service mode - Panasonic g7 (awesome camera)

MerfianFerelli wrote:

Redirected from other thread!

I bought my G7 about a year or so ago in the UK.

Just found out about the service mode hack and wanted to ask about people’s experience with editing the footage recorded in ntsc in the UK on a PAL system. I mainly shoot weddings so was curious as to how people do this?

What do you mean, edited on a PAL system? PAL is, strictly speaking, a TV standard (and almost irrelevant at that).

If you are editing on a PC (no PAL involved) you just use your normal native frame rate for the footage (29.97fps) and render out at the same.

If you are putting online, you are good to go; if showing as a file on TV, most modern TVs are capable of displaying the required frame rate.

I've had my G7 (and G6) set this way from new, it allows me to match the output from all other devices (cellphones, action cams) none of which are even capable of 25fps.

What do you mean, edited on a PAL system?

I think I mean PAL as in UK? I’m mainly make content for online display anyway or at least offline on computers of other related hardware... so you’re saying I could leave my camera (almost) in this ntsc service mode and not have an issue with compatibility? I edit on Mac in fcpx or premiere, dabbling with editing on my iPad Pro too.

thanks for your help!

MerfianFerelli wrote:

What do you mean, edited on a PAL system?

I think I mean PAL as in UK?

Sure, we have PAL down here. Great system, but it only applies to TVs and some content shown on them. Doesn't apply to anything you'll use to edit on.

I’m mainly make content for online display anyway or at least offline on computers of other related hardware... so you’re saying I could leave my camera (almost) in this ntsc service mode and not have an issue with compatibility? I edit on Mac in fcpx or premiere, dabbling with editing on my iPad Pro too.

Absolutely, you'll be more compatible in ntsc/service mode than in PAL anyway.

Most action cams and cellphones will do 30fps and even 60fps. Youtube (generally) expects and recommends 30fps for input. You can't get that from a PAL compatible G7 except in service mode.

I guess about now some people will be throwing their hands up in horror and saying that for a true cinematic experience we need to be shooting in 24fps, but I've never bought into that argument - not at my level of competence, anyway.

Be very careful.

There is another thread from a guy who got into the service mode and didn't realize that it dumps the camera alignment data. Accessing that mode sets a data flag that alerts Service that you've been tinkering.  It will void your warranty, and it can be a very expensive repair.

Wasabi Bob wrote:

Be very careful.

I've seen no issues and have been running it like this for almost a couple of years.

There is another thread from a guy who got into the service mode and didn't realize that it dumps the camera alignment data.

What do you mean, "dumps the camera alignment data"?

Accessing that mode sets a data flag that alerts Service that you've been tinkering. It will void your warranty, and it can be a very expensive repair.

Why would a repair be necessary  - unless perhaps you try to roll back to a previous firmware version, I think somebody tried to do that - and that did cost a lot of money to repair.

Seems strange you might void your warranty for just looking at the shutter count.

Having worked for a service center I'm sharing info I have from experience. When a tech services the camera for any problem that's not cosmetic or mechanical, the first thing the tech does is  to download the camera alignment data. This procedure is not included in the service manual that you can find on line. However, if you read through the manual carefully it will instruct you to "reload the camera data" (that was previously exported.)

If you don't, the camera reverts to using generic alignment data that is loaded into every camera's main PCB at the time of manufacturing. This allows the camera to be powered up and aligned much faster than having to load firmware into every camera for the first time during the final alignment steps. The data includes AF / Color and Shutter Speed accuracy. The initial settings are "close", but definitely not spot on. More significant is the fact that when you enter this mode and don't complete the procedure you set a "flag" that tells the servicer that you've been playing with the camera. This will void your warranty if the problem the camera was sent in for triggers them to check this flag.

Service modes are hidden for good reasons, so I don't feel sorry for anyone who goes poking their nose where it should not be. It's very easy to transform your camera into an expensive paperweight.

Wasabi Bob wrote:

Having worked for a service center I'm sharing info I have from experience. When a tech services the camera for any problem that's not cosmetic or mechanical, the first thing the tech does is to download the camera alignment data. This procedure is not included in the service manual that you can find on line. However, if you read through the manual carefully it will instruct you to "reload the camera data" (that was previously exported.)

If you don't, the camera reverts to using generic alignment data that is loaded into every camera's main PCB at the time of manufacturing. This allows the camera to be powered up and aligned much faster than having to load firmware into every camera for the first time during the final alignment steps. The data includes AF / Color and Shutter Speed accuracy. The initial settings are "close", but definitely not spot on. More significant is the fact that when you enter this mode and don't complete the procedure you set a "flag" that tells the servicer that you've been playing with the camera. This will void your warranty if the problem the camera was sent in for triggers them to check this flag.

