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G1X III Beginning of the End for 1" Cameras?

Started Oct 24, 2017 | Discussions
digitallollygag Senior Member • Posts: 1,338
G1X III Beginning of the End for 1" Cameras?

Some speculate the G1X III means the end of the line for the G5X, as it clearly looks like the big brother to the G5X.

Right now I can think of only three brands that offer 1" sensor cameras: Canon, Panasonic, and Sony.  Nikon abandoned the 1" sensor DL cameras before even starting, apparently figuring it wasn't a profitable enough segment.

The 1/1.7" premium compact cameras gave way to the 1" sensor premium compacts fairly recently.  With the introduction of the G1X III I'm wondering if it is not only the end of the line for the G5X, but the beginning of the end for Canon 1" sensor premium compacts as a whole.  The USD $1,299 initial price of the G1X III is borderline breathtaking, but if it is a volume success, will Canon make lower-tier APS-C sensor G7X and G9X variants, or simply consolidate to just maybe two APS-C PowerShots?

Higher margin premium cameras seem to be the direction much of the industry is headed.

Your thoughts?

davesurrey Senior Member • Posts: 1,846
Re: G1X III Beginning of the End for 1" Cameras?

Even if the G1Xiii is the dead knell for any G5X replacement I doubt it will be anytime soon that cameras like the RX10 or FZ1000 can go APS-C and maintain a similar zoom range, without some clever computational tricks to overcome basic optics.

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justmeMN Forum Pro • Posts: 10,709
Re: G1X III Beginning of the End for 1" Cameras?
5

No. The G9 X II and G7 X II need 1" sensors to stay compact. In addition, they are selling well so there is no need for change.

From Canon's just released financial results:

"As for digital compact cameras, sales of high-value-added models enjoyed solid demand; supported by healthy demand for the newly launched G9 X Mark II, part of the high-image-quality PowerShot G-series lineup increasing from the same period of the previous year."

(unknown member) Senior Member • Posts: 2,153
Re: G1X III Beginning of the End for 1" Cameras?

There will be a G5X II; IMO. Budget option.

Don Vittorio
Don Vittorio Regular Member • Posts: 246
Re: G1X III Beginning of the End for 1" Cameras?
1

Im still waiting for a January announcement for the G3XII.

Hope there are some rumors soon.

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Chaplain Mark
Chaplain Mark Veteran Member • Posts: 6,539
Re: G1X III Beginning of the End for 1" Cameras?
1

I doubt it.

The 1" sensor is such a good performer, it will be a long time before its market dries up.

Meanwhile, it remains to be seen how well the G1XIII sells, and how happy its owners turn out to be with the new camera.

It is a lovely camera, but for my money, I prefer the faster lens combined with longer reach of the G5X.

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bumpydoo New Member • Posts: 14
Re: G1X III Beginning of the End for 1" Cameras?

Don Vittorio wrote:

Im still waiting for a January announcement for the G3XII.

Hope there are some rumors soon.

no kidding. an APS-C sensor would make it big enough that i'd rather have a camera where i can swap lens. 1" is a nice sweet spot, and the RX10 while its very nice has a big, big drawback: its bigger than an APS-C camera. Sure, it has 600mm... but so does the G3X mk  i while being actually portable and weather sealed and with better controls

Basically, all the G3X needs is a newer cpu / AF and maybe slightly improved lens. Everything else is already pretty good, even 2-3 years later

Yannis1976
Yannis1976 Veteran Member • Posts: 6,308
Re: G1X III Beginning of the End for 1" Cameras?

justmeMN wrote:

No. The G9 X II and G7 X II need 1" sensors to stay compact. In addition, they are selling well so there is no need for change.

From Canon's just released financial results:

"As for digital compact cameras, sales of high-value-added models enjoyed solid demand; supported by healthy demand for the newly launched G9 X Mark II, part of the high-image-quality PowerShot G-series lineup increasing from the same period of the previous year."

What about reverting to a crop version of their APSC sensor similarly to LX100?

