Deal of the year - pulled the trigger on M6

As long time Canon (also M) user, I don´t find newer Canon products very compelling for purchase. M6 was in the same class.

Well, good deal changed that. Got it for $385 with 15-45mm kit lens. After I sell the lens (already have one), and maybe the old M, The final cost of transition will be around 180. Peanuts, that is...

I never do normal reviews, as everybody can read many of these. I usually do "differences and small things to point out" reviews. Here is what I got.

The camera body is little lighter, but well built. I like how it looks, the size of it, and how many dials and buttons it has. Too bad that I didn´t feel all this helps me with handling the camera. Most buttons are smaller and with poorer feelings about these. It´s more "fiddly" camera, so there is not much of a difference between fiddling with the LCD, and fiddling with hardware controls. I rather take it as a change, not as a good upgrade. I could do quite well with awesome touch screen UI of the original M, and didn´t feel it´s better here. The grip is quite an upgrade, but not huge. It´s small grip, and it´s close to the lens, so my fingers touch both at one time, which I somehow hate. I will accept it though. All this is due to the high expectations compared to the sleek "old powershot design". There were none before, except for size. But after time, The original M turned out to be NOT POCKETABLE with any lens, So Once I slap 22mm on the M6, the feeling is bout the same.

Screen is now tiltable. I have almost no use for this function, and I´m concerned about lifetime of the flex cable being stressed by screen panel movement, but hopefully it will be okay with low usage. Viewing angles are good, and I like color and contrast of it. Refresh rate felt like significantly better, also there is less "lag" in the image. I found it jumps into lower refresh rates and more lag if one shoots in dark environment with longer times (over 1s), which the older bodies didn´t do as much. That gives me worse feel about it, but it´s not a biggie either. Now, I´m quite dissapointed with the screen size, as the screen panel is quite big, but the screen alone is not. It has huge bezels. That´s shame. It could be significantly larger, for better view and touch UI capabilities, ergonomics.

Focusing was quite huge jump. I found some occasions, when I could fool the AF, so it wouldn´t focus at all, but it was prety minor issue. Not at the times I needed it to focus on particular subject. That one needs to be verified after I do some birding with 55-250mm IS STM and Kenko TC mounted on it.

Still, it was quite fast, accurate, does good in lower light, and the focusing settings are broader, so it does better job generally. Still, it´s only half way to DSLR speed. When I needed to focus with my previous SL1, and the AF motor didn´t have to move a lot, it could focus as many times as I managed to push the AF button, and it tracked "usable-to well". Even eight times AF in a second wasn´t problem. M6 is no slouch, but still is slower, and only does about 3x-4x(best case) focus iterations per second. I would not use it for kids or moving animals seriously at any point. Still, with most lenses, it´s night and day compared to M and M10. So I´m very happy for it.

Image Sensor and output Is generally better, but due to the expectations, it´s mixed bag. Mild bump in resolution, and maybe weaker AA filter helps with sharpness, it does what I expected. Dynamic Range feels like 1,5 stops better, and it will definitely solve some of my landscape and indoors shooting issues. Base ISO noise feels like 1/3 stops better than my older Ms. Little better in darker areas without pushing. High ISO noise alone feels the same. So, no "one stop higher ISO speed shooting", no "poor light issues solved instantly". No. I´t´s only mild upgrade. Barely noticable in real world. But still, the upgrade is welcome. Also, I can substitute the additional resolution for more denoise, so It can rather get over 1/2 stops of performance bump in the final image. This works for most of the ISO range. I´ll be more likely to shoot ISO 1600, which alone, is good enough.

Lenses are little bit pain here, even after so so many years.

I only use 22mm lens on the camera now, and I´m going to use EF, EF-S, and third party lenses for this camera. Those other Canon M lenses, although very good, don´t feel like FUN enaugh to justify this system for me. No fast primes, no long reach tele lens.

I even had 11-22mm IS STM, and while it was very, very good, I found that it´s still not enough "fun", so it went, eventually....

