Sony A9 - two card slots but no overflow?

sybersitizen wrote:

PAntunes wrote:

If you're recording photos to one card and video to another, you don't want the camera to start recording the images to the video card or video to the photo card. If you're recording jpegs to one card and raws to the other, you don't want the raws going to the jpeg card.

You shouldn't try to tell me what I want. Nor should Sony.

And that's exactly how all other cameras work.

In fact that is exactly what I would want if the capacity of one card is exhausted and the other is not. A very good thing.

The only feature missing from the sony compared to the others is one option where the camera does the overflow without separation of media or redundancy. But if you need that, wouldn't a bigger card be a better option?

You're not getting the point. Maybe people already have two cards and don't want to buy a third one with double the capacity.

You don't need two card slots for storage space. You need two cards because you either want redundancy or separation of media.

Again, you shouldn't try to tell me what I want. Nor should Sony.

Omitting a simple choice that some people with different system brands really do use and some people with the Sony brand would use if it existed is not a defendable stance for a camera company to take. A company gains respect by making things easier for customers, not harder.

Sony isn't telling you what you want, or even what they think you want. They are telling you what they think the majority of people that will actually buy the A9 want. They don't have bandwidth to add every feature every user will want, so (assuming they work like most development shops) they conduct surveys, look at user feedback, T-shirt size effort of different initiatives, prioritize them, and work them in order.

Your desired functionality is probably in a backlog somewhere, but didn't get enough priority to make the cut.

sybersitizen wrote:

SQLGuy wrote:

sybersitizen wrote:

PAntunes wrote:

If you're recording photos to one card and video to another, you don't want the camera to start recording the images to the video card or video to the photo card. If you're recording jpegs to one card and raws to the other, you don't want the raws going to the jpeg card.

You shouldn't try to tell me what I want. Nor should Sony.

And that's exactly how all other cameras work.

In fact that is exactly what I would want if the capacity of one card is exhausted and the other is not. A very good thing.

The only feature missing from the sony compared to the others is one option where the camera does the overflow without separation of media or redundancy. But if you need that, wouldn't a bigger card be a better option?

You're not getting the point. Maybe people already have two cards and don't want to buy a third one with double the capacity.

You don't need two card slots for storage space. You need two cards because you either want redundancy or separation of media.

Again, you shouldn't try to tell me what I want. Nor should Sony.

Omitting a simple choice that some people with different system brands really do use and some people with the Sony brand would use if it existed is not a defendable stance for a camera company to take. A company gains respect by making things easier for customers, not harder.

Sony isn't telling you what you want, or even what they think you want. They are telling you what they think the majority of people that will actually buy the A9 want.

Oh? I wonder why Sony thinks their users don't want that feature while other camera companies think their users do. BTW, it's not just about the A9; you're just seeing it in the E-mount forum for the first time. The feature has been missing from every two-slot camera Sony has produced since 2008; there have been four of those. In every instance, some users have stated quite clearly that they want an automatic overflow option; so there's no way it can be considered a surprising or unreasonable request. It keeps coming up every time it's omitted.

They don't have bandwidth to add every feature every user will want, so (assuming they work like most development shops) they conduct surveys, look at user feedback, T-shirt size effort of different initiatives, prioritize them, and work them in order.

Your desired functionality is probably in a backlog somewhere, but didn't get enough priority to make the cut.

I'd say they'd better get on it then. It's been nine years now.

We're talking about $4500 for the body + at least $2000 on lenses, and you think the user of this camera is worried about using smaller cards he/she already has instead of upgrading to new cards? 
Photographers wanted a dual card system for redundancy, not to use two of the old cards in the camera.

sybersitizen wrote:

SQLGuy wrote:

sybersitizen wrote:

PAntunes wrote:

If you're recording photos to one card and video to another, you don't want the camera to start recording the images to the video card or video to the photo card. If you're recording jpegs to one card and raws to the other, you don't want the raws going to the jpeg card.

You shouldn't try to tell me what I want. Nor should Sony.

And that's exactly how all other cameras work.

In fact that is exactly what I would want if the capacity of one card is exhausted and the other is not. A very good thing.

Sony isn't telling you what you want, or even what they think you want. They are telling you what they think the majority of people that will actually buy the A9 want.

Oh? I wonder why Sony thinks their users don't want that feature while other camera companies think their users do. BTW, it's not just about the A9; you're just seeing it in the E-mount forum for the first time. The feature has been missing from every two-slot camera Sony has produced since 2008; there have been four of those. In every instance, some users have stated quite clearly that they want an automatic overflow option; so there's no way it can be considered a surprising or unreasonable request. It keeps coming up every time it's omitted.

