how to compare camera to mobile phone?

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SergeyAU Forum Member • Posts: 52
how to compare camera to mobile phone?

there was a discussion before about why phones seem to take better pictures these days. I am just trying to work out a simple formula to convert settings that my s9 has taken pictures with to settings on my Canon M100

S9 crop factor is 6.1 (1/2.55" sensor)

M100 crop factor is 1.6

Is there a simple calculator somewhere to convert aperture, shutter, ISO from one size sensor to another?

If phone used f1.7, 1/125, ISO 1200, what should I set my camera to for a similar looking picture?

Canon EOS M100 Nikon Coolpix S9
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Mark Scott Abeln
Mark Scott Abeln Forum Pro • Posts: 13,400
Not the way to do it
3

You probably won’t get satisfactory results by matching equivalent settings.

The secret of a lot of smartphones is pretty simple:

  • Boost saturation to make the photos more colorful 
  • Boost contrast to give strong midtone detail, and give purer whites and darker blacks.
  • Boost sharpening to give you crisper images.
  • Dial in a bit of negative exposure compensation to preserve color and texture in brighter colors.

These are the basics and probably will give you the results you want.

There are other things that smartphones can do such as stacking exposures to give less noise, but this isn’t a problem if you use your camera’s base ISO, which a smartphone camera can’t match.

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Gerry Winterbourne Forum Pro • Posts: 15,610
Re: how to compare camera to mobile phone?
4

SergeyAU wrote:

there was a discussion before about why phones seem to take better pictures these days. I am just trying to work out a simple formula to convert settings that my s9 has taken pictures with to settings on my Canon M100

S9 crop factor is 6.1 (1/2.55" sensor)

M100 crop factor is 1.6

Is there a simple calculator somewhere to convert aperture, shutter, ISO from one size sensor to another?

If phone used f1.7, 1/125, ISO 1200, what should I set my camera to for a similar looking picture?

This is a wild goose chase. Before you even think about settings you need to work out which lens will give you the same field of view. Then you need to know the saturation, contrast, sharpening etc that the phone applied (and those parameters are probably invisible to you).

Unless you can answer all those things you won't get similar looking pictures whatever settings you use.

Just accept that a camera is one tool and a phone is a different tool and find the way of using each that gives the results you want.

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Gerry
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OP SergeyAU Forum Member • Posts: 52
Re: how to compare camera to mobile phone?

I was trying to compare night/low light shots.

Not talking about FoV. Just visual lightness and sharpness.

OP SergeyAU Forum Member • Posts: 52
Re: how to compare camera to mobile phone?

One of the reasons why I ask this question is because I am very amateur photographer and I don't always know what to dial into manual settings. So the idea was that I can use my phone to take a test snap and then convert it to my camera settings if I liked the picture from mobile

baloo_buc Forum Pro • Posts: 10,126
Re: how to compare camera to mobile phone?

SergeyAU wrote:

there was a discussion before about why phones seem to take better pictures these days. I am just trying to work out a simple formula to convert settings that my s9 has taken pictures with to settings on my Canon M100

S9 crop factor is 6.1 (1/2.55" sensor)

M100 crop factor is 1.6

Is there a simple calculator somewhere to convert aperture, shutter, ISO from one size sensor to another?

If phone used f1.7, 1/125, ISO 1200, what should I set my camera to for a similar looking picture?

Stricto senso you will get the same results with f/6.5, 1/125 s and ISO 17500. But M50 can have f/4 as aperture not f/6.5 so you can have a better picture at f/4, 1/125 s, ISO 6400.

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Victor
Bucuresti, Romania

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OP SergeyAU Forum Member • Posts: 52
Re: how to compare camera to mobile phone?

What is the ISO conversion formula?

baloo_buc Forum Pro • Posts: 10,126
Re: how to compare camera to mobile phone?
1

The equivalent ISO is the ISO multiplied with the crop factor squared. Your crop factor would be 6.1/1.6=3.8125. ISO (large sensor) = 3.8125^2 x ISO (small sensor).

So ISO = 3.8125^2 x 1200 = 17442.

You can find why in this article:

https://www.dpreview.com/articles/2666934640/what-is-equivalence-and-why-should-i-care

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Victor
Bucuresti, Romania

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OP SergeyAU Forum Member • Posts: 52
Re: how to compare camera to mobile phone?

This just feels strange, that on a bigger sensor I have to use much higher ISO than on the smaller sensor?

OP SergeyAU Forum Member • Posts: 52
Re: how to compare camera to mobile phone?

baloo_buc wrote:

The equivalent ISO is the ISO multiplied with the crop factor squared. Your crop factor would be 6.1/1.6=3.8125. ISO (large sensor) = 3.8125^2 x ISO (small sensor).

So ISO = 3.8125^2 x 1200 = 17442.

You can find why in this article:

https://www.dpreview.com/articles/2666934640/what-is-equivalence-and-why-should-i-care

So, thinking about it, if I want similar picture as my phone, I set my camera to F/6.5, same shutter speed of 1/125 and ISO of 18168 (just using numbers). But it will be grainy as hell! I have to try it tonight and see for myself. And if I can lower the aperture to say 3.5, I can also drop the ISO, which should produce much better/cleaner image...

PhotoTeach2 Senior Member • Posts: 9,761
Re: how to compare camera to mobile phone?
2

I respect your interest in (any/all) facets of photography, (including "equivalence").

But I don't understand why you are obsessed with taking the "same" image ???

But you also have to define what you mean by "same" ???

You can shoot a cell-phone f1.7, 1/125, ISO 1200 image on your "M" @ EXACTLY THE SAME EXPOSURE-SETTINGS. The "lightness" will be the same, (assuming the ISO calibrations are the same), but DOF & noise-level will be different.

