PANASONIC NA, WHAT ARE YOU DOING? GX9

First off, the GX9 (GX7 MkIII) Came out the gates in a Bad spot, partially because the GX8 owners felt wronged, being that the GX7 MkIII was a downgrade in some key areas, not to mention the Price, -especially that you can get a GX7 MkII for half the price.

Now WEX photo video has the Killer deal on the GX7 MkIII:

https://www.wexphotovideo.com/panasonic-gx9-digital-camera-body-1652892/

You can get it for under $600.00 (body only)!! In the U.S., we dont even get a Body only option, just a Kit zoom lens, which personally speaking, if I were to use this camera, I'd only use primes.

Who's in charge of Panasonic North America? Who is making the decisions on pricing, kit choices, Naming, etc...? They severely dropped the ball with the GX7 MkIII. Wheres the BODY ONLY option??

Even Fujifilm with the X-E3 gives people THREE options: Body only, a kit with a great 23mm f/2 WR prime lens and a kit with the excellent 18-55!!

It makes you wonder who's in charge at Panasonic NA... Maybe they're just business exec's, that I hate to say, only know how to sell product like TVs, Hair dryers and consumer electronics, like most of the Lumix haters say, with no concern nor educated on photography.

Whatever it is, NA needs better buying options and better competitive pricing, in order to compete with the competition. The Pricing and lack of buying options for this camera is a Joke right now.

I get it, but have you emailed Panasonic and expressed your opinion to them? It's clearly a deal breaker to you and many people so I would make sure your voice is heard.

I take it is because in the US, people don't tend to buy the body option for entry/mid level cameras even when it's offered. Buying the kit and selling off the lens tends to make more financial sense. Eliminating that SKU reduces costs for Panasonic and their dealers.

I remember the GX85 had a body only SKU that was discontinued very quickly in the US. I take it is because sales were extremely low for that option.

Why do you keep on mentioning GX7 MKIII? Do you live in Japan? Because that is the only place on this planet where it's called GX7 MKIII. Everywhere else on planet Earth it's GX9.

And before you get all, "but why the difference", it's simple. Money.

Unlike the rest of the world, GX7 actually sold very well in Japan. Panasonic needed to do something about selling more cameras to the rest of the world. So they figured to have a three tier system where:

GXx is tier 1

GXxx is tier 2

GXxxx is tier 3

BUT in Japan, where GX7 actually did well, they needed to keep the GX7 name going so MKII and now MKIII.

Seriously, I don't see where all the confusion is coming from. GX9 is known as GX9 everywhere on this planet earth except Japan. Why complain about the name of GX7 MKIII because of one naming difference in one country out of the many on this planet?

As for the $600 GX9 in Europe, oh please, it's not $600 USD, it's $765USD but Panasonic Europe/UK just happens to have a 2 month promotion going on that brings the price down to $600USD. And before you complain, "well, why isn't the promotion going on in the US", well, tell me how often does Olympus have a WORLD WIDE promotion? Generally (could be always), camera manufacturers have promotions that are separated by NA, Europe, Asia, etc. And this promotion is only for 2 months after which it becomes $765USD again

As for body only price, what is the big deal? You can get the GX9 for $1000USD with the very good WR 12-60mm. If you really don't want the lens sell it for an easy $300. Thus $700.

And the X-E3 is a different tier camera. It's rather easy to understand why there are more options plus better bundled lenses for it. Higher the tier, the better the included lenses. Besides, the Panasonic 12-60mm is not the same tier as the cheapy 14-42mm lens that comes with the entry level cameras.

Now, with all that said, if you are saying that the GX9 is overpriced as a $700USD camera, well, you are certainly welcome to go rant at Panasonic.

MrALLCAPS wrote:

First off, the GX9 (GX7 MkIII) Came out the gates in a Bad spot, partially because the GX8 owners felt wronged, being that the GX7 MkIII was a downgrade in some key areas, not to mention the Price, -especially that you can get a GX7 MkII for half the price.

