Fuji S5 Pro post-processing comparisons (love Cameras, hate Computers (software))

fPrime wrote:

Erik Baumgartner wrote:

fPrime wrote:

dadu007 wrote:

fPrime wrote:

Congrats on picking up an S5 Pro! As you’ve found, there’s no currently made Fuji camera (GFX included) that can quite match the S5 Pro’s colors.

Every converter has options for developing RAW files, and particularly with HU some of these are less than obvious to brand new users. You might just not be using HU with best practices yet.

If you’d like, post a link to a RAW file from your S5 Pro and the output from RAW Therapee that you like. I’d be happy to run it through my own optimized HU processing so that you can see the rendering differences.

fPrime

Sure! I'd love to see what you can do with the file in HU.

Here's the link to a folder with the .jpg from my Raw Therapee and the original .RAF from my Fuji S5 Pro. I also included a screenshot of the file loaded fresh in HU:

Fuji S Pro RAF and RT jpg

Thanks! You actually chose a good RAW here with skin tones, highlights close to being blown, plenty of detail, and outdoors where the WB is relatively predictable. I went with 5000K for WB and didn't apply any lens corrections outside of CA removal since I wasn't sure which 35mm was used.

Here's my HU VS-3 output for the file you shared:

HU VS-3

And just so we can flip back and forth here is the RT processed file:

RAW Therapee

Before I bias the comparison with my own observations, what differences can you see between these two?

fPrime

Any particular reason to avoid Lightroom and Capture One (other than the cost)? They do a decent job as well.

I'm glad you guys are happy with this old camera but, sorry, I don't see anything magic about the color, rendering, anything really.

Lightroom

Hi Erik,

I’m trying this file in LR just to see what I can pull out of it. What sharpening settings or sharpening method did you apply to your edit?

fPrime

It did get a gentle run through Topaz Denoise which helped clean things up a bit, but otherwise it’s just Lightroom sharpening with a subtle radial Texture/NR/Sharpening adjustment added to help bring some increased definition to the mushy detail around the periphery - whatever lens was used doesn’t hold a candle to any of my Fuji glass. I’m not at my computer so can’t help with specifics.

Erik Baumgartner wrote:

fPrime wrote:

Erik Baumgartner wrote:

fPrime wrote:

dadu007 wrote:

fPrime wrote:

Congrats on picking up an S5 Pro! As you’ve found, there’s no currently made Fuji camera (GFX included) that can quite match the S5 Pro’s colors.

Every converter has options for developing RAW files, and particularly with HU some of these are less than obvious to brand new users. You might just not be using HU with best practices yet.

If you’d like, post a link to a RAW file from your S5 Pro and the output from RAW Therapee that you like. I’d be happy to run it through my own optimized HU processing so that you can see the rendering differences.

fPrime

Sure! I'd love to see what you can do with the file in HU.

Here's the link to a folder with the .jpg from my Raw Therapee and the original .RAF from my Fuji S5 Pro. I also included a screenshot of the file loaded fresh in HU:

Fuji S Pro RAF and RT jpg

Thanks! You actually chose a good RAW here with skin tones, highlights close to being blown, plenty of detail, and outdoors where the WB is relatively predictable. I went with 5000K for WB and didn't apply any lens corrections outside of CA removal since I wasn't sure which 35mm was used.

Here's my HU VS-3 output for the file you shared:

HU VS-3

And just so we can flip back and forth here is the RT processed file:

RAW Therapee

Before I bias the comparison with my own observations, what differences can you see between these two?

fPrime

Any particular reason to avoid Lightroom and Capture One (other than the cost)? They do a decent job as well.

I'm glad you guys are happy with this old camera but, sorry, I don't see anything magic about the color, rendering, anything really.

Lightroom

Hi Erik,

I’m trying this file in LR just to see what I can pull out of it. What sharpening settings or sharpening method did you apply to your edit?

fPrime

It did get a gentle run through Topaz Denoise which helped clean things up a bit, but otherwise it’s just Lightroom sharpening with a subtle radial Texture/NR/Sharpening adjustment added to help bring some increased definition to the mushy detail around the periphery - whatever lens was used doesn’t hold a candle to any of my Fuji glass. I’m not at my computer so can’t help with specifics.

Thanks, if it was anything past “standard” LR sharpening settings let me know.

Personally I leave LR sharpening off as I find deconvolution sharpening in PS to be more effective. Sharpening the S5 Pro, however, usually requires a bit more kick than the settings used with Bayer sensors thanks to its thick AA filter and interpolated 12MP resolution.

fPrime

fPrime wrote:

Erik Baumgartner wrote:

It did get a gentle run through Topaz Denoise which helped clean things up a bit, but otherwise it’s just Lightroom sharpening with a subtle radial Texture/NR/Sharpening adjustment added to help bring some increased definition to the mushy detail around the periphery - whatever lens was used doesn’t hold a candle to any of my Fuji glass. I’m not at my computer so can’t help with specifics.

