How long until they are giving away DSLR's ?

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Lee Jay Forum Pro • Posts: 54,272
Re: How long until they are giving away DSLR's ?
4

AOC wrote:

They'll drop a bit, then they'll start rising in price b/c the only people buying them--at a time when mirrorless and quite possibly also cellphones would be far superior--will be relatively price inelastic diehard fans hellbent on owning a clickety-clack mirror.

You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about, and the way you talk it sounds like you're a marketing major which would explain it.

Do you seriously expect a cell phone camera, with a lens that's literally 2.5mm in diameter, to ever be able to take a picture like this one?

Just so you know, this is the "lens" that took that picture:

Or this one:

Or this one:

Cell phones are limited by their teeny tiny form factor to lenses that fit into a tiny corner of their teeny tiny form factor, thus they will NEVER be superior to a system which can accept a far larger piece of optics.

Remember, cameras are mostly about optics, and Moore's law and Google's software doesn't allow you to overcome the laws of optics.

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Lee Jay

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Fishchris
OP Fishchris Senior Member • Posts: 4,688
Re: Never...

bullet1 wrote:

Fishchris wrote:

I know... I know... DSLR's are locked in pretty firmly. Personally, I won't go so far as to say, "I will never buy or use a mirrorless camera" but I can say, I currently have zero interest in one. I'm really not sure what it's going to take, to make me switch to ML cameras, except to say, they are going to have to have a few things about them that not just equal the best DSLR's, but blow them out of the water, and no areas which are not as good, to make ML cameras an obvious choice for myself.

What I'm really hoping, is that enough people will make that switch a lot sooner than me, and make the DSLR camera of my dreams, a lot more affordable.

Will this ever happen ? 3 years, 5 years, 10, never ?

I mean if you looked around a bit, you could probably find someone to give you a very nice film camera, right ? Why should this be any different ?

But they may disappear...

It is not the interest of DSLR manufacturers to give away their cameras, even if they don't sell.

When DSLRs become commodity items like 1080p TVs, they will be heavily discounted first and then disappear altogether when the inventory runs out as there is no business sense to sell them any more.

But I wasn't talking about new from the manufacturer... I meant used, from guys switching to ML

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AOC
AOC Regular Member • Posts: 195
Re: How long until they are giving away DSLR's ?
7

Lee Jay wrote:

AOC wrote:

They'll drop a bit, then they'll start rising in price b/c the only people buying them--at a time when mirrorless and quite possibly also cellphones would be far superior--will be relatively price inelastic diehard fans hellbent on owning a clickety-clack mirror.

You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about, and the way you talk it sounds like you're a marketing major which would explain it.

Do you seriously expect a cell phone camera, with a lens that's literally 2.5mm in diameter, to ever be able to take a picture like this one?

Just so you know, this is the "lens" that took that picture:

The P1000 took the shot below.

Moon looks way bigger than yours!

Go back and read what I wrote about WTP and price elasticity.

Someone like you is a perfect example of a diehard mirror-fan boy who would continue to stick with his mirrored bodies long after mirrorless bodies deliver superior results for most other people.

J A C S
J A C S Forum Pro • Posts: 14,144
Re: How long until they are giving away DSLR's ?

Fishchris wrote:

I know... I know... DSLR's are locked in pretty firmly. Personally, I won't go so far as to say, "I will never buy or use a mirrorless camera" but I can say, I currently have zero interest in one. I'm really not sure what it's going to take, to make me switch to ML cameras, except to say, they are going to have to have a few things about them that not just equal the best DSLR's, but blow them out of the water, and no areas which are not as good, to make ML cameras an obvious choice for myself.

Lenses.

What I'm really hoping, is that enough people will make that switch a lot sooner than me, and make the DSLR camera of my dreams, a lot more affordable.

No, it will make them non-existent.

Lee Jay Forum Pro • Posts: 54,272
Re: How long until they are giving away DSLR's ?
8

AOC wrote:

Lee Jay wrote:

AOC wrote:

They'll drop a bit, then they'll start rising in price b/c the only people buying them--at a time when mirrorless and quite possibly also cellphones would be far superior--will be relatively price inelastic diehard fans hellbent on owning a clickety-clack mirror.

You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about, and the way you talk it sounds like you're a marketing major which would explain it.

Do you seriously expect a cell phone camera, with a lens that's literally 2.5mm in diameter, to ever be able to take a picture like this one?

Just so you know, this is the "lens" that took that picture:

The P1000 took the shot below.