BTW: that ISO seems high and shutter-speed low unless you are shooting indoors or NIGHT.

Because of the larger-sensor ... the DOF will be shorter/shallower.

To get the same DOF you need to use f/11 (and about ISO-26,000 @ 1/125s), but you will also need approx. 12mm lens for same FOV/AOV & DOF.

Both cameras/phone are DIFFERENT ...

Both cameras/phone have BOTH advantages and disadvantages.

Fully exploit both for their best images in different situations.

Obviously your cell-phone will always BE WITH YOU.

Your cell-phone probably has a WIDER lens than you currently have, (but it's "zoom" capability is "digital" and very limited).

Its wider lens is not recommended for "portraits".

And its (small) sensor has a long/deep DOF, (even @ f/1.7).

Because the sensor is so small, it has a (much) higher noise level, but also has advanced built-in "noise-reduction" processing.

Your (M) camera can shoot at narrower DOF, (maybe even narrower than you wanted if it was FF).

The narrow DOF is very beneficial for portraits or when you want to isolate a subject from fore/background.

Obviously you have much wider/"tele", (OPTICAL) ZOOM options on your (M) camera.

And you can have a wide choice of interchangeable lenses ...

And I posted this (suggested lens) list prior ...

8mm to 12mm = ULTRA-Wide-Angle

12mm to 17mm = WIDE-Angle (my preference 15mm) -- NOTE: Your cell-phone probably about 12mm-EFL to your M

17mm to 25mm = slight-Wide-Angle

25mm to 35mm = "NORMAL" (I prefer 28mm)

40mm to 60mm = slight-TELE (my preference for "waist-up" portraits = 53mm)

60mm to 90mm = medium-TELE (my preference for "head-shot" portraits = 85mm)

95mm to 300+mm = TELE

onlyfreeman
onlyfreeman Senior Member • Posts: 1,352
What are you trying to achieve?

You could get way better results from your camera, but it requires more effort.

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Gerry Winterbourne Forum Pro • Posts: 15,610
Re: how to compare camera to mobile phone?
1

SergeyAU wrote:

I was trying to compare night/low light shots. Not talking about FoV. Just visual lightness and sharpness.

Well, it would help if you say what you mean first time round.

But it's still futile trying to work from a phone camera to a "real" camera. You'll get far more useful answers if you just ask "what are useful settings low light pictures with my camera?"

Or, even simpler, use the "Dark" setting on your camera to see what it gives as the settings normally appropriate for that particular camera.

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OP SergeyAU Forum Member • Posts: 52
Re: how to compare camera to mobile phone?

Hello

I explained in another response that I am a novice photographer and do not often know what settings I should be using. Idea was that I can use my mobile phone to take a picture and if I like that picture in terms of exposure, shutter speed etc, then I can dial the same or equivalent settings in to a APS-C camera and get better results (better lens, depth of field that I may like more etc). I was not going to use it blindly, but some shots I just don't know what to set things to and my mobile takes better pictures than I do on APS-C

OP SergeyAU Forum Member • Posts: 52
Re: how to compare camera to mobile phone?

This is what was taken with my mobile. I don't have a photo from the camera handy, but it was not pretty. Too much noise as I upped ISO while trying to capture a child standing still at 1/200 etc

I was hoping to take a better photo on my M100 than that of a mobile phone, but I did not succeed on this occasion

PS: Image is not an original from the camera, but a resized version

PhotoTeach2 Senior Member • Posts: 9,761
Re: how to compare camera to mobile phone?
1

SergeyAU wrote:

Hello

I explained in another response that I am a novice photographer and do not often know what settings I should be using. Idea was that I can use my mobile phone to take a picture and if I like that picture in terms of exposure, shutter speed etc, then I can dial the same or equivalent settings in to a APS-C camera and get better results (better lens, depth of field that I may like more etc). I was not going to use it blindly, but some shots I just don't know what to set things to and my mobile takes better pictures than I do on APS-C

Simple ... the EXPOSURE-SETTINGS are the SAME (if ISO-calibration is the same) ... the DOF will be wider on phone and very short/shallow on larger-sensor.

OP SergeyAU Forum Member • Posts: 52
Re: how to compare camera to mobile phone?

But how can I set them the same, as my mobile is F/1.7 and my lens is F/3.6?

PhotoTeach2 Senior Member • Posts: 9,761
Re: how to compare camera to mobile phone?
1

SergeyAU wrote:

This is what was taken with my mobile. I don't have a photo from the camera handy, but it was not pretty. Too much noise as I upped ISO while trying to capture a child standing still at 1/200 etc

I was hoping to take a better photo on my M100 than that of a mobile phone, but I did not succeed on this occasion

PS: Image is not an original from the camera, but a resized version

Your moon is WAY over-exposed, could use f/16 @ 1/125s @ ISO-250 ... and FLASH on subject.

OP SergeyAU Forum Member • Posts: 52
Re: how to compare camera to mobile phone?
1

no, it was intentional just to show a silhouette

again, this was taken with a phone on auto settings

PhotoTeach2 Senior Member • Posts: 9,761
Re: how to compare camera to mobile phone?
1

SergeyAU wrote:

But how can I set them the same, as my mobile is F/1.7 and my lens is F/3.6?

f/3.6 @ ISO-2500 @ 1/125s.

But if you are shooting for MOON exposure, that will over-expose. (you can use f/11 @ 1/125s @ ISO-250 if moon is FULL & "high" in CLEAR sky)

Note: You need to use f/8, f/5.6, or even f/3.6 if moon is  is lower ... (but the closer subject/silhouette will be blurry if focused on moon)

But you will need FLASH for correct subject exposure at night w/ moon in background.

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