Sony 24-105 f4 soft right corners?

Started Jul 26, 2018 | Discussions
mohxinn Regular Member • Posts: 134
Sony 24-105 f4 soft right corners?

Hi,

I recently moved to Sony camp I bougth a Sony A7 III together with a Sony Zeiss 24-70 f4 and a Sony 85mm 1.8 G lens.

Yesterday I decided to try a Sony 24-105 f4 since I read about the raving reviews and how it trumps the Zeiss 24-70 f4 despite having a longer zoom range.

I did a quick test between the 2 lenses to check how much better the 24-105 was.

Below are center and corner crops (left and right) from the 2 lenses. The test target was a bench of matte magazines pages fastened to a wall. The test was done 24mm at F4.
Tripod was used and SteadyShot was disabled for both lenses.

Center Crop

Sony

Zeiss

Right Corner Crop

Sony

Zeiss

Left Corner Crop

Sony

Zeiss

Full Image

Sony

Zeiss

As expected Sony 24-105 is sharper in the center and a lot sharper in the left corner. However, it seems to be less sharp in the corners on the right comparerd to the Zeiss. Does this means it is decentered? Or is this a testing error?

I very much look forward to your valuable comments and suggestions!

Regards,
Mohsin
Flickr: https://www.flickr.com/photos/90692793@N03/

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C47 Contributing Member • Posts: 634
Re: Sony 24-105 f4 soft right corners?
1

mohxinn wrote:

Does this means it is decentered? Or is this a testing error?

This is really hard to say on the basis of theses photos. Can you post some photos you shot of a symmetric test chart and some real life photos of subjects that are farther away?

https://www.google.com/search?q=lens+test+chart&tbm=isch

https://phillipreeve.net/blog/how-to-check-how-decentered-your-lens-is/

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OP mohxinn Regular Member • Posts: 134
Re: Sony 24-105 f4 soft right corners?

Is this any better? Printed one of freely available lens test chart.

Sony 24-105,105mm at F4

Thanks for helping out

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C47 Contributing Member • Posts: 634
Re: Sony 24-105 f4 soft right corners?

I can hardly see any differences when zooming in on the edges and comparing them side by side. The lower left and upper right edges seem minimally softer.

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OP mohxinn Regular Member • Posts: 134
Re: Sony 24-105 f4 soft right corners?

C47 wrote:

I can hardly see any differences when zooming in on the edges and comparing them side by side. The lower left and upper right edges seem minimally softer.

Is that normal?

Do you own a 24-105 lens? I was hoping if you do then perhaps you can tell if this lens is a keeper or should I get another copy?

Again I appreciate your time and help!

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Costas L Regular Member • Posts: 166
Re: Sony 24-105 f4 soft right corners?
2

There is a fairly simple test for decentering described by Fred Miranda at the link below. Should be quick to try but need bright conditions so you can use a high shutter speed

http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1534737

daran
daran Regular Member • Posts: 298
Re: Sony 24-105 f4 soft right corners?

Seems rather soft. Might be field curvature, though. Have you tried focusing on the corner or increasing the distance?

For comparison, I shot something similar with the 25-105 on an A7r2: Full Res Test It took me some fiddling to get the camera fully perpendicular to the floor and I believe I focused manually.

mohxinn wrote:

Is this any better? Printed one of freely available lens test chart.

Sony 24-105,105mm at F4

Thanks for helping out

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JimKasson
JimKasson Forum Pro • Posts: 25,537
An offer

If you run this test three times:

https://blog.kasson.com/lens-screening-testing/

and send me three sets of the raw files -- 27 images in all -- I'll analyze them and report back to you.

Here's what a good copy of that lens looks like at 24 mm:

https://blog.kasson.com/lens-screening-testing/examples/good-zoom-at-24-mm/

Jim

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ArtAlt
ArtAlt Senior Member • Posts: 1,976
Re: Sony 24-105 f4 soft right corners?

mohxinn wrote:

Hi,

I recently moved to Sony camp I bougth a Sony A7 III together with a Sony Zeiss 24-70 f4 and a Sony 85mm 1.8 G lens.

