Exchange Sony A7R IV with GFX 50S?

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Manzur Fahim
Manzur Fahim Senior Member • Posts: 2,547
Exchange Sony A7R IV with GFX 50S?

Hello everyone,

Just checking water and see what everyone's opinion is. So I sold my GFX 50S with Steelsring EF-GFX Adapter and the Sigma 85mm F/1.4 EX HSM. And now the Guy is saying if I want, he will exchange it again with my Sony A7R IV + Sony Planar T* FE 50mm F/1.4 ZA and also give me around $1200 cash.

I already have GFX 100, so what would you do if you were in my shoe? Exchange or politely decline?

Let's see what everyone thinks of this. Thanks in advance.

Manzur

 Manzur Fahim's gear list:Manzur Fahim's gear list
Fujifilm GFX 100 Sony a7R IV Fujifilm GF 110mm F2 Fujifilm GF 23mm F4 Sigma DP2 Merrill +9 more
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Fujifilm GFX 50S Sony a7R IV
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JimKasson
JimKasson Forum Pro • Posts: 27,374
Re: Exchange Sony A7R IV with GFX 50S?
7

Manzur Fahim wrote:

Hello everyone,

Just checking water and see what everyone's opinion is. So I sold my GFX 50S with Steelsring EF-GFX Adapter and the Sigma 85mm F/1.4 EX HSM. And now the Guy is saying if I want, he will exchange it again with my Sony A7R IV + Sony Planar T* FE 50mm F/1.4 ZA and also give me around $1200 cash.

I already have GFX 100, so what would you do if you were in my shoe? Exchange or politely decline?

Let's see what everyone thinks of this. Thanks in advance.

Manzur

Presumably, you bought the a7RIV for a reason. What was the reason? Is there any circumstance in which having both a GFX 100 and a GFX 50S would be helpful to you? What circumstance(s)? Weigh those two answers against each other.

Jim

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Rick Knepper
Rick Knepper Forum Pro • Posts: 17,518
Re: Exchange Sony A7R IV with GFX 50S?

Manzur Fahim wrote:

Hello everyone,

Just checking water and see what everyone's opinion is. So I sold my GFX 50S with Steelsring EF-GFX Adapter and the Sigma 85mm F/1.4 EX HSM. And now the Guy is saying if I want, he will exchange it again with my Sony A7R IV + Sony Planar T* FE 50mm F/1.4 ZA and also give me around $1200 cash.

I already have GFX 100, so what would you do if you were in my shoe? Exchange or politely decline?

Let's see what everyone thinks of this. Thanks in advance.

Manzur

I bought the a7rIV because I'll be able to do a few things my GFX currently can't do.

1.) focal lengths longer than 200mm FF Equiv.

2.) focal lengths wider than 19mm FF Equiv

3.) If I ever catch the super shallow DoF bug, FF has it.

4.) good tracking AF for wildlife

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Once you've done fifty, anything less is iffy.

 Rick Knepper's gear list:Rick Knepper's gear list
Pentax 645Z Canon EOS 5DS R Fujifilm GFX 50S Sony a7R IV Fujifilm GF 23mm F4 +10 more
Erik Kaffehr
Erik Kaffehr Veteran Member • Posts: 3,488
Re: Exchange Sony A7R IV with GFX 50S?
1

JimKasson wrote:

Manzur Fahim wrote:

Hello everyone,

Just checking water and see what everyone's opinion is. So I sold my GFX 50S with Steelsring EF-GFX Adapter and the Sigma 85mm F/1.4 EX HSM. And now the Guy is saying if I want, he will exchange it again with my Sony A7R IV + Sony Planar T* FE 50mm F/1.4 ZA and also give me around $1200 cash.

I already have GFX 100, so what would you do if you were in my shoe? Exchange or politely decline?

Let's see what everyone thinks of this. Thanks in advance.

Manzur

Presumably, you bought the a7RIV for a reason. What was the reason? Is there any circumstance in which having both a GFX 100 and a GFX 50S would be helpful to you? What circumstance(s)? Weigh those two answers against each other.

Jim

Hi,

I would always feel comfortable with a backup. So, I essentially always carry backup gear. But, I have been shooting for like 50 years and had just one gear failure.