They don't have bandwidth to add every feature every user will want, so (assuming they work like most development shops) they conduct surveys, look at user feedback, T-shirt size effort of different initiatives, prioritize them, and work them in order.

Your desired functionality is probably in a backlog somewhere, but didn't get enough priority to make the cut.

I'd say they'd better get on it then. It's been nine years now.

How long something's been in the backlog counts for nothing. Is it more important than 60FPS AF? No. Is it more important than faster Eye AF? No. Is it more important than updating the LA-EA3? No.

What features that did make it into the A9 would you trade this for?

sybersitizen wrote:

SQLGuy wrote:

sybersitizen wrote:

SQLGuy wrote:

sybersitizen wrote:

PAntunes wrote:

If you're recording photos to one card and video to another, you don't want the camera to start recording the images to the video card or video to the photo card. If you're recording jpegs to one card and raws to the other, you don't want the raws going to the jpeg card.

You shouldn't try to tell me what I want. Nor should Sony.

And that's exactly how all other cameras work.

In fact that is exactly what I would want if the capacity of one card is exhausted and the other is not. A very good thing.

Sony isn't telling you what you want, or even what they think you want. They are telling you what they think the majority of people that will actually buy the A9 want.

Oh? I wonder why Sony thinks their users don't want that feature while other camera companies think their users do. BTW, it's not just about the A9; you're just seeing it in the E-mount forum for the first time. The feature has been missing from every two-slot camera Sony has produced since 2008; there have been four of those. In every instance, some users have stated quite clearly that they want an automatic overflow option; so there's no way it can be considered a surprising or unreasonable request. It keeps coming up every time it's omitted.

They don't have bandwidth to add every feature every user will want, so (assuming they work like most development shops) they conduct surveys, look at user feedback, T-shirt size effort of different initiatives, prioritize them, and work them in order.

Your desired functionality is probably in a backlog somewhere, but didn't get enough priority to make the cut.

I'd say they'd better get on it then. It's been nine years now.

How long something's been in the backlog counts for nothing. Is it more important than 60FPS AF? No. Is it more important than faster Eye AF? No. Is it more important than updating the LA-EA3? No.

There's always somebody to take the stance that 'your' requested feature, whatever it might be, is low on the totem pole. It obviously has been for Sony ... but that does not mean it should be.

What features that did make it into the A9 would you trade this for?

Your idea that a trade is even necessary is a total fallacy.

This is what I've done for my day job for years: product manager for a large software company.

There's only so much bandwidth. If you want something done, that always means something else won't get done. Sorry, but that's the reality of any product being delivered on a set budget and/or timeframe.

SQLGuy wrote:

This is what I've done for my day job for years: product manager for a large software company.

There's only so much bandwidth. If you want something done, that always means something else won't get done. Sorry, but that's the reality of any product being delivered on a set budget and/or timeframe.

OK, lose the green "auto" mode.

Oh, sorry, that's hardware, too.

Jim

sybersitizen wrote:

PAntunes wrote:

sybersitizen wrote:

SQLGuy wrote:

sybersitizen wrote:

PAntunes wrote:

If you're recording photos to one card and video to another, you don't want the camera to start recording the images to the video card or video to the photo card. If you're recording jpegs to one card and raws to the other, you don't want the raws going to the jpeg card.

You shouldn't try to tell me what I want. Nor should Sony.

And that's exactly how all other cameras work.

In fact that is exactly what I would want if the capacity of one card is exhausted and the other is not. A very good thing.

The only feature missing from the sony compared to the others is one option where the camera does the overflow without separation of media or redundancy. But if you need that, wouldn't a bigger card be a better option?

You're not getting the point. Maybe people already have two cards and don't want to buy a third one with double the capacity.

You don't need two card slots for storage space. You need two cards because you either want redundancy or separation of media.

Again, you shouldn't try to tell me what I want. Nor should Sony.

Omitting a simple choice that some people with different system brands really do use and some people with the Sony brand would use if it existed is not a defendable stance for a camera company to take. A company gains respect by making things easier for customers, not harder.

Sony isn't telling you what you want, or even what they think you want. They are telling you what they think the majority of people that will actually buy the A9 want.