And that's a cell phone, right?  Oh, I forgot, you're too clueless to actually respond to the post you failed to read.

Moon looks way bigger than yours!

You're clueless.  Look at the EXIF data.  That is an 8 second exposure at f/7 on a full-frame camera taken during a total lunar eclipse.

Go back and read what I wrote about WTP and price elasticity.

Who cares?

Someone like you is a perfect example of a diehard mirror-fan boy who would continue to stick with his mirrored bodies long after mirrorless bodies deliver superior results for most other people.

I don't care about most other people, nor do I care about average people.  Average people don't care about photography which is why they use their cell phone cameras.  Other people are free to choose what they want, but having tested the best available EVFs, they still entirely stink for my use.

Anyway, this post was about why cell phone cameras won't ever be "far superior" (your words) - because their optics are too small to be so.

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Lee Jay

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Fishchris
OP Fishchris Senior Member • Posts: 4,688
Re: How long until they are giving away DSLR's ?
2

Lee Jay wrote:

AOC wrote:

Lee Jay wrote:

AOC wrote:

They'll drop a bit, then they'll start rising in price b/c the only people buying them--at a time when mirrorless and quite possibly also cellphones would be far superior--will be relatively price inelastic diehard fans hellbent on owning a clickety-clack mirror.

You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about, and the way you talk it sounds like you're a marketing major which would explain it.

Do you seriously expect a cell phone camera, with a lens that's literally 2.5mm in diameter, to ever be able to take a picture like this one?

Just so you know, this is the "lens" that took that picture:

The P1000 took the shot below.

And that's a cell phone, right? Oh, I forgot, you're too clueless to actually respond to the post you failed to read.

Moon looks way bigger than yours!

You're clueless. Look at the EXIF data. That is an 8 second exposure at f/7 on a full-frame camera taken during a total lunar eclipse.

Go back and read what I wrote about WTP and price elasticity.

Who cares?

Someone like you is a perfect example of a diehard mirror-fan boy who would continue to stick with his mirrored bodies long after mirrorless bodies deliver superior results for most other people.

I don't care about most other people, nor do I care about average people. Average people don't care about photography which is why they use their cell phone cameras. Other people are free to choose what they want, but having tested the best available EVFs, they still entirely stink for my use.

Anyway, this post was about why cell phone cameras won't ever be "far superior" (your words) - because their optics are too small to be so.

Why can't everyone be as friendly and cool as I am ? 😄 Lol

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wklee Veteran Member • Posts: 8,531
Doesn’t it depend APS-C or FF

APS-C goes back 20 years? FF is more recent so depending on the age a Nikon D1, D100, D2 might be given away?

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Love Photography 888
Love Photography 888 Forum Member • Posts: 89
$399 at Costco
2

Currently at Costco you can get a Nikon d3500 with 18-55mm and 70-300mm. That's two lenses and to top it off Nikon will throw in a memory card and a camera bag. The month before last was Canon doing the same kit at the same price. These cameras are pretty much being given away. I've literally been to Costco hundreds of times and have NEVER seen anyone look at the camera section.

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bullet1 Veteran Member • Posts: 7,239
Re: Never...
1

Fishchris wrote:

bullet1 wrote:

Fishchris wrote:

I know... I know... DSLR's are locked in pretty firmly. Personally, I won't go so far as to say, "I will never buy or use a mirrorless camera" but I can say, I currently have zero interest in one. I'm really not sure what it's going to take, to make me switch to ML cameras, except to say, they are going to have to have a few things about them that not just equal the best DSLR's, but blow them out of the water, and no areas which are not as good, to make ML cameras an obvious choice for myself.

What I'm really hoping, is that enough people will make that switch a lot sooner than me, and make the DSLR camera of my dreams, a lot more affordable.

Will this ever happen ? 3 years, 5 years, 10, never ?

I mean if you looked around a bit, you could probably find someone to give you a very nice film camera, right ? Why should this be any different ?

But they may disappear...

It is not the interest of DSLR manufacturers to give away their cameras, even if they don't sell.

When DSLRs become commodity items like 1080p TVs, they will be heavily discounted first and then disappear altogether when the inventory runs out as there is no business sense to sell them any more.

But I wasn't talking about new from the manufacturer... I meant used, from guys switching to ML

Now are we hoping that people who move to ML will just give away their old DSLRs? I know I won't.I have sold my 5D and 5D Mark II.