Yesterday I decided to try a Sony 24-105 f4 since I read about the raving reviews and how it trumps the Zeiss 24-70 f4 despite having a longer zoom range.

I did a quick test between the 2 lenses to check how much better the 24-105 was.

Below are center and corner crops (left and right) from the 2 lenses. The test target was a bench of matte magazines pages fastened to a wall. The test was done 24mm at F4.
Tripod was used and SteadyShot was disabled for both lenses.

...

As expected Sony 24-105 is sharper in the center and a lot sharper in the left corner. However, it seems to be less sharp in the corners on the right comparerd to the Zeiss. Does this means it is decentered? Or is this a testing error?

I very much look forward to your valuable comments and suggestions!

Regards,
Mohsin
Flickr: https://www.flickr.com/photos/90692793@N03/

Is there a reliable way to assure that the plane of the test chart and plane of the sensor are parallel?

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Nick46
Nick46 Regular Member • Posts: 130
Re: Sony 24-105 f4 soft right corners?
3

That's a good question. In my view one would need some pretty sophisticated laboratory equipment to set the sensor & target up.

These DIY test on these forums tell us nothing.

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jiulin Regular Member • Posts: 199
Re: Sony 24-105 f4 soft right corners?
1

Having read this thread, I also did some tests on my 24-105.

I think mine is also a little decentered. The results are consistent (several tests @ 20m and 2m): Lower R > Top R > Lower L > Top L (while the center is in good focus).

I advise everyone not to waste time with this test unless you can return it. I've taken 9k photos with mine and never noticed any issue until today's test. Not only have I wasted my time but also been feeling sub-par.

Btw, I did the test on FM forum & this one: https://phillipreeve.net/blog/how-to-check-how-decentered-your-lens-is/

I prefer the second one because flipping the camera means not using a tripod.

Maybe having the subject further away is easier on the lens?

Anyway, if I bought one of the lenses infamous for decentering, I'll do this again.

HP1999 Senior Member • Posts: 4,316
Re: Sony 24-105 f4 soft right corners?
4

Not sure it matters. Corners of frames are filled with things that is not the main point of interest.

Further, no one looks at photos like this.

If you have a 70 inch 4K whatever TV do you watch from 5 inches away?

I dont hold a photo that close to my eyes in real life.

Have you ever purchased a new suit and as soon as the sales guy puts on the jacket to try do you raise your hands in the air?  I have seen this and no one walks around like this, cracks me up....

Make your decision by taking a normal photo. Do you like it or not?

This is assuming you have it in focus and exposure is good.

If yes great if not return it.

Shadowfixer Senior Member • Posts: 1,512
Re: Sony 24-105 f4 soft right corners?

If you have to take a picture of a gnats rear end and zoom to 500% to see a difference, I doubt there is a real world issue.

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OP mohxinn Regular Member • Posts: 134
Re: An offer

JimKasson wrote:

If you run this test three times:

https://blog.kasson.com/lens-screening-testing/

and send me three sets of the raw files -- 27 images in all -- I'll analyze them and report back to you.

Here's what a good copy of that lens looks like at 24 mm:

https://blog.kasson.com/lens-screening-testing/examples/good-zoom-at-24-mm/

Jim

I will try to do this over the weekend. Just confirming my understanding. My camera is Sony A7 III which 24 MP FF camera. I plan to test at 24mm and F5.6 that way, if I understood correctly from the info on the link you sent, I can have a shorter distance to target and a smaller test target.

Based on above info can I print on an A3 paper?

Everytime should use the same FL and aperture, right?

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OP mohxinn Regular Member • Posts: 134
Re: Sony 24-105 f4 soft right corners?

Costas L wrote:

There is a fairly simple test for decentering described by Fred Miranda at the link below. Should be quick to try but need bright conditions so you can use a high shutter speed

http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1534737

Thanks for the link. I will try this

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OP mohxinn Regular Member • Posts: 134
Re: Sony 24-105 f4 soft right corners?

daran wrote:

Seems rather soft. Might be field curvature, though. Have you tried focusing on the corner or increasing the distance?

For comparison, I shot something similar with the 25-105 on an A7r2: Full Res Test It took me some fiddling to get the camera fully perpendicular to the floor and I believe I focused manually.

mohxinn wrote:

Is this any better? Printed one of freely available lens test chart.