Oh? I wonder why Sony thinks their users don't want that feature while other camera companies think their users do. BTW, it's not just about the A9; you're just seeing it in the E-mount forum for the first time. The feature has been missing from every two-slot camera Sony has produced since 2008; there have been four of those. In every instance, some users have stated quite clearly that they want an automatic overflow option; so there's no way it can be considered a surprising or unreasonable request. It keeps coming up every time it's omitted.

They don't have bandwidth to add every feature every user will want, so (assuming they work like most development shops) they conduct surveys, look at user feedback, T-shirt size effort of different initiatives, prioritize them, and work them in order.

Your desired functionality is probably in a backlog somewhere, but didn't get enough priority to make the cut.

I'd say they'd better get on it then. It's been nine years now.

We're talking about $4500 for the body + at least $2000 on lenses, and you think the user of this camera is worried about using smaller cards he/she already has instead of upgrading to new cards?
Photographers wanted a dual card system for redundancy, not to use two of the old cards in the camera.

It's just freakin' amazing how much some people 'know' about what other people want.

So, apparently the Canon and Nikon users - who have overflow in their cameras and use it - are not photographers.

Cameras are made to address specific needs. Just because one guy said he uses something doesn't mean that other brands should waste time implementing that feature. In this case, if both cards were the same like in the A9, he could just swap cards.... 
I'm not saying can't want it, I'm just pointing how useless it is for this camera.

sybersitizen wrote:

PAntunes wrote:

sybersitizen wrote:

PAntunes wrote:

sybersitizen wrote:

SQLGuy wrote:

sybersitizen wrote:

PAntunes wrote:

If you're recording photos to one card and video to another, you don't want the camera to start recording the images to the video card or video to the photo card. If you're recording jpegs to one card and raws to the other, you don't want the raws going to the jpeg card.

You shouldn't try to tell me what I want. Nor should Sony.

And that's exactly how all other cameras work.

In fact that is exactly what I would want if the capacity of one card is exhausted and the other is not. A very good thing.

The only feature missing from the sony compared to the others is one option where the camera does the overflow without separation of media or redundancy. But if you need that, wouldn't a bigger card be a better option?

You're not getting the point. Maybe people already have two cards and don't want to buy a third one with double the capacity.

You don't need two card slots for storage space. You need two cards because you either want redundancy or separation of media.

Again, you shouldn't try to tell me what I want. Nor should Sony.

Omitting a simple choice that some people with different system brands really do use and some people with the Sony brand would use if it existed is not a defendable stance for a camera company to take. A company gains respect by making things easier for customers, not harder.

Sony isn't telling you what you want, or even what they think you want. They are telling you what they think the majority of people that will actually buy the A9 want.

Oh? I wonder why Sony thinks their users don't want that feature while other camera companies think their users do. BTW, it's not just about the A9; you're just seeing it in the E-mount forum for the first time. The feature has been missing from every two-slot camera Sony has produced since 2008; there have been four of those. In every instance, some users have stated quite clearly that they want an automatic overflow option; so there's no way it can be considered a surprising or unreasonable request. It keeps coming up every time it's omitted.

They don't have bandwidth to add every feature every user will want, so (assuming they work like most development shops) they conduct surveys, look at user feedback, T-shirt size effort of different initiatives, prioritize them, and work them in order.

Your desired functionality is probably in a backlog somewhere, but didn't get enough priority to make the cut.

I'd say they'd better get on it then. It's been nine years now.

We're talking about $4500 for the body + at least $2000 on lenses, and you think the user of this camera is worried about using smaller cards he/she already has instead of upgrading to new cards?

I think a $4500 camera with $2000 lenses should have a wide array of user options.

Photographers wanted a dual card system for redundancy, not to use two of the old cards in the camera.

It's just freakin' amazing how much some people 'know' about what other people want.

So, apparently the Canon and Nikon users - who have overflow in their cameras and use it - are not photographers.

Cameras are made to address specific needs. Just because one guy said he uses something doesn't mean that other brands should waste time implementing that feature.

Nothing that one guy - you, for example - says ever applies to the big wide world of other people.

In this case, if both cards were the same like in the A9, he could just swap cards....
I'm not saying can't want it, I'm just pointing how useless it is for this camera.

Wrong. It's useless for you. Big difference.

I'm not saying it's useless for me.... I'm saying it's useless for this camera. The only reason you provided for that feature was to use older and smaller cards. That is not a reason for the typical user of this camera. Can you tell me a reason why a professional sports photographer, or wedding photographer would need to use overflow instead of getting a bigger card?

Out of curiosity, and slightly (ok, way off topic by now), what option is your a9 set to? I currently have mine set to sort RAW/Movie files.

