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Scratches inside EF 85 f1.2L II that was never opened. $1800 to repair!

Started Aug 9, 2017 | Discussions
rksilp New Member • Posts: 4
Scratches inside EF 85 f1.2L II that was never opened. $1800 to repair!

The lens was purchased new from B&H and barely used (due to weight). I only used it on special occasions when f1.2-2.0 would be useful since I already have 70-200 2.8L IS II. I noticed during cleaning that the lens showed faint swirl marks "inside". It was not on front or rear element. The focusing seemed normal to me.

So, I decided to send it to Newport New service center for evaluation. They quoted the total cost to repair for around $1800 saying that G2 lens, G3 lens and USM focus assembly needed to be replaced! The most expensive part is the USM focus assembly (~$1100) So, it wasn't worth repairing it since for the same amount of money I can get a brand new one or a very good used one with warranty from reputable sellers for a lot cheaper than $1800.

I never took this lens to a beach or dusty areas. I used it indoor most of the time. What could possibly causes the fine scratches inside the lens elements (and might damage the focus assembly)?

Canon EF 85mm F1.2L II USM
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Tazz93
Tazz93 Veteran Member • Posts: 3,484
Re: Scratches inside EF 85 f1.2L II that was never opened. $1800 to repair!

"What could possibly causes the fine scratches inside the lens elements (and might damage the focus assembly)?"

Sounds like previous service/assembly is to blame...but good luck proving that. Buying new is not a guarantee its never touched/used these days. Errors and plain out deceit can explain it.

When you got it, did you check it out well? If so, I can't think of a way the inner elements can get scratched without popping the seal.

 Tazz93's gear list:Tazz93's gear list
Canon EOS-1D Mark II N Canon EOS 5DS Canon EOS R5 Canon Extender EF 2x II Canon EF 70-200mm F2.8L IS II USM +11 more
OP rksilp New Member • Posts: 4
Re: Scratches inside EF 85 f1.2L II that was never opened. $1800 to repair!

I didn't see it when I first got it and also haven't noticed until 2 weeks ago. I inspected all the screws on the lens body and none of them showed sign of coming in contact with screw driver or any tool.

I talked to a customer service at service center and she cannot explain why the scratches showed up inside. (It took me a while to get her to understand that the scratches are not on the external surfaces of front or rear elements since she kept on hinting that they were from my cleaning or putting the caps on the lens). I thought they were going to offer me an option to exchange it for a refurbished unit but it never come up in the repair estimate or phone conversation.

Before I got the last estimate, I was fine with having 1 or 2 glass elements replaced which would bring total cost to about $600.  But adding that USM focus assembly (again, I did NOT notice any focus issue on recently taken photos) took it above my repair cost decision point.

JerryriggedTECH
JerryriggedTECH Senior Member • Posts: 1,098
Re: Scratches inside EF 85 f1.2L II that was never opened. $1800 to repair!

rksilp wrote:

The lens was purchased new from B&H and barely used (due to weight). I only used it on special occasions when f1.2-2.0 would be useful since I already have 70-200 2.8L IS II. I noticed during cleaning that the lens showed faint swirl marks "inside". It was not on front or rear element. The focusing seemed normal to me.

So, I decided to send it to Newport New service center for evaluation. They quoted the total cost to repair for around $1800 saying that G2 lens, G3 lens and USM focus assembly needed to be replaced! The most expensive part is the USM focus assembly (~$1100) So, it wasn't worth repairing it since for the same amount of money I can get a brand new one or a very good used one with warranty from reputable sellers for a lot cheaper than $1800.

I never took this lens to a beach or dusty areas. I used it indoor most of the time. What could possibly causes the fine scratches inside the lens elements (and might damage the focus assembly)?

How long ago did you purchase?  Is it not still under warranty?

 JerryriggedTECH's gear list:JerryriggedTECH's gear list
Canon EOS 5D Mark IV Canon EOS R Canon EF 100mm F2.8L Macro IS USM Canon EF 70-200mm F2.8L IS II USM Canon EF 24-70mm F2.8L II USM +5 more
Tazz93
Tazz93 Veteran Member • Posts: 3,484
Re: Scratches inside EF 85 f1.2L II that was never opened. $1800 to repair!

There are two elements the fit very close in most lenses, if those are the two that need replacing and the USM assembly drives one of the two, it's possible physical damage could have done that. Maybe something like a drop?  That is a stretch, but I now can see a possibility.

Anyway... sorry to hear about the incident. One thing to note, if it was due to physical damage, some home/rental policies cover that type of thing (accidental damage to cameras). However, you'll have to decide if it's worth filing a claim, IF they cover it, premiums will be at risk.