Thanks, if it was anything past “standard” LR sharpening settings let me know.

Like I said, Topaz DeNoise was in the mix too which does tend to crisp things up nicely.

Personally I leave LR sharpening off as I find deconvolution sharpening in PS to be more effective. Sharpening the S5 Pro, however, usually requires a bit more kick than the settings used with Bayer sensors thanks to its thick AA filter and interpolated 12MP resolution.

fPrime

This is 100% plain old Lightroom with (as before) standard demosaicing and sharpening. Being a RAF, I wondered if Iridient X-Transformer would work with it but, alas, it does not.

100% Lightroom

Your earlier conversion with HU VS-3

Erik Baumgartner wrote:

fPrime wrote:

Erik Baumgartner wrote:

It did get a gentle run through Topaz Denoise which helped clean things up a bit, but otherwise it’s just Lightroom sharpening with a subtle radial Texture/NR/Sharpening adjustment added to help bring some increased definition to the mushy detail around the periphery - whatever lens was used doesn’t hold a candle to any of my Fuji glass. I’m not at my computer so can’t help with specifics.

Thanks, if it was anything past “standard” LR sharpening settings let me know.

Like I said, Topaz DeNoise was in the mix too which does tend to crisp things up nicely.

Personally I leave LR sharpening off as I find deconvolution sharpening in PS to be more effective. Sharpening the S5 Pro, however, usually requires a bit more kick than the settings used with Bayer sensors thanks to its thick AA filter and interpolated 12MP resolution.

fPrime

This is 100% plain old Lightroom with (as before) standard demosaicing and sharpening. Being a RAF, I wondered if Iridient X-Transformer would work with it but, alas, it does not.

100% Lightroom

Your earlier conversion with HU VS-3

Indeed, there a very few RAW converters outside of Hyper Utility that incorporate both the S and R pixels of the SuperCCD sensor. LR is one, S7 Raw the other one.

Thanks for posting the plain 100% LR rendition. Additional plug-ins can muddy any converter differences. And to be fair, my rendition is benefited by the use of Luminar 4 which I think gives it more separation and 3D Pop. I use it with every photo I process these days, highly recommended.

fPrime

I wanted to post an example of a situation where the Lightroom profile for the S5 Pro simply breaks down for me. This usually happens under interior lighting with mixed light sources. Here is one where we have ambient daylight mixed with bounce flash indoors.

First the Hyper Utility rendition:

HU VS-3

Now Lightroom:

LR

Zoom in to 100% and look at the incorrect rendering of colors on the boxes and collar of the shirt by Lightroom. I also find here that the Lightroom version looks more digital, less natural than the Hyper Utility rendition.

fPrime

fPrime wrote:

I wanted to post an example of a situation where the Lightroom profile for the S5 Pro simply breaks down for me. This usually happens under interior lighting with mixed light sources. Here is one where we have ambient daylight mixed with bounce flash indoors.

First the Hyper Utility rendition:

HU VS-3

Now Lightroom:

LR

Zoom in to 100% and look at the incorrect rendering of colors on the boxes and collar of the shirt by Lightroom. I also find here that the Lightroom version looks more digital, less natural than the Hyper Utility rendition.

fPrime

Hmm, interesting. Would you mind sharing the RAW file for that?

Erik Baumgartner wrote:

Hmm, interesting. Would you mind sharing the RAW file for that?

Here you go. I set my WB by grey dropper tool on the white window framing.

https://we.tl/t-bhsyepiMWJ

fPrime

fPrime wrote:

I wanted to post an example of a situation where the Lightroom profile for the S5 Pro simply breaks down for me. This usually happens under interior lighting with mixed light sources. Here is one where we have ambient daylight mixed with bounce flash indoors.

First the Hyper Utility rendition:

HU VS-3

Now Lightroom:

LR

Zoom in to 100% and look at the incorrect rendering of colors on the boxes and collar of the shirt by Lightroom. I also find here that the Lightroom version looks more digital, less natural than the Hyper Utility rendition.

The incorrect rendering of color on the collar and box are almost certainly due to "someone" not being careful with the Defringing tool :-), there is no issue with my version below and, IMO, Lightroom (with a little tweaking) produces a generally better looking rendering overall (subjective, I know). I'm not too keen on the bluish shadows on the HU VS-3 version.

Lightroom

Erik Baumgartner wrote:

fPrime wrote:

I wanted to post an example of a situation where the Lightroom profile for the S5 Pro simply breaks down for me. This usually happens under interior lighting with mixed light sources. Here is one where we have ambient daylight mixed with bounce flash indoors.

First the Hyper Utility rendition:

HU VS-3

Now Lightroom:

LR

Zoom in to 100% and look at the incorrect rendering of colors on the boxes and collar of the shirt by Lightroom. I also find here that the Lightroom version looks more digital, less natural than the Hyper Utility rendition.