D

sybersitizen wrote:

PAntunes wrote:

sybersitizen wrote:

PAntunes wrote:

sybersitizen wrote:

PAntunes wrote:

sybersitizen wrote:

SQLGuy wrote:

sybersitizen wrote:

PAntunes wrote:

If you're recording photos to one card and video to another, you don't want the camera to start recording the images to the video card or video to the photo card. If you're recording jpegs to one card and raws to the other, you don't want the raws going to the jpeg card.

You shouldn't try to tell me what I want. Nor should Sony.

And that's exactly how all other cameras work.

In fact that is exactly what I would want if the capacity of one card is exhausted and the other is not. A very good thing.

The only feature missing from the sony compared to the others is one option where the camera does the overflow without separation of media or redundancy. But if you need that, wouldn't a bigger card be a better option?

You're not getting the point. Maybe people already have two cards and don't want to buy a third one with double the capacity.

You don't need two card slots for storage space. You need two cards because you either want redundancy or separation of media.

Again, you shouldn't try to tell me what I want. Nor should Sony.

Omitting a simple choice that some people with different system brands really do use and some people with the Sony brand would use if it existed is not a defendable stance for a camera company to take. A company gains respect by making things easier for customers, not harder.

Sony isn't telling you what you want, or even what they think you want. They are telling you what they think the majority of people that will actually buy the A9 want.

Oh? I wonder why Sony thinks their users don't want that feature while other camera companies think their users do. BTW, it's not just about the A9; you're just seeing it in the E-mount forum for the first time. The feature has been missing from every two-slot camera Sony has produced since 2008; there have been four of those. In every instance, some users have stated quite clearly that they want an automatic overflow option; so there's no way it can be considered a surprising or unreasonable request. It keeps coming up every time it's omitted.

They don't have bandwidth to add every feature every user will want, so (assuming they work like most development shops) they conduct surveys, look at user feedback, T-shirt size effort of different initiatives, prioritize them, and work them in order.

Your desired functionality is probably in a backlog somewhere, but didn't get enough priority to make the cut.

I'd say they'd better get on it then. It's been nine years now.

We're talking about $4500 for the body + at least $2000 on lenses, and you think the user of this camera is worried about using smaller cards he/she already has instead of upgrading to new cards?

I think a $4500 camera with $2000 lenses should have a wide array of user options.

Photographers wanted a dual card system for redundancy, not to use two of the old cards in the camera.

It's just freakin' amazing how much some people 'know' about what other people want.

So, apparently the Canon and Nikon users - who have overflow in their cameras and use it - are not photographers.

Cameras are made to address specific needs. Just because one guy said he uses something doesn't mean that other brands should waste time implementing that feature.

Nothing that one guy - you, for example - says ever applies to the big wide world of other people.

In this case, if both cards were the same like in the A9, he could just swap cards....
I'm not saying can't want it, I'm just pointing how useless it is for this camera.

Wrong. It's useless for you. Big difference.

I'm not saying it's useless for me.... I'm saying it's useless for this camera. The only reason you provided for that feature was to use older and smaller cards. That is not a reason for the typical user of this camera. Can you tell me a reason why a professional sports photographer, or wedding photographer would need to use overflow instead of getting a bigger card?

First, I don't think this camera will be bought only by professional sports and wedding photographers. Enthusiasts, whatever their interests might be, will be buying it, I'm sure. Possibly some other categories of users. And whether any shooter has older smaller cards or newer larger cards, there may be times when total capacity takes precedence over redundancy. And I also mentioned a possibility where different file formats are being directed to each card, and one might fill up before the other. Wouldn't there be cases where a second card that can optionally take up slack with no manual intervention be appreciated by some - not all - users? I would think so by the fact that this thread exists, and that some people within the thread have expressed their interest in having the option.

Nevertheless, I'm getting worn down here and might as well acquiesce. Maybe someone else will have the energy to take up the discussion. If not, then I guess Sony is doing a perfect job with the A9 storage system, so owners and prospective buyers just need to get high capacity cards and be happy. Perhaps Sony will someday (paradoxically) make the small change that allows two-card overflow on some less expensive future camera intended for a different demographic.

If total capacity is the priority, what you need is a bigger card. Because 250gb for a 24mp camera, even shooting raw 20fps, is a lot. 
If you need overflow, you're just using the camera wrong. The second card reader is not as fast. Is not designed to be the main card reader. It's there to give you a back up. 
If I set a camera to separate files, I don't want them to overflow. That just makes the separation pointless to begin with.