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You know, I have to really give it to Canon...

Started Sep 19, 2017 | Discussions
Ben Herrmann
Ben Herrmann Forum Pro • Posts: 21,163
You know, I have to really give it to Canon...
5

...meaning, in a nice way!

As a matter of lead-in information, I have the pleasure of using a variety of cameras from various brands.  I don't shoot with DSLR's anymore (although I still have some), and my focus has been solely on Mirrorless models and enthusiast cameras.

Having said that, I've been privy to lots of different camera styles, philosophies, and operational characteristics.  And needless to say, I have to remark that just about all brands are capable of superb IQ.  You won't catch me being solely a one-brand only fanboy.

And this now brings me to Canon.  My current Canon participation consists of a series of EOS-M cameras and lenses, along with some older enthusiast models - mainly the G12 and SX50HS.  I used to shoot quite extensively with various Canon DSLR's, but the mirrorless world had won me over with regards to size and weight, so I sold all of those.

With the exception of Canon, Panasonic and Sony, all of the other camera makers - that is, Fuji, Nikon, Olympus, and Pentax - have all given up researching and producing advanced enthusiast models.  And that's a shame really as their histories have included some absolutely wonderful camera models (known as prosumer models back in the day).

Canon, on the other hand, has maintained a variety of focus points - and the enthusiast market is one of them.  When I look at all that Canon is producing across the board, I have to tip my hat to them.  I don't yet have any of the 1" sensored Powershot models only because I have so much gear now that adding anything else would be overkill.  But I have to tell you that if the G1X III rumor is real, I'll be in the front of the line to get one.  And if they update the G3X with something faster and better, I'll be there also.

In the meanwhile, I'll still using the likes of the older Fuji X10, X20, X30, XF1, X-S1,  Olympus XZ1, Panasonica LX7, Nikon P700, P330, and Canon G12 + SX50HS because of their excellent IQ and performance parameters..  But my admiration remains strong for what Canon continues to do on the enthusiast front.  They're not letting up and although not everyone will be happy with all of their releases (such is life), they are willing to continue R&D on this line of product.

So as one who uses a variety of different brand gear, it's really nice to see Canon continue doing what they do best - and that is making sure the Powershot line of cameras remains top notch.  And others have noticed also.  I know quite a few folks who in previous years would have never considered Canon (because they've been using enthusiast models from other brands) but are now using Canon enthusiast cameras - or getting ready to.

That says alot...

-- hide signature --

Sincerely,

Bernd ("Ben") Herrmann
Fuquay Varina, North Carolina USA

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camguyed Regular Member • Posts: 403
Re: You know, I have to really give it to Canon...

I have to agree. I have been shooting with Nikon SLRs & DSLRs since 1974 and I am not about to change but I have been using Canon point'n'shoots since the Power Shot S400. I picked up a refurbed Canon G5X over the summer and couldn't be happier! It's nice to have a viewfinder on a point'n'shoot again.

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sueanne
sueanne Forum Pro • Posts: 21,078
Re: You know, I have to really give it to Canon...
2

Of all my cameras, Canons are my favorite.

Ben Herrmann wrote:

...meaning, in a nice way!

As a matter of lead-in information, I have the pleasure of using a variety of cameras from various brands. I don't shoot with DSLR's anymore (although I still have some), and my focus has been solely on Mirrorless models and enthusiast cameras.

Having said that, I've been privy to lots of different camera styles, philosophies, and operational characteristics. And needless to say, I have to remark that just about all brands are capable of superb IQ. You won't catch me being solely a one-brand only fanboy.

And this now brings me to Canon. My current Canon participation consists of a series of EOS-M cameras and lenses, along with some older enthusiast models - mainly the G12 and SX50HS. I used to shoot quite extensively with various Canon DSLR's, but the mirrorless world had won me over with regards to size and weight, so I sold all of those.

With the exception of Canon, Panasonic and Sony, all of the other camera makers - that is, Fuji, Nikon, Olympus, and Pentax - have all given up researching and producing advanced enthusiast models. And that's a shame really as their histories have included some absolutely wonderful camera models (known as prosumer models back in the day).

Canon, on the other hand, has maintained a variety of focus points - and the enthusiast market is one of them. When I look at all that Canon is producing across the board, I have to tip my hat to them. I don't yet have any of the 1" sensored Powershot models only because I have so much gear now that adding anything else would be overkill. But I have to tell you that if the G1X III rumor is real, I'll be in the front of the line to get one. And if they update the G3X with something faster and better, I'll be there also.