Service modes are hidden for good reasons, so I don't feel sorry for anyone who goes poking their nose where it should not be. It's very easy to transform your camera into an expensive paperweight.

That all seems pretty clear, but your use of the term dumps isn't. Do you mean "dumps" as in "writes out" (which is the way it is generally used), or do you mean "ignores", ie, "no longer makes use of the data".

I'm aware that in service mode the camera writes out 2 configuration files to the SD card, ie, that is what you refer to as "dumps the alignment data".

But of itself, that is not a bad thing. And I get that you might need that when replacing the PCB.

But can you clarify - are you also implying that the camera ignores this specific configuration data and reverts to the some kind of generic default or unadjusted profiles the entire time it is in service mode? I would have thought if that were the case this might be quite frustrating for service techs, and how would they calibrate the camera if the alignment data is only used in normal mode.

You guys have been super helpful, i’ll definitely be having another look into *cough* service mode.

luckily in the time I’ve had cameras, over 5 years now... I’ve never had to take one or any piece of equipment for that matter for a service or repairs more specifically. I’m normally good at looking after my kit! Often too careful.

but you’re info and experience are all greatly appreciated. Thank you both!

looking at the G80/85 to take over as an A camera at some point for the built in IS? Unless you guys would have any other suggestions in a similar vein to the g7?

many thanks again!

I'm sorry for the delay in responding, but I've been on the road and just returned. So when you enter the service mode, and don't exit correctly, the camera reverts to the "default" settings loaded during manufacturing - close, but as previously noted not spot on. Since the exit procedure is not explained in the general service manual I think it's very safe to assume that anyone who ventures into this mode will arrive at the same end result.

What amazes me is how so many people feel they know more than the manufacturer. These menus are hidden and somewhat restricted for very good reasons. If you go by the philosophy, "if it's not broken, don't try to fix it", you can't go wrong! Someone once told me that experience is what you learn when things didn't go as you expected!

hindesite wrote:

Wasabi Bob wrote:

Having worked for a service center I'm sharing info I have from experience. When a tech services the camera for any problem that's not cosmetic or mechanical, the first thing the tech does is to download the camera alignment data. This procedure is not included in the service manual that you can find on line. However, if you read through the manual carefully it will instruct you to "reload the camera data" (that was previously exported.)

If you don't, the camera reverts to using generic alignment data that is loaded into every camera's main PCB at the time of manufacturing. This allows the camera to be powered up and aligned much faster than having to load firmware into every camera for the first time during the final alignment steps. The data includes AF / Color and Shutter Speed accuracy. The initial settings are "close", but definitely not spot on. More significant is the fact that when you enter this mode and don't complete the procedure you set a "flag" that tells the servicer that you've been playing with the camera. This will void your warranty if the problem the camera was sent in for triggers them to check this flag.

Service modes are hidden for good reasons, so I don't feel sorry for anyone who goes poking their nose where it should not be. It's very easy to transform your camera into an expensive paperweight.

That all seems pretty clear, but your use of the term dumps isn't. Do you mean "dumps" as in "writes out" (which is the way it is generally used), or do you mean "ignores", ie, "no longer makes use of the data".

I'm aware that in service mode the camera writes out 2 configuration files to the SD card, ie, that is what you refer to as "dumps the alignment data".

But of itself, that is not a bad thing. And I get that you might need that when replacing the PCB.

But can you clarify - are you also implying that the camera ignores this specific configuration data and reverts to the some kind of generic default or unadjusted profiles the entire time it is in service mode? I would have thought if that were the case this might be quite frustrating for service techs, and how would they calibrate the camera if the alignment data is only used in normal mode.

That all seems pretty clear, but your use of the term dumps isn't. Do you mean "dumps" as in "writes out" (which is the way it is generally used), or do you mean "ignores", ie, "no longer makes use of the data".

I'm aware that in service mode the camera writes out 2 configuration files to the SD card, ie, that is what you refer to as "dumps the alignment data".

But of itself, that is not a bad thing. And I get that you might need that when replacing the PCB.

But can you clarify - are you also implying that the camera ignores this specific configuration data and reverts to the some kind of generic default or unadjusted profiles the entire time it is in service mode? I would have thought if that were the case this might be quite frustrating for service techs, and how would they calibrate the camera if the alignment data is only used in normarvice mode is entered, and exited improperly, the custom

Without going into the specifics, once that special mode is entered the "custom data" for that specific camera is downloaded to the techs PC. At the end of the service, that same  data must be manually reloaded. If you enter that mode, and exit improperly without reloading the custom alignment data, the camera reverts to using the "generic" alignment data that every camera gets when first built. What you are likely left with is a working camera that may not be 100% accurately aligned. It also leaves "a trail of bread crumbs" so the next tech knows errors or what's been done previously. Bottom line, unless you know what you are doing, stay out of these menus or possibly risk voiding the warranty.