The incorrect rendering of color on the collar and box are almost certainly due to "someone" not being careful with the Defringing tool :-),

You're right! I had used the LR defringing tool on dadu007's outdoor image then saved those settings as my LR defaults for the S5 Pro before zeroing out the defringing. When I then imported these indoor RAW's of my own, the outdoor defaults with defringing were applied. D'oh!

there is no issue with my version below and, IMO, Lightroom (with a little tweaking) produces a generally better looking rendering overall (subjective, I know). I'm not too keen on the bluish shadows on the HU VS-3 version.

Lightroom

Thanks for the rendition above. With the defringing issue solved, let me run some fresh comparisons tomorrow.

fPrime

fPrime wrote:

Erik Baumgartner wrote:

fPrime wrote:

I wanted to post an example of a situation where the Lightroom profile for the S5 Pro simply breaks down for me. This usually happens under interior lighting with mixed light sources. Here is one where we have ambient daylight mixed with bounce flash indoors.

First the Hyper Utility rendition:

HU VS-3

Now Lightroom:

LR

Zoom in to 100% and look at the incorrect rendering of colors on the boxes and collar of the shirt by Lightroom. I also find here that the Lightroom version looks more digital, less natural than the Hyper Utility rendition.

The incorrect rendering of color on the collar and box are almost certainly due to "someone" not being careful with the Defringing tool :-),

You're right! I had used the LR defringing tool on dadu007's outdoor image then saved those settings as my LR defaults for the S5 Pro before zeroing out the defringing. When I then imported these indoor RAW's of my own, the outdoor defaults with defringing were applied. D'oh!

The Defringe Tool is definitely best used manually on a per image basis (as needed). If an image has important content that is close to fringe/CA color, you will likely need to carefully tweak the color sample sliders after sampling to avoid unwanted collateral damage. If you cannot correct some especially bad fringing/CA without negatively affecting the image elsewhere, any undesired global effects caused by the Defringe Tool can be easily erased locally using the the adjustment brush with the Defringe slider set to the left.

there is no issue with my version below and, IMO, Lightroom (with a little tweaking) produces a generally better looking rendering overall (subjective, I know). I'm not too keen on the bluish shadows on the HU VS-3 version.

Lightroom

Thanks for the rendition above. With the defringing issue solved, let me run some fresh comparisons tomorrow.

fPrime

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rjcsmtx wrote:

Free download from Fuji website - Fuji Raw Convertor is hands down the best option. I tried most of them.

Color handling matches HU and saves 12mp jpegs.

Also has very capable editing pre export.

Why go any other route?

Unfortunately it doesn't support the older SuperCCD cameras.

https://fujifilm-x.com/en-us/support/compatibility/software/x-raw-studio/

fPrime

Hi fPrime. I think they mean this one which is based on Silkypix -

https://fujifilm-x.com/en-my/support/compatibility/software/raw-file-converter-ex-powered-by-silkypix/

I used Silkypix 10 for this conversion.

JdKen wrote:

I used Silkypix 10 for this conversion.

Thanks, JdKen, I'll download the Silkypix version for Fuji RAW converter to see how it compares.

Working within Lightroom over the weekend I got the closest match to my HU VS-3 results by reverting Lightroom "Adobe Color" to the old "Adobe Standard" profile which lowered the contrast curve enough for this image (where they eyes didn't get enough light from the front and are easily crushed).

Lightroom

Like I mentioned earlier, I use Lightroom for all of my other cameras so for convenience sake alone it would be great to bring my Fuji S5 Pro under the same umbrella.

fPrime

fPrime wrote:

JdKen wrote:

I used Silkypix 10 for this conversion.

Thanks, JdKen, I'll download the Silkypix version for Fuji RAW converter to see how it compares.

Working within Lightroom over the weekend I got the closest match to my HU VS-3 results by reverting Lightroom "Adobe Color" to the old "Adobe Standard" profile which lowered the contrast curve enough for this image (where they eyes didn't get enough light from the front and are easily crushed).

Lightroom

Like I mentioned earlier, I use Lightroom for all of my other cameras so for convenience sake alone it would be great to bring my Fuji S5 Pro under the same umbrella.

Here's my own Fuji RAW converter powered by Silkypix rendition:

Fuji RAW Converter

Color me impressed. This has gotten the tones and contrast just about perfect. I also believe that I was able to find an accurate WB more easily using the grey balance tool in Fuji RAW Converter than I could with using the same tool in Lightroom or Hyper Utility.

So what do I like in this latest rendition other than the WB? Well, the fact that I could lower the contrast helped greatly in reducing the skin tones from blocking up. Now the face looks much more natural. I also seem to be able to preserve more color detail and saturation than I could with either Lightroom or HU.

I will continue to try other RAW's with Fuji's converter to confirm that it is really doing better than its predecessor and Adobe, but so far this looks promising!

fPrime