Mitakon 35mm f/0.95 wide open in daylight... Electronic Shutter or ND filter?

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akin_t Veteran Member • Posts: 3,320
Mitakon 35mm f/0.95 wide open in daylight... Electronic Shutter or ND filter?

I honestly keep forgetting about the electronic shutter on Fuji cameras.

Is there any reason to use an ND filter over the electronic shutter to nail exposure with this wide open on sunny days?

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Sjak
Sjak Senior Member • Posts: 4,517
Re: Mitakon 35mm f/0.95 wide open in daylight... Electronic Shutter or ND filter?
3

If you shoot moving subjects, then the mechanical shutter is recommended, and that may require the ND-filter sometimes. Otherwise, the electronic shutter is fine.

My shutter is usually set to MS+ES. For moving stuff, full aperture on a fast lens is not the way to achieve reliable focus anyway

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JayPhizzt Senior Member • Posts: 1,031
Re: Mitakon 35mm f/0.95 wide open in daylight... Electronic Shutter or ND filter?
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Sjak wrote:

If you shoot moving subjects, then the mechanical shutter is recommended, and that may require the ND-filter sometimes. Otherwise, the electronic shutter is fine.

My shutter is usually set to MS+ES. For moving stuff, full aperture on a fast lens is not the way to achieve reliable focus anyway

I don't think there are many people that shoot moving subjects with manual lenses... Maybe for slow moving subjects, but then rolling shutter probably won't be much of a problem anyway.

I have a Mitakon 35/0.95 and I just use the electronic shutter when needed.

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Sjak
Sjak Senior Member • Posts: 4,517
Re: Mitakon 35mm f/0.95 wide open in daylight... Electronic Shutter or ND filter?
1

JayPhizzt wrote:

I don't think there are many people that shoot moving subjects with manual lenses...

Why not? It's often easy to anticipate when and where a target will be. Recently, there was e.g. a post about someone experiencing issues with AF on kids on a swing; with MF, that is very easy. Or panning: with MF, there is no chance the system will suddenly decide to focus on something in the background instead.

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CeeDave
CeeDave Senior Member • Posts: 1,390
Re: Mitakon 35mm f/0.95 wide open in daylight... Electronic Shutter or ND filter?
2

Sjak wrote:

JayPhizzt wrote:

I don't think there are many people that shoot moving subjects with manual lenses...

Why not? It's often easy to anticipate when and where a target will be. Recently, there was e.g. a post about someone experiencing issues with AF on kids on a swing; with MF, that is very easy. Or panning: with MF, there is no chance the system will suddenly decide to focus on something in the background instead.

I agree, this works for me, even with the Rokinon 135/2 for street performers (and that lens has very shallow DOF with its 67.5 mm entrance pupil, compared to 36.8 mm for the 35/0.95.

E-shutter is a good thing to have as a backstop on bright days with fast lenses, and often gives me shots with no objectionable artifacts. At least on the T1, ES cannot be used with tracking continuous AF, by the way.

Musician on Royal Street, New Orleans. EXIF is wrong (forgot to set it in menu, doh!)—this is the Rokinon 135/2 at f/2 and 1/5400 s, electronic shutter. She moved quickly, but predictably (and in a limited range).

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Chris
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alekt449 Regular Member • Posts: 114
Re: Mitakon 35mm f/0.95 wide open in daylight... Electronic Shutter or ND filter?
1

akin_t wrote:

I honestly keep forgetting about the electronic shutter on Fuji cameras.

Is there any reason to use an ND filter over the electronic shutter to nail exposure with this wide open on sunny days?

Electronic shutter changes the bokeh which the lens produces. If bokeh is your primary objective try testing side by side if it is relevant for you. Here explained

Truman Prevatt
Truman Prevatt Veteran Member • Posts: 9,167
Re: Mitakon 35mm f/0.95 wide open in daylight... Electronic Shutter or ND filter?

alekt449 wrote:

akin_t wrote:

I honestly keep forgetting about the electronic shutter on Fuji cameras.

Is there any reason to use an ND filter over the electronic shutter to nail exposure with this wide open on sunny days?

Electronic shutter changes the bokeh which the lens produces. If bokeh is your primary objective try testing side by side if it is relevant for you. Here explained

Interesting.  The electronic shutter implementation we have today is really a scanning shutter - instead of a true electronic implementation of a shutter.  I steer away from purely electronic shutters unless absolutely necessary.  I would much prefer slap a ND filter on than use an electronic shutter.

The EFC is pretty much the sweet spot for below 1/2000s  with the H1 and T3.

