Changes to peaking in A7rIII?

Started Nov 13, 2017 | Discussions
Lightshow
Lightshow Veteran Member • Posts: 7,226
Changes to peaking in A7rIII?
1

Has anyone found out what changes were made?

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1369441-REG/sony_ilce7rm2_b_alpha_a7r_iii_mirrorless.html

Body Design and Built-In Wi-Fi/Bluetooth

  • An updated Quad-VGA OLED Tru-Finder EVF is featured, and has a 3.69m-dot resolution for bright, clear viewing in high detail. Both Standard and High quality settings can be used, depending on the shooting situation, in order to optimize the viewing experience. This updated viewfinder design also affords the use of autofocus in the Focus Magnifier mode as well as improved focusing peaking to benefit manual focus operation.

http://www.glazerscamera.com/sony-a7r-iii-body

Versatile viewing
- 3.69 million dot Quad-VGA OLED Tru-FinderTM
- High quality mode
- AF in Focus Magnifier
- Improved peaking

https://www.vistek.ca/store/DigitalSLRs/420183/sony-alpha-a7riii-body.aspx

Improved Peaking

The evolved BIONZ X processing engine improves the accuracy of “peaking” display that highlights in-focus areas when focusing manually, making it easier to achieve precise focus.

Extra processing of some sort, Can any testers verify? Please.

-- hide signature --

A Manual Focus Junky...
One photographers junk lens is an artists favorite tool.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lightshow-photography/
####Where's my FF NEX-7 ?????
Firmware request:
-A button map for toggling the EVF & LCD.
-Still waiting for the minimum shutter speed with auto ISO for my NEX-7 and A7r. I know it will never happen.
-Customize the display screen layout, I'd love to have both Histogram and level at the same time.
-More peaking options.
-An RGB overlay on the histogram:

-An option to return the focus assist zoom to one button press
-An option to return to how the NEX-7 handled playback, ie. center button to zoom, then you could use the control dial to zoom in and out, then center button to exit the zoom mode.

 Lightshow's gear list:Lightshow's gear list
Sony Alpha NEX-7 Sony a7R Leica Elmarit-M 24mm f/2.8 ASPH Leica APO-Summicron-M 90mm f/2 ASPH Voigtlander 15mm F4.5 Super Wide Heliar +20 more
Lightshow
OP Lightshow Veteran Member • Posts: 7,226
Re: Changes to peaking in A7rIII?

I was hoping someone would have hands on an A7rIII to check into this....

Maybe when it ships.

-- hide signature --

A Manual Focus Junky...
One photographers junk lens is an artists favorite tool.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lightshow-photography/
####Where's my FF NEX-7 ?????
Firmware request:
-A button map for toggling the EVF & LCD
-Still waiting for the minimum shutter speed with auto ISO for my NEX-7 and A7r. I know it will never happen.
-Customize the display screen layout, I'd love to have both Histogram and level at the same time.
-More peaking options.
an RGB overlay on the histogram https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/602/20236258313_c604dd9522_n.jpg
-An option to return the focus assist zoom to one button press
-An option to return to how the NEX-7 handled playback, ie. center button to zoom, then you could use the control dial to zoom in and out, then center button to exit the zoom mode.

 Lightshow's gear list:Lightshow's gear list
Sony Alpha NEX-7 Sony a7R Leica Elmarit-M 24mm f/2.8 ASPH Leica APO-Summicron-M 90mm f/2 ASPH Voigtlander 15mm F4.5 Super Wide Heliar +20 more
(unknown member) Contributing Member • Posts: 854
Re: Changes to peaking in A7rIII?

Lightshow wrote:

Has anyone found out what changes were made?

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1369441-REG/sony_ilce7rm2_b_alpha_a7r_iii_mirrorless.html

Body Design and Built-In Wi-Fi/Bluetooth

  • An updated Quad-VGA OLED Tru-Finder EVF is featured, and has a 3.69m-dot resolution for bright, clear viewing in high detail. Both Standard and High quality settings can be used, depending on the shooting situation, in order to optimize the viewing experience. This updated viewfinder design also affords the use of autofocus in the Focus Magnifier mode as well as improved focusing peaking to benefit manual focus operation.

http://www.glazerscamera.com/sony-a7r-iii-body

Versatile viewing
- 3.69 million dot Quad-VGA OLED Tru-FinderTM
- High quality mode
- AF in Focus Magnifier
- Improved peaking

https://www.vistek.ca/store/DigitalSLRs/420183/sony-alpha-a7riii-body.aspx

Improved Peaking

The evolved BIONZ X processing engine improves the accuracy of “peaking” display that highlights in-focus areas when focusing manually, making it easier to achieve precise focus.