That said, I always feel that having two bodies instead of one is a good thing.

Best regards

Erik

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Manzur Fahim
OP Manzur Fahim Senior Member • Posts: 2,547
Re: Exchange Sony A7R IV with GFX 50S?

JimKasson wrote:

Manzur Fahim wrote:

Hello everyone,

Just checking water and see what everyone's opinion is. So I sold my GFX 50S with Steelsring EF-GFX Adapter and the Sigma 85mm F/1.4 EX HSM. And now the Guy is saying if I want, he will exchange it again with my Sony A7R IV + Sony Planar T* FE 50mm F/1.4 ZA and also give me around $1200 cash.

I already have GFX 100, so what would you do if you were in my shoe? Exchange or politely decline?

Let's see what everyone thinks of this. Thanks in advance.

Manzur

Presumably, you bought the a7RIV for a reason. What was the reason? Is there any circumstance in which having both a GFX 100 and a GFX 50S would be helpful to you? What circumstance(s)? Weigh those two answers against each other.

Jim

I bought the A7R IV as an upgrade from the A7r III. When I had the GFX 50S, I'd always keep the A7r III with it, as GFX 50S was more limited in what it could do. But now I see that GFX 100 is not as limited and can do better, A7R IV does not get as much use as R3 used to. It is sill a great camera, no doubt.

1. Having two GFX body means I can just carry and buy GF lenses, no E mount lenses.

2. 60MP FF with 3.76 micron pixels is not better than 51MP MF with 5.30 micron pixels.

3. A7R IV is a very capable camera, GFX 50S is not in terms of AF speed and performance.

4. Having a different system means I can maybe sometimes carry just the Sony, where GFX is a bit overkill.

Still confused, but maybe I'll just keep the A7R IV.

 Manzur Fahim's gear list:Manzur Fahim's gear list
Fujifilm GFX 100 Sony a7R IV Fujifilm GF 110mm F2 Fujifilm GF 23mm F4 Sigma DP2 Merrill +9 more
Manzur Fahim
OP Manzur Fahim Senior Member • Posts: 2,547
Re: Exchange Sony A7R IV with GFX 50S?

Erik Kaffehr wrote:

JimKasson wrote:

Manzur Fahim wrote:

Hello everyone,

Just checking water and see what everyone's opinion is. So I sold my GFX 50S with Steelsring EF-GFX Adapter and the Sigma 85mm F/1.4 EX HSM. And now the Guy is saying if I want, he will exchange it again with my Sony A7R IV + Sony Planar T* FE 50mm F/1.4 ZA and also give me around $1200 cash.

I already have GFX 100, so what would you do if you were in my shoe? Exchange or politely decline?

Let's see what everyone thinks of this. Thanks in advance.

Manzur

Presumably, you bought the a7RIV for a reason. What was the reason? Is there any circumstance in which having both a GFX 100 and a GFX 50S would be helpful to you? What circumstance(s)? Weigh those two answers against each other.

Jim

Hi,

I would always feel comfortable with a backup. So, I essentially always carry backup gear. But, I have been shooting for like 50 years and had just one gear failure.

That said, I always feel that having two bodies instead of one is a good thing.

Best regards

Erik

Hi Erik,

Yes, always having a backup body is a great idea. I always carry two. Never had a failure, but always been careful. I already have the GFX 100, just deciding for the 2nd body: A7R IV or GFX 50S.

 Manzur Fahim's gear list:Manzur Fahim's gear list
Fujifilm GFX 100 Sony a7R IV Fujifilm GF 110mm F2 Fujifilm GF 23mm F4 Sigma DP2 Merrill +9 more
Manzur Fahim
OP Manzur Fahim Senior Member • Posts: 2,547
Re: Exchange Sony A7R IV with GFX 50S?

Rick Knepper wrote:

I bought the a7rIV because I'll be able to do a few things my GFX currently can't do.

1.) focal lengths longer than 200mm FF Equiv.

2.) focal lengths wider than 19mm FF Equiv

3.) If I ever catch the super shallow DoF bug, FF has it.

4.) good tracking AF for wildlife

All valid points, though not useful for me at the moment, I might need the 1 & 2 some years down the line. Thanks for pointing them out.

