In anticipating the incoming M6mkII, how mkI holds up till now for me

Started 2 months ago | Photos
zero214
zero214 Regular Member • Posts: 126
In anticipating the incoming M6mkII, how mkI holds up till now for me
22

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Canon EOS M6 Canon EF 85mm f/1.8 USM Canon EF 100mm F2.8L Macro IS USM Canon EF-M 22mm f/2 STM Canon EF-M 11-22mm f/4-5.6 IS STM +3 more
Comment & critique:
Please provide me constructive critique and criticism.
thunder storm Senior Member • Posts: 2,524
Re: In anticipating the incoming M6mkII, how mkI holds up till now for me
9

Could have been made with the original M or the M100 too.  "Sometimes" the photographer is more important. 

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If your facts are different we could save the peace just by calling it copy to copy variation.

dpeete Regular Member • Posts: 400
Re: In anticipating the incoming M6mkII, how mkI holds up till now for me

Not denigrating the photographer, because clearly these are amazing shots.... but they also point to the subject matter being important. Static subjects work well with the M.

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Craig Smith Regular Member • Posts: 282
Re: In anticipating the incoming M6mkII, how mkI holds up till now for me
3

Fantastic shots!

Remember guys, Ansel Adams didn't have IBIS, dual card slots, or 4K video and look what he accomplished! Go out and take some pics!

(Look for the original M6 to be on sale this holiday season.)

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noisephotographer Contributing Member • Posts: 975
Re: In anticipating the incoming M6mkII, how mkI holds up till now for me

Craig Smith wrote:

(Look for the original M6 to be on sale this holiday season.)

I wouldn't recommend that unless you never use P mode + Auto Iso. The M6 has a serious issue in P mode + Auto Iso, but nobody in this forum is talking about that (I guess most users here are very biased or don't test cameras accurately): In P mode + Auto Iso the M6 will often choose 1/250s, even with the stabilized 15-45mm at 15mm in low-light conditions. Then you will capture even less light in low-light conditions than very old(!) smartphone cameras.

It seems that this happens when the camera detects that it is moving, but even very small normal(!) movements can cause 1/250s at high Isos. I can reproduce this immediately with M5, M6 and M100 cameras. Whenever I go to a camera store, I can reproduce it immediately, so I could show it to a Canon employee, who confirmed the issue. This was one of the main reasons (apart from the unusable(!) low-light autofocus when using slow lenses without using the autofocus light) why I sent the M6 back. The M50 (or Canon DSLRs) don't have this issue. It's a shame that Canon doesn't fix this issue.

But the M50 has a very inconsistent autofocus when you want to focus on small objects, nearly unusable. I didn't test this with the M6, so it's possible that the M6 is better in this regard.

Ben Herrmann
Ben Herrmann Forum Pro • Posts: 20,691
These are very good...
4

You apparently are a imaginative (and excellent) photographer - keep up the good work.  There is a tendency to remark, "Well, those could have been taken with any camera," but that sort of rains on the parade of the poster.  I've caught myself periodically wanting to say that on some postings on all of the forums, but I then tend to pull back from doing so.

As for the Mk6 Mk II, there are those (which always happens with a pending release) who will malign the camera - in this case, strongly speculating that the higher ISO's will go to sh_t due to the higher MP count.  I say let's wait for the release and the tests/reviews before we write that assumption into stone.  I know I'm interested in the M6 Mk II mainly for the higher MP factor (cropping, etc) because I would mainly be interested in using it for day time scenic and nature scenarios (I'm not a video user - just stills).

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Best of luck and health to you all!

Bernd ("Ben") Werner Herrmann
Fuquay Varina, North Carolina USA

As a reminder, keep in mind that my postings represent my opinions only - not those of other folks, nor am I implying that others will feel the same way that I do about a given issue. However, If you feel compelled to argue about a personal opinion of mine, please feel free to go ahead and do so - without my participation of course - and that would be quite an interesting conversation to say the least.

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thunder storm Senior Member • Posts: 2,524
Re: In anticipating the incoming M6mkII, how mkI holds up till now for me

noisephotographer wrote:

Craig Smith wrote:

(Look for the original M6 to be on sale this holiday season.)

I wouldn't recommend that unless you never use P mode + Auto Iso. The M6 has a serious issue in P mode + Auto Iso, but nobody in this forum is talking about that (I guess most users here are very biased or don't test cameras accurately): In P mode + Auto Iso the M6 will often choose 1/250s, even with the stabilized 15-45mm at 15mm in low-light conditions. Then you will capture even less light in low-light conditions than very old(!) smartphone cameras.

