Can the Z6 autofocus become as good as the A7m3 autofocus with the upcoming firmware update ? Locked

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JPD2 New Member • Posts: 8
Can the Z6 autofocus become as good as the A7m3 autofocus with the upcoming firmware update ?

Hi all,

I have been away from this forum for many years. I still have my old Nikon D90, and I have been looking to upgrade to full frame.

I am interested in mirrorless, and I've read and watched video reviews of the various mirrorless cameras. I like the Z6 a lot, but the Sony A7m3 has considerably better autofocus in lower light. I don't know much really about mirrorless cameras, and I am wondering if the firmware upgrade coming on May 18th will allow the Nikon Z6 to match the low light autofocus abilities of the Sony ?

Nikon D90 Nikon Z6
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tommiejeep
tommiejeep Veteran Member • Posts: 6,904
Re: Can the Z6 autofocus become as good as the A7m3 autofocus with the upcoming firmware update ?

I do not think anyone can answer until we see the FW in action. I do have a7iii. Low light covers a lot of ground. I shoot many indoor Events where light is not great but is there. Same with outdoor Events where I have to pick my shots. I shoot mostly people so I need some minimum shutter speeds and I also use f1.8 -f2.8 lenses most of the time (no flash) .

I am getting Z6 but not sure if I will wait until FW issued or not. I will get either 35 1,8 S or 50 1.8 S with kit zoom just to have a native faster lens.

I think anyone answering in a + or - will be speculating unless they are already shooting both.

Cheers,

-- hide signature --

Anticipate the Light and wing it when you get it wrong but always have fun
Tom
http://images.nikonians.org/galleries/showgallery.php/cat/500/ppuser/165169

OP JPD2 New Member • Posts: 8
Re: Can the Z6 autofocus become as good as the A7m3 autofocus with the upcoming firmware update ?

tommiejeep wrote:

I do not think anyone can answer until we see the FW in action. I do have a7iii. Low light covers a lot of ground. I shoot many indoor Events where light is not great but is there. Same with outdoor Events where I have to pick my shots. I shoot mostly people so I need some minimum shutter speeds and I also use f1.8 -f2.8 lenses most of the time (no flash) .

I am getting Z6 but not sure if I will wait until FW issued or not. I will get either 35 1,8 S or 50 1.8 S with kit zoom just to have a native faster lens.

I think anyone answering in a + or - will be speculating.

Cheers,

Thanks Tom.

Please everyone else (and Tom),  speculate as much as you like  

michaeladawson Forum Pro • Posts: 13,440
Re: Can the Z6 autofocus become as good as the A7m3 autofocus with the upcoming firmware update ?

JPD2 wrote:

Hi all,

I have been away from this forum for many years. I still have my old Nikon D90, and I have been looking to upgrade to full frame.

I am interested in mirrorless, and I've read and watched video reviews of the various mirrorless cameras. I like the Z6 a lot, but the Sony A7m3 has considerably better autofocus in lower light. I don't know much really about mirrorless cameras, and I am wondering if the firmware upgrade coming on May 18th will allow the Nikon Z6 to match the low light autofocus abilities of the Sony ?

No.  It won’t.

but I don’t care about low light AF.  What it won’t have is a revamped AF-C tracking system.

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Mike Dawson

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rokoko
rokoko Senior Member • Posts: 1,055
Re: Can the Z6 autofocus become as good as the A7m3 autofocus with the upcoming firmware update ?

I tried the test version at CP+. It's very difficult to say it was as fast as 7iii.

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Gabriele Sartori Veteran Member • Posts: 4,433
Re: Can the Z6 autofocus become as good as the A7m3 autofocus with the upcoming firmware update ?

michaeladawson wrote:

No. It won’t.

but I don’t care about low light AF. What it won’t have is a revamped AF-C tracking system.

Mike, why are you so sure about that?

The sensor is virtually the same, the rest is all math.

-- hide signature --

Regards
Gabriele
California, CA

Thom Hogan: "Stop arguing and do more study and shooting. Amazingly, the autofocus system you're complaining about will get better when you do."

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Marianne Oelund Veteran Member • Posts: 7,779
Math skills, or budget?

Gabriele Sartori wrote:

michaeladawson wrote:

No. It won’t.

but I don’t care about low light AF. What it won’t have is a revamped AF-C tracking system.

Mike, why are you so sure about that?

The sensor is virtually the same, the rest is all math.

Mike isn't confident that Nikon engineers do math as well as Sony engineers - or that they have as much budget.