 Manzur Fahim's gear list:Manzur Fahim's gear list
Fujifilm GFX 100 Sony a7R IV Fujifilm GF 110mm F2 Fujifilm GF 23mm F4 Sigma DP2 Merrill +9 more
JimKasson
JimKasson Forum Pro • Posts: 27,374
Re: Exchange Sony A7R IV with GFX 50S?
2

Manzur Fahim wrote:

JimKasson wrote:

Manzur Fahim wrote:

Hello everyone,

Just checking water and see what everyone's opinion is. So I sold my GFX 50S with Steelsring EF-GFX Adapter and the Sigma 85mm F/1.4 EX HSM. And now the Guy is saying if I want, he will exchange it again with my Sony A7R IV + Sony Planar T* FE 50mm F/1.4 ZA and also give me around $1200 cash.

I already have GFX 100, so what would you do if you were in my shoe? Exchange or politely decline?

Let's see what everyone thinks of this. Thanks in advance.

Manzur

Presumably, you bought the a7RIV for a reason. What was the reason? Is there any circumstance in which having both a GFX 100 and a GFX 50S would be helpful to you? What circumstance(s)? Weigh those two answers against each other.

Jim

I bought the A7R IV as an upgrade from the A7r III. When I had the GFX 50S, I'd always keep the A7r III with it, as GFX 50S was more limited in what it could do. But now I see that GFX 100 is not as limited and can do better, A7R IV does not get as much use as R3 used to. It is sill a great camera, no doubt.

1. Having two GFX body means I can just carry and buy GF lenses, no E mount lenses.

2. 60MP FF with 3.76 micron pixels is not better than 51MP MF with 5.30 micron pixels.

3. A7R IV is a very capable camera, GFX 50S is not in terms of AF speed and performance.

4. Having a different system means I can maybe sometimes carry just the Sony, where GFX is a bit overkill.

Still confused, but maybe I'll just keep the A7R IV.

If you don't need those things that the a7RIV and associated lenses can do and the GFX cameras can't, then saying goodbye to E-mount makes sense.

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Tom Ames Senior Member • Posts: 1,430
Re: Exchange Sony A7R IV with GFX 50S?

Rick Knepper wrote:

Manzur Fahim wrote:

Hello everyone,

Just checking water and see what everyone's opinion is. So I sold my GFX 50S with Steelsring EF-GFX Adapter and the Sigma 85mm F/1.4 EX HSM. And now the Guy is saying if I want, he will exchange it again with my Sony A7R IV + Sony Planar T* FE 50mm F/1.4 ZA and also give me around $1200 cash.

I already have GFX 100, so what would you do if you were in my shoe? Exchange or politely decline?

Let's see what everyone thinks of this. Thanks in advance.

Manzur

I bought the a7rIV because I'll be able to do a few things my GFX currently can't do.

1.) focal lengths longer than 200mm FF Equiv.

2.) focal lengths wider than 19mm FF Equiv

3.) If I ever catch the super shallow DoF bug, FF has it.

4.) good tracking AF for wildlife

Good summary!

 Tom Ames's gear list:Tom Ames's gear list
Fujifilm GFX 50R Nikon Z7 Fujifilm GF 110mm F2 Fujifilm GF 32-64mm F4 Fujifilm GF 50mm F3.5 +8 more
Innocentius Contributing Member • Posts: 687
Re: Exchange Sony A7R IV with GFX 50S?

Manzur Fahim wrote:

Erik Kaffehr wrote:

JimKasson wrote:

Manzur Fahim wrote:

Hello everyone,

Just checking water and see what everyone's opinion is. So I sold my GFX 50S with Steelsring EF-GFX Adapter and the Sigma 85mm F/1.4 EX HSM. And now the Guy is saying if I want, he will exchange it again with my Sony A7R IV + Sony Planar T* FE 50mm F/1.4 ZA and also give me around $1200 cash.

I already have GFX 100, so what would you do if you were in my shoe? Exchange or politely decline?

Let's see what everyone thinks of this. Thanks in advance.

Manzur

Presumably, you bought the a7RIV for a reason. What was the reason? Is there any circumstance in which having both a GFX 100 and a GFX 50S would be helpful to you? What circumstance(s)? Weigh those two answers against each other.