It seems that this happens when the camera detects that it is moving, but even very small normal(!) movements can cause 1/250s at high Isos. I can reproduce this immediately with M5, M6 and M100 cameras. Whenever I go to a camera store, I can reproduce it immediately, so I could show it to a Canon employee, who confirmed the issue.

The 70D has the same issue. I will upgrade it for its poor auto ISO implementation alone. Not sure yet if i will get an 80D, 90D or 7DmkII as a replacement.

This was one of the main reasons (apart from the unusable(!) low-light autofocus when using slow lenses without using the autofocus light) why I sent the M6 back. The M50 (or Canon DSLRs) don't have this issue. It's a shame that Canon doesn't fix this issue.

But the M50 has a very inconsistent autofocus when you want to focus on small objects, nearly unusable. I didn't test this with the M6, so it's possible that the M6 is better in this regard.

Using object/face tracking with very small parts of the frame with subjects far away is a problem. Single point AF might give better results. If it is an part of the frame just as small, but the object isn't so far away there are no issues.  For my type of shooting it is almost never a problem, but i have run into these situations, so i can confirm the issue.

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If your facts are different we could save the peace just by calling it copy to copy variation.

konsolas_captures
konsolas_captures Junior Member • Posts: 35
Re: In anticipating the incoming M6mkII, how mkI holds up till now for me

Amazing photos man, bravo!!!

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Bhotoz Contributing Member • Posts: 987
Re: In anticipating the incoming M6mkII, how mkI holds up till now for me
1

thunder storm wrote:

Could have been made with the original M or the M100 too. "Sometimes" the photographer is more important.

Yes, but with original M, some of these pics propably should have been taken using manual focus. Nice pics anyway!

zero214
OP zero214 Regular Member • Posts: 126
Re: These are very good...

Thank you folks and thank you for your compliments Ben,

I'm really looking forward the release of M6mkII, because it looks too sexy :-P, I might order one and find a used M5 or black M6 (which there will be a lot after M5mkII gets released) to accompany my silver one.

M6 still does fine for me, from astro, landscape, portrait, so there is no need to replace it, as I have gifted my M and M2 to a friend and my sister, it's getting annoying to change lense everytime I wander out or change subject, especially changing lense in the open sea, I might order M6mkII without waiting for reviews, then live with whatever shortcomings just like with original M (with the help from Marco Nero and his helpful threads and excellent captures) back then.

M series is a fun way to get into photography (I was into the tech of Sony back then and lost interest) after my years with iPhone 4s, so small to carry, weightless and I'm less noticed by surrounding folks when photographing scenes, compare to other guys with enoromous lenses, cameras, and tripods.

As for your remark, I have seen those so many times on so many forums that I don't really mind, it might annoy me as first but now I tend to ignore those comments and life goes on.

Just keep trying to push the Ms to the extreme, with the M6mkII, i guess the doomsayers will finally be silent?

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Jack Jian Regular Member • Posts: 174
Re: These are very good...

Things I would go for the M6 mk II
1. Increase in low light AF sensitivity (-5ev with f1.4), indicating (I assumed), improve AF performance, more in line with accuracy and consistency. 
2. Deeper buffer or at least, UHS II is very fast that I won't need to wait long when shooting those occasional fast actions. 
3. Eye AF is a welcome! (I love shooting wide with 50/85).
4. Non-cropped 4K with DPAF is much welcome.
5. Touch and drag added in attachable EVF is great. 
6. 32MP, I don't care, but it's a welcome to have more space when cropping in.
7. 30fps RAW burst is amazing!

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Alastair Norcross Veteran Member • Posts: 6,732
Re: In anticipating the incoming M6mkII, how mkI holds up till now for me
1

noisephotographer wrote:

Craig Smith wrote:

(Look for the original M6 to be on sale this holiday season.)

I wouldn't recommend that unless you never use P mode + Auto Iso. The M6 has a serious issue in P mode + Auto Iso, but nobody in this forum is talking about that (I guess most users here are very biased or don't test cameras accurately):

This is just plain idiotic. You complained about this extensively a while ago. I didn't know about it before that, because, like most people with the M6, I don't use P mode. I haven't used P mode on a camera in over thirty years. So I didn't test the camera in P mode for this behavior, because I knew I'd never be using P mode. For me, and many (probably most) others, it's simply a non-issue. So the camera does something that some people don't like (but for which there's actually a good reason--see below), but doesn't affect the vast majority of users. Why should we talk about it? You've already told us about it, so what more is there to say? That Noise person can't use the M6, because he can't figure out how to use the camera in one of the other modes. Oh dear! Let's wring our hands for him, and keep posting about it, so as not to be 'biased'. We get it. You feel you have to use P mode with auto ISO, and you can't keep the camera still, so it selects 1/250, and you don't like it.

