My first prints from my GH5 are a disaster! Where am I going wrong?

Where in the UK do you live? If you're still struggling after using Internet resources I'd be happy to meet up if we're not too far away (I'm in the Midlands). I'm no expert, but I print my own shots up to A3 and use lab services from time to time, including making Photobooks. I've always been very pleased with the results. I only ever shoot raw and use LR as my software.

Mark9473 wrote:

You're confusing megabytes and megapixels. Do not downsize your images.

Agree do not downsize give them all data. My experience some years ago with CEWE was that they gave you an option optimize or leave as it is. Not sure if this is still true however I will never let lab to optimize anything (but downsizing...)

This is something I learned the hard way - I will try to explain it simply for you.

Assuming youve made all the adjustments you want (including pre export sharpening) - , After you have arranged all the photos into the photobook - see if you can find the exact print dimensions of each image (many software allow you to see the properties of each image). Then go back into lightroom and re-export every image at the exact dimensions that are in the photo book. Sharpen the image also during scaling/export (light room sharpen for print normal or high) or sharpen post export using another software. This is time consuming yes but it ensure your images are not altered by the photobook software and maintains the sharpness you want.

Do not trust any photobook software to manage your images except to arrange them on the page. Do not scale or make any manipulations to the image within the photobook software - this is very bad (except during the initial arrangement stage). If you need to make adjustments - do it again in lightroom with the original image and re-export with the right dimensions again.

e.g. if you realise you need to crop a photo in the book, go back to lightroom and do the crop with the full res image and re-export again.

Yes this is time consuming but this ensures your images look exactly the way you wanted them to.

Also check what DPI the printer uses. Its important you match the DPI when exporting your images. For print this is usually 300dpi but sometimes higher.

Are you sure the printing service does not apply some automatic corrections to your images? Not hard to imagine they automatically brighten up the images, boost saturation and do some extra sharpening so that the books are appealing to mass market consumer that is used to seeing flashy colourful images on facebook or Instagram.

While I would go easier on sharpening for the images you posted, I don't think they are as overcooked as to end up disastrous when printed.

Have you tried making individual prints for any of those images?

C Sean wrote:

I'm very new when it comes to developing my raw files to JPEG. It's only in the last year or so I been shooting less JPEG and spending more time developing raw files. While I wouldn't call myself a newbie but in reality I'm more in the experimenting stage and gaining confident. More time I spend in Lightroom, better the results will become.

In the last twelve months I also have an interest in printing. I would rather have my best holiday photos in books and assessable rather than locked away on a hard drive. I had my photos from the trips to Botswana and Kenya printed into three books and the results were a mix bag. The pictures lacked definition and sharpness. The later attempts I increased the contrast and sharpness and the results weren't improved that much. The pictures were acceptable and because it wildlife shots, they weren't that bad but they weren't clean. They were graining, lack sharpness and definition.

What I was doing was going to Lightroom and exporting the pictures to be printed on shiny thick paper. I then use the Jessops Photo program to create book using the exported pictures.

A few weeks ago I went to Goodwood Revival which is a car show with vintage car racing. I used the GH5 for most of my shots and it has a 20-megapixel sensor and no AA filter. So the pictures from the camera will be sharper than say the GH4. My shots from the GH5 at a zoo are sharper than my pictures I took with the GH4 in Africa.

I had a good day at Goodwood Revival and I decided to get my pictures printed in a book. This time around I used less sharpness so I wouldn't have so much noise, not have as much contrast and use noise reduction to clean the image. The book came today and they're no different to my African ones. The pictures are covered in noise, there's no sharpness to them and there is no definition.

So logically I'm either doing something wrong or my Lightroom skills are terrible. However, during Goodwood, I used a custom setting not realising the custom setting is JPEG only not JPEG + RAW. Some of the pictures I used for the book are in camera JPEG and they have the same problems as the developed raw files converted to JPEG.

I am planning to go to a Jessops store and bring one of my photo books with me to find out where I'm going wrong. My thoughts are even with a Sony A7r mkII and a super sharp prime I would get me the same results. The other thoughts are I'm throwing away money and I probably better off using an one inch sensor camera and use a cheap printer. The pictures in the book look like it was taken with an old compact camera. My other thoughts that the pictures are being blown up. So maybe I need to put in the exact resolution in the export stage but even on the Jessops program the pictures don't look dull.

Any thoughts?

What size photo books are these? What size are you exporting the JPGs? I've only printed one photo book, and that was from photos taken in 2011 with an E-410 (10Mp Four Thirds sensor), and a Stylus 5010 (14Mp 1/2.7" sensor), and I was very pleased with them. The cover of the book uses a photo from the little Stylus taken at sunset, and even at 12x12" it looks great.