Jim

Hi,

I would always feel comfortable with a backup. So, I essentially always carry backup gear. But, I have been shooting for like 50 years and had just one gear failure.

That said, I always feel that having two bodies instead of one is a good thing.

Best regards

Erik

Hi Erik,

Yes, always having a backup body is a great idea. I always carry two. Never had a failure, but always been careful. I already have the GFX 100, just deciding for the 2nd body: A7R IV or GFX 50S.

I can only answer this question with FF experience: keep the body's the same, if not possible, keep at least the same brand. Postprocessing pictures from two different brands for one wedding (t. ex.) is a LOT of work.

I had two Canon which matched fairly well with OOC raw pictures, one time I had a Sigma placed way up the chapel of the church that just took a picture every minute for two hours. To get these to the same colors and all (so it would match the book they orderded)... pfeww.

Dunno about Fuji and Sony... but afaik Sony delivers always a bit of cool pictures OOC, where Fuji is more rich in colors OOC. I don't want to ignite a war here on which of these are best, I just want to state that it crunches time to get them the same...

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MattPointZero
MattPointZero Senior Member • Posts: 1,095
A7riv has not closed the gap to MF
1

Manzur Fahim wrote:

Hello everyone,

Just checking water and see what everyone's opinion is. So I sold my GFX 50S with Steelsring EF-GFX Adapter and the Sigma 85mm F/1.4 EX HSM. And now the Guy is saying if I want, he will exchange it again with my Sony A7R IV + Sony Planar T* FE 50mm F/1.4 ZA and also give me around $1200 cash.

I already have GFX 100, so what would you do if you were in my shoe? Exchange or politely decline?

Let's see what everyone thinks of this. Thanks in advance.

Manzur

Having just tried the A7riv and having got briefly swept up with the Sony marketing about it being closer to MF, I found it to be a pretty horrible camera (and I say that as a big fan of Sony A7 cameras having owned all generations of R cams to this point.).  Noisy images and unreliable AF.  I ended up with a Nikon Z backup...

my primary system is the GFX50S, and I find it fast enough to use for a huge range of work - the only reason I don’t have another S or a 50R as my backup is financial - there is, in my opinion, no comparison in the detail and look of the images.  In your position the only reason I’d consider the Sony is if I shot something specifically that the Sony can deal with but the Fuji can’t, and so far I haven’t found what that is.

 MattPointZero's gear list:MattPointZero's gear list
Fujifilm GFX 50S Nikon Z7 Fujifilm GF 110mm F2 Fujifilm GF 45mm F2.8 Nikon Z 24-70mm F2.8
Velocity of Sound
Velocity of Sound Contributing Member • Posts: 874
That's not what DPReview concluded...

If you read their "best landscape camera " showdown, the A7RIV is their top pick. The GFX 50S is listed in addition for consideration (listed third, behind the Canon EOS 5DS R, although I don't know that they ordered the list by strength of recommendation). The GFX 100 isn't listed.  However, they had this to say:

If you look solely at the camera body, it's hard to justify the GFX 50S over its high-res full-frame peers because, while light, fast and capable by medium format standards, the image quality isn't significantly better than the smaller, lighter, faster and often cheaper rivals. However, the GF lenses make it easier to get full benefit from its 50MP, meaning it regularly delivers to its full capability.

I guess there's some discrepancy there with another series of articles that they wrote some months back, in which they concluded that larger sensors are superior.  The conclusion is also a bit wishy-washy: they say image quality isn't significantly better, but that GF lenses regularly deliver "full capability."  If that implies that Sony lenses aren't getting the full capability then it would seem to state that image quality is better.

I've never shot a Sony MILC, so I don't really know based on direct experience.

 Velocity of Sound's gear list:Velocity of Sound's gear list
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jbpfrance Junior Member • Posts: 37
Re: That's not what DPReview concluded...

Velocity of Sound wrote:

The conclusion is also a bit wishy-washy...

To say the least...

However, I understand their comments: at this level of (high) quality, other -even subjective- parameters will make the difference between equipments. DPR cannot enter this domain (of personal subjective preferences) ...