Recommendations: Well It´s canon. Awesome ecosystem, awesome choice of general usage lenses, adaption of EF lenses is very good. It´s all intuitive, fast, understandable, great value, pretty good ergonomics and handling, very well tuned system. I thought I can miss that, so I visited the dark side (Nikon FX), to get rid of "not enough low light capabilities and resolution" problems, But I found the sensor alone IS NOT the decisive factor in my photography, So I´m back in awesome Canon ecosystem, and while Canon is bad, and milks us badly, at least they know how to do it, they do it well. For that reason, I must recommend Canon as a brand to anybody who asks me what to choose, If he doesn´t know what he wants.

crashpc wrote:

As long time Canon (also M) user, I don´t find newer Canon products very compelling for purchase. M6 was in the same class.

Well, good deal changed that. Got it for $385 with 15-45mm kit lens. After I sell the lens (already have one), and maybe the old M, The final cost of transition will be around 180. Peanuts, that is...

Wow, what a wonderful deal! Congratulations!

I never do normal reviews, as everybody can read many of these. I usually do "differences and small things to point out" reviews. Here is what I got.

The camera body is little lighter, but well built. I like how it looks, the size of it, and how many dials and buttons it has. Too bad that I didn´t feel all this helps me with handling the camera. Most buttons are smaller and with poorer feelings about these. It´s more "fiddly" camera, so there is not much of a difference between fiddling with the LCD, and fiddling with hardware controls. I rather take it as a change, not as a good upgrade. I could do quite well with awesome touch screen UI of the original M, and didn´t feel it´s better here. The grip is quite an upgrade, but not huge. It´s small grip, and it´s close to the lens, so my fingers touch both at one time, which I somehow hate. I will accept it though. All this is due to the high expectations compared to the sleek "old powershot design". There were none before, except for size. But after time, The original M turned out to be NOT POCKETABLE with any lens, So Once I slap 22mm on the M6, the feeling is bout the same.

I like Richard Frienic's grip with a solid feel of the original M, but M5 is good enough to hold. Many controls give me a big pleasure to play with the camera.

Although many say that the original UI is better than M3/5/6's, I do not get the point.

Screen is now tiltable. I have almost no use for this function, and I´m concerned about lifetime of the flex cable being stressed by screen panel movement, but hopefully it will be okay with low usage. Viewing angles are good, and I like color and contrast of it. Refresh rate felt like significantly better, also there is less "lag" in the image. I found it jumps into lower refresh rates and more lag if one shoots in dark environment with longer times (over 1s), which the older bodies didn´t do as much. That gives me worse feel about it, but it´s not a biggie either. Now, I´m quite dissapointed with the screen size, as the screen panel is quite big, but the screen alone is not. It has huge bezels. That´s shame. It could be significantly larger, for better view and touch UI capabilities, ergonomics.

I also have almost no use for tiltable LCD. Maybe because of my laziness. I am sorry that M5 is also slow to respond and this is Canon's latest technology for mirrorless.

Focusing was quite huge jump. I found some occasions, when I could fool the AF, so it wouldn´t focus at all, but it was prety minor issue. Not at the times I needed it to focus on particular subject. That one needs to be verified after I do some birding with 55-250mm IS STM and Kenko TC mounted on it.

Still, it was quite fast, accurate, does good in lower light, and the focusing settings are broader, so it does better job generally. Still, it´s only half way to DSLR speed. When I needed to focus with my previous SL1, and the AF motor didn´t have to move a lot, it could focus as many times as I managed to push the AF button, and it tracked "usable-to well". Even eight times AF in a second wasn´t problem. M6 is no slouch, but still is slower, and only does about 3x-4x(best case) focus iterations per second. I would not use it for kids or moving animals seriously at any point. Still, with most lenses, it´s night and day compared to M and M10. So I´m very happy for it.

As for me, fast enough for the most situations. This is one of the greatest improvement although it is still behind in comparison with Canon DSLR and others' mirrorless.

Image Sensor and output Is generally better, but due to the expectations, it´s mixed bag. Mild bump in resolution, and maybe weaker AA filter helps with sharpness, it does what I expected. Dynamic Range feels like 1,5 stops better, and it will definitely solve some of my landscape and indoors shooting issues. Base ISO noise feels like 1/3 stops better than my older Ms. Little better in darker areas without pushing. High ISO noise alone feels the same. So, no "one stop higher ISO speed shooting", no "poor light issues solved instantly". No. I´t´s only mild upgrade. Barely noticable in real world. But still, the upgrade is welcome. Also, I can substitute the additional resolution for more denoise, so It can rather get over 1/2 stops of performance bump in the final image. This works for most of the ISO range. I´ll be more likely to shoot ISO 1600, which alone, is good enough.

