A-Mount

Started 2 months ago | Discussions
cgarrard
OP cgarrard Forum Pro • Posts: 15,677
Btw... the A58

Ed at Ridersite wrote:

Hey Carl. Do a review of the Sony A-68. Totally ignored by almost every ranking. I know it's 3.5 years old, but it's still the best entry level camera on the market - AF micro-adjust, built in focus limiter for all lenses, A-77II sensor and AF module. Plus, only $600!

Seems like another good bargain, what's the general consensus on that one?

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tbcass
tbcass Forum Pro • Posts: 42,237
Re: Btw... the A58

cgarrard wrote:

Ed at Ridersite wrote:

Hey Carl. Do a review of the Sony A-68. Totally ignored by almost every ranking. I know it's 3.5 years old, but it's still the best entry level camera on the market - AF micro-adjust, built in focus limiter for all lenses, A-77II sensor and AF module. Plus, only $600!

Seems like another good bargain, what's the general consensus on that one?

As far as I know the A58 was discontinued some time ago.

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Tom

 tbcass's gear list:tbcass's gear list
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sybersitizen Forum Pro • Posts: 12,888
Re: Btw... the A58

tbcass wrote:

cgarrard wrote:

Ed at Ridersite wrote:

Hey Carl. Do a review of the Sony A-68. Totally ignored by almost every ranking. I know it's 3.5 years old, but it's still the best entry level camera on the market - AF micro-adjust, built in focus limiter for all lenses, A-77II sensor and AF module. Plus, only $600!

Seems like another good bargain, what's the general consensus on that one?

As far as I know the A58 was discontinued some time ago.

The discussion above is about the A68, a current product. I don't know why the subject line says A58.

cgarrard
OP cgarrard Forum Pro • Posts: 15,677
Re: Btw... the A58

sybersitizen wrote:

tbcass wrote:

cgarrard wrote:

Ed at Ridersite wrote:

Hey Carl. Do a review of the Sony A-68. Totally ignored by almost every ranking. I know it's 3.5 years old, but it's still the best entry level camera on the market - AF micro-adjust, built in focus limiter for all lenses, A-77II sensor and AF module. Plus, only $600!

Seems like another good bargain, what's the general consensus on that one?

As far as I know the A58 was discontinued some time ago.

The discussion above is about the A68, a current product. I don't know why the subject line says A58.

He commented on the A68, I replied I'd review it. Then I also had another question about the A58.

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Lensmate
Lensmate Veteran Member • Posts: 3,591
Re: Have we reached #1000 in end of A Mount threads yet? :-)

tbcass wrote:

Lensmate wrote:

How do explain the reasoning of what you said above - to quote "There was plenty of activity with the A-mount about 2 years or so ago"...?

An observation that would require paying attention to the A-mount forum, nest pas?

Not really and the reason is logical. Here's a possible scenario. He was last here 2 years ago when there was plenty of activity. He came here after a 2 year absence and noticed there was much less activity. 2 years ago the forum still was active due to the A99ii which was released 2 1/2 years ago. Since no new A Mount cameras have been introduced since the A99ii activity has dropped considerably. I know I don't post here much anymore even though I still use my A Mount gear. I have no reason to.

That doesn't wash...you'd have to wearing blinders to make that assumption. Good try though...

-Martin P

https://www.flickr.com/photos/photosauraus_rex/

QuietOC
QuietOC Senior Member • Posts: 3,054
Re: Btw... the A58
1

cgarrard wrote:

Ed at Ridersite wrote:

Hey Carl. Do a review of the Sony A-68. Totally ignored by almost every ranking. I know it's 3.5 years old, but it's still the best entry level camera on the market - AF micro-adjust, built in focus limiter for all lenses, A-77II sensor and AF module. Plus, only $600!

Seems like another good bargain, what's the general consensus on that one?

It is a very good camera with some strange choices--mainly the not terribly useful rear control wheel that isn't able to be made the secondary control or act like the similar control wheels on E-mount or act like the directional controls on previous SLTs or act like the joysticks on A77/A99 models. It can also be assigned as a dedicated Ev dial which it's placement makes unusable.

