First non-kit lens for a young photographer.

Started 4 months ago | Discussions
OP Marty Lo Junior Member • Posts: 25
Re: First non-kit lens for a young photographer.

Auf Reisen wrote:

I think it's great how much interest you show in your child's hobby.

Ask her what she likes about the pictures she took at 40mm. Was it the tighter framing or the fact that it is easier to achieve subject isolation (blurred background) at this focal length with slower zooms?

Definitely the latter, subject isolation is something that I find still find it hard to comprehend, why have less captured information? Our eyes work this way due to an evolutionary compromise (but what an amazing compromise they are!), I guess helps the photographer communicate what the subject is to the viewer.

If the former, the 45 1.8 is probably a no-brainer. If the latter, a fast prime in the normal range (17-25) would maybe be the better choice.

That said, nothing has helped me improve my photography more than going out shooting with a a prime with an uncomfortable focal length and learning to adjust to the limitations. But that might be a thought for later.

 Marty Lo's gear list:Marty Lo's gear list
Panasonic Lumix DMC-LX3 Olympus E-M5 II Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 40-150mm F4-5.6 R Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 14-42mm F3.5-5.6 EZ Apple iPad Pro 9.7
Auf Reisen Contributing Member • Posts: 669
Re: First non-kit lens for a young photographer.
1

Marty Lo wrote:

Auf Reisen wrote:

I think it's great how much interest you show in your child's hobby.

Ask her what she likes about the pictures she took at 40mm. Was it the tighter framing or the fact that it is easier to achieve subject isolation (blurred background) at this focal length with slower zooms?

Definitely the latter, subject isolation is something that I find still find it hard to comprehend, why have less captured information? Our eyes work this way due to an evolutionary compromise (but what an amazing compromise they are!), I guess helps the photographer communicate what the subject is to the viewer.

Many people find a blurred background aesthetically pleasing.

But the more relevant reason, for me at least, is that it is much easier to arrange the elements in a scene in an aesthetically pleasing way when there are fewer clearly defined elements. Longer focal lengths help in isolating a subject because much of the scene is left out of the frame. A shallow depth of field helps because fewer elements are clearly defined.

When I started out with photography, I gravitated towards longer lenses because it was easier to isolate clearly defined subjects with them. But these subjects also lacked context!

As I developed more as a photographer, I learned to shoot wider and with a deeper depth of field. It is harder to do right, but the result often offers more context and frequently, but not always, makes for better photographs.

It is hard to translate that into actionable advice for you, as every photographer's development is different. I think having your daughter try out a couple of bright primes might be a good option. I would suggest that normal focal lengths like 17 or 25 are more versatile in the long run. But of your daughter gravitates toward portraiture, a 45 is a great option. So is the Panasonic 42.5, by the way. It focuses closer, which might help with flower photography (I've seen your daughter likes those).

 Auf Reisen's gear list:Auf Reisen's gear list
Olympus OM-D E-M10 II Panasonic Lumix G 20mm F1.7 ASPH Olympus M.Zuiko Digital 45mm F1.8 Samyang 7.5mm F3.5 Fisheye Olympus M.Zuiko ED 75-300mm 1:4.8-6.7 II +2 more
OP Marty Lo Junior Member • Posts: 25
Re: First non-kit lens for a young photographer.

Jeff wrote:

Marty Lo wrote:

Jeff wrote:

There are already some good suggestions, so these are just some additional thoughts ...

... your current lenses are not particularly bright. So an f/1.8 lens would be a nice addition to help with indoor and early evening/morning shooting. The 17/1.8 is a good general purpose lens for that purpose.

... If she likes shooting portraits, pets, small features, etc, the 45/1.8 would be a lot of fun.

.... the 60/2.8 macro would also be good for portrait shooting, and also open a whole new world of macro shooting. She would learn a lot about core photographic principles, too.

Has she expressed any particular interests?

So far it's been varied and on advice from a photographer friend, I haven't placed any constraints for her. I have noticed however she loves to shoot with a shallow DoF whenever she could e.g.

https://www.instagram.com/p/B3Vj6RunSSZ/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

https://www.instagram.com/p/B3O8KCJHy2t/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

Those are sweet examples. I assume "#demonmonkey# must be the younger brother.