Now WEX photo video has the Killer deal on the GX7 MkIII:

https://www.wexphotovideo.com/panasonic-gx9-digital-camera-body-1652892/

You can get it for under $600.00 (body only)!! In the U.S., we dont even get a Body only option, just a Kit zoom lens, which personally speaking, if I were to use this camera, I'd only use primes.

Who's in charge of Panasonic North America? Who is making the decisions on pricing, kit choices, Naming, etc...? They severely dropped the ball with the GX7 MkIII. Wheres the BODY ONLY option??

Even Fujifilm with the X-E3 gives people THREE options: Body only, a kit with a great 23mm f/2 WR prime lens and a kit with the excellent 18-55!!

It makes you wonder who's in charge at Panasonic NA... Maybe they're just business exec's, that I hate to say, only know how to sell product like TVs, Hair dryers and consumer electronics, like most of the Lumix haters say, with no concern nor educated on photography.

Whatever it is, NA needs better buying options and better competitive pricing, in order to compete with the competition. The Pricing and lack of buying options for this camera is a Joke right now.

In Japan. Panasonic calls it the GX7 Mark III. The GX80/85 is really the GX7 Mark II. I'd prefer to call it what it really is, not what marketing "wants us" to call it.

JakeJY wrote:

I take it is because in the US, people don't tend to buy the body option for entry/mid level cameras even when it's offered. Buying the kit and selling off the lens tends to make more financial sense. Eliminating that SKU reduces costs for Panasonic and their dealers.

Makes more financial sense for whom? Not Panasonic. That doesnt make business sense at all.

I remember the GX85 had a body only SKU that was discontinued very quickly in the US. I take it is because sales were extremely low for that option.

Sales were extremely low for the GX7 MkII period. The MkII isnt even discontinued, but bundled with two lenses for around $600. https://www.amazon.com/PANASONIC-12-32mm-45-150mm-Stabilization-DMC-GX85WK/dp/B079VDF7ZG/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1534709432&sr=8-1&keywords=Gx85

This hurts sales for the MkIII even more, because theres not much that many new features that separates the two.

peppermonkey wrote:

Why do you keep on mentioning GX7 MKIII? Do you live in Japan? Because that is the only place on this planet where it's called GX7 MKIII. Everywhere else on planet Earth it's GX9.

Sorry, but I refuse to go by Marketing names. It's not the follow up to the GX8, it's a follow up to the GX7.

And before you get all, "but why the difference", it's simple. Money.

Unlike the rest of the world, GX7 actually sold very well in Japan. Panasonic needed to do something about selling more cameras to the rest of the world. So they figured to have a three tier system where:

GXx is tier 1

GXxx is tier 2

GXxxx is tier 3

BUT in Japan, where GX7 actually did well, they needed to keep the GX7 name going so MKII and now MKIII.

Again, I'll go by the name that the people who Made the camera, actually calls it, not marketing talk, thank you.

Seriously, I don't see where all the confusion is coming from. GX9 is known as GX9 everywhere on this planet earth except Japan. Why complain about the name of GX7 MKIII because of one naming difference in one country out of the many on this planet?

No one is complaining about the name but YOU. I'm complaining about Price.

As for the $600 GX9 in Europe, oh please, it's not $600 USD, it's $765USD but Panasonic Europe/UK just happens to have a 2 month promotion going on that brings the price down to $600USD. And before you complain, "well, why isn't the promotion going on in the US", well, tell me how often does Olympus have a WORLD WIDE promotion? Generally (could be always), camera manufacturers have promotions that are separated by NA, Europe, Asia, etc. And this promotion is only for 2 months after which it becomes $765USD again

So right now, since we posted our comments, how MUCH is it, Right Now? Its $600 USD. You cant argue that. And I'm not talking about what Olympus is doing, im talking about THIS camera, and the difference in PRICE and OPTIONS depending on where its sold, RIGHT. NOW.

As for body only price, what is the big deal? You can get the GX9 for $1000USD with the very good WR 12-60mm. If you really don't want the lens sell it for an easy $300. Thus $700.