Extra processing of some sort, Can any testers verify? Please.

As far as I can see, peaking is based on the partial sensor read-out (line-skipped?) done for the LCD or EVF, depending on the output's respective resolution. Reading more of the sensor for higher resolution output will of course make peaking more accurate. Reading the whole sensor would be ideal for peaking, but not for battery life.

I'd like to see a focus point, like the AF points, which shows whether it's in focus in MF mode and have selectable threshold on what's considered in focus. It could use the full resolution of the sensor for that area for maximum accuracy or the sensor contrast detect areas if possible for the purpose.

Lightshow
OP Lightshow Veteran Member • Posts: 7,226
Re: Changes to peaking in A7rIII?

Now that samples are out in the wild, some first hand feedback would be awesome.

-- hide signature --

A Manual Focus Junky...
One photographers junk lens is an artists favorite tool.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lightshow-photography/
####Where's my FF NEX-7 ?????
Firmware request:
-A button map for toggling the EVF & LCD
-Still waiting for the minimum shutter speed with auto ISO for my NEX-7 and A7r. I know it will never happen.
-Customize the display screen layout, I'd love to have both Histogram and level at the same time.
-More peaking options.
an RGB overlay on the histogram https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/602/20236258313_c604dd9522_n.jpg
-An option to return the focus assist zoom to one button press
-An option to return to how the NEX-7 handled playback, ie. center button to zoom, then you could use the control dial to zoom in and out, then center button to exit the zoom mode.

 Lightshow's gear list:Lightshow's gear list
Sony Alpha NEX-7 Sony a7R Leica Elmarit-M 24mm f/2.8 ASPH Leica APO-Summicron-M 90mm f/2 ASPH Voigtlander 15mm F4.5 Super Wide Heliar +20 more
blue_skies
blue_skies Forum Pro • Posts: 11,882
Re: Changes to peaking in A7rIII?

holin wrote:

Lightshow wrote:

Has anyone found out what changes were made?

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1369441-REG/sony_ilce7rm2_b_alpha_a7r_iii_mirrorless.html

Body Design and Built-In Wi-Fi/Bluetooth

  • An updated Quad-VGA OLED Tru-Finder EVF is featured, and has a 3.69m-dot resolution for bright, clear viewing in high detail. Both Standard and High quality settings can be used, depending on the shooting situation, in order to optimize the viewing experience. This updated viewfinder design also affords the use of autofocus in the Focus Magnifier mode as well as improved focusing peaking to benefit manual focus operation.

http://www.glazerscamera.com/sony-a7r-iii-body

Versatile viewing
- 3.69 million dot Quad-VGA OLED Tru-FinderTM
- High quality mode
- AF in Focus Magnifier
- Improved peaking

https://www.vistek.ca/store/DigitalSLRs/420183/sony-alpha-a7riii-body.aspx

Improved Peaking

The evolved BIONZ X processing engine improves the accuracy of “peaking” display that highlights in-focus areas when focusing manually, making it easier to achieve precise focus.

Extra processing of some sort, Can any testers verify? Please.

As far as I can see, peaking is based on the partial sensor read-out (line-skipped?) done for the LCD or EVF, depending on the output's respective resolution. Reading more of the sensor for higher resolution output will of course make peaking more accurate. Reading the whole sensor would be ideal for peaking, but not for battery life.

I'd like to see a focus point, like the AF points, which shows whether it's in focus in MF mode and have selectable threshold on what's considered in focus. It could use the full resolution of the sensor for that area for maximum accuracy or the sensor contrast detect areas if possible for the purpose.

This is my understanding too - FP is applied to the EVF or LCD 'streaming' image, not the sensor or actual RAW/JPG image.

As the EVF gets higher resolution, the FP algorithms can be fine-tuned. Or better, the FP highlights will cover a narrower focal range, making it more useful for MF.

Of course, it will also become harder to see, as the number of highlighted pixels will be fewer wrt/ the current EVF/LCD resolution.