That's him.

I took a look at her instagram feed which, for a 9 year old, shows a lot of fun and interests.

From the instagram feed, it's pretty clear that she gravitates towards to portrait shooting, and definitely likes to isolate a subject through selective focus, composition, and lighting contrasts. She knows her subject, which is something that can't always be said about much older or more experienced shooters. This has to be a lot of fun for everyone.

Her brother is hating it, after 3 days he either runs or turns away or mean mugs as soon as he thinks a camera is aimed at him.

Based on what I see in these images, the 45/1.8 would seem like a no brainer. It's a small compact lens at a nearly ideal focal length for portraits and isolating a subject. I used mine for years before trading it on the 45/1.2. You can get them for about $400 new from B&H. The great news is that you can also get it from one of the reputable Hong Kong dealers on ebay for less than $200. It's hard to go wrong for that price.

Another option might be the 75/1.8 that gives even more subject isolation, and is otherwise a terrific lens. It's a little over $500 from ebay, and might be a little too long. This is also a favorite of mine, but it doesn't get as much use as the 45.

I don't own the Sigma 56/1.4, so can't offer first-hand experience, but it is a little less pricey (about $430 from HK) than the 75, a little better focal length, and ought to do a very nice job with selective focus. People on this forum seem to really like this lens.

Hope that's useful.

Sports shooting is a bit more daunting (for the wallet) as we all love grappling and combat sports = mostly limited lighting leads to some scary ISO figures....let's just say it would probably be cheaper to bulk buy lights for the gym than stoop for gear to match lighting.

Btw, best dad ever.

 Marty Lo's gear list:Marty Lo's gear list
Panasonic Lumix DMC-LX3 Olympus E-M5 II Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 40-150mm F4-5.6 R Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 14-42mm F3.5-5.6 EZ Apple iPad Pro 9.7
Ramyeah
Ramyeah Regular Member • Posts: 373
Re: First non-kit lens for a young photographer.

Marty Lo wrote:

Ramyeah wrote:

Marty Lo wrote:

Hi all,

Firstly I'm not a photography orientated guy but have fair technical background and able to research/learn fairly quickly.

I've needed to do this since my eldest child (9) have fallen head over heels with photography.

I familiarised myself with the concepts such as focal lengths, stops/qty of light and can shoot a subject fairly well exposed and focused on subject, they lack any appeal which is fine by me as I'm simply the purchaser, driver, archiver and sometimes settings advisor when light/speed of subject gets a bit challenging.

Recently, I acquired for her an OM-D E-M 5 Mk2 with 2 kit lenses:

That's a great camera

Our local store had great patient staff, my initial intent was for something compact with interchangeable lenses, they let her try the whole range, canon, Lumix, Sony, Fujifilm. Straight away she preferred a having viewfinder and gravitated to the OM-D after the second visit. Then a week later Olympus cameras were on sale.

You are lucky...hardly find such assortment of brands of MILCs in a single Brick & Mortar store these days.

1. 14-42mm F3.5-5.6 EZ

2. 40-150mm F4-5.6 R

The two kit lenses cover most of the range required to try out different genres of photography, especially, for a beginner. (I started my DSLR journey with similar set 15 years ago, with Oly DSLR). And, are really good quality to provide great pictures.

Along with other improvements to her kit in general such as more comfortable sling, small tripod, spare battery, cleaning kit etc, I'm planning to acquire another lens for her in the near future. Hampered by not having an eye for photography I stuck to reviews and specifications in forming a short list for that fits the budget.

1. 12-40mm F2.8

pros: 1.5-4x more light throughout a focal range she's used to, weatherproof (great where we reside), rated highly by Olympus youtubers(?)

cons: 2x weight of current 40-150.

This one seems to be the easy choice as it's similar yet superior to her current lens in every way except for a near 2x increase in weight and bulk.