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(unknown member) Senior Member • Posts: 2,265
Re: G1X III Beginning of the End for 1" Cameras?
1

digitallollygag wrote:

Nikon abandoned the 1" sensor DL cameras before even starting, apparently figuring it wasn't a profitable enough segment.

No. Because they could not get the processors to work and they tried to get out 3 cameras from scratch simultaneously, one having a radically wide field of view, outgunning all the carefully and cautiously developed opposition cameras at a stroke. It was not profitable after a 2 year delay after announcement to sort out problems.

It was a project doomed from the very outset.

Kung Fu
Kung Fu Veteran Member • Posts: 3,990
Re: G1X III Beginning of the End for 1" Cameras?
4

digitallollygag wrote:

Some speculate the G1X III means the end of the line for the G5X, as it clearly looks like the big brother to the G5X.

Right now I can think of only three brands that offer 1" sensor cameras: Canon, Panasonic, and Sony. Nikon abandoned the 1" sensor DL cameras before even starting, apparently figuring it wasn't a profitable enough segment.

The 1/1.7" premium compact cameras gave way to the 1" sensor premium compacts fairly recently. With the introduction of the G1X III I'm wondering if it is not only the end of the line for the G5X, but the beginning of the end for Canon 1" sensor premium compacts as a whole. The USD $1,299 initial price of the G1X III is borderline breathtaking, but if it is a volume success, will Canon make lower-tier APS-C sensor G7X and G9X variants, or simply consolidate to just maybe two APS-C PowerShots?

Higher margin premium cameras seem to be the direction much of the industry is headed.

Your thoughts?

Who is buying this camera at $1300? Noobs? They don’t care about sensor size, they care about price. Enthusiasts? They’re not dropping $1300 on a slow fixed lens camera that can’t even match the shallow depth of field of a G7X.

Other than the price, I just don’t see what’s “premium” about the G1X III.

1” cameras offer basically aps-c image quality in most situations, in a very small package, with fast lenses, and can be had for well under $1000.

(unknown member) Senior Member • Posts: 2,265
Re: G1X III Beginning of the End for 1" Cameras?
1

Kung Fu wrote:

digitallollygag wrote:

Some speculate the G1X III means the end of the line for the G5X, as it clearly looks like the big brother to the G5X.

Right now I can think of only three brands that offer 1" sensor cameras: Canon, Panasonic, and Sony. Nikon abandoned the 1" sensor DL cameras before even starting, apparently figuring it wasn't a profitable enough segment.

The 1/1.7" premium compact cameras gave way to the 1" sensor premium compacts fairly recently. With the introduction of the G1X III I'm wondering if it is not only the end of the line for the G5X, but the beginning of the end for Canon 1" sensor premium compacts as a whole. The USD $1,299 initial price of the G1X III is borderline breathtaking, but if it is a volume success, will Canon make lower-tier APS-C sensor G7X and G9X variants, or simply consolidate to just maybe two APS-C PowerShots?

Higher margin premium cameras seem to be the direction much of the industry is headed.

Your thoughts?

Who is buying this camera at $1300? Noobs? They don’t care about sensor size, they care about price. Enthusiasts? They’re not dropping $1300 on a slow fixed lens camera that can’t even match the shallow depth of field of a G7X.

Other than the price, I just don’t see what’s “premium” about the G1X III.

1” cameras offer basically aps-c image quality in most situations, in a very small package, with fast lenses, and can be had for well under $1000.

This camera really needs shunting to the EOS-M forum. Heaven help the first people to post images on this site. An aps-c lion wandering in to a pack of 1" wolves.

It is difficult to imagine why this camera means 1" will disappear but paranoia is the mother of all inventions.

Kung Fu
Kung Fu Veteran Member • Posts: 3,990
Re: G1X III Beginning of the End for 1" Cameras?

KeepCalm wrote:

Kung Fu wrote:

digitallollygag wrote:

Some speculate the G1X III means the end of the line for the G5X, as it clearly looks like the big brother to the G5X.