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Source credit: Prov 2:6
- Marianne

edform
edform Veteran Member • Posts: 6,420
Re: Math skills, or budget?

Marianne Oelund wrote:

Gabriele Sartori wrote:

michaeladawson wrote:

No. It won’t.

but I don’t care about low light AF. What it won’t have is a revamped AF-C tracking system.

Mike, why are you so sure about that?

The sensor is virtually the same, the rest is all math.

Mike isn't confident that Nikon engineers do math as well as Sony engineers - or that they have as much budget.

Is everyone forgetting that Nikon did the 1-series cameras, with their astonishing AF system, years before Sony got into good AF? The J5 even had a Sony sensor and its AF is wonderful; the Sony RX100-IV and RX10-IV models did not get to market until October 2017, two and a half years later.

No information confirming it has ever been released, but speculation was common at the time of the release of those two Sony models, that Sony had done a swap deal with Nikon to get the technological basis of their high-performance AF systems

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Ed Form

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Leonard Shepherd
Leonard Shepherd Forum Pro • Posts: 17,999
Re: Can the Z6 autofocus become as good as the A7m3 autofocus with the upcoming firmware update ?

It partly depends what you use it for.

From about 25% of the image area - equivalent to about 1:1 on FX.

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Leonard Shepherd
In lots of ways good photography is much more about how equipment is used rather than the equipment being used.

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olyflyer
olyflyer Forum Pro • Posts: 26,739
It doesn't really matter...

...because the Sony is a Sony and the Nikon is a Nikon. Two different brand names, so my lenses DEFINITELY focus better on the Z7 and Z7 already today. The ergonomics of the Z fits my hands better, I like the Nikon more and my Z7 work with all my Nikon gear.

...but if you start from scratch, get the one you like most. Even in this case, it doesn't really matter if the Sony is better or not in one aspect or the other. Basing a decision like that on a single, and never really testable on equal terms feature, is in my opinion wrong unless you buy a camera for that single purpose only.

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Matsu Senior Member • Posts: 2,311
Re: Math skills, or budget?

Marianne Oelund wrote:

Gabriele Sartori wrote:

michaeladawson wrote:

No. It won’t.

but I don’t care about low light AF. What it won’t have is a revamped AF-C tracking system.

Mike, why are you so sure about that?

The sensor is virtually the same, the rest is all math.

Mike isn't confident that Nikon engineers do math as well as Sony engineers - or that they have as much budget.

Hi Marianne, I’m curious if you’ve been using a z camera, and if so, how you’re making out with it, particularly in the case continuous AF and perhaps as compared to Nikon’s 51 pt PDAF DSLRs in that regard.

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Marianne Oelund Veteran Member • Posts: 7,779
Re: Math skills, or budget?

Matsu wrote:

Marianne Oelund wrote:

Gabriele Sartori wrote:

michaeladawson wrote:

No. It won’t.

but I don’t care about low light AF. What it won’t have is a revamped AF-C tracking system.

Mike, why are you so sure about that?

The sensor is virtually the same, the rest is all math.

Mike isn't confident that Nikon engineers do math as well as Sony engineers - or that they have as much budget.

Hi Marianne, I’m curious if you’ve been using a z camera, and if so, how you’re making out with it, particularly in the case continuous AF and perhaps as compared to Nikon’s 51 pt PDAF DSLRs in that regard.

I have a Z7, but haven't done any action photography with it.  On May 16th I'll be taking it to a skating show, so will have a better idea after that.

Back in 2015, I took my Nikon 1 V3 to the same show with an AF-S 85/1.8G mounted via the FT1 adapter, and results were mixed.  There were very few completely out-of-focus images, but only a small minority were critically sharp.  Overall I would say there was a front-focus tendency.

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Source credit: Prov 2:6
- Marianne

Peter Guma
Peter Guma Regular Member • Posts: 270
Re: Can the Z6 autofocus become as good as the A7m3 autofocus with the upcoming firmware update ?

My Z6 focusing fine in low light, if you strugle during reception, you can turn on af light assist from camera. Its same as dj lights hiting ppls. I believe that there will be soon flash with ML compatible af assist light.

what i would like to see, AF at maximum aperture no matter what aperture is set...

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Signature

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SrMi
SrMi Contributing Member • Posts: 917
Re: Can the Z6 autofocus become as good as the A7m3 autofocus with the upcoming firmware update ?

JPD2 wrote:

<snip>

I am interested in mirrorless, and I've read and watched video reviews of the various mirrorless cameras. I like the Z6 a lot, but the Sony A7m3 has considerably better autofocus in lower light. <snip>

Why do you say that? I do not feel that my a7m3 has better AF in low light than my Z 7.