The next three are primes:

2. 17mm F1.8

equiv. of ~25mm on Fujifilms that gets raved about for everyday photography

3. 25mm F1.8

equiv. of 50mm. Closest to the eye's perspective. Everyone needs one????

4. 45mm F1.8

Looking at her photo metadata, a lot of her favourited shots were taken between 40-62mm.

They're share common traits being not waterproof but allows > 2x the light again to the 12-40mm. They are all quite compact and seem suitable to have as the lens to leave on the camera ready to go.

I personally feel, 12-40/2.8 Pro would be an overkill (in terms of size, weight and price) though I see your point regarding weatherproof.

I thought about this a lot. Compared to the 14-42/3.5-56, it's +5x the size 4x the weight for essentially 1-2 steps on the ISO dial or holding the shot a that little longer. Unlike price tag where pain eases heavy things don't lighten with distance...or inclines.

To make matters even more complex (to me) I've read that standard lenses are commonly shot with a reduction of 1 stop to the aperture for sharpness and the 12-40mm is equally sharp throughout it's aperture range, so does that mean for optimal use the prime lenses are effective F2.8 lens anyway?

No need to worry on this aspect, they are adequately sharp even wide open.

Great to hear!

Apologies if I'm way out of my league here, I generally lack an eye for aesthetics and simply thinking in terms I can fathom i.e. amount, duration of light vs amount of signal noise.

Looking forward to your advice.

Thanks.

Marty.

Marty,

I must say that, you have done your homework pretty well, in order to support the passion of your kid...appreciate the effort put in to understand the subject, and you are not off the mark at all.

I would stress upon learning the basics of photography - the techniques, skills and the aesthetics aspects first and later go for upgrading the gear to overcome it's shortcomings, if any, for a specific use-case.

At the moment it's sufficient light, not so much dawn to dusk but whenever we go indoors. Outdoors the sun here is a killer, literally.

My general suggestions would be: As a beginner, let her start with the available kit and click all and sundry photos to her liking - which is what she's doing, I guess.

However, learning with a Prime lens has it's own merit, as one has to think of framing and composition, without the flexibility of the zoom. From your data, that looks like 45/1.8 - another exceptional High Quality-High value lens (and so are the other two). Adding that to the kit, would help enhance skills and progress next level

I'm of a mind to take her to the store to try all 3 and let her decide on the right angled prime.

Yeah, with the privilege and convenience of a well stocked store nearby, no reason why you should not.

I have a gut feeling that this constraint is a good thing, been stressing to her to only walk forwards but with both eyes open, camera lowered in any other direction.

Yes, that's what I meant. A prime lens, with it's constant FL forces one to learn framing composition etc. by moving about and around the subject. Easier to do experimentation and compare the results. With a zoom one might have a tendency to zoom-in or out to just get the subject in the frame, but may ignore other aspects of composition in the process.

Then, ask her to work on some specific "project' say every week or so, based on her interest and aptitude. You can jointly review the pictures in terms of focus, framing, composition, etc. and discuss how to improve - a great way to learn.

Have to pass that duty of to her teacher =D, she can compose and post process far better than I can. If someone told me to shoot something, I can pick a lens, dial it in and give a clean, clear photo of the subject in the centre, completely contained in the frame. It's been totally bewildering to me at what and when she decides to shoot along with her choice in lighting and colouring back home.

Submitting photos to some photographic forums which are mostly topic specific like street/macro/action/wildlife etc. for Comments & Critics from other enthusiasts/seniors is a great way for learning, especially for a beginner.

Any recommendations in this regard? She currently uses only an old instagram account converted to her use.

In dpreview, look at the Photography specific Forums like Landscape, Nature, Macro, Sports etc (3rd column under 'Forum')

https://www.mu-43.com/forums/ is another site, which you can explore.

Facebook and Flickr, has several groups dedicated to specific genre and gear, where one can share/add the uploaded picture. On Instagram itself, there are specific user groups, with" # " that you can select according to the type of photo posted, to add to those groups.

I'm not much into posting on forums and not aware of all the many options available these days..and others can add their suggestions in this regard.