If the video output supports 4K, you could get an additional monitor display to show FP - the FP algorithms are then applied inside this display device, e.g. fealworld or ikan:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?A=details&O=&Q=&ap=y&c3api=1876%2C%7Bcreative%7D%2C%7Bkeyword%7D&gclid=Cj0KCQiAus_QBRDgARIsAIRGNGhTZPiEf6XNMpwPXMWtjMGachbDJbnu-4dd3puAG3T2bwccbBTKkL8aAim1EALw_wcB&is=REG&m=Y&sku=1197329

-- hide signature --

Cheers,
Henry

 blue_skies's gear list:blue_skies's gear list
Sony Alpha NEX-6 Sony a6000 Sony a5100 Sony a7 II Sony a7R II +37 more
MikeRan Contributing Member • Posts: 610
Re: Changes to peaking in A7rIII?

holin wrote:

As far as I can see, peaking is based on the partial sensor read-out (line-skipped?) done for the LCD or EVF, depending on the output's respective resolution. Reading more of the sensor for higher resolution output will of course make peaking more accurate. Reading the whole sensor would be ideal for peaking, but not for battery life.

of course full sensor readout isn’t possible with the frame rate required to update the finder.  For instance A9 with a possible refresh rate of 120Hz?  Presumably it’s 20FPS burst mode is as fast as the camera can pull pixel data off the sensor.  So one could imagine best case, the A9 can only read 4MP of data per frame.  However one could imagine the image doesn’t have to be read uniformly.  4 neighboring pixels can be read for instance, and contrast among those 4 pixels could indicate focus sharpness  so as you move across the sensor, groups of 4 pixels are used.  Probably only Sony engineers know how it actually works.

I'd like to see a focus point, like the AF points, which shows whether it's in focus in MF mode and have selectable threshold on what's considered in focus. It could use the full resolution of the sensor for that area for maximum accuracy or the sensor contrast detect areas if possible for the purpose.

This is a good idea.  Why can’t the PDAF sensors be activated in manual focus mode and light up when the PDAF sensors detect an in-focus image.  Should be doable, I would think.

 MikeRan's gear list:MikeRan's gear list
Sony a9 Sony FE 70-200mm F2.8 GM OSS Sony FE 100-400mm F4.5-5.6 Sony FE 24-105mm F4 Tamron 28-75mm F2.8 III +10 more
Lightshow
OP Lightshow Veteran Member • Posts: 7,226
Re: Changes to peaking in A7rIII?

MikeRan wrote:

holin wrote:

As far as I can see, peaking is based on the partial sensor read-out (line-skipped?) done for the LCD or EVF, depending on the output's respective resolution. Reading more of the sensor for higher resolution output will of course make peaking more accurate. Reading the whole sensor would be ideal for peaking, but not for battery life.

of course full sensor readout isn’t possible with the frame rate required to update the finder. For instance A9 with a possible refresh rate of 120Hz? Presumably it’s 20FPS burst mode is as fast as the camera can pull pixel data off the sensor. So one could imagine best case, the A9 can only read 4MP of data per frame. However one could imagine the image doesn’t have to be read uniformly. 4 neighboring pixels can be read for instance, and contrast among those 4 pixels could indicate focus sharpness so as you move across the sensor, groups of 4 pixels are used. Probably only Sony engineers know how it actually works.

I'd like to see a focus point, like the AF points, which shows whether it's in focus in MF mode and have selectable threshold on what's considered in focus. It could use the full resolution of the sensor for that area for maximum accuracy or the sensor contrast detect areas if possible for the purpose.

This is a good idea. Why can’t the PDAF sensors be activated in manual focus mode and light up when the PDAF sensors detect an in-focus image. Should be doable, I would think.

I've been asking for more Peaking controls since I got my NEX-7, specifically a threshold level setting, and an option similar to an emboss effect like what Ricoh uses in the GXR.

-- hide signature --

A Manual Focus Junky...
One photographers junk lens is an artists favorite tool.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lightshow-photography/
####Where's my FF NEX-7 ?????
Firmware request:
-A button map for toggling the EVF & LCD
-Still waiting for the minimum shutter speed with auto ISO for my NEX-7 and A7r. I know it will never happen.
-Customize the display screen layout, I'd love to have both Histogram and level at the same time.
-More peaking options.
-An RGB overlay on the histogram https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/602/20236258313_c604dd9522_n.jpg
-An option to return the focus assist zoom to one button press
-An option to return to how the NEX-7 handled playback, ie. center button to zoom, then you could use the control dial to zoom in and out, then center button to exit the zoom mode.

 Lightshow's gear list:Lightshow's gear list
Sony Alpha NEX-7 Sony a7R Leica Elmarit-M 24mm f/2.8 ASPH Leica APO-Summicron-M 90mm f/2 ASPH Voigtlander 15mm F4.5 Super Wide Heliar +20 more
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