Attempted astro with eos m + 22mm lens but frame flashed red and won't take shot

Started 10 months ago | Questions
tim21 Forum Member • Posts: 95
Attempted astro with eos m + 22mm lens but frame flashed red and won't take shot

I guess this has something to do with it being too dark? But I saw a post on here where a guy took some pretty good astro shots with the same set up, so I guess it is the settings I'm using? It was a shame cos the one pic I did take caught a pretty awesome meteorite  : - (

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AlbertTheLazy
AlbertTheLazy Veteran Member • Posts: 7,640
Re: Attempted astro with eos m + 22mm lens but frame flashed red and won't take shot

tim21 wrote:

I guess this has something to do with it being too dark? But I saw a post on here where a guy took some pretty good astro shots with the same set up, so I guess it is the settings I'm using? It was a shame cos the one pic I did take caught a pretty awesome meteorite : - (

What exposure mode and autofocus mode were you using? For astro I'd use manual for both (and I hardly ever shoot in manual).

Why not post the meteorite pic to show what settings you used.

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SoCalWill
SoCalWill Senior Member • Posts: 6,214
Re: Attempted astro with eos m + 22mm lens but frame flashed red and won't take shot

You're trying to get the shot in a semi-automated mode that's exceeding the shutter speed limit for that mode; you'll have to allocate more ISO/f-stop or move to Manual.

Be aware that with ~20MP you have about five seconds before stars start to notably motion blur.

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PhotoTeach2 Senior Member • Posts: 9,421
3 + 3 + 3

Astro must be done in manual mode, (both exposure and focus).

Typical exposures are ISO-3200 @ f/2.8(3) @ 30-seconds. (I remember it as 3+3+3)

But since longer than 15-seconds can show "trails", I suggest using f/2 lens or ISO-6400 @ 15-seconds.

bobkoure
bobkoure Senior Member • Posts: 1,575
Re: Attempted astro with eos m + 22mm lens but frame flashed red and won't take shot

SoCalWill wrote:

You're trying to get the shot in a semi-automated mode that's exceeding the shutter speed limit for that mode; you'll have to allocate more ISO/f-stop or move to Manual.

Be aware that with ~20MP you have about five seconds before stars start to notably motion blur.

Interesting! I've just started trying astro with my D750, 20mm f/1.8.

I first tried ISO 100, f/1.8, 30sec, and I'm not seeing much motion blur, if any.

Not challenging, just very new to this.

Loads of light pollution in my backyard; we've got a place in Maine that's quite dark but I thought I'd try some test shots...

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SoCalWill
SoCalWill Senior Member • Posts: 6,214
Re: Attempted astro with eos m + 22mm lens but frame flashed red and won't take shot
1

Looks like you're pointed almost dead North, which will minimize the effect, but you can still see the rotation motion on the stars on each side. You also don't appear to be focused to infinity, so you've lost some sharpness that would better illustrate the movement.

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bobkoure
bobkoure Senior Member • Posts: 1,575
Re: Attempted astro with eos m + 22mm lens but frame flashed red and won't take shot

I focused manually, using zoomed-in live view. I'd get better results if I just focused the lens as far as it can go?

[edit]

I wasn't paying attention to cardinal directions, just facing away from the light pollution

[/edit]

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bobkoure
bobkoure Senior Member • Posts: 1,575
Re: 3 + 3 + 3

PhotoTeach2 wrote:

Astro must be done in manual mode, (both exposure and focus).

Typical exposures are ISO-3200 @ f/2.8(3) @ 30-seconds. (I remember it as 3+3+3)

But since longer than 15-seconds can show "trails", I suggest using f/2 lens or ISO-6400 @ 15-seconds.

If you don't have a dual-mode sensor, like the D850, and are shooting in RAW, why bother raising ISO? Read noise?

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PhotoTeach2 Senior Member • Posts: 9,421
Re: Attempted astro with eos m + 22mm lens but frame flashed red and won't take shot

bobkoure wrote:

I focused manually, using zoomed-in live view. I'd get better results if I just focused the lens as far as it can go?

That does not work on all lenses, some focus "beyond" infinity.

[edit]

I wasn't paying attention to cardinal directions, just facing away from the light pollution

Well "north" can be an interesting shot ... but many like "Milky-Way".

PhotoTeach2 Senior Member • Posts: 9,421
Re: 3 + 3 + 3

bobkoure wrote:

PhotoTeach2 wrote:

Astro must be done in manual mode, (both exposure and focus).

Typical exposures are ISO-3200 @ f/2.8(3) @ 30-seconds. (I remember it as 3+3+3)

But since longer than 15-seconds can show "trails", I suggest using f/2 lens or ISO-6400 @ 15-seconds.

If you don't have a dual-mode sensor, like the D850, and are shooting in RAW, why bother raising ISO? Read noise?