Give it a few months and you would know which is the type of photography she's more interested in. Then, it's easy to chose the appropriate lens to suit that genre and help her learn specifics and enhance skills.

^ That sounds like a fine idea and our most likely course of action!

My best wishes to your child and cheers to her supporting dad,

Ramesh

My thanks.

Best,

Ramesh

 Ramyeah's gear list:Ramyeah's gear list
Olympus OM-D E-M5 Olympus E-M1 Olympus M.Zuiko Digital 45mm F1.8 Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 12-50mm 1:3.5-6.3 EZ Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 60mm F2.8 Macro +5 more
Ramyeah
Ramyeah Regular Member • Posts: 373
Re: First non-kit lens for a young photographer.
1

Forgot to mention: Please feel free to share the pictures in this forum. It can be anything shot with an MFT gear. You'll find, we are generally friendly guys  and many would be eager to help nurture a budding young photographer through comments and suggestions.

 Ramyeah's gear list:Ramyeah's gear list
Olympus OM-D E-M5 Olympus E-M1 Olympus M.Zuiko Digital 45mm F1.8 Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 12-50mm 1:3.5-6.3 EZ Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 60mm F2.8 Macro +5 more
Luke Forrest Contributing Member • Posts: 603
Re: First non-kit lens for a young photographer.
2

Hello Marty, welcome to the forum. I've read through the posts and there are many opinions so I almost hesitate to add another one. It only makes your task harder.

There have been many recommendations for the 45mm because your daughter gravitates towards this focal length but I would still caution against buying a prime lens that in effect leaves you permanently zoomed in unless you change lenses.

I'd recommend a general 50mm equivalent lens to begin with. An 85mm equivalent lens is more flattering for portraits but it doesn't mean you can't take portraits with a 50mm lens. I've seen many 50mm equivalent portraits which are amazing. I feel with a more normal focal length your daughter will be less inclined to change lenses and maybe even teach her to zoom with her feet to fill the frame. Many people start with a 35mm or 50mm equivalent lens for good reason. 85mm is more of a specialist lens and unless your daughter already has a clear focus to be a portrait photographer, it is not a lens I'd start with.

In regards to what micro four thirds lens I'd buy, I'd take a good look at the Panasonic 25mm 1.4 II which is the new weather sealed version. It's cheaper and smaller than the Olympus 1.2 but faster than the 1.8 which doesn't have any sealing. It's not a big lens and it has a versatile focal length. The aperture is bright enough to play with depth of field. On a completely subjective note, I also feel this lens has really nice rendering compared to other lenses with a similar focal length.

I used to have the old version which has the same optics. I don't shoot with it now as my interests have changed but here are a couple of old images taken with the lens.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/luke_forrest/11449823473/in/dateposted/

https://www.flickr.com/photos/luke_forrest/11449842953/in/dateposted/

https://www.flickr.com/photos/luke_forrest/11449813216/in/dateposted/

Best of luck.

Tim Reidy Productions
Tim Reidy Productions Senior Member • Posts: 3,702
Re: First non-kit lens for a young photographer.
2

4. 45mm F1.8

Looking at her photo metadata, a lot of her favourited shots were taken between 40-62mm.

This is where you should be looking for, in this range you have a 45 Olymbus

a 42.5 from panasonic

and 60mm from sigma and all are under 400 usd new.

all the o and p are brighter that what you currently have.

If you wanted waterproof you can get the 12-40 12-50 or 12-60 lenses which have some wr.

most m43 lenses do not need to be stopped down.

They're share common traits being not waterproof but allows > 2x the light again to the 12-40mm. They are all quite compact and seem suitable to have as the lens to leave on the camera ready to go.

To make matters even more complex (to me) I've read that standard lenses are commonly shot with a reduction of 1 stop to the aperture for sharpness and the 12-40mm is equally sharp throughout it's aperture range, so does that mean for optimal use the prime lenses are effective F2.8 lens anyway?

Apologies if I'm way out of my league here, I generally lack an eye for aesthetics and simply thinking in terms I can fathom i.e. amount, duration of light vs amount of signal noise.

Looking forward to your advice.