In the meanwhile, I'll still using the likes of the older Fuji X10, X20, X30, XF1, X-S1, Olympus XZ1, Panasonica LX7, Nikon P700, P330, and Canon G12 + SX50HS because of their excellent IQ and performance parameters.. But my admiration remains strong for what Canon continues to do on the enthusiast front. They're not letting up and although not everyone will be happy with all of their releases (such is life), they are willing to continue R&D on this line of product.

So as one who uses a variety of different brand gear, it's really nice to see Canon continue doing what they do best - and that is making sure the Powershot line of cameras remains top notch. And others have noticed also. I know quite a few folks who in previous years would have never considered Canon (because they've been using enthusiast models from other brands) but are now using Canon enthusiast cameras - or getting ready to.

That says alot...

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MyM6II Senior Member • Posts: 2,424
Re: You know, I have to really give it to Canon...
1

sueanne wrote:

Of all my cameras, Canons are my favorite.

Of all canons, cameras are my favorite. 😉😂

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rpm40
rpm40 Senior Member • Posts: 2,411
Re: You know, I have to really give it to Canon...
1

You're right. I have always been a fan of both Olympus and Fuji, with their classic styling, good manual controls and nice jpegs, but both have been pretty quiet on the enthusiast front.

Fuji has their x100 and x70 which are nice, but I think they are too set in their ways regarding their sensors, and the old 2/3" from their compacts doesn't excite now that the competition is cramming 1" sensors into everything.

Olympus has stagnated, with no real follow up to their nice XZ-2 and Stylus 1, and I am guessing they are facing a similar problem- the smaller sensors they are used to using are out of favor, and getting a foot in the door to get 1" sensors is a big undertaking considering the lower number of cameras they sell. I have been hoping for a long time that they would put an m4/3 sized sensor in some enthusiast compacts, but to no avail. I bet Olympus could come up with a beautiful competitor to the Panasonic LX100, and I have always thought a compact digital Trip would be very cool, with an m4/3 sensor and 35mm lens.

I think what we are seeing right now in the enthusiast space is that the brands who are able to innovate are those that have the resources and access to modern sensors in the popular sizes. The one brand that skews my theory, though, is Nikon- they have the means, and they have plenty of experience with 1". Now that they killed off Nikon 1, I have no idea why they decided their 1" enthusiast compact line was dead before it hit the shelves.

panamforeman
panamforeman Senior Member • Posts: 1,296
Re: You know, I have to really give it to Canon...

camguyed wrote:

I have to agree. I have been shooting with Nikon SLRs & DSLRs since 1974 and I am not about to change but I have been using Canon point'n'shoots since the Power Shot S400. I picked up a refurbed Canon G5X over the summer and couldn't be happier! It's nice to have a viewfinder on a point'n'shoot again.

Corvette?  80s?

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Canon PowerShot S120 Panasonic ZS100 Canon Pixma Pro9000
Jim Senior Member • Posts: 2,666
Re: You know, I have to really give it to Canon...

panamforeman wrote:

camguyed wrote:

I have to agree. I have been shooting with Nikon SLRs & DSLRs since 1974 and I am not about to change but I have been using Canon point'n'shoots since the Power Shot S400. I picked up a refurbed Canon G5X over the summer and couldn't be happier! It's nice to have a viewfinder on a point'n'shoot again.

Corvette? 80s?

I think it's a 1963-1967 Corvette.

Jim

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Jon_T
Jon_T Veteran Member • Posts: 6,393
Re: You know, I have to really give it to Canon...

Jim wrote:

panamforeman wrote:

camguyed wrote:

I have to agree. I have been shooting with Nikon SLRs & DSLRs since 1974 and I am not about to change but I have been using Canon point'n'shoots since the Power Shot S400. I picked up a refurbed Canon G5X over the summer and couldn't be happier! It's nice to have a viewfinder on a point'n'shoot again.

Corvette? 80s?

I think it's a 1963-1967 Corvette.

Agree.

1968 Chevy change the body style.

Image from Google Search

Cheers,
Jon

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camguyed Regular Member • Posts: 403
Re: You know, I have to really give it to Canon...

panamforeman wrote:

camguyed wrote:

I have to agree. I have been shooting with Nikon SLRs & DSLRs since 1974 and I am not about to change but I have been using Canon point'n'shoots since the Power Shot S400. I picked up a refurbed Canon G5X over the summer and couldn't be happier! It's nice to have a viewfinder on a point'n'shoot again.

Corvette? 80s?