Right now I can think of only three brands that offer 1" sensor cameras: Canon, Panasonic, and Sony. Nikon abandoned the 1" sensor DL cameras before even starting, apparently figuring it wasn't a profitable enough segment.

The 1/1.7" premium compact cameras gave way to the 1" sensor premium compacts fairly recently. With the introduction of the G1X III I'm wondering if it is not only the end of the line for the G5X, but the beginning of the end for Canon 1" sensor premium compacts as a whole. The USD $1,299 initial price of the G1X III is borderline breathtaking, but if it is a volume success, will Canon make lower-tier APS-C sensor G7X and G9X variants, or simply consolidate to just maybe two APS-C PowerShots?

Higher margin premium cameras seem to be the direction much of the industry is headed.

Your thoughts?

Who is buying this camera at $1300? Noobs? They don’t care about sensor size, they care about price. Enthusiasts? They’re not dropping $1300 on a slow fixed lens camera that can’t even match the shallow depth of field of a G7X.

Other than the price, I just don’t see what’s “premium” about the G1X III.

1” cameras offer basically aps-c image quality in most situations, in a very small package, with fast lenses, and can be had for well under $1000.

This camera really needs shunting to the EOS-M forum. Heaven help the first people to post images on this site. An aps-c lion wandering in to a pack of 1" wolves.

It is difficult to imagine why this camera means 1" will disappear but paranoia is the mother of all inventions.

How did you read “paranoia” from my post? Or are you just upset that I’m not head over heels for whatever Canon decides to pitch over the wall?

Don’t feel bad, my current daily driver is an A95, so you can just write me off as a Luddite.

OzarkAggie Senior Member • Posts: 2,153
Re: G1X III Beginning of the End for 1" Cameras?

Lions are usually beset by jackals, though not for long.

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It's not the camera...

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(unknown member) Senior Member • Posts: 2,265
Re: G1X III Beginning of the End for 1" Cameras?

Kung Fu wrote:

KeepCalm wrote:

Kung Fu wrote:

digitallollygag wrote:

Some speculate the G1X III means the end of the line for the G5X, as it clearly looks like the big brother to the G5X.

Right now I can think of only three brands that offer 1" sensor cameras: Canon, Panasonic, and Sony. Nikon abandoned the 1" sensor DL cameras before even starting, apparently figuring it wasn't a profitable enough segment.

The 1/1.7" premium compact cameras gave way to the 1" sensor premium compacts fairly recently. With the introduction of the G1X III I'm wondering if it is not only the end of the line for the G5X, but the beginning of the end for Canon 1" sensor premium compacts as a whole. The USD $1,299 initial price of the G1X III is borderline breathtaking, but if it is a volume success, will Canon make lower-tier APS-C sensor G7X and G9X variants, or simply consolidate to just maybe two APS-C PowerShots?

Higher margin premium cameras seem to be the direction much of the industry is headed.

Your thoughts?

Who is buying this camera at $1300? Noobs? They don’t care about sensor size, they care about price. Enthusiasts? They’re not dropping $1300 on a slow fixed lens camera that can’t even match the shallow depth of field of a G7X.

Other than the price, I just don’t see what’s “premium” about the G1X III.

1” cameras offer basically aps-c image quality in most situations, in a very small package, with fast lenses, and can be had for well under $1000.

This camera really needs shunting to the EOS-M forum. Heaven help the first people to post images on this site. An aps-c lion wandering in to a pack of 1" wolves.

It is difficult to imagine why this camera means 1" will disappear but paranoia is the mother of all inventions.

How did you read “paranoia” from my post? Or are you just upset that I’m not head over heels for whatever Canon decides to pitch over the wall?

Don’t feel bad, my current daily driver is an A95, so you can just write me off as a Luddite.

I didn't. I am talking about this thread topic as part of my reply to your pretty damning comments about new owners within the topic.