Thanks.

Marty.

 Tim Reidy Productions's gear list:Tim Reidy Productions's gear list
Panasonic Lumix DMC-FZ200 Pentax K-7 Pentax K-3 Panasonic Lumix DMC-G7 Panasonic G85 +1 more
Chas2 Veteran Member • Posts: 3,634
Data Analysis First
1

check out the exit on the photos.   There will be natural peaks of “most used” focal lengths and that will provide insight to the focal lengths she gravitates to.

Confirm the popular focal lengths by using blue tape to “lock” in a focal length on the EZ lens or the 40-150 to simulate a fixed focal length lens.  Sure you won’t have the wider apertures available but she will quickly learn if she like those lens lengths

 Chas2's gear list:Chas2's gear list
Panasonic Lumix DMC-GM1 Panasonic Lumix DMC-GX7 Panasonic G85 Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 9-18mm F4.0-5.6 Panasonic Lumix G 20mm F1.7 ASPH +12 more
addlightness Senior Member • Posts: 3,138
25/1.8
2

As my kids come of age, I teach them to drive with manual transmission first.  And for photography, a MILC with 50/f1.8 efl first (in this case, a Nikon V1 + 18.5/1.8 prime).

IMO, once they learn to work with constraints, they appreciate the physics behind them.

 addlightness's gear list:addlightness's gear list
Panasonic Lumix DMC-GM1 Olympus E-M5 II Olympus PEN-F Panasonic Lumix DMC-GX85 Panasonic Lumix G 14mm F2.5 ASPH +10 more
barbara j Regular Member • Posts: 268
Enough already, let her enjoy the experience ❤️
5

Marty Lo wrote:

When it comes to weatherproofing it's a yes and it's less stress for both of us. However who doesn't like light and compact.

As to focal length she just seems to pick up whatever and snap away. Currently, all her shots are taken in aperture priority with the exception of sports. ISO is left at 200 or Auto. The only settings she is adamant about is usually during post processing (I'm a fan of machine learning, she abhors it).

I probably should take her into the store again to try them out, that's how we picked out the camera in the end.

How can she experience the joy of mastering something new if you insist on doing all of the learning and all of the leg work for her. This is her camera, her creative outlet, i think you might be trying too too hard to “improve” her experience. Sounds like you are trying to direct the post processing as well.

It is very hard when you love your child so much and you want the best for her but in this case, I think, and this is probably just me, but I think you need to back off and let her ask for your help and then only give the help that is requested. Otherwise, the images she produces will be your images, she will smile, but she will not value them.

You do sound like a wonderful father, just a little over enthusiastic 😄

 barbara j's gear list:barbara j's gear list
Canon EOS M3 Panasonic Lumix DC-GX9 Canon EF-M 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS STM Canon EF-M 22mm f/2 STM Panasonic 12-60mm F3.5-5.6 OIS +5 more
jwilliams Veteran Member • Posts: 5,106
I'd recommend ....
1

I'd recommend any of the 3 primes you list. All are very good and can produce photos with a look (shallow DOF, sharper) that the zooms can't. Look at how she used the 14-42 zoom and what FLs you use most. Just buy the prime that fits where in the FL range she shot the most.  If you can't really do that I'd go by the old adage that you can always crop but can't put back something that isn't there.  That would favor the 17 1.8 which is one of my personal favorites.  Great for shooting inside by available light allowing her to use the camera inside without resorting to flash.

The 12-40 is a great lens and something to keep on the list to acquire. I just think a prime will be a bit more liberating for a beginner.

-- hide signature --

Jonathan

cameralight Regular Member • Posts: 158
Re: First non-kit lens for a young photographer.
1

Ramyeah wrote:

Marty Lo wrote:

Hi all,

Firstly I'm not a photography orientated guy but have fair technical background and able to research/learn fairly quickly.

I've needed to do this since my eldest child (9) have fallen head over heels with photography.

I familiarised myself with the concepts such as focal lengths, stops/qty of light and can shoot a subject fairly well exposed and focused on subject, they lack any appeal which is fine by me as I'm simply the purchaser, driver, archiver and sometimes settings advisor when light/speed of subject gets a bit challenging.