I don't remember but here are some more that I listed on another thread:

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/60103444

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/60109878

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Kung Fu
Kung Fu Veteran Member • Posts: 3,990
Re: You know, I have to really give it to Canon...

rpm40 wrote:

You're right. I have always been a fan of both Olympus and Fuji, with their classic styling, good manual controls and nice jpegs, but both have been pretty quiet on the enthusiast front.

Fuji has their x100 and x70 which are nice, but I think they are too set in their ways regarding their sensors, and the old 2/3" from their compacts doesn't excite now that the competition is cramming 1" sensors into everything.

I admit, I don’t understand the popularity of Fuji cameras. They’re expensive, have AF from 10 years ago, cheap fixed non-touch LCD screens, and feel like hollow plastic. The silly viewfinders aren’t even 100% coverage.

Olympus has stagnated, with no real follow up to their nice XZ-2 and Stylus 1, and I am guessing they are facing a similar problem- the smaller sensors they are used to using are out of favor, and getting a foot in the door to get 1" sensors is a big undertaking considering the lower number of cameras they sell. I have been hoping for a long time that they would put an m4/3 sized sensor in some enthusiast compacts, but to no avail. I bet Olympus could come up with a beautiful competitor to the Panasonic LX100, and I have always thought a compact digital Trip would be very cool, with an m4/3 sensor and 35mm lens.

Olympus has bet all their chips on m4/3, and that’s it. It may be simple economics. But they haven’t made a camera that’s excited me since 2005.

I think what we are seeing right now in the enthusiast space is that the brands who are able to innovate are those that have the resources and access to modern sensors in the popular sizes. The one brand that skews my theory, though, is Nikon- they have the means, and they have plenty of experience with 1". Now that they killed off Nikon 1, I have no idea why they decided their 1" enthusiast compact line was dead before it hit the shelves.

Bad forecasting, poor QC, a declining dslr market, still behind Canon in LiveView and video. Nikon’s list of problems is long.

Ben Herrmann
OP Ben Herrmann Forum Pro • Posts: 21,163
Hmnnnnn....
1

Don't know which Fuji cameras you are referring to with regards to this "hollow plastic" feel  As you must know, "feel" (perception of quality) can be a very subjective scenario.  One person may balk about the cheap "feel" of a particular camera, yet the next person may rave about it - now go figure.  Fuji has an allure to its users - something I wouldn't have understood until I got on the Fuji bandwagon awhile back - that keeps them coming back (folks do have choices, y'know).  I'm totally enthralled with their product line - yet I can thoroughly enjoy shooting with Canon, Panasonic, Olympus, Samsung, etc.

With regards to M43 cameras, they're going quite strong and their forums web-wide are quite active.  I first bought into the initial 4/3 movement with the release of the very first Olympus E-1 (5 MP's) back in 2004, a solid brick of a camera that I still use today because of that gorgeous Kodak manufactured sensor (ohhhh those colors).  When M43 came out, the transition was quite easy because the same size sensor was still being used albeit without the mirror.  So Olympus and Panasonic set the tone for mirrorless.  Of course, when you don't use their products, it becomes easy to wonder, "W-T-F" is so endearing about that strange format?"  And as you saw with the introduction of the 1" sensors for enthusiast models, the IQ levels captured by those small (yet larger of what was standard previously) chips were quite eye opening.  So the 4/3 sensor still has a wealth of options available. 

The thing is that for those of us who use a variety of systems (or have in the past), we tend to appreciate what each brand brings to the table.   And you typically won't find us being a one-brand fanboy.  Suffice it to say that now-a-days, just about all brands are capable of producing photographic instruments that produce fantastic IQ.  It's then up to the user to coax the best results we can from their cameras.

-- hide signature --

Sincerely,
Bernd ("Ben") Herrmann
Fuquay Varina, North Carolina USA

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Kung Fu
Kung Fu Veteran Member • Posts: 3,990
Re: Hmnnnnn....

Ben Herrmann wrote:

Don't know which Fuji cameras you are referring to with regards to this "hollow plastic" feel

X100, X20, X30. I went to B&H several times with the intention of buying one for street photography, and couldn’t get past that feeling. I’m not the first person to say that.

To each their own, obviously others disagree with me on that.

As you must know, "feel" (perception of quality) can be a very subjective scenario. One person may balk about the cheap "feel" of a particular camera, yet the next person may rave about it - now go figure. Fuji has an allure to its users - something I wouldn't have understood until I got on the Fuji bandwagon awhile back - that keeps them coming back (folks do have choices, y'know). I'm totally enthralled with their product line - yet I can thoroughly enjoy shooting with Canon, Panasonic, Olympus, Samsung, etc.