In P mode + Auto Iso the M6 will often choose 1/250s, even with the stabilized 15-45mm at 15mm in low-light conditions. Then you will capture even less light in low-light conditions than very old(!) smartphone cameras.

It seems that this happens when the camera detects that it is moving, but even very small normal(!) movements can cause 1/250s at high Isos

Yes, small movements cause it to select 1/250, and then, when you hold still again, it reverts to the more appropriate slower speed immediately. If you are moving the camera while taking the shot, it needs a higher speed. This is actually an intelligent feature by Canon. Overall, the auto ISO implementation on the M6 is not great (but not because of this particular issue), but it's easy to live with it, if you understand the basics of photography. Maybe the M6II will improve that. If so, good, but it's such a minor issue that you'd have to be either a monomaniac or an incompetent photographer to rule out the camera on that basis.

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Ben Herrmann
Ben Herrmann Forum Pro • Posts: 20,691
Bingo - exactly what I was thinking....NT
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Best of luck and health to you all!

Bernd ("Ben") Werner Herrmann
Fuquay Varina, North Carolina USA

As a reminder, keep in mind that my postings represent my opinions only - not those of other folks, nor am I implying that others will feel the same way that I do about a given issue. However, If you feel compelled to argue about a personal opinion of mine, please feel free to go ahead and do so - without my participation of course - and that would be quite an interesting conversation to say the least.

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thunder storm Senior Member • Posts: 2,524
Re: In anticipating the incoming M6mkII, how mkI holds up till now for me

Alastair Norcross wrote:

noisephotographer wrote:

Craig Smith wrote:

(Look for the original M6 to be on sale this holiday season.)

I wouldn't recommend that unless you never use P mode + Auto Iso. The M6 has a serious issue in P mode + Auto Iso, but nobody in this forum is talking about that (I guess most users here are very biased or don't test cameras accurately):

This is just plain idiotic. You complained about this extensively a while ago. I didn't know about it before that, because, like most people with the M6, I don't use P mode. I haven't used P mode on a camera in over thirty years. So I didn't test the camera in P mode for this behavior, because I knew I'd never be using P mode. For me, and many (probably most) others, it's simply a non-issue.

Oh, so there is a preference disqualified because you don't have the same preference and the M6 has a design flaw.

So the camera does something that some people don't like (but for which there's actually a good reason--see below), but doesn't affect the vast majority of users. Why should we talk about it? You've already told us about it, so what more is there to say?

That it would be nice if the problem - although it is not your problem - would be solved with the newest M6 version. I see everybody here repeating there preferences regarding the new M6, so why is the redundancy in this case all of a sudden so problematic?

That Noise person can't use the M6, because he can't figure out how to use the camera in one of the other modes. Oh dear! Let's wring our hands for him, and keep posting about it, so as not to be 'biased'. We get it. You feel you have to use P mode with auto ISO, and you can't keep the camera still, so it selects 1/250, and you don't like it.

In P mode + Auto Iso the M6 will often choose 1/250s, even with the stabilized 15-45mm at 15mm in low-light conditions. Then you will capture even less light in low-light conditions than very old(!) smartphone cameras.

It seems that this happens when the camera detects that it is moving, but even very small normal(!) movements can cause 1/250s at high Isos

Yes, small movements cause it to select 1/250, and then, when you hold still again, it reverts to the more appropriate slower speed immediately.

In the 70D the "immediacy" isn't that immediate. It might be trying to intelligent, but if it is the same as with the M6 it is a slow intelligence really.

If you are moving the camera while taking the shot, it needs a higher speed. This is actually an intelligent feature by Canon. Overall, the auto ISO implementation on the M6 is not great (but not because of this particular issue), but it's easy to live with it, if you understand the basics of photography. Maybe the M6II will improve that. If so, good, but it's such a minor issue that you'd have to be either a monomaniac or an incompetent

(...)

photographer to rule out the camera on that basis.

I would say: Just don't rule out another photographer because he/she has a preference you don't have.

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If your facts are different we could save the peace just by calling it copy to copy variation.

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