - indeed to a very large degree in continuous AF, and more subtly in single AF.

The Pen F has a full magnesium body as opposed to the 5iii's plastic body. It reminds me of my days when my camera of choice was Leica M rangefinders of which I owned 4.

The Pen F's only functional weakness is C-AF. S-AF works just fine. I shoot images for a live theater group (used for marketing) where stage lighting is most often fairly dim with no issues. The only time in 2 yrs of shooting for the theater with the Pen F & an Oly 12-40/2.8 Pro lens, was one scene where the stage was in total darkness, with 3 people sitting on a couch facing the audience & their faces lit up solely by a 12" tv facing them about 3 ft away from them. They were very dim. It is the only scene I've ever struggled with & even with that, I did get a few good ones.

When shooting theater, my ISO is always set to ISO 6400 which is needed to stop the actors movement in dim stage lighting. I apply a little NR in post processing & the images are fine.

I have been shooting for this theater for 7 years, The last 2 yrs with the Pen F & an Olympus 12-40/2.8 Pro. I have shot roughly 11,000 handheld theater images with this camera. Prior to shooting theater with the Pen F, I shot with FF Nikons.