As someone who owns/owned GX7 MkII/X-E2, not to mention the numerous GX series cameras, I preferred a body only option if it were available, also I've sold kit lenses. I dont want to go with the hassle of selling a lens. I want to buy a body, slap on a prime and go shoot... Is that do hard to fathom???

And the X-E3 is a different tier camera. It's rather easy to understand why there are more options plus better bundled lenses for it. Higher the tier, the better the included lenses. Besides, the Panasonic 12-60mm is not the same tier as the cheapy 14-42mm lens that comes with the entry level cameras.

It's not a different tier camera compared to the GX7 MkIII. It is in the same tier. It's just that obviously someone at Fujifilm understands the customer better and/or caters to them by providing Options.

Now, with all that said, if you are saying that the GX9 is overpriced as a $700USD camera, well, you are certainly welcome to go rant at Panasonic.

I am, I just did.

MrALLCAPS wrote:

First off, the GX9 (GX7 MkIII) Came out the gates in a Bad spot, partially because the GX8 owners felt wronged, being that the GX7 MkIII was a downgrade in some key areas, not to mention the Price, -especially that you can get a GX7 MkII for half the price.

Now WEX photo video has the Killer deal on the GX7 MkIII:

https://www.wexphotovideo.com/panasonic-gx9-digital-camera-body-1652892/

You can get it for under $600.00 (body only)!! In the U.S., we dont even get a Body only option, just a Kit zoom lens, which personally speaking, if I were to use this camera, I'd only use primes.

Who's in charge of Panasonic North America? Who is making the decisions on pricing, kit choices, Naming, etc...? They severely dropped the ball with the GX7 MkIII. Wheres the BODY ONLY option??

Even Fujifilm with the X-E3 gives people THREE options: Body only, a kit with a great 23mm f/2 WR prime lens and a kit with the excellent 18-55!!

It makes you wonder who's in charge at Panasonic NA... Maybe they're just business exec's, that I hate to say, only know how to sell product like TVs, Hair dryers and consumer electronics, like most of the Lumix haters say, with no concern nor educated on photography.

Whatever it is, NA needs better buying options and better competitive pricing, in order to compete with the competition. The Pricing and lack of buying options for this camera is a Joke right now.

MrALLCAPS wrote:

JakeJY wrote:

I take it is because in the US, people don't tend to buy the body option for entry/mid level cameras even when it's offered. Buying the kit and selling off the lens tends to make more financial sense. Eliminating that SKU reduces costs for Panasonic and their dealers.

Makes more financial sense for whom? Not Panasonic. That doesnt make business sense at all.

In that line I was talking about the user; for example GX85 with 12-32mm kit is selling for $600. You can sell off the kit lens for $150, ending up with $450 net. No way Panasonic will offer a body for only $450. Note even though the street price for a 12-32mm is ~$150, it does not cost Panasonic that much to bundle the lens with the camera.

It makes business sense for Panasonic too not to offer an SKU if practically no one buys the body-only version. It costs money to maintain that SKU (it will be in all the sales sheets, order systems, to create the specific packaging and labeling for it) and also costs money to maintain an inventory (both to Panasonic and vendors). For low volumes, this overhead cost can easily be much higher than the sales they saved from having a body-only SKU (especially given the same people can just buy the kit and sell it off).

I remember the GX85 had a body only SKU that was discontinued very quickly in the US. I take it is because sales were extremely low for that option.

Sales were extremely low for the GX7 MkII period. The MkII isnt even discontinued, but bundled with two lenses for around $600. https://www.amazon.com/PANASONIC-12-32mm-45-150mm-Stabilization-DMC-GX85WK/dp/B079VDF7ZG/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1534709432&sr=8-1&keywords=Gx85

This hurts sales for the MkIII even more, because theres not much that many new features that separates the two.

You linked to a new 12-32mm + 45-150mm SKU they just introduced recently. Of course the sales for that is lower since it's quite new. The GX85 12-32mm kit sold well from what I can tell.