I suggest posting a few samples of the JPGs you used, and we can determine if the problem is the file, or the printing.

C Sean wrote:

Astrotripper wrote:

Are you sure the printing service does not apply some automatic corrections to your images? Not hard to imagine they automatically brighten up the images, boost saturation and do some extra sharpening so that the books are appealing to mass market consumer that is used to seeing flashy colourful images on facebook or Instagram.

While I would go easier on sharpening for the images you posted, I don't think they are as overcooked as to end up disastrous when printed.

Have you tried making individual prints for any of those images?

I been doing some research into this and apparently CEWE does automatic adjustments. So this include additional sharpness, contrast and other additions. There is an option to turn this feature off but I need a screen calibrator before I give printing another go.

The other thing is I learned about soft proofing and I will be comparing my converted raw files and the photos in the book. Without my screen calibrated it might be a waste of time but I want to see if how much of the automatic adjustment alter the pictures.

If they are making auto adjustments to  files I would go to another vendor.

I want my images to look the way I processed them. I am pushing the limits of the DR on the image - i dont need the "printer guy" blowing the highlights or over saturating, increasing contrast etc.

Noise should not be much of a issue when printing and will look better than screen do not esize to smaller resoloution and turn your brightness of your screen down by about 50% always print as high dpi as possible .

If you use a calibrated monitor it will help match screen to print i use a epson r2000 and benq swpt2700 photographic monitor calibrated with eye one but i have my monitor with two programmes one for what my images look like on screen and one with brightness tuned down so i know it looks like when i print and normally get great results even letting the printer manage the print normally only goes wrong when i try to profile .proof papers etc.

C Sean wrote:

Any thoughts?

Just a single thought:

If you do not have a photo printer, buy one - it is not expensive, not by any measures. Having printer ready, take a decent shot at good light (better .JEPG) and examine it.

If shot is well focused, do not do any PP and print it as is. I'm positive you'll be delighted by the image quality from the camera you have.

Now, if I'm correct than the problem is your PP skills. What looks nice and punchy on the screen, prints out badly.

I understood the OP wants a printed photobook, not loose pictures.

Mark9473 wrote:

I understood the OP wants a printed photobook, not loose pictures.

I understood he wants to know why...

C Sean wrote:

I'm very new when it comes to developing my raw files to JPEG. It's only in the last year or so I been shooting less JPEG and spending more time developing raw files. While I wouldn't call myself a newbie but in reality I'm more in the experimenting stage and gaining confident. More time I spend in Lightroom, better the results will become.

In the last twelve months I also have an interest in printing. I would rather have my best holiday photos in books and assessable rather than locked away on a hard drive. I had my photos from the trips to Botswana and Kenya printed into three books and the results were a mix bag. The pictures lacked definition and sharpness. The later attempts I increased the contrast and sharpness and the results weren't improved that much. The pictures were acceptable and because it wildlife shots, they weren't that bad but they weren't clean. They were graining, lack sharpness and definition.

What I was doing was going to Lightroom and exporting the pictures to be printed on shiny thick paper. I then use the Jessops Photo program to create book using the exported pictures.

A few weeks ago I went to Goodwood Revival which is a car show with vintage car racing. I used the GH5 for most of my shots and it has a 20-megapixel sensor and no AA filter. So the pictures from the camera will be sharper than say the GH4. My shots from the GH5 at a zoo are sharper than my pictures I took with the GH4 in Africa.

I had a good day at Goodwood Revival and I decided to get my pictures printed in a book. This time around I used less sharpness so I wouldn't have so much noise, not have as much contrast and use noise reduction to clean the image. The book came today and they're no different to my African ones. The pictures are covered in noise, there's no sharpness to them and there is no definition.

So logically I'm either doing something wrong or my Lightroom skills are terrible. However, during Goodwood, I used a custom setting not realising the custom setting is JPEG only not JPEG + RAW. Some of the pictures I used for the book are in camera JPEG and they have the same problems as the developed raw files converted to JPEG.

I am planning to go to a Jessops store and bring one of my photo books with me to find out where I'm going wrong. My thoughts are even with a Sony A7r mkII and a super sharp prime I would get me the same results. The other thoughts are I'm throwing away money and I probably better off using an one inch sensor camera and use a cheap printer. The pictures in the book look like it was taken with an old compact camera. My other thoughts that the pictures are being blown up. So maybe I need to put in the exact resolution in the export stage but even on the Jessops program the pictures don't look dull.

Any thoughts?

Here's a good tutorial about 3-stage sharpening and how to sharpen an image for a particular print size. It makes all the difference.

Guide to Image Sharpening

Sounds to me like you also need to spend some time learning how to use Lightroom's noise reduction more effectively.

What ISO setting did you use for these images?