A little bit better, but a little bit different color profile.

Lenses are little bit pain here, even after so so many years.

I only use 22mm lens on the camera now, and I´m going to use EF, EF-S, and third party lenses for this camera. Those other Canon M lenses, although very good, don´t feel like FUN enaugh to justify this system for me. No fast primes, no long reach tele lens.

Todays, I am enjoying using EF 28mm 1.8 and 50mm 1.4 more than before because M5 has EVF, which gives me a more stable, comfortable posture. Of course they have been in my collection since even before getting the original M. If starting from scratch, I would not buy both of them for EOS Ms.

I even had 11-22mm IS STM, and while it was very, very good, I found that it´s still not enough "fun", so it went, eventually....

Interesting because many are satisfied with 11-22.

Recommendations: Well It´s canon. Awesome ecosystem, awesome choice of general usage lenses, adaption of EF lenses is very good. It´s all intuitive, fast, understandable, great value, pretty good ergonomics and handling, very well tuned system. I thought I can miss that, so I visited the dark side (Nikon FX), to get rid of "not enough low light capabilities and resolution" problems, But I found the sensor alone IS NOT the decisive factor in my photography, So I´m back in awesome Canon ecosystem, and while Canon is bad, and milks us badly, at least they know how to do it, they do it well. For that reason, I must recommend Canon as a brand to anybody who asks me what to choose, If he doesn´t know what he wants.

Since I chose EOS 5 (not 5D) as my first camera, I have been not able to depart from Canon even though there have been many shortcomings in Canon.

lumenite wrote:

Wow, what a wonderful deal! Congratulations!

Indeed, it is!

I like Richard Frienic's grip with a solid feel of the original M, but M5 is good enough to hold. Many controls give me a big pleasure to play with the camera.

I quite like the M body shaping, as I have different expectations from it. So I don't feel like putting an additional grip would help. It would completely change nature of the camera body for me. But thanks for recommendation.

Although many say that the original UI is better than M3/5/6's, I do not get the point.

It(s weird, but I feel it the same way. The M touch UI worked very well for my purpose, and reverting back to tiny buttons and dials is not upgrade for me. Also as it is new to me, I never remember what settings is hidden under particular dial.bso I have to try more of these, to get wanted results and parameter changes. That is quite frustrating compared to tapping on what I need. It really feels worse.

I also have almost no use for tiltable LCD. Maybe because of my laziness. I am sorry that M5 is also slow to respond and this is Canon's latest technology for mirrorless.

Mostly laziness, I agree. But I'm not lazy to lay down for a shot. Or maybe layzy enaugh to lay down, and not fiddle with the screen, in very uncomfortable body position...

As for me, fast enough for the most situations. This is one of the greatest improvement although it is still behind in comparison with Canon DSLR and others' mirrorless.

I do agree on that one. I'm not sure if I value this change enough. Time will tell. I have to try the focus peaking function with MF. That seems to be also very good.

A little bit better, but a little bit different color profile.

Yes. I noticed different colors immediately. I found it pleasantly "clinical", but from shot to shot, I like to add the old school Canon warmer and saturated look to it.

Todays, I am enjoying using EF 28mm 1.8 and 50mm 1.4

Had 1.4 before on M. Quite big, and it didn't focus well wide open. So I used MF. For that kind of usage, I'm looking at Samyang 50mm f/1.2. For AF lens, I'm very happy with 1.8 STM.

more than before because M5 has EVF, which gives me a more stable, comfortable posture.

I see. It does help a lot. It was great fight in my head, over viewfinder. But compactness decided for no VF.

Of course they have been in my collection since even before getting the original M. If starting from scratch, I would not buy both of them for EOS Ms.

I even had 11-22mm IS STM, and while it was very, very good, I found that it´s still not enough "fun", so it went, eventually....

Interesting because many are satisfied with 11-22.

It is darn good lens indeed! I like to recommend it. It's just that I didn't have use for 15-22mm range, it's not fast lens (in terms of aperture), and not THAT funny. Rather work horse. And I explained that one already. I need more fun than that.

Since I chose EOS 5 (not 5D) as my first camera, I have been not able to depart from Canon even though there have been many shortcomings in Canon.