I bought a factory refurbished A68K at the end of 2017 for $410 shipped. It replaced an A65. The A68 sensor performs much better. The 5 FPS full-frame limit seems completely artificial. All the other cost savings on it are good trade offs. It has micro focus adjustment and supports UHS SD writes.

It reuses the same EVF, rear screen including tilt mechsnism, and composite mount face as the A58. It shares the A77 form factor, top plate and flash.

 QuietOC's gear list:QuietOC's gear list
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toughluck Veteran Member • Posts: 3,335
Re: Have we reached #1000 in end of A Mount threads yet? :-)

Lensmate wrote:

cgarrard wrote:

Lensmate wrote:

cgarrard wrote:

tbcass wrote:

There have been so many discussions on this that another thread is not needed. Personally I don't really care because the A99ii and the lenses I own are all I need. Couple that with fact my primary camera is an RX10iv and I'm 73 years old the A99ii is the last A Mount camera I will ever buy even if Sony comes out with a new one.

Had no idea. There was plenty of activity with the A-Mount until about 2 years or so ago.

Thanks Tom!

How coy of you...you seem to know this even though you admit to not viewing the A-mount forums? Looking at your past visits to the other forums you skip around to, I'd say you are trying to flame the fire here. Searching on this topic is not that difficult unless you have the mind of a mollusk.

-Martin P

https://www.flickr.com/photos/photosauraus_rex/

I pay attention to camera announcements, that doesn't mean I pay attention to this forum Martin.

How do explain the reasoning of what you said above - to quote "There was plenty of activity with the A-mount about 2 years or so ago"...?

I think he meant A mount in general, as in camera (A68, A99ii) and lens (G2) releases, later nothing.

An observation that would require paying attention to the A-mount forum, nest pas?

I think A mount≠A mount forum.

-Martin P

https://www.flickr.com/photos/photosauraus_rex/

 toughluck's gear list:toughluck's gear list
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toughluck Veteran Member • Posts: 3,335
Re: A-Mount
1

cgarrard wrote:

... well?

I'd be sad to see it go quietly. I hope it doesn't.

It won't. Sony is extremely averse to killing off product lines without offering a migration path to another line and they are keen to be the last one to withdraw from a market.

What are your thoughts on the management of the A-Mount since SLT?

Pretty much the same treatment as other niche products, maybe even better than some. Consider that Canon released their high end APS-c DSLR, EOS 7D ii at the same time as Sony released A77ii (six (or was it seven?) years ago). Neither camera was updated even though Canon probably sold more of that model than Sony sold all SLTs in that time. And I honestly think it's more likely we'll see A77iii than EOS 7D iii.

What should Sony do with the A-Mount?

Move back in time and make all Sony lens releases SSM or SAM, then make the A700 full frame with the Nikon D3/D700 sensor and sell it for the same price as the A700. Use the 12 megapixel APS-c sensor in A200 and A300. Avoid the A350. Follow up with A900 with its 24 megapixel sensor, continue development of their 16, 20 and 24 megapixel APS-c sensors, but only offer it in amateur SLTs. A6x and above needs to be full frame. Keep it simple -- 24 and 36/42 megapixel sensors in two body sizes.

What do you think will happen with the A-Mount?

Nobody knows, I think even Sony doesn't know very well.

-Carl

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 toughluck's gear list:toughluck's gear list
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QuietOC
QuietOC Senior Member • Posts: 3,054
Re: A-Mount

toughluck wrote:

Move back in time and make all Sony lens releases SSM or SAM...

I was just thinking this about too. They could have not rebadged the screw-drive Minolta lenses and not released the 16-80, 16-105, 18-250, and 55-200 in 2007. Tamron offered the later two with focus motors for Canon. The former we're likely developed previous to the acquisition. All the lenses Sony released after 2007 were SAM or SSM. The screw-drive motor could have been eliminated from some bodies.

2010 would have been a good time to have done this to coincide with the E-mount and SLT launches. Instead Sony developed the LA-EA2 so NEX owners could continue to use 1985 Minolta lenses.

 QuietOC's gear list:QuietOC's gear list
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tbcass
tbcass Forum Pro • Posts: 42,237
Re: Btw... the A58

sybersitizen wrote:

tbcass wrote:

cgarrard wrote:

Ed at Ridersite wrote:

Hey Carl. Do a review of the Sony A-68. Totally ignored by almost every ranking. I know it's 3.5 years old, but it's still the best entry level camera on the market - AF micro-adjust, built in focus limiter for all lenses, A-77II sensor and AF module. Plus, only $600!