I said "or" .... another choice is f/1.2 - 1.4 and then can even "lower" ISO, (below 3200).

The 3+3+3 is just any easy way to remember a "basic" exposure, (like Sunny-16 or Loony-11).

bobkoure
bobkoure Senior Member • Posts: 1,575
Re: Attempted astro with eos m + 22mm lens but frame flashed red and won't take shot

PhotoTeach2 wrote:

bobkoure wrote:

I focused manually, using zoomed-in live view. I'd get better results if I just focused the lens as far as it can go?

That does not work on all lenses, some focus "beyond" infinity.

That was my concern. I'm new to this one, don't know if it does or not..

[edit]

I wasn't paying attention to cardinal directions, just facing away from the light pollution

Well "north" can be an interesting shot ... but many like "Milky-Way".

I plan to get plenty of those, once I get better at this, in a place with a decently dark sky. But there's no Internet (or even good cell coverage) there.

Four miles across, and the entire shore on the other side is conservation land, nearest town's lights are on the other side of a mountain. I can't get WISP because it's blocked by that mountain, but so's the light...

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bobkoure
bobkoure Senior Member • Posts: 1,575
Re: 3 + 3 + 3

PhotoTeach2 wrote:

bobkoure wrote:

PhotoTeach2 wrote:

Astro must be done in manual mode, (both exposure and focus).

Typical exposures are ISO-3200 @ f/2.8(3) @ 30-seconds. (I remember it as 3+3+3)

But since longer than 15-seconds can show "trails", I suggest using f/2 lens or ISO-6400 @ 15-seconds.

If you don't have a dual-mode sensor, like the D850, and are shooting in RAW, why bother raising ISO? Read noise?

I said "or" .... another choice is f/1.2 - 1.4 and then can even "lower" ISO, (below 3200).

The 3+3+3 is just any easy way to remember a "basic" exposure, (like Sunny-16 or Loony-11).

I realize that I'd have had better luck focusing if I boosted ISO for that.  My point with ISO is that for a lot of cameras these days, it's just a gamma adjustment.  I normally leave ISO Auto on, but I'd had it off for that test shot. Time to experiment

 bobkoure's gear list:bobkoure's gear list
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SoCalWill
SoCalWill Senior Member • Posts: 6,214
Re: Attempted astro with eos m + 22mm lens but frame flashed red and won't take shot
1

bobkoure wrote:

I focused manually, using zoomed-in live view. I'd get better results if I just focused the lens as far as it can go?

Auto-focus on the moon, switch to manual focus - now you're locked at true infinity.

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bobkoure
bobkoure Senior Member • Posts: 1,575
Re: Attempted astro with eos m + 22mm lens but frame flashed red and won't take shot

SoCalWill wrote:

bobkoure wrote:

I focused manually, using zoomed-in live view. I'd get better results if I just focused the lens as far as it can go?

Auto-focus on the moon, switch to manual focus - now you're locked at true infinity.

Sounds like a great solution but the moon was down when I got out there last night

BTW I'm finding it... interesting to find buttons with my fingers with the camera rotated up so far. One cool thing the D750 can do that the 600 could not is remap the 'record' button next to the LCD to ISO. I saw that in the manual, wondered why anybody would want it, as the ISO button already there on the back of the camera is easy to press with my left thumb, but yeah, OK, now I like this functionality

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PhotoTeach2 Senior Member • Posts: 9,421
Re: Attempted astro with eos m + 22mm lens but frame flashed red and won't take shot
1

SoCalWill wrote:

bobkoure wrote:

I focused manually, using zoomed-in live view. I'd get better results if I just focused the lens as far as it can go?

Auto-focus on the moon, switch to manual focus - now you're locked at true infinity.

I like that idea .... (except moon is "only" 260,000mi).

But of course the bigger problem is best "star" photos are with "new" (no) moon.

PhotoTeach2 Senior Member • Posts: 9,421
Re: 3 + 3 + 3
1

bobkoure wrote:

PhotoTeach2 wrote:

bobkoure wrote:

PhotoTeach2 wrote:

Astro must be done in manual mode, (both exposure and focus).

Typical exposures are ISO-3200 @ f/2.8(3) @ 30-seconds. (I remember it as 3+3+3)

But since longer than 15-seconds can show "trails", I suggest using f/2 lens or ISO-6400 @ 15-seconds.

If you don't have a dual-mode sensor, like the D850, and are shooting in RAW, why bother raising ISO? Read noise?

I said "or" .... another choice is f/1.2 - 1.4 and then can even "lower" ISO, (below 3200).

The 3+3+3 is just any easy way to remember a "basic" exposure, (like Sunny-16 or Loony-11).