I bought the A7III but will keep my 6D for Pocket Wizard E-TTL radio triggers, MiniTT1 and FlexTT5.

If the next Canon ML (R, RP, etc.) I buy can work with those Pocket Wizard triggers, I will sell the 6D. If the value of the 6D goes down to $0, I could give it away but then nobody would want it.

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Nelson

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Wayne Larmon Forum Pro • Posts: 10,348
Only if ML becomes compellingly better. Still waiting.

Fishchris wrote:

bullet1 wrote:

But they may disappear...

It is not the interest of DSLR manufacturers to give away their cameras, even if they don't sell.

When DSLRs become commodity items like 1080p TVs, they will be heavily discounted first and then disappear altogether when the inventory runs out as there is no business sense to sell them any more.

But I wasn't talking about new from the manufacturer... I meant used, from guys switching to ML

Not until ML is a significant advance over DSLR. Such as if the manufacturers add Pixel 2 level computational photography to ML and not to DSLRs. (Sensor size multiplied by 10x. Maybe resolution also.) Right now Canon and Nikon MLs are only sidegrades to DSLRs (at least Canon MLs are.) Slightly better in some aspects but using the same old stagnant technology. New ML superior lenses that are larger, heavier, and more expensive isn't really an advance.

This may happen with Sony and Fuji, but hasn't happened quite yet.

Wayne

BillAngel Regular Member • Posts: 109
Re: $399 at Costco

Love Photography 888 wrote:

Currently at Costco you can get a Nikon d3500 with 18-55mm and 70-300mm. That's two lenses and to top it off Nikon will throw in a memory card and a camera bag. The month before last was Canon doing the same kit at the same price. These cameras are pretty much being given away. I've literally been to Costco hundreds of times and have NEVER seen anyone look at the camera section.

I was in a Best Buy store on Monday checking out the Nikon gear which I've never seen anyone else in that store do. And while they have a Nikon Z series mirrorless camera body on display, they don't have any lenses to mount on it so you  can look through the viewfinder and see what the image is  like or play with the controls and take a few pictures.

DeathArrow Senior Member • Posts: 1,051
Re: How long until they are giving away DSLR's ?

I just wish I have a D5 and a 600mm f/4. If Sony would make a 600mm f/4 and give to me for free together with an A9, I wouldn't say no!

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DeathArrow Senior Member • Posts: 1,051
Re: How long until they are giving away DSLR's ?

Wheatfield7 wrote:

They have practically been giving them away for a couple of decades.

If $6500 means free, then you are right!

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khunpapa
khunpapa Senior Member • Posts: 2,380
Re: How long until they are giving away DSLR's ?

Fishchris wrote:

What I'm really hoping, is that enough people will make that switch a lot sooner than me, and make the DSLR camera of my dreams, a lot more affordable.

Will this ever happen ? 3 years, 5 years, 10, never ?

Exactly 19 years, 8 months, 3 days, 16 hours, 42 minutes, 33.663571 seconds from now.

Trust me! I am the Psychic.

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Flashes of my Memory.

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Fishchris
OP Fishchris Senior Member • Posts: 4,688
Two things I want to reiterate...

khunpapa wrote:

Fishchris wrote:

What I'm really hoping, is that enough people will make that switch a lot sooner than me, and make the DSLR camera of my dreams, a lot more affordable.

Will this ever happen ? 3 years, 5 years, 10, never ?

Exactly 19 years, 8 months, 3 days, 16 hours, 42 minutes, 33.663571 seconds from now.

Trust me! I am the Psychic.

...about this thread.

First off, while I had hoped the title would get a lot of attention (kind of click bait) and it did, I also hoped it would be obvious that I was being just a little bit facetious, when I said "giving them away".... A lot of people took that literally and really, I just meant, "will become a much better deal"

Also, I'm not sure if anybody saw my analogy with the Gigapan pro pano head... As I had kind divided my OP with a row of hiphons, and it might have chopped that off ? Seems odd to me that I would get this many responses, and yet zero to do with my Gigapan example ?

Anyway, thanks to all that responded.

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gary0319
gary0319 Veteran Member • Posts: 5,781
Re: Two things I want to reiterate...

Fishchris wrote:

khunpapa wrote:

Fishchris wrote:

What I'm really hoping, is that enough people will make that switch a lot sooner than me, and make the DSLR camera of my dreams, a lot more affordable.

Will this ever happen ? 3 years, 5 years, 10, never ?

Exactly 19 years, 8 months, 3 days, 16 hours, 42 minutes, 33.663571 seconds from now.