Seems like another good bargain, what's the general consensus on that one?

As far as I know the A58 was discontinued some time ago.

The discussion above is about the A68, a current product. I don't know why the subject line says A58.

Carl asked about the A58 in the header and said the following "Seems like another good bargain, what's the general consensus on that one?".

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Tom

 tbcass's gear list:tbcass's gear list
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tbcass
tbcass Forum Pro • Posts: 42,237
Re: Have we reached #1000 in end of A Mount threads yet? :-)

You're a tough nut aren't you?

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Tom

 tbcass's gear list:tbcass's gear list
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cgarrard
OP cgarrard Forum Pro • Posts: 15,677
Re: Btw... the A58

Interesting.

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QuietOC
QuietOC Senior Member • Posts: 3,054
Re: Btw... the A58

cgarrard wrote:

Interesting.

I totally missed that you were asking about the A58. It is no longer listed on Sony.com.

I started with the A58 in early 2015 when Sony had it on sale with the 18-55 for $400 and $150 discounts on the 55-200 and 55-300. It was already being closed-out then. I am sure being my first real camera colors my opinions.

Now I've tried an A57 and A65 I can see that it was more of an A38, but the viewfinder is nicer than those earlier, higher end models. I still prefer a simple tilting rear screen.

Issues: tiny buffer that often shrank, 20 MB/s SD writing (like previous models), aliasing with video and stills.

 QuietOC's gear list:QuietOC's gear list
Sony a77 II Sony a7 II Canon EF 85mm f/1.8 USM Sony DT 55-300mm F4.5-5.6 SAM Sony DT 16-50mm F2.8 SSM +128 more
cgarrard
OP cgarrard Forum Pro • Posts: 15,677
Re: Btw... the A58

QuietOC wrote:

cgarrard wrote:

Interesting.

I totally missed that you were asking about the A58. It is no longer listed on Sony.com.

No worries at all, you weren't the only one.

I started with the A58 in early 2015 when Sony had it on sale with the 18-55 for $400 and $150 discounts on the 55-200 and 55-300. It was already being closed-out then. I am sure being my first real camera colors my opinions.

Now I've tried an A57 and A65 I can see that it was more of an A38, but the viewfinder is nicer than those earlier, higher end models. I still prefer a simple tilting rear screen.

Issues: tiny buffer that often shrank, 20 MB/s SD writing (like previous models), aliasing with video and stills.

I appreciate you taking the time to give feedback on it. The last SLT I owned was the A57 I think. Prior to that I recall going to the press event with Sony in San Diego to test out the NEX 7/A77/A65 cameras, they sent me some for review after. Never got around to reviewing them because they didn't seem "finished" firmware wise.  From memory, the A57 was the most polished of them all- however I missed the A77ii/A58/A68 announcements completely.

-Carl

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QuietOC
QuietOC Senior Member • Posts: 3,054
Re: Btw... the A58

cgarrard wrote:

QuietOC wrote:

cgarrard wrote:

Interesting.

I totally missed that you were asking about the A58. It is no longer listed on Sony.com.

No worries at all, you weren't the only one.

I started with the A58 in early 2015 when Sony had it on sale with the 18-55 for $400 and $150 discounts on the 55-200 and 55-300. It was already being closed-out then. I am sure being my first real camera colors my opinions.

Now I've tried an A57 and A65 I can see that it was more of an A38, but the viewfinder is nicer than those earlier, higher end models. I still prefer a simple tilting rear screen.

Issues: tiny buffer that often shrank, 20 MB/s SD writing (like previous models), aliasing with video and stills.

I appreciate you taking the time to give feedback on it. The last SLT I owned was the A57 I think. Prior to that I recall going to the press event with Sony in San Diego to test out the NEX 7/A77/A65 cameras, they sent me some for review after. Never got around to reviewing them because they didn't seem "finished" firmware wise. From memory, the A57 was the most polished of them all- however I missed the A77ii/A58/A68 announcements completely.