Suteetat Forum Member • Posts: 85
Re: Exchange Sony A7R IV with GFX 50S?

I have GFX 100 with A7r IV ( and Z7 if that matter ).

I used to have 50S before GFX100 came out. Basically, I would not

trade A7r IV or Z7 for a 50S when I have GFX100 for sure.

Basically, I think it would be painful to carry both GFX100 and 50S at the same time.

I personally think that either A7r IV or Z7 will complement GFX100 better as it offer smaller and lighter package than 50S. I use A7r IV a lot with small manual lenses ( don't really like GM lenses much, too big, too heavy for small body often ). I was recently on a trip to Tokyo and was carrying GFX100 and A7r IV with a few GFX lenses and a few manual lenses and the weight is just about the limit of what I can carry. I can't imagine

carrying both 50s and GFX100 with GF lenses mounted on both. It won't be fun when I will be on my feet the whole day.

Also as good as GFX100 is, its AF is still quite a bit behind both A7r IV and Z7 so there will be time when either will be more useful than another big, slow AF camera.

Erik Kaffehr
Erik Kaffehr Veteran Member • Posts: 3,488
Re: That's not what DPReview concluded...

Velocity of Sound wrote:

If you read their "best landscape camera " showdown, the A7RIV is their top pick. The GFX 50S is listed in addition for consideration (listed third, behind the Canon EOS 5DS R, although I don't know that they ordered the list by strength of recommendation). The GFX 100 isn't listed. However, they had this to say:

If you look solely at the camera body, it's hard to justify the GFX 50S over its high-res full-frame peers because, while light, fast and capable by medium format standards, the image quality isn't significantly better than the smaller, lighter, faster and often cheaper rivals. However, the GF lenses make it easier to get full benefit from its 50MP, meaning it regularly delivers to its full capability.

Hi,

Resolutionswise, the A7rIV is pretty similar to the GFX 50S/R. The GFX 50 models have a special microlens design that yields a smaller than normal pixel aperture that enhances sharpness at the cost of increased aliasing.

Both cameras can make good use of a lot of different lenses.

I guess there's some discrepancy there with another series of articles that they wrote some months back, in which they concluded that larger sensors are superior. The conclusion is also a bit wishy-washy: they say image quality isn't significantly better, but that GF lenses regularly deliver "full capability." If that implies that Sony lenses aren't getting the full capability then it would seem to state that image quality is better.

It is obvious that larger size has an advantage. But the 44x33 mm sensor is just 1.68 times the area of the the 24x36 mm sensor. Going from APS-C is 2.25X, a much larger step. The 1.68X size is equivalent to 2/3EV advantage.

Now, if you look at the Sony lens line up, you have f/1.4 lenses from 24 mm to 85 mm and you can also use Canon or Sigma mount lenses. Fujifilm has only one f/2 lens and that is the GF 110/2.

So, to some extents, the larger apertures more than compensate the 2/3 EV advantage of the GFX 50 with regard to photon collection ability. (*)

Another factor is that the Sony models have in body image stabilisation, which is a quite obvious advantage unless you have IS in the lenses or use tripod, which many landscape photographers do.

Another question is how sharp the lenses are. It seems that the GF lenses are very sharp, although I would say that little is known about sample variation.

So, I think that DPR's evaluation may have some merit, like all mankind, DPR editors are fallible.

In many ways, I think that the GFX 100 is the really right stuff.

Best regards

Erik

(*) Technically speaking, it depends. A larger sensor is always beneficial when exposed fully to the right at base ISO.

But, when higher ISO is used , there is usually some reason for it like, like shutter speed, need of DoF. a 24x36 mm system has a 2/3 stop advantage in DoF over a 33x44 system. So, if say f/8 is needed for DoF on 44x33, 24x36 mm will deliver the same DoF at f/6.2.

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Erik Kaffehr
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Innocentius Contributing Member • Posts: 687
Dpreview concluded a lot

Velocity of Sound wrote:

If you read their "best landscape camera " showdown, the A7RIV is their top pick. The GFX 50S is listed in addition for consideration (listed third, behind the Canon EOS 5DS R, although I don't know that they ordered the list by strength of recommendation). The GFX 100 isn't listed. However, they had this to say:

<snip>

They also concluded the A7RIV is the (their?) best portrait camera.