Recently, I acquired for her an OM-D E-M 5 Mk2 with 2 kit lenses:

That's a great camera

1. 14-42mm F3.5-5.6 EZ

2. 40-150mm F4-5.6 R

The two kit lenses cover most of the range required to try out different genres of photography, especially, for a beginner. (I started my DSLR journey with similar set 15 years ago, with Oly DSLR). And, are really good quality to provide great pictures.

Along with other improvements to her kit in general such as more comfortable sling, small tripod, spare battery, cleaning kit etc, I'm planning to acquire another lens for her in the near future. Hampered by not having an eye for photography I stuck to reviews and specifications in forming a short list for that fits the budget.

1. 12-40mm F2.8

pros: 1.5-4x more light throughout a focal range she's used to, weatherproof (great where we reside), rated highly by Olympus youtubers(?)

cons: 2x weight of current 40-150.

This one seems to be the easy choice as it's similar yet superior to her current lens in every way except for a near 2x increase in weight and bulk.

The next three are primes:

2. 17mm F1.8

equiv. of ~25mm on Fujifilms that gets raved about for everyday photography

3. 25mm F1.8

equiv. of 50mm. Closest to the eye's perspective. Everyone needs one????

4. 45mm F1.8

Looking at her photo metadata, a lot of her favourited shots were taken between 40-62mm.

They're share common traits being not waterproof but allows > 2x the light again to the 12-40mm. They are all quite compact and seem suitable to have as the lens to leave on the camera ready to go.

I personally feel, 12-40/2.8 Pro would be an overkill (in terms of size, weight and price) though I see your point regarding weatherproof.

To make matters even more complex (to me) I've read that standard lenses are commonly shot with a reduction of 1 stop to the aperture for sharpness and the 12-40mm is equally sharp throughout it's aperture range, so does that mean for optimal use the prime lenses are effective F2.8 lens anyway?

No need to worry on this aspect, they are adequately sharp even wide open.

Apologies if I'm way out of my league here, I generally lack an eye for aesthetics and simply thinking in terms I can fathom i.e. amount, duration of light vs amount of signal noise.

Looking forward to your advice.

Thanks.

Marty.

Marty,

I must say that, you have done your homework pretty well, in order to support the passion of your kid...appreciate the effort put in to understand the subject, and you are not off the mark at all.

I would stress upon learning the basics of photography - the techniques, skills and the aesthetics aspects first and later go for upgrading the gear to overcome it's shortcomings, if any, for a specific use-case.

My general suggestions would be: As a beginner, let her start with the available kit and click all and sundry photos to her liking - which is what she's doing, I guess.

However, learning with a Prime lens has it's own merit, as one has to think of framing and composition, without the flexibility of the zoom. From your data, that looks like 45/1.8 - another exceptional High Quality-High value lens (and so are the other two). Adding that to the kit, would help enhance skills and progress next level

Then, ask her to work on some specific "project' say every week or so, based on her interest and aptitude. You can jointly review the pictures in terms of focus, framing, composition, etc. and discuss how to improve - a great way to learn.

Submitting photos to some photographic forums which are mostly topic specific like street/macro/action/wildlife etc. for Comments & Critics from other enthusiasts/seniors is a great way for learning, especially for a beginner.

Give it a few months and you would know which is the type of photography she's more interested in. Then, it's easy to chose the appropriate lens to suit that genre and help her learn specifics and enhance skills.

My best wishes to your child and cheers to her supporting dad,

Ramesh

Very good advice. One thing however I would suggest in regard to submitting photos to online forums is to check out the nature and tone of the forum in advance.

It would be a great shame to see an enthusiastic youngster get disheartened just because certain commenters can't resist being overly-critical of others' efforts.

Photo Pete Veteran Member • Posts: 5,182
Re: First non-kit lens for a young photographer.
1

9 is very young and it is quite probable that the infatuation with dedicated camera gear might not last long once she sees friends snapping away with their smartphones and having fun with the other phone features too.