I realize that I'd have had better luck focusing if I boosted ISO for that. My point with ISO is that for a lot of cameras these days, it's just a gamma adjustment. I normally leave ISO Auto on, but I'd had it off for that test shot. Time to experiment

"Auto" ISO, (or any "auto" exposure mode), is not good for night sky because it will "lighten" it to an (18%) gray.

bobkoure
bobkoure Senior Member • Posts: 1,575
Re: 3 + 3 + 3

PhotoTeach2 wrote:

bobkoure wrote:

PhotoTeach2 wrote:

bobkoure wrote:

PhotoTeach2 wrote:

Astro must be done in manual mode, (both exposure and focus).

Typical exposures are ISO-3200 @ f/2.8(3) @ 30-seconds. (I remember it as 3+3+3)

But since longer than 15-seconds can show "trails", I suggest using f/2 lens or ISO-6400 @ 15-seconds.

If you don't have a dual-mode sensor, like the D850, and are shooting in RAW, why bother raising ISO? Read noise?

I said "or" .... another choice is f/1.2 - 1.4 and then can even "lower" ISO, (below 3200).

The 3+3+3 is just any easy way to remember a "basic" exposure, (like Sunny-16 or Loony-11).

I realize that I'd have had better luck focusing if I boosted ISO for that. My point with ISO is that for a lot of cameras these days, it's just a gamma adjustment. I normally leave ISO Auto on, but I'd had it off for that test shot. Time to experiment

"Auto" ISO, (or any "auto" exposure mode), is not good for night sky because it will "lighten" it to an (18%) gray.

The question becomes, will it boost ISO high enough to blow out highlights? With a low read noise camera, higher ISO is pretty much a simple multiplication, which I can divide back in post - so long as my highlights aren't blown. I plan to experiment with this, eventually.

I tried boosting ISO to get a liveview that showed me the stars I was framing, but only see the very brightest ones. Not super useful, especially if I zoom the view in. Any idea how to deal with this? My D750 lets me set monitor brightness and monitor color balance - but not contrast. Without changing either of these, I get a grey field with maybe one star visible. There is, of course, an OVF, but I'm having trouble bending my neck to look through it with the camera on tripod and pointing overhead. Right angle attachment? Or maybe there's an open sight that I can attach, a la Nikonos, and use like a guide scope? I went googling and found a way to mount a reflex sight on a hotshoe. Is that the way to go?

 bobkoure's gear list:bobkoure's gear list
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bobkoure
bobkoure Senior Member • Posts: 1,575
Re: 3 + 3 + 3

bobkoure wrote:

PhotoTeach2 wrote:

bobkoure wrote:

PhotoTeach2 wrote:

bobkoure wrote:

PhotoTeach2 wrote:

Astro must be done in manual mode, (both exposure and focus).

Typical exposures are ISO-3200 @ f/2.8(3) @ 30-seconds. (I remember it as 3+3+3)

But since longer than 15-seconds can show "trails", I suggest using f/2 lens or ISO-6400 @ 15-seconds.

If you don't have a dual-mode sensor, like the D850, and are shooting in RAW, why bother raising ISO? Read noise?

I said "or" .... another choice is f/1.2 - 1.4 and then can even "lower" ISO, (below 3200).

The 3+3+3 is just any easy way to remember a "basic" exposure, (like Sunny-16 or Loony-11).

I realize that I'd have had better luck focusing if I boosted ISO for that. My point with ISO is that for a lot of cameras these days, it's just a gamma adjustment. I normally leave ISO Auto on, but I'd had it off for that test shot. Time to experiment

"Auto" ISO, (or any "auto" exposure mode), is not good for night sky because it will "lighten" it to an (18%) gray.

The question becomes, will it boost ISO high enough to blow out highlights? With a low read noise camera, higher ISO is pretty much a simple multiplication, which I can divide back in post - so long as my highlights aren't blown. I plan to experiment with this, eventually.

I tried boosting ISO to get a liveview that showed me the stars I was framing, but only see the very brightest ones. Not super useful, especially if I zoom the view in. Any idea how to deal with this? My D750 lets me set monitor brightness and monitor color balance - but not contrast. Without changing either of these, I get a grey field with maybe one star visible. There is, of course, an OVF, but I'm having trouble bending my neck to look through it with the camera on tripod and pointing overhead. Right angle attachment? Or maybe there's an open sight that I can attach, a la Nikonos, and use like a guide scope? I went googling and found a way to mount a reflex sight on a hotshoe. Is that the way to go?

BTW, I found a $6 hot-shoe to weaver rail adapterthat won't poke me in the eye if I try to use the OVF. Weaver sights are pretty cheap. I don't need an actual 'red dot', and, as my DSLR has no recoil   I could even use an airsoft sight.

 bobkoure's gear list:bobkoure's gear list
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