Wonder if it will also win in the contest of the best lomography camera...

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Sigma DP1x Sigma DP3 Merrill Canon PowerShot A1200 Fujifilm FinePix X100 Sony Cyber-shot DSC-QX10 +9 more
Greg7579
Greg7579 Veteran Member • Posts: 8,085
Re: Exchange Sony A7R IV with GFX 50S?

Suteetat wrote:

I have GFX 100 with A7r IV ( and Z7 if that matter ).

I used to have 50S before GFX100 came out. Basically, I would not

trade A7r IV or Z7 for a 50S when I have GFX100 for sure.

Basically, I think it would be painful to carry both GFX100 and 50S at the same time.

I personally think that either A7r IV or Z7 will complement GFX100 better as it offer smaller and lighter package than 50S. I use A7r IV a lot with small manual lenses ( don't really like GM lenses much, too big, too heavy for small body often ). I was recently on a trip to Tokyo and was carrying GFX100 and A7r IV with a few GFX lenses and a few manual lenses and the weight is just about the limit of what I can carry. I can't imagine

carrying both 50s and GFX100 with GF lenses mounted on both. It won't be fun when I will be on my feet the whole day.

Also as good as GFX100 is, its AF is still quite a bit behind both A7r IV and Z7 so there will be time when either will be more useful than another big, slow AF camera.

I think this is an interesting thread and well handled here on this Board. If this discussion comparing major brands and which one is best or most useful came up on the Sony or Fuji Boards there would be trouble almost immediately, but not here.

Funny. I am in the same boat in a way. I have the GFX 100 and I'm a travel shooter. I also have the 50r which, as most of you know, I have traveled extensively with and did not mind it at all. In fact, I loved it.

And here is the kicker. I have in my closet the XT-3, XH-1 and X100F plus 14 of the very best Fuji XF lenses. That is some amazing travel kit. But guess what? Since shooting the GFX 50 for the past 11 months, I have not touched it.

When deciding to buy the GFX 100, I was agonizing whether to buy the r4 instead. Use the 50r for my MF and GFX lenses and the alphasevenarefour as the compliment. But I didn't do it (still might).

Why? Because I did not want to venture into GM lens territory. Those are big lenses and make the kit back up there in mass pretty quickly.

But … I don't really want the 50r anymore because I'm afraid I will never shoot it as I am going to make myself travel with the GFX 100 for a while and when at home I'm shooting the 100.

But I could do this … I could walk into my local pro camera shop and trade the 50r and a lot of the Fuji APSC gear for an r4 and the 24-70 and 70-200 big zooms and be right back in the thick of the FF game and use it for travel. That would stick my toe in the Sony water, which I have been close to doing for two years.

I could do that and it would not cost me any more money because I would be losing the Fuji X gear and the 50r on a really bad trade-in value.  (That shop will give me about 60% of the used price at B&H.)

But … Many of you have already told me that to compliment my GFX kit with high-res r4 Sony kit is not the best solution because I already have all this great Fuji APSC gear.  Why two high-res systems?  Well, because I'm finding myself not shooting the Fuji X kit now that I have gone MF.

So I'm thinking about it....

It all boils down to will I shoot the GFX 50r again when I have this beast 100 sitting here?  And will I shoot the Fuji X kit again?  Probably not.  And the Sony alphasevenarethree/four has been whispering to me for along time....

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Greg7579
Greg7579 Veteran Member • Posts: 8,085
Re: That's not what DPReview concluded...

Velocity of Sound wrote:

If you read their "best landscape camera " showdown, the A7RIV is their top pick. The GFX 50S is listed in addition for consideration (listed third, behind the Canon EOS 5DS R, although I don't know that they ordered the list by strength of recommendation). The GFX 100 isn't listed. However, they had this to say:

If you look solely at the camera body, it's hard to justify the GFX 50S over its high-res full-frame peers because, while light, fast and capable by medium format standards, the image quality isn't significantly better than the smaller, lighter, faster and often cheaper rivals. However, the GF lenses make it easier to get full benefit from its 50MP, meaning it regularly delivers to its full capability.