I was (able to jump the ship). Baad bad move. Take me as bad example. It put me "off rails" here and there that some of the Canon performance and features shortcomings are so deep compared to competition, but in real life, I found out that basic aspects of the camera work great, and "hipsters and novelty" features of other brands won't make me happier. Good lesson! Lost over $1000 during these stewpid transitions.

It´s not that simple. It´s not laggy or grainy for shorter exposure times. It rather has more to do with exposure simulation needs. To do that for long exposures, the real preview exposure probably has to have more input light too, and that is done with longer shutter speeds. To a point where the speed doesn´t allow for high FPS, as 1/10s cannot be done 60x in one second obviously.

Your review hit the nail on the head. The abundance of dials didn't really help me with shooting adjustments, specially as no shooting info is permanently shown on screen (speed or aperture). I turned the touch screen off, as I got confused: should I change a setting with dials or use the screen? Like you, I found the grip to be somewhat cramped.

That said, the M6 has a lot going for it. Good focus, compact, nice flipscreen. IQ is pretty good and I even liked the kitzoom.

The Sony A6300 has slightly better IQ and grip, But the screen + EVF were pretty much unsusable due to not automatically gaining up in sunlight. Focus also seemed to be more miss than hit.

For the price you got the M6 it's a no brainer!

Yes, it's rather shame that those hardware controls don't really help one with handling and "ease of use". Hope I get used to it soon.  Worst case scenario could be selling it with profit and getting SL2, but the compact size with 22mm lens has the edge here. For that reason alone, I'm not willing to go DSLR ever again.

My friend wants to buy this camera too, so I didn't enjoy it fully, as he got it borrowed for the weekend. I still have to decide what fun glass I need to get. Seems 22mm and 50mm STM does general work for me. Some telephoto lens is coming. At least 55-250mm IS STM. Would be glad for something little longer, but with the same long end image quality. The new kit lens is very hard to outdo in the same class, or for similar money....

I'm looking at Samyang 8mm f/2.8 and 50mm f/1.2. And I wonder about longer focal length macro.

No, I actually opposed your claim. It doesn't have much to do with CPU of the camera, or its age. It rather looks like bunch of decisions made to still provide real image preview. If there is a mode, or settings, which doesn't need to brighten the hell out of the dark scene, there is no noise or lag issue. It simply reaches physical limits. On the other hand, normal OVF keeps you in the darkness. New, or old. The same way  this is not caused by old or weak CPU.

Can you technically explain how that overworking situation due to the different light situation happens? Any evidence to break physics and prove me wrong?

I still don't know whether I'm right or not here, but as an electrician engineer knowing stuff about CPUs and uCs, i have some background knowledge to have educated guess.

The only problem with M6 is location of button "MENU". On M1 and M2 there was space where you can hold the camera. It is A LOT more comfortable to hold M1 and M2 with one hand. I am thinking to attach some cap on top of this pesky button. Obviously designers didn't try to hold the camera themselves at all. 

I fully agree. Also I don't like the repositioning of all these buttons. It was good and logical on old M. Now I always hit something else, go back, check under what button is the function I wanted, and repeat my attempt.

Hey.

Even after reading some manual, I cannot find where can I set ISO seetings "step size". I.E. one third stop, one half, or full stop. I have no use for mid-stops, and changing between so long list of ISO speeds is nasty. Does anybody know if that is possible to set differently?

Thanks in advance.

It's locked at 1/3 stop step size.  The only documentation is pg 211 of the M6 manual.

That's shame. Thank you for help...

In search for fun lenses, I finally pulled the trigger on Samyang 8mm f/2.8 II. After lurking on e-bay, waiting for good deal, I decided to buy the lens for full price, and while "in the search", I found that local shop has it for quite good price. Jumped on it immediately. Hope it will be okay (last piece, long time waiting for me).

Anyway, I will look for more fun lenses.

I´m thinking about very fast 50m.

Any recommendations for Kamlan 50mm f/1.1?

I didn´t find reliable reviews from which I could assess, If the Kamlan is sharp enough in the center wide open. If it is at least as sharp as 1.4 from Canon, or not...

Hey. Got very unlucky today.

Only one piece of Samyang 8mm in our country, and the delivery company probably ruined it (not delivered, and it says something about "damage checking" in the tracking page). My life is ruined like for two weeks now. I hope I find another deal elsewhere, but it doesn´t look very positive.