I never said the GX85 was discontinued. What I'm talking about is the body-only SKU for the GX85 (DMC-GX85KBODY), which you are complaining there is no equivalent of for GX9:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1281436-REG/panasonic_dmc_gx85kbody_lumix_dmc_gx85_mirrorless_micro.html

This was offered initially, but was discontinued very quickly. Again, likely because few people bought the body-only. Panasonic probably made the decision not to offer it for GX9 after that experience.

JakeJY wrote:

MrALLCAPS wrote:

JakeJY wrote:

I take it is because in the US, people don't tend to buy the body option for entry/mid level cameras even when it's offered. Buying the kit and selling off the lens tends to make more financial sense. Eliminating that SKU reduces costs for Panasonic and their dealers.

Makes more financial sense for whom? Not Panasonic. That doesnt make business sense at all.

In that line I was talking about the user; for example GX85 with 12-32mm kit is selling for $600. You can sell off the kit lens for $150, ending up with $450 net. No way Panasonic will offer a body for only $450. Note even though the street price for a 12-32mm is ~$150, it does not cost Panasonic that much to bundle the lens with the camera.

Personally, I would rather pay $600 body only for the MkIII, Than spend a grand and go thru the hassle of posting and selling the kit lens on Ebay.

It makes business sense for Panasonic too not to offer an SKU if practically no one buys the body-only version. It costs money to maintain that SKU (it will be in all the sales sheets, order systems, to create the specific packaging and labeling for it) and also costs money to maintain an inventory (both to Panasonic and vendors).

Pansonic once sold the GF1 with the 20mm. It sold very well. Same for the GX7 in Europe/Canada sold great as well. Again, someone at Panasonic NA is dropping the ball. Both rangefinder styles bodies from Fujifilm can be purchased with prime lenses. I dont see what's the problem with that, options.

I remember the GX85 had a body only SKU that was discontinued very quickly in the US. I take it is because sales were extremely low for that option.

Sales were extremely low for the GX7 MkII period. The MkII isnt even discontinued, but bundled with two lenses for around $600. https://www.amazon.com/PANASONIC-12-32mm-45-150mm-Stabilization-DMC-GX85WK/dp/B079VDF7ZG/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1534709432&sr=8-1&keywords=Gx85

This hurts sales for the MkIII even more, because theres not much that many new features that separates the two.

You linked to a new 12-32mm + 45-150mm SKU they just introduced recently. Of course the sales for that is lower since it's quite new. The GX85 12-32mm kit sold well from what I can tell.

I never said the GX85 was discontinued. What I'm talking about is the body-only SKU for the GX85 (DMC-GX85KBODY), which you are complaining there is no equivalent of for GX9:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1281436-REG/panasonic_dmc_gx85kbody_lumix_dmc_gx85_mirrorless_micro.html

This was offered initially, but was discontinued very quickly. Again, likely because few people bought the body-only. Panasonic probably made the decision not to offer it for GX9 after that experience.

Yet in Japan, the GX7 MkIII is sold with Body only, prime and zoom lens options... https://panasonic.jp/dc/g_series/products/gx7mk3/option.html

Maybe Panasonic NA should review their strategy here in the USA. That's all I'm saying.

nevada5 wrote:

MrALLCAPS wrote:

In Japan. Panasonic calls it the GX7 Mark III. The GX80/85 is really the GX7 Mark II. I'd prefer to call it what it really is, not what marketing "wants us" to call it.

Someone else explained the reasoning for the "Japan is different" thingy here.

Why wouldn't you call it by the name that's on the camera itself? It takes your prejudices out of the issue and it allows others to know what you're referring to. I'm not offended if you say you don't like the GX9 because of ........ But if you want to have a discussion, people need to know what you're talking about.

Just because someone gave a reason, doesnt mean it's Right. And it's obvious from the consensus, that it was a Bad marketing move to do so. Where does it even say "GX9" on the camera, Anyways?

On top of that, I mentioned "GX9" in the heading. What more do you need? You're here, right??

nevada5 wrote:

MrALLCAPS wrote:

nevada5 wrote:

MrALLCAPS wrote:

In Japan. Panasonic calls it the GX7 Mark III. The GX80/85 is really the GX7 Mark II. I'd prefer to call it what it really is, not what marketing "wants us" to call it.