I guess there's some discrepancy there with another series of articles that they wrote some months back, in which they concluded that larger sensors are superior. The conclusion is also a bit wishy-washy: they say image quality isn't significantly better, but that GF lenses regularly deliver "full capability." If that implies that Sony lenses aren't getting the full capability then it would seem to state that image quality is better.

I've never shot a Sony MILC, so I don't really know based on direct experience.

There have been many of us following very closely the general DPR editorial attitude on MF - mainly GFX and the new Hassy 50 MP (same sensor).  It was heavily biased and had a negative tone when GFX came out and the 50s/r were not well received.  DPR repeatedly insisted that the IQ was not better than high res FF (especially Sony and Nikon) and they did it consistently in both articles and OP postings, and in more subtle ways.  If you did not agree with that opinion, it could get you in trouble fast.

Then the GFX 100 hit and RB gave it a very fair and professional review and the DPR general editorial tone seemed to shift a bit, although RB actually said that he was sticking with his guns on the 50s/r.  He said that on the GFX review thread in response to me saying he did a great job on that GFX 100 review (and all of his latest reviews on all cameras, which are really good work).

Now this article hits and the DPR attitude is very obvious.  It is justifiable.  It is their opinion.  I get the impression that they still look at GFX and Hassy as niche.  Maybe it is.

One can call it bias if one wants, but it is basically just DPR saying that the 50 MP MF has no better IQ than high-res Sony FF, and that the FF option is far more versatile, while still paying homage to the great GFX 100, which is not obtainable for most of their audience.

Something along those lines....  But many of us who shoot MF do see a big difference in the IQ results of MF vs high-res FF, so we might not agree with the DPR conclusion.

So the only point of contention remains any discussion of the MF Look, which is verboten on DPR, and also the fact that many of us MF shooters do see a significant difference between Fuji/Hassy 50 MP MF IQ and high res FF.  I see it.  But I can't prove it. It is just an opinion based on a lot of shooting which then in turn drives future camera purchasing decisions and systems decisions and leanings.

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 Greg7579's gear list:Greg7579's gear list
Fujifilm XF 16mm F1.4 R WR XF 90mm Leica Q2 Fujifilm X100F Fujifilm X-H1 +16 more
MattPointZero
MattPointZero Senior Member • Posts: 1,095
Re: That's not what DPReview concluded...

Velocity of Sound wrote:

If you read their "best landscape camera " showdown, the A7RIV is their top pick. The GFX 50S is listed in addition for consideration (listed third, behind the Canon EOS 5DS R, although I don't know that they ordered the list by strength of recommendation). The GFX 100 isn't listed. However, they had this to say:

If you look solely at the camera body, it's hard to justify the GFX 50S over its high-res full-frame peers because, while light, fast and capable by medium format standards, the image quality isn't significantly better than the smaller, lighter, faster and often cheaper rivals. However, the GF lenses make it easier to get full benefit from its 50MP, meaning it regularly delivers to its full capability.

I guess there's some discrepancy there with another series of articles that they wrote some months back, in which they concluded that larger sensors are superior. The conclusion is also a bit wishy-washy: they say image quality isn't significantly better, but that GF lenses regularly deliver "full capability." If that implies that Sony lenses aren't getting the full capability then it would seem to state that image quality is better.

I've never shot a Sony MILC, so I don't really know based on direct experience.

Indeed - and it was exactly this kind of review that got me excited by the a7Riv, especially as someone who has really liked the previous iterations.

My user experience was very different.

I should caveat that I imagine for landscapes it is very good.  I am primarily a portrait shooter.

I will try and dig out some image file examples for you that illustrate what I was seeing.  I found the A7Riii to be 'better' in terms of IQ at anything other than base ISO - there is no doubt that at base ISO in good light, the iv produces some very detailed images, and I guess we would expect nothing less.  However I found the eye AF and low light AF to be wildly inconsistent, with a very high rate of focus misses where I would have expected the Riii to have been fairly reliable - also as soon as you go over about 320 ISO I was finding the images notably noisy - again, I guess to be expected in the high MP tradeoff, but the overall drop in 'look' of the image and loss of detail as the ISO went up even a little completely undermined the point of the camera for me.  And even when you had the thing at base ISO in good light, the images from the GFX50S are clearly superior and more detailed.  **ANOTHER CAVEAT** I shoot the GFX with the 45 and 110 primes, the sony I was shooting with the 24-70, albeit the GM lens which has always been close to prime quality on my previous cameras.