All this analysis about a camera not yet sold is pretty silly. I will stick with my G1X II which has shallow depth of field but a not so good sensor and a clunky click ring. The G7X has not got much shallow depth of field really has it? just a bit more than one with even less. Swings and roundabouts all the time and the perfect camera never comes.

People can still get the G1X II if they want this type of shallow DOF camera but it will soon be no more and that is that.

(unknown member) Senior Member • Posts: 2,265
Re: G1X III Beginning of the End for 1" Cameras?
1

OzarkAggie wrote:

Lions are usually beset by jackals, though not for long.

Jackals are a less noble beast than a wolf so I was trying to be kind and I was thinking of a single lion. Calling the 1" brigade Jackals would really put the dog amongst the pigeons.

Kung Fu
Kung Fu Veteran Member • Posts: 3,990
Re: G1X III Beginning of the End for 1" Cameras?
2

KeepCalm wrote:

Kung Fu wrote:

KeepCalm wrote:

Kung Fu wrote:

digitallollygag wrote:

Some speculate the G1X III means the end of the line for the G5X, as it clearly looks like the big brother to the G5X.

Right now I can think of only three brands that offer 1" sensor cameras: Canon, Panasonic, and Sony. Nikon abandoned the 1" sensor DL cameras before even starting, apparently figuring it wasn't a profitable enough segment.

The 1/1.7" premium compact cameras gave way to the 1" sensor premium compacts fairly recently. With the introduction of the G1X III I'm wondering if it is not only the end of the line for the G5X, but the beginning of the end for Canon 1" sensor premium compacts as a whole. The USD $1,299 initial price of the G1X III is borderline breathtaking, but if it is a volume success, will Canon make lower-tier APS-C sensor G7X and G9X variants, or simply consolidate to just maybe two APS-C PowerShots?

Higher margin premium cameras seem to be the direction much of the industry is headed.

Your thoughts?

Who is buying this camera at $1300? Noobs? They don’t care about sensor size, they care about price. Enthusiasts? They’re not dropping $1300 on a slow fixed lens camera that can’t even match the shallow depth of field of a G7X.

Other than the price, I just don’t see what’s “premium” about the G1X III.

1” cameras offer basically aps-c image quality in most situations, in a very small package, with fast lenses, and can be had for well under $1000.

This camera really needs shunting to the EOS-M forum. Heaven help the first people to post images on this site. An aps-c lion wandering in to a pack of 1" wolves.

It is difficult to imagine why this camera means 1" will disappear but paranoia is the mother of all inventions.

How did you read “paranoia” from my post? Or are you just upset that I’m not head over heels for whatever Canon decides to pitch over the wall?

Don’t feel bad, my current daily driver is an A95, so you can just write me off as a Luddite.

I didn't. I am talking about this thread topic as part of my reply to your pretty damning comments about new owners within the topic.

All this analysis about a camera not yet sold is pretty silly.

Almost any non-critical human activity can be called “silly”. Talking about cameras, speculating, debating specs and functionality, is a harmless pastime. I don’t let it bother me.

(unknown member) Senior Member • Posts: 2,265
Re: G1X III Beginning of the End for 1" Cameras?

Kung Fu wrote:

KeepCalm wrote:

Kung Fu wrote:

KeepCalm wrote:

Kung Fu wrote:

digitallollygag wrote:

Some speculate the G1X III means the end of the line for the G5X, as it clearly looks like the big brother to the G5X.

Right now I can think of only three brands that offer 1" sensor cameras: Canon, Panasonic, and Sony. Nikon abandoned the 1" sensor DL cameras before even starting, apparently figuring it wasn't a profitable enough segment.

The 1/1.7" premium compact cameras gave way to the 1" sensor premium compacts fairly recently. With the introduction of the G1X III I'm wondering if it is not only the end of the line for the G5X, but the beginning of the end for Canon 1" sensor premium compacts as a whole. The USD $1,299 initial price of the G1X III is borderline breathtaking, but if it is a volume success, will Canon make lower-tier APS-C sensor G7X and G9X variants, or simply consolidate to just maybe two APS-C PowerShots?