 Tazz93's gear list:Tazz93's gear list
Canon EOS-1D Mark II N Canon EOS 5DS Canon EOS R5 Canon Extender EF 2x II Canon EF 70-200mm F2.8L IS II USM +11 more
OP rksilp New Member • Posts: 4
Re: Scratches inside EF 85 f1.2L II that was never opened. $1800 to repair!

It is no longer under warranty.

OP rksilp New Member • Posts: 4
Re: Scratches inside EF 85 f1.2L II that was never opened. $1800 to repair!

The lens was never dropped and the exterior does not show any kind of physical damage AFAIK.

GreyGoose Regular Member • Posts: 133
Re: Scratches inside EF 85 f1.2L II that was never opened. $1800 to repair!

rksilp wrote:

It is no longer under warranty.

Sorry to hear that. I can sympathize. It must be a common that lightly used gear goes out-of-warranty before defects are detected. I purchased a 70-300 f/4-5.6 IS USM as a backup for my 100-400 f/4-5.6 IS USM. Recently the much used 100-400 needed a repair so i pulled out my mint condition 70-300 which had only been used twice (because it is a backup). Much to my disgust, both the AF and IS were dead. Canon estimated out-of-warranty repair cost was $485 to replace both AF and IS modules (75% cost of new lens $650). I declined the repair and now own a $650 doorstop.

BlueRay2 Forum Pro • Posts: 14,816
Re: Scratches inside EF 85 f1.2L II that was never opened. $1800 to repair!

rksilp wrote:

The lens was purchased new from B&H and barely used (due to weight). I only used it on special occasions when f1.2-2.0 would be useful since I already have 70-200 2.8L IS II. I noticed during cleaning that the lens showed faint swirl marks "inside". It was not on front or rear element. The focusing seemed normal to me.

So, I decided to send it to Newport New service center for evaluation. They quoted the total cost to repair for around $1800 saying that G2 lens, G3 lens and USM focus assembly needed to be replaced! The most expensive part is the USM focus assembly (~$1100) So, it wasn't worth repairing it since for the same amount of money I can get a brand new one or a very good used one with warranty from reputable sellers for a lot cheaper than $1800.

I never took this lens to a beach or dusty areas. I used it indoor most of the time. What could possibly causes the fine scratches inside the lens elements (and might damage the focus assembly)?

this unfortunate lens look like the front element was rubbed with something abrasive very carelessly! this doesn't mean i am disagreeing with you that it is the internal element! i have 12-13 "L" lenses but never had the slightest issue with them from the day 1 but i do empathize with people who do have issue with their expensive gear while out of warranty!!!! what a shame.

WindwardHaole Senior Member • Posts: 1,550
Re: Scratches inside EF 85 f1.2L II that was never opened. $1800 to repair!

If by Newport News service center you are referring to Canon's own facility, why not contact them again and see if they will verify that the lens was new and had never been opened? If Canon will confirm that the lens was new/unopened, contact BHPhoto and see if the merchant will do something for you? BHPhoto has an excellent reputation and may be willing to help.

Ignat Kozlov New Member • Posts: 3
Re: Scratches inside EF 85 f1.2L II that was never opened. $1800 to repair!

I ran into a similar problem. Between the lenses there are strange streaks and micro dots, like small drops of oil.

(unknown member) Contributing Member • Posts: 724
Looks like mold.
2

nt

Ignat Kozlov New Member • Posts: 3
Re: Looks like mold.

How did you solve the problem? Does it affect image quality?

Ignat Kozlov New Member • Posts: 3
Re: Looks like mold.

more pic

shawnphoto Senior Member • Posts: 1,307
Re: Looks like mold.

Ignat Kozlov wrote:

How did you solve the problem? Does it affect image quality?

It is possible to clean the mold using a mild solvent like hydrogen peroxide. Bad mold could actually damage the glass by etching it. Most of the time it’s not worth the trouble or cost unless you’re a repair expert.

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Canon EOS R Canon EOS RP Canon EOS R5 Canon EF 24-105mm F4L IS II USM Canon RF 28-70mm F2L USM +4 more
(unknown member) Contributing Member • Posts: 724
Those surfaces are probably permanently damaged (etched).

Would most likely cost way too much to fix.

maiaibing Veteran Member • Posts: 5,139
Re: Looks like mold.
1

Snapper2013 wrote:

nt

Its mold alright. And btw that was also the problem with the OP's lens.

Glass suffers under damp conditions.

 maiaibing's gear list:maiaibing's gear list
Canon EOS 5DS R Canon EF 70-200mm F2.8L IS II USM Canon EF 300mm f/2.8L IS II USM Canon Extender EF 1.4x III Canon Extender EF 2x III +5 more
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