A9 is a different story.

tommiejeep
tommiejeep Veteran Member • Posts: 6,904
Re: Can the Z6 autofocus become as good as the A7m3 autofocus with the upcoming firmware update ?

Interesting, thanks.

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Anticipate the Light and wing it when you get it wrong but always have fun
Tom
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OP JPD2 New Member • Posts: 8
Re: It doesn't really matter...

It does matter.

I want a new camera, and I prefer Nikon in general to Sony.

But I won't buy the Z6 unless they can improve it's autofocus up to the level of the Sony a7 iii.

I was hopeful that this can be done through a firmware upgrade.

goactive Senior Member • Posts: 1,748
Re: It doesn't really matter...

The Z6 focus is just fine I shoot with it every few days on jobs will be shooting another wedding with it for an afternoon wedding tomorrow.

AF-C for people walking works fantastic. Also for fast moving racing.

And the low light focus is also very good see the dark image the Z6 still focus on.

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Started shooting digital back with the first 2MP cameras. Over 20 cameras later still going. I shoot family and people portraits, weddings, Sports and a little of everything.

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commiebiker Senior Member • Posts: 2,307
Re: Can the Z6 autofocus become as good as the A7m3 autofocus with the upcoming firmware update ?

JPD2 wrote:

I like the Z6 a lot, but the Sony A7m3 has considerably better autofocus in lower light. I don't know much really about mirrorless cameras, and I am wondering if the firmware upgrade coming on May 18th will allow the Nikon Z6 to match the low light autofocus abilities of the Sony ?

No offence, but if by your own admission you "don't know much about mirrorless cameras" you should be careful making any assumptions about either system.

I've been using the Z cameras since day one and don't have any issues focusing in challenging light.  I used the Sony A7 system (Mark ii) extensively before that.  Nikon is already ahead of the Sony generation 1 and 2.  I won't speak to the latest versions because I don't have personal knowledge.

Here is my point though.  Go to my web site and tell me if you can see the difference between shots taken with the Nikon Z6 /7, the Sony A7s/Rii, or the Nikon D4 / 700 /3s.

All these cameras are highly capable if people take the time to learn how to use them.  All these people niggling about features like eye AF make me want to laugh..or maybe cry

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Geomaticsman Senior Member • Posts: 2,542
Re: Can the Z6 autofocus become as good as the A7m3 autofocus with the upcoming firmware update ?

michaeladawson wrote:

JPD2 wrote:

Hi all,

I have been away from this forum for many years. I still have my old Nikon D90, and I have been looking to upgrade to full frame.

I am interested in mirrorless, and I've read and watched video reviews of the various mirrorless cameras. I like the Z6 a lot, but the Sony A7m3 has considerably better autofocus in lower light. I don't know much really about mirrorless cameras, and I am wondering if the firmware upgrade coming on May 18th will allow the Nikon Z6 to match the low light autofocus abilities of the Sony ?

No. It won’t.

but I don’t care about low light AF. What it won’t have is a revamped AF-C tracking system.

+1

I'm sure the updated firmware will provide some welcome improvements in AF-C performance, but I just don't see how a simple firmware update can magically close the AF performance gap between the Z and A cameras. That will require hardware/design changes.

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Gary prefers Nikon

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OP JPD2 New Member • Posts: 8
Re: Can the Z6 autofocus become as good as the A7m3 autofocus with the upcoming firmware update ?

commiebiker wrote:

JPD2 wrote:

I like the Z6 a lot, but the Sony A7m3 has considerably better autofocus in lower light. I don't know much really about mirrorless cameras, and I am wondering if the firmware upgrade coming on May 18th will allow the Nikon Z6 to match the low light autofocus abilities of the Sony ?

No offence, but if by your own admission you "don't know much about mirrorless cameras" you should be careful making any assumptions about either system.

I've been using the Z cameras since day one and don't have any issues focusing in challenging light. I used the Sony A7 system (Mark ii) extensively before that. Nikon is already ahead of the Sony generation 1 and 2. I won't speak to the latest versions because I don't have personal knowledge.

Here is my point though. Go to my web site and tell me if you can see the difference between shots taken with the Nikon Z6 /7, the Sony A7s/Rii, or the Nikon D4 / 700 /3s.

All these cameras are highly capable if people take the time to learn how to use them. All these people niggling about features like eye AF make me want to laugh..or maybe cry

I read quite a bit, and this video seems to show quite some difference between the 2 cameras autofocus abilities   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pD6uvvXzUT0

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