-Carl

Yeah, the A65 had a bug in the focus magnifier when you moved to the edge the display wouldn't update until you reversed the direction a step. I think they miscalculated the sensor size or something. The cameras since then stop the scrolling before the error happens, but you still can't see the edges of the sensor.

The A65 would occasionally misexposure shots after the shutter was already pressed. It was really annoying for me when testing lenses. Not very noticeable in other uses.

Both of those issues were fixed by the A58 at least. The A65 sure sounds impressive on paper.

Several cameras have some sort of memory bug with I believe the Distortion Compensation. The A58 would get down to only being able to capture 3 or 4 frames in the buffer. The Sony customer service team seemed aware of it when I called. Reseting the camera got the buffer back to 6 frames.

The A77II has needed the A6300 updates since before the A6300 was released. We should have 8 FPS live-view, dual gain, AF-C Eye AF, etc.

 QuietOC's gear list:QuietOC's gear list
Sony a77 II Sony a7 II Canon EF 85mm f/1.8 USM Sony DT 55-300mm F4.5-5.6 SAM Sony DT 16-50mm F2.8 SSM +128 more
cgarrard
OP cgarrard Forum Pro • Posts: 15,677
Re: Btw... the A58

QuietOC wrote:

cgarrard wrote:

QuietOC wrote:

cgarrard wrote:

Interesting.

I totally missed that you were asking about the A58. It is no longer listed on Sony.com.

No worries at all, you weren't the only one.

I started with the A58 in early 2015 when Sony had it on sale with the 18-55 for $400 and $150 discounts on the 55-200 and 55-300. It was already being closed-out then. I am sure being my first real camera colors my opinions.

Now I've tried an A57 and A65 I can see that it was more of an A38, but the viewfinder is nicer than those earlier, higher end models. I still prefer a simple tilting rear screen.

Issues: tiny buffer that often shrank, 20 MB/s SD writing (like previous models), aliasing with video and stills.

I appreciate you taking the time to give feedback on it. The last SLT I owned was the A57 I think. Prior to that I recall going to the press event with Sony in San Diego to test out the NEX 7/A77/A65 cameras, they sent me some for review after. Never got around to reviewing them because they didn't seem "finished" firmware wise. From memory, the A57 was the most polished of them all- however I missed the A77ii/A58/A68 announcements completely.

-Carl

Yeah, the A65 had a bug in the focus magnifier when you moved to the edge the display wouldn't update until you reversed the direction a step. I think they miscalculated the sensor size or something. The cameras since then stop the scrolling before the error happens, but you still can't see the edges of the sensor.

The A65 would occasionally misexposure shots after the shutter was already pressed. It was really annoying for me when testing lenses. Not very noticeable in other uses.

Both of those issues were fixed by the A58 at least. The A65 sure sounds impressive on paper.

That's good

Several cameras have some sort of memory bug with I believe the Distortion Compensation. The A58 would get down to only being able to capture 3 or 4 frames in the buffer. The Sony customer service team seemed aware of it when I called. Reseting the camera got the buffer back to 6 frames.

Sounds like oversight on firmware or something.

The A77II has needed the A6300 updates since before the A6300 was released. We should have 8 FPS live-view, dual gain, AF-C Eye AF, etc.

Tell me more about that? Again, I'm very much behind on all things SLT. I am considering doing an SLT review and still can't decide which model, almost got the A77II... however now... not sure

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Lensmate
Lensmate Veteran Member • Posts: 3,591
Re: Have we reached #1000 in end of A Mount threads yet? :-)

tbcass wrote:

You're a tough nut aren't you?

Call me jaded but I've encountered too many people that are more slippery than a pint of phlegm.

This comes to mind as well:

https://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/fauxtographer.htm

https://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/2-kinds-of-photographers.htm

-Martin P

https://www.flickr.com/photos/photosauraus_rex/

QuietOC
QuietOC Senior Member • Posts: 3,054
Re: Btw... the A58

cgarrard wrote:

QuietOC wrote:

cgarrard wrote:

QuietOC wrote:

cgarrard wrote:

Interesting.

I totally missed that you were asking about the A58. It is no longer listed on Sony.com.

No worries at all, you weren't the only one.

I started with the A58 in early 2015 when Sony had it on sale with the 18-55 for $400 and $150 discounts on the 55-200 and 55-300. It was already being closed-out then. I am sure being my first real camera colors my opinions.