When the chip makers can prefect the readout technology for for a global shutter (and keep the read noise in check) then the mechanical and current implementation of the electronic shutter will be obsolete. But until then - I will keep the shutter speed less than 1/8000s and use the mechanical shutter and on my H1 use EFC at 1/2000s and use the mechanical shutter from 1/2000 to 1/8000.

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OP akin_t Veteran Member • Posts: 3,320
Re: Mitakon 35mm f/0.95 wide open in daylight... Electronic Shutter or ND filter?

alekt449 wrote:

akin_t wrote:

I honestly keep forgetting about the electronic shutter on Fuji cameras.

Is there any reason to use an ND filter over the electronic shutter to nail exposure with this wide open on sunny days?

Electronic shutter changes the bokeh which the lens produces. If bokeh is your primary objective try testing side by side if it is relevant for you. Here explained

Thanks for pointing that out, yes that definitely was my use case.

I do wonder why this is the case though, maybe it's because we don't have a true global shutter. Either way, I wonder whether it's worth the price of an ND filter, I'll conduct some tests and see what I notice.

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CeeDave
CeeDave Senior Member • Posts: 1,390
Re: Mitakon 35mm f/0.95 wide open in daylight... Electronic Shutter or ND filter?
1

alekt449 wrote:

akin_t wrote:

I honestly keep forgetting about the electronic shutter on Fuji cameras.

Is there any reason to use an ND filter over the electronic shutter to nail exposure with this wide open on sunny days?

Electronic shutter changes the bokeh which the lens produces. If bokeh is your primary objective try testing side by side if it is relevant for you. Here explained

Interesting. I haven’t noticed this on my X-T1 with manual lenses, and can’t reproduce it, either.

Maybe it is related to how a camera manipulates the aperture at the time of exposure, which it can only do for lenses that communicate with the camera? I can’t see how shutter speed or type *per se* could have any effect on blur. Anyone have an explanation?

(Also, it shouldn’t affect exposure...this really looks like either a hardware problem in automated aperture control, or a firmware/software problem in the e-shutter control. I’m not persuaded that it is inevitable with ES, but I’m open to a persuasive explanation.)

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Chris
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OP akin_t Veteran Member • Posts: 3,320
Re: Mitakon 35mm f/0.95 wide open in daylight... Electronic Shutter or ND filter?

CeeDave wrote:

alekt449 wrote:

akin_t wrote:

I honestly keep forgetting about the electronic shutter on Fuji cameras.

Is there any reason to use an ND filter over the electronic shutter to nail exposure with this wide open on sunny days?

Electronic shutter changes the bokeh which the lens produces. If bokeh is your primary objective try testing side by side if it is relevant for you. Here explained

Interesting. I haven’t noticed this on my X-T1 with manual lenses, and can’t reproduce it, either.

Maybe it is related to how a camera manipulates the aperture at the time of exposure, which it can only do for lenses that communicate with the camera? I can’t see how shutter speed or type *per se* could have any effect on blur. Anyone have an explanation?

(Also, it shouldn’t affect exposure...this really looks like either a hardware problem in automated aperture control, or a firmware/software problem in the e-shutter control. I’m not persuaded that it is inevitable with ES, but I’m open to a persuasive explanation.)

It's a mystery isn't it? I know how an electronic shutter works, so to me I can understand the difference in exposure but definitely not the difference in out of focus areas (which is purely a function of lens opening).

In any case, I will run some tests with both the Zeiss 32mm and the MItakon 35mm and see what happens.

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SigmaChrome Forum Pro • Posts: 11,185
Re: Mitakon 35mm f/0.95 wide open in daylight... Electronic Shutter or ND filter?

akin_t wrote:

I honestly keep forgetting about the electronic shutter on Fuji cameras.

Is there any reason to use an ND filter over the electronic shutter to nail exposure with this wide open on sunny days?

It really depends of whether you want to capture movement or freeze it. If you want a slow shutter speed then, yes, you need an ND filter.

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yukosteel
yukosteel Regular Member • Posts: 101
Re: Mitakon 35mm f/0.95 wide open in daylight... Electronic Shutter or ND filter?
1

Mitakon 35mm F0.95 version II is one of my most used lens on Fuji-X for more than 3 years. 95% of time I'm using electronic shutter. In my personal shooting cases I never needed a ND filter.

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Sjak
Sjak Senior Member • Posts: 4,517
Re: Mitakon 35mm f/0.95 wide open in daylight... Electronic Shutter or ND filter?

CeeDave wrote:

Musician on Royal Street, New Orleans. EXIF is wrong (forgot to set it in menu, doh!)—this is the Rokinon 135/2 at f/2 and 1/5400 s, electronic shutter. She moved quickly, but predictably (and in a limited range).

Excellent shot, well done!!

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