Higher margin premium cameras seem to be the direction much of the industry is headed.

Your thoughts?

Who is buying this camera at $1300? Noobs? They don’t care about sensor size, they care about price. Enthusiasts? They’re not dropping $1300 on a slow fixed lens camera that can’t even match the shallow depth of field of a G7X.

Other than the price, I just don’t see what’s “premium” about the G1X III.

1” cameras offer basically aps-c image quality in most situations, in a very small package, with fast lenses, and can be had for well under $1000.

This camera really needs shunting to the EOS-M forum. Heaven help the first people to post images on this site. An aps-c lion wandering in to a pack of 1" wolves.

It is difficult to imagine why this camera means 1" will disappear but paranoia is the mother of all inventions.

How did you read “paranoia” from my post? Or are you just upset that I’m not head over heels for whatever Canon decides to pitch over the wall?

Don’t feel bad, my current daily driver is an A95, so you can just write me off as a Luddite.

I didn't. I am talking about this thread topic as part of my reply to your pretty damning comments about new owners within the topic.

All this analysis about a camera not yet sold is pretty silly.

Almost any non-critical human activity can be called “silly”. Talking about cameras, speculating, debating specs and functionality, is a harmless pastime. I don’t let it bother me.

Silly was in itself a silly word to use so apologies for that. I do think some premature conclusions are being made generally. Of course it will all wash away when we know what the beast is really like in the long run and it keeps us all amused.

Kung Fu
Kung Fu Veteran Member • Posts: 3,990
Re: G1X III Beginning of the End for 1" Cameras?

KeepCalm wrote:

Kung Fu wrote:

KeepCalm wrote:

Kung Fu wrote:

KeepCalm wrote:

Kung Fu wrote:

digitallollygag wrote:

Some speculate the G1X III means the end of the line for the G5X, as it clearly looks like the big brother to the G5X.

Right now I can think of only three brands that offer 1" sensor cameras: Canon, Panasonic, and Sony. Nikon abandoned the 1" sensor DL cameras before even starting, apparently figuring it wasn't a profitable enough segment.

The 1/1.7" premium compact cameras gave way to the 1" sensor premium compacts fairly recently. With the introduction of the G1X III I'm wondering if it is not only the end of the line for the G5X, but the beginning of the end for Canon 1" sensor premium compacts as a whole. The USD $1,299 initial price of the G1X III is borderline breathtaking, but if it is a volume success, will Canon make lower-tier APS-C sensor G7X and G9X variants, or simply consolidate to just maybe two APS-C PowerShots?

Higher margin premium cameras seem to be the direction much of the industry is headed.

Your thoughts?

Who is buying this camera at $1300? Noobs? They don’t care about sensor size, they care about price. Enthusiasts? They’re not dropping $1300 on a slow fixed lens camera that can’t even match the shallow depth of field of a G7X.

Other than the price, I just don’t see what’s “premium” about the G1X III.

1” cameras offer basically aps-c image quality in most situations, in a very small package, with fast lenses, and can be had for well under $1000.

This camera really needs shunting to the EOS-M forum. Heaven help the first people to post images on this site. An aps-c lion wandering in to a pack of 1" wolves.

It is difficult to imagine why this camera means 1" will disappear but paranoia is the mother of all inventions.

How did you read “paranoia” from my post? Or are you just upset that I’m not head over heels for whatever Canon decides to pitch over the wall?

Don’t feel bad, my current daily driver is an A95, so you can just write me off as a Luddite.

I didn't. I am talking about this thread topic as part of my reply to your pretty damning comments about new owners within the topic.

All this analysis about a camera not yet sold is pretty silly.

Almost any non-critical human activity can be called “silly”. Talking about cameras, speculating, debating specs and functionality, is a harmless pastime. I don’t let it bother me.

Silly was in itself a silly word to use so apologies for that. I do think some premature conclusions are being made generally. Of course it will all wash away when we know what the beast is really like in the long run and it keeps us all amused.