It would be great to keep her interest though so I’d concentrate on providing lens options that smartphones can’t really match. Go for a lightweight long telephoto such as the 70-300 or an ultra wide angle such as the 9-18 or a macro lens. In a child’s mind being able to zoom in super close or capture a really wide view of a room or being able to take photos of tiny objects is surprisingly appealing.

Being able to shoot with shallow depth of field is not really so unique as many smartphones are emulating the effect anyway. 9 year olds tend to be less concerned about it appearing a little artificial than us old grumpy photographers.

-- hide signature --

Have Fun
Photo Pete

Photo Pete Veteran Member • Posts: 5,182
Re: First non-kit lens for a young photographer.
1

Marty Lo wrote:

Nikonparrothead wrote:

It’s helpful that you know the focal range she prefers to shoot in. But ask what types of images she has NOT been able to capture with her current kit.

The lens that helps her capture those images would be the next lens (the macro may be it — though I found them too sharp for most portraits).

Petsonally I’d put the pause on gear purchases and encourage her knowledge of the craft through video tutorials. It sounds like, except for sports, she’s using the camera as a point, zoom and shoot.

The biggest shortcoming so far is lighting indoors.

Get her a little bounce flash like a nissin i40.

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Have Fun
Photo Pete

Aberaeron Veteran Member • Posts: 7,876
Don't go over the top!
2

She's young and needs stuff to look forward to.

Get her the 45mm f1.8 for Christmas and leave it there for a while. She will be luckier than 99% of The Earth's population of adults, let alone children.

 Aberaeron's gear list:Aberaeron's gear list
Fujifilm X20 Panasonic Lumix DMC-G7 Olympus OM-D E-M10 II Panasonic Lumix DMC-GX85 Sony a7 III +23 more
jhunna Senior Member • Posts: 1,157
Re: Don't go over the top!
1

Aberaeron wrote:

She's young and needs stuff to look forward to.

Get her the 45mm f1.8 for Christmas and leave it there for a while. She will be luckier than 99% of The Earth's population of adults, let alone children.

I logged in to suggest the same.  This or the 60 macro would be my recommendation because the difference between this and the kit lenses would be noticeable immediately.

 jhunna's gear list:jhunna's gear list
Panasonic Lumix DMC-GX8 Panasonic Lumix DMC-GX85 Panasonic Lumix G 20mm F1.7 ASPH Panasonic Leica DG Macro-Elmarit 45mm F2.8 ASPH OIS Olympus Body Cap Lens 15mm F8.0 +7 more
Jeff Veteran Member • Posts: 6,170
Re: Enough already, let her enjoy the experience ❤️
1

barbara j wrote:

Marty Lo wrote:

When it comes to weatherproofing it's a yes and it's less stress for both of us. However who doesn't like light and compact.

As to focal length she just seems to pick up whatever and snap away. Currently, all her shots are taken in aperture priority with the exception of sports. ISO is left at 200 or Auto. The only settings she is adamant about is usually during post processing (I'm a fan of machine learning, she abhors it).

I probably should take her into the store again to try them out, that's how we picked out the camera in the end.

How can she experience the joy of mastering something new if you insist on doing all of the learning and all of the leg work for her. This is her camera, her creative outlet, i think you might be trying too too hard to “improve” her experience. Sounds like you are trying to direct the post processing as well.

It is very hard when you love your child so much and you want the best for her but in this case, I think, and this is probably just me, but I think you need to back off and let her ask for your help and then only give the help that is requested. Otherwise, the images she produces will be your images, she will smile, but she will not value them.

You do sound like a wonderful father, just a little over enthusiastic 😄

Did you look at her photos?  She's doing all right, to put it simply.  She's 9, and dad is just trying to keep up.

 Jeff's gear list:Jeff's gear list
Olympus 45mm F1.2 Pro Olympus PEN E-P5 Olympus E-M1 Olympus OM-D E-M1X Olympus Zuiko Digital ED 150mm 1:2.0 +9 more
Jeff Veteran Member • Posts: 6,170
Re: First non-kit lens for a young photographer.
1

Photo Pete wrote:

9 is very young and it is quite probable that the infatuation with dedicated camera gear might not last long once she sees friends snapping away with their smartphones and having fun with the other phone features too.