Sony 24-105,105mm at F4

Thanks for helping out

Thanks for sharing your test shots. Gives me something to compare to. I think I need better lighting to judge the performance reliably.

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Fenwayfan77 Forum Member • Posts: 76
Re: Sony 24-105 f4 soft right corners?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QVD2Q-3HbVo

This is a simple yet effective and accurate way to test for decentered issues.

JimKasson
JimKasson Forum Pro • Posts: 25,537
Re: An offer

mohxinn wrote:

JimKasson wrote:

If you run this test three times:

https://blog.kasson.com/lens-screening-testing/

and send me three sets of the raw files -- 27 images in all -- I'll analyze them and report back to you.

Here's what a good copy of that lens looks like at 24 mm:

https://blog.kasson.com/lens-screening-testing/examples/good-zoom-at-24-mm/

I will try to do this over the weekend. Just confirming my understanding. My camera is Sony A7 III which 24 MP FF camera. I plan to test at 24mm and F5.6 that way, if I understood correctly from the info on the link you sent, I can have a shorter distance to target and a smaller test target.

Yes, stopping down shortens the distance

Based on above info can I print on an A3 paper?

That should work.

Everytime should use the same FL and aperture, right?

Yes. Focus once, make 9 shots. Refocus, and do it again. Refocus a final time and make the last 9 shots.

Jim

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OP mohxinn Regular Member • Posts: 134
Re: An offer

JimKasson wrote:

mohxinn wrote:

JimKasson wrote:

If you run this test three times:

https://blog.kasson.com/lens-screening-testing/

and send me three sets of the raw files -- 27 images in all -- I'll analyze them and report back to you.

Here's what a good copy of that lens looks like at 24 mm:

https://blog.kasson.com/lens-screening-testing/examples/good-zoom-at-24-mm/

I will try to do this over the weekend. Just confirming my understanding. My camera is Sony A7 III which 24 MP FF camera. I plan to test at 24mm and F5.6 that way, if I understood correctly from the info on the link you sent, I can have a shorter distance to target and a smaller test target.

Yes, stopping down shortens the distance

Based on above info can I print on an A3 paper?

That should work.

Everytime should use the same FL and aperture, right?

Yes. Focus once, make 9 shots. Refocus, and do it again. Refocus a final time and make the last 9 shots.

Jim

One more question, my printer is of Ricoh brand and as far as I can tell from the printer options, I supports either 600 x 600 dpi or 1200 x 1200 dpi. Which targets should I use? Epson ones or the Canon ones?

Also do I need to print only one target or all three targets (60, 80 and 100 spoke)? If yes, how should the targets be placed?

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JimKasson
JimKasson Forum Pro • Posts: 25,537
Re: An offer

mohxinn wrote:

JimKasson wrote:

mohxinn wrote:

JimKasson wrote:

If you run this test three times:

https://blog.kasson.com/lens-screening-testing/

and send me three sets of the raw files -- 27 images in all -- I'll analyze them and report back to you.

Here's what a good copy of that lens looks like at 24 mm:

https://blog.kasson.com/lens-screening-testing/examples/good-zoom-at-24-mm/

I will try to do this over the weekend. Just confirming my understanding. My camera is Sony A7 III which 24 MP FF camera. I plan to test at 24mm and F5.6 that way, if I understood correctly from the info on the link you sent, I can have a shorter distance to target and a smaller test target.

Yes, stopping down shortens the distance

Based on above info can I print on an A3 paper?

That should work.

Everytime should use the same FL and aperture, right?

Yes. Focus once, make 9 shots. Refocus, and do it again. Refocus a final time and make the last 9 shots.

One more question, my printer is of Ricoh brand and as far as I can tell from the printer options, I supports either 600 x 600 dpi or 1200 x 1200 dpi. Which targets should I use? Epson ones or the Canon ones?

Canon ones, if you crop. Or just pick any one and resize using nearest neighbor.

Also do I need to print only one target or all three targets (60, 80 and 100 spoke)? If yes, how should the targets be placed?

Just pick one.

Jim

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