Now I've tried an A57 and A65 I can see that it was more of an A38, but the viewfinder is nicer than those earlier, higher end models. I still prefer a simple tilting rear screen.

Issues: tiny buffer that often shrank, 20 MB/s SD writing (like previous models), aliasing with video and stills.

I appreciate you taking the time to give feedback on it. The last SLT I owned was the A57 I think. Prior to that I recall going to the press event with Sony in San Diego to test out the NEX 7/A77/A65 cameras, they sent me some for review after. Never got around to reviewing them because they didn't seem "finished" firmware wise. From memory, the A57 was the most polished of them all- however I missed the A77ii/A58/A68 announcements completely.

-Carl

Yeah, the A65 had a bug in the focus magnifier when you moved to the edge the display wouldn't update until you reversed the direction a step. I think they miscalculated the sensor size or something. The cameras since then stop the scrolling before the error happens, but you still can't see the edges of the sensor.

The A65 would occasionally misexposure shots after the shutter was already pressed. It was really annoying for me when testing lenses. Not very noticeable in other uses.

Both of those issues were fixed by the A58 at least. The A65 sure sounds impressive on paper.

That's good

Several cameras have some sort of memory bug with I believe the Distortion Compensation. The A58 would get down to only being able to capture 3 or 4 frames in the buffer. The Sony customer service team seemed aware of it when I called. Reseting the camera got the buffer back to 6 frames.

Sounds like oversight on firmware or something.

The A77II has needed the A6300 updates since before the A6300 was released. We should have 8 FPS live-view, dual gain, AF-C Eye AF, etc.

Tell me more about that? Again, I'm very much behind on all things SLT. I am considering doing an SLT review and still can't decide which model, almost got the A77II... however now... not sure

The A68 is seriously under-reviewed. DPR had one. They made a sample gallery and that was it. It was never mentioned after that--not even in the price guides. The A6300 was released around the same time, and the A68 was released later in the North America. It wasn't clear why. Maybe there was still too much A58 inventory.

 QuietOC's gear list:QuietOC's gear list
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lhkjacky Senior Member • Posts: 2,867
Re: Btw... the A58
3

cgarrard wrote:

Again, I'm very much behind on all things SLT. I am considering doing an SLT review and still can't decide which model, almost got the A77II... however now... not sure

If you want do a review about Sony A-mount SLT camera, I recommend the A99mk2.
It is the only camera in market support hybrid PDAF. 42MP 12fps and excellent 4k video.
According to many review, the A99mk2 kill the Canon 5kmk4 in almost every aspects, such as image quality, resolution, video quality, buffer, burst rate, AF tracking, AF coverage, Eye AF, etc.

A77mk2 is also a great camera as well. It is almost 5 years old now, but it is still one of the best APSC camera in market. Especially when you compare to camera released at the same year Canon 7d mk2, you will find that the A77mk2 is almost close to perfect at that time. 24MP 12fps, Eye AF, XAVC-S, 79-point AF, etc.

I am looking forward Sony to release a new A77mk3 / A99mk3 before Tokyo Olympic.
Both Canon 5kmk4 and 7dmk2 haven't got upgrade yet.

 lhkjacky's gear list:lhkjacky's gear list
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Gesture Veteran Member • Posts: 6,607
Re: A-Mount
1

Good thoughts.

Many of us will always want a "camera."

I do think that there are great niches that the traditional OEMs just don't know how to exploit.

Action and rugged cameras.

Vlogging cameras.

Thousands, maybe millions of YouTubers making great content and I don't see people using smart phones to create YouTube videos for the most part.  Some of the Canon 1" sensor cameras have been popular and many use the Panasonic GH cameras.  But I think the OEMs could do much better, tailoring cameras to the needs and desires of these people.  Many of these folks do serious video editing on programs like Final Cut Pro.  They have substantial investment in equipment.   It's a potent market.

Scientific and museum users.

And there will always be dedicated cameras needed for science, commercial photography, sports-action, wildlife, etc.

Of newer platforms, I think the 1" sensor cameras can be profitable.  Those Panasonic 1" sensor bridge cameras (FZ 1000, etc.) make for a great travel camera.

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