With regards to M43 cameras, they're going quite strong and their forums web-wide are quite active. I first bought into the initial 4/3 movement with the release of the very first Olympus E-1 (5 MP's) back in 2004, a solid brick of a camera that I still use today because of that gorgeous Kodak manufactured sensor (ohhhh those colors). When M43 came out, the transition was quite easy because the same size sensor was still being used albeit without the mirror. So Olympus and Panasonic set the tone for mirrorless. Of course, when you don't use their products, it becomes easy to wonder, "W-T-F" is so endearing about that strange format?"

I’ve owned several m4/3 cameras, both Olympus and Panasonic, over the years.

And as you saw with the introduction of the 1" sensors for enthusiast models, the IQ levels captured by those small (yet larger of what was standard previously) chips were quite eye opening.

Yes, good enough for me to sell my dslr and m4/3 cameras. The small increase in IQ and low light ability wasn’t worth the cost, size, and weight to me.

So the 4/3 sensor still has a wealth of options available.

The thing is that for those of us who use a variety of systems (or have in the past), we tend to appreciate what each brand brings to the table. And you typically won't find us being a one-brand fanboy. Suffice it to say that now-a-days, just about all brands are capable of producing photographic instruments that produce fantastic IQ. It's then up to the user to coax the best results we can from their cameras.

No fanboy here, I’m sure you weren’t referring to me. 😉

(unknown member) Senior Member • Posts: 2,265
Re: You know, I have to really give it to Canon...

rpm40 wrote:

I have no idea why they decided their 1" enthusiast compact line was dead before it hit the shelves.

Probably because projected sales revenue minus money spent on research and extended development was looking to be a big negative. Plus they decided to storm in to the arena all guns blazing with a broad range of 3 high performance models, one having an exceptionally wide angle zoom lens, no working up of the range gradually like the rest. Plus they probably just could not get the technology sorted within the means available to them especially after processor design problems meant a years extension of the project. Just because you want to do something does not mean you can within the available budget.

I think it was a bit of a do or die project in that they had to get it all going at once from scratch being late in the market and luck and fortune and reality was against them.

ShatteredSky
ShatteredSky Senior Member • Posts: 2,065
Re: You know, I have to really give it to Canon...

Ben Herrmann wrote:

With the exception of Canon, Panasonic and Sony, all of the other camera makers - that is, Fuji, Nikon, Olympus, and Pentax - have all given up researching and producing advanced enthusiast models.

Yes, it is a shame that there was no XZ-3 ... the XZ-2 was / is still very nice.

But I have to tell you that if the G1X III rumor is real, I'll be in the front of the line to get one. And if they update the G3X with something faster and better, I'll be there also.

Yeah, I will be curious how it will compare to the LX100 (not just IQ-wise, but also handling) and what the LX200 will bring to the table. If Canon is quick with a housing and the autofocus betters the LX100, it will replace the latter for my underwater shooting. The only thing that might hamper that is probably a worse macro-modus than the LX100 and certainly the XZ-2.

Well, let's wait and see, interesting times ...

Regards

-- hide signature --

"Blue for the shattered sky"

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GeraldW Veteran Member • Posts: 8,872
Re: You know, I have to really give it to Canon...

You really need to try the G7X II.  The DIGIC 7 processor is a marvelous upgrade from DIGIC 6.  The G7X II easily replaced both my S90 and G15; although I did keep the S90.

-- hide signature --

Jerry

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GeraldW Veteran Member • Posts: 8,872
Re: You know, I have to really give it to Canon...

Some while back, it was storied about that Nikon was farming out their compact cameras to a third party house.  Supposedly that's why the P7000, etc. were quite slow responding.  If Nikon tried this with the 1" sensor fixed lens cameras, it could easily have overwhelmed their sub-contractor.

I have no knowledge that this was the case for the cameras they cancelled; but it does fit, as Nikon has been plenty fast with their in-house designed DSLR's, and the Nikon 1 series had fast AF with 1" sensors.

-- hide signature --

Jerry

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Kung Fu
Kung Fu Veteran Member • Posts: 3,990
Re: You know, I have to really give it to Canon...

GeraldW wrote:

Some while back, it was storied about that Nikon was farming out their compact cameras to a third party house. Supposedly that's why the P7000, etc. were quite slow responding. If Nikon tried this with the 1" sensor fixed lens cameras, it could easily have overwhelmed their sub-contractor.

I have no knowledge that this was the case for the cameras they cancelled; but it does fit, as Nikon has been plenty fast with their in-house designed DSLR's, and the Nikon 1 series had fast AF with 1" sensors.

Yes, the P7700 was the slowest camera I have ever owned, from any era.

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