Someone else explained the reasoning for the "Japan is different" thingy here.

Why wouldn't you call it by the name that's on the camera itself? It takes your prejudices out of the issue and it allows others to know what you're referring to. I'm not offended if you say you don't like the GX9 because of ........ But if you want to have a discussion, people need to know what you're talking about.

Just because someone gave a reason, doesnt mean it's Right. And it's obvious from the consensus, that it was a Bad marketing move to do so.

Bad marketing move - maybe, maybe not. But that doesn't change facts.

Where does it even say "GX9" on the camera, Anyways?

On the bottom. It says "Panasonic DC GX9."

They could call it a Panasonic 1DX III but we wouldn't pretend it was a professional sports body. Calling that camera the GX9 is somewhat of an insult to consumers given that it's inferior to the GX8 in almost every way. Nobody would be complaining if they'd called it the GX90.

nevada5 wrote:

MrALLCAPS wrote:

nevada5 wrote:

MrALLCAPS wrote:

In Japan. Panasonic calls it the GX7 Mark III. The GX80/85 is really the GX7 Mark II. I'd prefer to call it what it really is, not what marketing "wants us" to call it.

Someone else explained the reasoning for the "Japan is different" thingy here.

Why wouldn't you call it by the name that's on the camera itself? It takes your prejudices out of the issue and it allows others to know what you're referring to. I'm not offended if you say you don't like the GX9 because of ........ But if you want to have a discussion, people need to know what you're talking about.

Just because someone gave a reason, doesnt mean it's Right. And it's obvious from the consensus, that it was a Bad marketing move to do so.

Bad marketing move - maybe, maybe not. But that doesn't change facts.

Where does it even say "GX9" on the camera, Anyways?

On the bottom. It says "Panasonic DC GX9."

So basically that proves my point. The name of the camera is merely printed on a sticker, not debossed/embossed on the camera itself? On the Bottom? Yeah, that's real marketable.

On top of that, I mentioned "GX9" in the heading. What more do you need? You're here, right??

Yep. That's how I knew which camera you were talking about.

Okay then, what's the problem again?

MrALLCAPS wrote:

nevada5 wrote:

MrALLCAPS wrote:

nevada5 wrote:

MrALLCAPS wrote:

In Japan. Panasonic calls it the GX7 Mark III. The GX80/85 is really the GX7 Mark II. I'd prefer to call it what it really is, not what marketing "wants us" to call it.

Someone else explained the reasoning for the "Japan is different" thingy here.

Why wouldn't you call it by the name that's on the camera itself? It takes your prejudices out of the issue and it allows others to know what you're referring to. I'm not offended if you say you don't like the GX9 because of ........ But if you want to have a discussion, people need to know what you're talking about.

Just because someone gave a reason, doesnt mean it's Right. And it's obvious from the consensus, that it was a Bad marketing move to do so.

Bad marketing move - maybe, maybe not. But that doesn't change facts.

Where does it even say "GX9" on the camera, Anyways?

On the bottom. It says "Panasonic DC GX9."

So basically that proves my point. The name of the camera is merely printed on a sticker, not debossed/embossed on the camera itself? On the Bottom? Yeah, that's real marketable.

To be fair, I think the only ILC cameras Panasonic currently makes that have the model name engraved on the body are the GH series. Even the G9 has no mention of the model name on the body other than the sticker on the bottom.

MrALLCAPS wrote:

First off, the GX9 (GX7 MkIII) Came out the gates in a Bad spot, partially because the GX8 owners felt wronged, being that the GX7 MkIII was a downgrade in some key areas, not to mention the Price, -especially that you can get a GX7 MkII for half the price.

Do you mean that the GX9 was a downgrade in some key areas from the GX8 (mainly EVF and weather resistance)?  Well, isn't your point that it's not a successor to the GX8 at all, but rather it is a descendant of the GX7?  Of course the EVF won't be as good as the GX8's.

tkbslc wrote:

You don't think it's confusing that the replacement for a Tier 2 camera
(GX85), uses a Tier 1 (GX9) naming convention. And the actual Tier 1 camera (GX8) has never been replaced? And honestly none of them seemed like a true successor to the original GX7 to begin with?