It would be great to keep her interest though so I’d concentrate on providing lens options that smartphones can’t really match. Go for a lightweight long telephoto such as the 70-300 or an ultra wide angle such as the 9-18 or a macro lens. In a child’s mind being able to zoom in super close or capture a really wide view of a room or being able to take photos of tiny objects is surprisingly appealing.

Being able to shoot with shallow depth of field is not really so unique as many smartphones are emulating the effect anyway. 9 year olds tend to be less concerned about it appearing a little artificial than us old grumpy photographers.

She's young. But if you look at her instagram feed that this 9yr has a pretty sophisticated eye

I was also very young when I got started with photography and my first instamatic, followed shortly thereafter by granddad's and uncle's old cast offs.  It was a lot of fun, even if they weren't in the same ball pack as this young person. Though I've had dry spells in the 5+ decades since, photography has always been a passion. Bet many of you would say the same thing. This may be hers, too.

You simply can't predict what's going to happen at this age. So take a flyer and have some fun while it lasts.

 Jeff's gear list:Jeff's gear list
Olympus 45mm F1.2 Pro Olympus PEN E-P5 Olympus E-M1 Olympus OM-D E-M1X Olympus Zuiko Digital ED 150mm 1:2.0 +9 more
JaKing
JaKing Senior Member • Posts: 6,130
Re: First non-kit lens for a young photographer.
1

Marty, welcome to the forum.

Recommendation - Olympus f/1.8 25mm.

Reasons -

- Optically fast, but you don't have to sell a kidney!

- Good reasons why almost every interchangeable lens camera for the last 80 years came with one of these as a 'standard lens'.

- THE guru of lens testing recommends it, Roger Cicala (see end of article in conclusions) :

https://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2018/01/finally-some-m43-mtf-testing-25mm-prime-lens-comparison/

I can personally vouch for this little beauty.

If she becomes interested in prime lens shooting, this becomes the foundation lens of a nice trio f/1.8 17, 25, 45 (+75 ... ). None are super expensive, all are excellent, except the 45mm has excessive field curvature - can be a benefit for e.g. portrait photography.

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br, john, from you know where
My gear list and sordid past are here: https://www.dpreview.com/members/1558378718/overview
Gallery: https://www.canopuscomputing.com.au/zen2/page/gallery/

 JaKing's gear list:JaKing's gear list
Olympus E-M1 Olympus E-M1 II Olympus M.Zuiko Digital ED 14-42mm F3.5-5.6 EZ Olympus 12-100mm F4.0 Olympus E-1 +28 more
David E P Junior Member • Posts: 27
Re: First non-kit lens for a young photographer.

Jeff wrote:

Photo Pete wrote:

9 is very young and it is quite probable that the infatuation with dedicated camera gear might not last long once she sees friends snapping away with their smartphones and having fun with the other phone features too.

It would be great to keep her interest though so I’d concentrate on providing lens options that smartphones can’t really match. Go for a lightweight long telephoto such as the 70-300 or an ultra wide angle such as the 9-18 or a macro lens. In a child’s mind being able to zoom in super close or capture a really wide view of a room or being able to take photos of tiny objects is surprisingly appealing.

Being able to shoot with shallow depth of field is not really so unique as many smartphones are emulating the effect anyway. 9 year olds tend to be less concerned about it appearing a little artificial than us old grumpy photographers.

She's young. But if you look at her instagram feed that this 9yr has a pretty sophisticated eye

Isnt Instagram supposed to be for kids at least 13 year old??

I was also very young when I got started with photography and my first instamatic, followed shortly thereafter by granddad's and uncle's old cast offs. It was a lot of fun, even if they weren't in the same ball pack as this young person. Though I've had dry spells in the 5+ decades since, photography has always been a passion. Bet many of you would say the same thing. This may be hers, too.

You simply can't predict what's going to happen at this age. So take a flyer and have some fun while it lasts.

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