Trust me! I am the Psychic.

...about this thread.

First off, while I had hoped the title would get a lot of attention (kind of click bait) and it did, I also hoped it would be obvious that I was being just a little bit facetious, when I said "giving them away".... A lot of people took that literally and really, I just meant, "will become a much better deal"

Also, I'm not sure if anybody saw my analogy with the Gigapan pro pano head... As I had kind divided my OP with a row of hiphons, and it might have chopped that off ? Seems odd to me that I would get this many responses, and yet zero to do with my Gigapan example ?

Anyway, thanks to all that responded.

My guess is that less than 5% have any idea what a Gigapan is/was...I don't.

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khunpapa
khunpapa Senior Member • Posts: 2,380
Re: How long until they are giving away DSLR's ?

Fishchris wrote:

The double hyphens kill !

Need some trick.

On a related note, the Gigapan pro came out more than 10 years ago, when DSLR's really were not making enough MP's for huge, detailed prints. At the time, I can see why they sold for $1000. But now, DSLR's are easily making 40+ MP's, which is more than enough for 99.5% of all photographers..... I would think, even enough for some of the guys who bought a Gigapan pro for their 6mp DSLR 10 years ago. It just seems to me that one could buy a used Gigapan pro for $200 ! But nope, these freaking things are still like $800 used ! $1000 new !?!? What the hell ? Freaking killing me over here.

Yet I probably couldn't sell one for a shiny nickel 😞

The 40 MP+ with wide angle lens is the wide angle 40+ MP image.

The 6*N stitched image is not.

The 99.5% of all photographers never stich the images, nor shooting pano. Those who do know why one needs it!

This $1000 payment is the investment of the proper tool for the proper job.

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onlyfreeman
onlyfreeman Senior Member • Posts: 1,364
Re: How long until they are giving away DSLR's ?

Fishchris wrote:

onlyfreeman wrote:

What do you need in your dream DSLR?

If you don't need great AF for example, there could be many cheaper options than a D850 I guess.

A bunch of clean MP's..... primarily. Great auto focus would be good too. And I guess, no AA filters.

Any particular issues with mirrorless?

You might be able to find some bargains in the FF MILC world.

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Lee Jay Forum Pro • Posts: 54,272
Re: Two things I want to reiterate...
2

gary0319 wrote:

Fishchris wrote:

khunpapa wrote:

Fishchris wrote:

What I'm really hoping, is that enough people will make that switch a lot sooner than me, and make the DSLR camera of my dreams, a lot more affordable.

Will this ever happen ? 3 years, 5 years, 10, never ?

Exactly 19 years, 8 months, 3 days, 16 hours, 42 minutes, 33.663571 seconds from now.

Trust me! I am the Psychic.

...about this thread.

First off, while I had hoped the title would get a lot of attention (kind of click bait) and it did, I also hoped it would be obvious that I was being just a little bit facetious, when I said "giving them away".... A lot of people took that literally and really, I just meant, "will become a much better deal"

Also, I'm not sure if anybody saw my analogy with the Gigapan pro pano head... As I had kind divided my OP with a row of hiphons, and it might have chopped that off ? Seems odd to me that I would get this many responses, and yet zero to do with my Gigapan example ?

Anyway, thanks to all that responded.

My guess is that less than 5% have any idea what a Gigapan is/was...I don't.

It's a robotic pan/tilt/trigger mechanism designed to produce "gigapixel" images by automatically creating multi-row panoramas using your existing compact or SLR camera.

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Lee Jay

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Lee Jay Forum Pro • Posts: 54,272
Re: How long until they are giving away DSLR's ?

khunpapa wrote:

Fishchris wrote:

The double hyphens kill !

Need some trick.

On a related note, the Gigapan pro came out more than 10 years ago, when DSLR's really were not making enough MP's for huge, detailed prints. At the time, I can see why they sold for $1000. But now, DSLR's are easily making 40+ MP's, which is more than enough for 99.5% of all photographers..... I would think, even enough for some of the guys who bought a Gigapan pro for their 6mp DSLR 10 years ago. It just seems to me that one could buy a used Gigapan pro for $200 ! But nope, these freaking things are still like $800 used ! $1000 new !?!? What the hell ? Freaking killing me over here.

Yet I probably couldn't sell one for a shiny nickel 😞

The 40 MP+ with wide angle lens is the wide angle 40+ MP image.

The 6*N stitched image is not.

They're the same.

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Lee Jay

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