I agree with you that the GX9/GX7 MkIII is a descendant of the GX7, not the GX8.  But IMO it actually seems like a worthy successor to the GX7 (unlike the GX85, which had some improvements but several downgrades from the GX7 to hit a lower price point).

The GX9 has the 20MP sensor, 5-axis stabilization, tilt EVF, MF/AF switch, etc.   In what ways is it not as good as the GX7?  I confess I haven't studied the GX9 all that much, but for someone who wants this size RF-style camera as their main shooter, what's not to like?

They named it the GX9 instead of the GX95, which sadly suggests that there will be no true successor to the GX8.  Much as I wish they would change their minds on that, I doubt it will happen.

MrALLCAPS wrote:

JakeJY wrote:

MrALLCAPS wrote:

JakeJY wrote:

I take it is because in the US, people don't tend to buy the body option for entry/mid level cameras even when it's offered. Buying the kit and selling off the lens tends to make more financial sense. Eliminating that SKU reduces costs for Panasonic and their dealers.

Makes more financial sense for whom? Not Panasonic. That doesnt make business sense at all.

In that line I was talking about the user; for example GX85 with 12-32mm kit is selling for $600. You can sell off the kit lens for $150, ending up with $450 net. No way Panasonic will offer a body for only $450. Note even though the street price for a 12-32mm is ~$150, it does not cost Panasonic that much to bundle the lens with the camera.

Personally, I would rather pay $600 body only for the MkIII, Than spend a grand and go thru the hassle of posting and selling the kit lens on Ebay.

It makes business sense for Panasonic too not to offer an SKU if practically no one buys the body-only version. It costs money to maintain that SKU (it will be in all the sales sheets, order systems, to create the specific packaging and labeling for it) and also costs money to maintain an inventory (both to Panasonic and vendors).

Pansonic once sold the GF1 with the 20mm. It sold very well. Same for the GX7 in Europe/Canada sold great as well. Again, someone at Panasonic NA is dropping the ball. Both rangefinder styles bodies from Fujifilm can be purchased with prime lenses. I dont see what's the problem with that, options.

Did it sell well in the US? Camera markets are not the same among the different regions.

I remember the GX85 had a body only SKU that was discontinued very quickly in the US. I take it is because sales were extremely low for that option.

Sales were extremely low for the GX7 MkII period. The MkII isnt even discontinued, but bundled with two lenses for around $600. https://www.amazon.com/PANASONIC-12-32mm-45-150mm-Stabilization-DMC-GX85WK/dp/B079VDF7ZG/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1534709432&sr=8-1&keywords=Gx85

This hurts sales for the MkIII even more, because theres not much that many new features that separates the two.

You linked to a new 12-32mm + 45-150mm SKU they just introduced recently. Of course the sales for that is lower since it's quite new. The GX85 12-32mm kit sold well from what I can tell.

I never said the GX85 was discontinued. What I'm talking about is the body-only SKU for the GX85 (DMC-GX85KBODY), which you are complaining there is no equivalent of for GX9:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1281436-REG/panasonic_dmc_gx85kbody_lumix_dmc_gx85_mirrorless_micro.html

This was offered initially, but was discontinued very quickly. Again, likely because few people bought the body-only. Panasonic probably made the decision not to offer it for GX9 after that experience.

Yet in Japan, the GX7 MkIII is sold with Body only, prime and zoom lens options... https://panasonic.jp/dc/g_series/products/gx7mk3/option.html

Maybe Panasonic NA should review their strategy here in the USA. That's all I'm saying.

Again, the USA is a different market than Japan. The evidence seems to show their strategy in US market is correct, even though you personally would want a body-only GX9.

The GX85 Body only apparently did not sell in the USA or they would not have discontinued it. They still offer the body only option for the GX7 II in Japan.