It’s funny, whenever I research my next “vintage” digital camera purchase, I search the forum for posts containing that model name, and there are usually 15 or more pages of threads about it to wade through, even before the release date. 🙂

0lf
0lf Senior Member • Posts: 1,284
Re: G1X III Beginning of the End for 1" Cameras?
1

digitallollygag wrote:

Some speculate the G1X III means the end of the line for the G5X, as it clearly looks like the big brother to the G5X.

Right now I can think of only three brands that offer 1" sensor cameras: Canon, Panasonic, and Sony. Nikon abandoned the 1" sensor DL cameras before even starting, apparently figuring it wasn't a profitable enough segment.

The 1/1.7" premium compact cameras gave way to the 1" sensor premium compacts fairly recently. With the introduction of the G1X III I'm wondering if it is not only the end of the line for the G5X, but the beginning of the end for Canon 1" sensor premium compacts as a whole. The USD $1,299 initial price of the G1X III is borderline breathtaking, but if it is a volume success, will Canon make lower-tier APS-C sensor G7X and G9X variants, or simply consolidate to just maybe two APS-C PowerShots?

Higher margin premium cameras seem to be the direction much of the industry is headed.

Your thoughts?

My thoughts:

1"sensored cameras have replaced 1/1.7" ones because they offer significative improvements and close to no drawbacks.

  • Pocketable (s120, xq2 -> g9x, RX100-1) : no compromises in size, very similar reach (at much, the G9x has less than 9% lost from s120 based on definition only, but I guess less in practice), much better IQ in all light conditions, better DoF management. The only drawback is the 24mm WA FoV.
  • Compact (LX7 -> G7x, LX10, RX100-3+) : similar size, similar or greater reach, much better IQ (DR, noise, definition) in all light conditions , better DoF management. No drawbacks.
  • Large compact (G16 -> G5x) : similar size, similar reach, much better IQ in all light conditions , better DoF management, lots of direct control, large EVF instead of tiny and not TTL OVF.
  • Long zoom (stylus 1 -> TZ100) : similar reach, better IQ, but smaller with narrow aperture. It is where there is the more difference, but the concepts are a bit different here.

On the contrary, for the moment, APSc compact have significant limitations and pretty small improvements compared to 1" cameras :

  • the G1x3 makes significant trade off in aperture and reach to accommodate for the APSc sensor which brings only limited improvements in pure IQ in good light.
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TORN Senior Member • Posts: 1,607
Really, an 80D in a super small box?
2

Kung Fu wrote:

Who is buying this camera at $1300? Noobs? They don’t care about sensor size, they care about price. Enthusiasts? They’re not dropping $1300 on a slow fixed lens camera that can’t even match the shallow depth of field of a G7X.

Other than the price, I just don’t see what’s “premium” about the G1X III.

1” cameras offer basically aps-c image quality in most situations, in a very small package, with fast lenses, and can be had for well under $1000.

1'' sensors provide 1'' image quality.

APS-C sensors provide APS-C image quality.

Premium about the G1X III is build, handling, sensor, size, speed, features and image quality. Just by looking at it you can see that it is beyond entry level in make and operation.

Your question is a bit like asking why the 80D is worth $1000. A G1X III is basically an 80D with a kit lens added and everything weather sealed. A feature that is hard to come by below $1000 anyway.

Longer reach or faster lens would have increased the size of this camera by quite a margin which would nullify the USP (unique selling point) of this camera: 80D power and quality in a compact form. In that case everybody would have asked: hey if it is not even smaller why not just buy a mirrorless instead?

Pretty sure this is what Canon was thinking when they designed the G1XIII and in a way they will surely find a good bunch of buyers. Well, even I would like to grab a full featured quality item for a change instead of a tiny camera which fits barely in my hands and operates like an uncomfortable beginner cam.

If you prefer anything else there are great options out there: Panasonic, Canon, Sony or a Fuji X100 if you like. You want it, they have it.

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