I imagine for landscape and architecture shooters the experience may be different, and as always even if you are a portrait shooter your experience may be different to mine - there were also reports of AF issues on some cameras, maybe mine was not a good example - either way it went straight back to the supplier and made me hug my GFX a little closer.  AFAICT there is absolutely no comparison.

 MattPointZero's gear list:MattPointZero's gear list
Fujifilm GFX 50S Nikon Z7 Fujifilm GF 110mm F2 Fujifilm GF 45mm F2.8 Nikon Z 24-70mm F2.8
MattPointZero
MattPointZero Senior Member • Posts: 1,095
Re: Exchange Sony A7R IV with GFX 50S?

Greg7579 wrote:

Suteetat wrote:

I have GFX 100 with A7r IV ( and Z7 if that matter ).

I used to have 50S before GFX100 came out. Basically, I would not

trade A7r IV or Z7 for a 50S when I have GFX100 for sure.

Basically, I think it would be painful to carry both GFX100 and 50S at the same time.

I personally think that either A7r IV or Z7 will complement GFX100 better as it offer smaller and lighter package than 50S. I use A7r IV a lot with small manual lenses ( don't really like GM lenses much, too big, too heavy for small body often ). I was recently on a trip to Tokyo and was carrying GFX100 and A7r IV with a few GFX lenses and a few manual lenses and the weight is just about the limit of what I can carry. I can't imagine

carrying both 50s and GFX100 with GF lenses mounted on both. It won't be fun when I will be on my feet the whole day.

Also as good as GFX100 is, its AF is still quite a bit behind both A7r IV and Z7 so there will be time when either will be more useful than another big, slow AF camera.

I think this is an interesting thread and well handled here on this Board. If this discussion comparing major brands and which one is best or most useful came up on the Sony or Fuji Boards there would be trouble almost immediately, but not here.

Funny. I am in the same boat in a way. I have the GFX 100 and I'm a travel shooter. I also have the 50r which, as most of you know, I have traveled extensively with and did not mind it at all. In fact, I loved it.

And here is the kicker. I have in my closet the XT-3, XH-1 and X100F plus 14 of the very best Fuji XF lenses. That is some amazing travel kit. But guess what? Since shooting the GFX 50 for the past 11 months, I have not touched it.

When deciding to buy the GFX 100, I was agonizing whether to buy the r4 instead. Use the 50r for my MF and GFX lenses and the alphasevenarefour as the compliment. But I didn't do it (still might).

Why? Because I did not want to venture into GM lens territory. Those are big lenses and make the kit back up there in mass pretty quickly.

But … I don't really want the 50r anymore because I'm afraid I will never shoot it as I am going to make myself travel with the GFX 100 for a while and when at home I'm shooting the 100.

But I could do this … I could walk into my local pro camera shop and trade the 50r and a lot of the Fuji APSC gear for an r4 and the 24-70 and 70-200 big zooms and be right back in the thick of the FF game and use it for travel. That would stick my toe in the Sony water, which I have been close to doing for two years.

I could do that and it would not cost me any more money because I would be losing the Fuji X gear and the 50r on a really bad trade-in value. (That shop will give me about 60% of the used price at B&H.)

But … Many of you have already told me that to compliment my GFX kit with high-res r4 Sony kit is not the best solution because I already have all this great Fuji APSC gear. Why two high-res systems? Well, because I'm finding myself not shooting the Fuji X kit now that I have gone MF.

So I'm thinking about it....

It all boils down to will I shoot the GFX 50r again when I have this beast 100 sitting here? And will I shoot the Fuji X kit again? Probably not. And the Sony alphasevenarethree/four has been whispering to me for along time....

I genuinely think you will be very disappointed!  Stick to a Leica Q2 for travel and the GFX100 for every thing else 

 MattPointZero's gear list:MattPointZero's gear list
Fujifilm GFX 50S Nikon Z7 Fujifilm GF 110mm F2 Fujifilm GF 45mm F2.8 Nikon Z 24-70mm F2.8
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