Canon has now reached NX300 (not yet NX500)

https://www.dpreview.com/news/2937046154/canon-debuts-eos-m6-mirrorless-with-optional-evf

And the nice part is the optional EVF, like samsung used to have for the very first (and still my favourite for rangefinder form factor) NX100.

Perhaps an M7/M8 will finally reach NX1/NX500, at least performance wise?

Kisaha wrote:

tecnoworld wrote:

https://www.dpreview.com/news/2937046154/canon-debuts-eos-m6-mirrorless-with-optional-evf

And the nice part is the optional EVF, like samsung used to have for the very first (and still my favourite for rangefinder form factor) NX100.

Perhaps an M7/M8 will finally reach NX1/NX500, at least performance wise?

When even their dSLRs haven't reach NX1 territory yet,

Depends which aspect.  Pure resolution, the 5DSR is a beast, for AF speed and accuracy the 1DXII is top notch.  But nothing edges out the NX1 as a well rounded camera and there are some points where it is entirely unmatched.  5DIV is fairly well rounded though, decent fps/buffer/resolution compromise, but here is where NX1 boasts its massive 15 fps.

I wouldn't expect any of their mirrorless to go there. Especially for people that value video to their hybrids as I do.

I was hoping the AF would have had a bit more bite though, it seems I fell for the bark myself.

tecnoworld wrote:

https://www.dpreview.com/news/2937046154/canon-debuts-eos-m6-mirrorless-with-optional-evf

And the nice part is the optional EVF, like samsung used to have for the very first (and still my favourite for rangefinder form factor) NX100.

Perhaps an M7/M8 will finally reach NX1/NX500, at least performance wise?

Canon's M series naming is strange. The M6 is a model below the M5, not above. And there's an M10 that's an even lower-end model. I prefer to have the higher number be the most expensive top of line model...D800, D810. D7000, D7100, D7200. Are they trying to confuse people into buying the low and mid tier models because the profit margin is higher????

wpstl wrote:

tecnoworld wrote:

https://www.dpreview.com/news/2937046154/canon-debuts-eos-m6-mirrorless-with-optional-evf

And the nice part is the optional EVF, like samsung used to have for the very first (and still my favourite for rangefinder form factor) NX100.

Perhaps an M7/M8 will finally reach NX1/NX500, at least performance wise?

Canon's M series naming is strange. The M6 is a model below the M5, not above. And there's an M10 that's an even lower-end model. I prefer to have the higher number be the most expensive top of line model...D800, D810. D7000, D7100, D7200. Are they trying to confuse people into buying the low and mid tier models because the profit margin is higher????

Yeh, I found that confusing as well because I initially thought the M6 was going to be the higher end model, but they only released the M5 recently!

They should've probably made a Mx and Mxx line, similar to their DSLRs.

Back on topic - It's a massive yawn fest., same with the 77D.  Atleast they both have Dual Pixel AF which is good.

Kisaha wrote:

ttbek wrote:

Kisaha wrote:

tecnoworld wrote:

https://www.dpreview.com/news/2937046154/canon-debuts-eos-m6-mirrorless-with-optional-evf

And the nice part is the optional EVF, like samsung used to have for the very first (and still my favourite for rangefinder form factor) NX100.

Perhaps an M7/M8 will finally reach NX1/NX500, at least performance wise?

When even their dSLRs haven't reach NX1 territory yet,

Depends which aspect. Pure resolution, the 5DSR is a beast, for AF speed and accuracy the 1DXII is top notch. But nothing edges out the NX1 as a well rounded camera and there are some points where it is entirely unmatched. 5DIV is fairly well rounded though, decent fps/buffer/resolution compromise, but here is where NX1 boasts its massive 15 fps.

I wouldn't expect any of their mirrorless to go there. Especially for people that value video to their hybrids as I do.

I was hoping the AF would have had a bit more bite though, it seems I fell for the bark myself.

I am talking about APS-C cameras, I can't really compare a 5000euros full frame camera with a 1000 APS-C one, even though I dare to say that NX has its benefits, definitely a better video camera than 5D, and a few tricks up its sleeve against the 1D. 5DSr is a specialist dSLR, I do not consider it a hybrid at all.

Well, for certain kinds of subjects the 80D PDAF gives a stronger showing, mainly just because of that tendency to lock onto backgrounds instead of birds with the NX1.   It's fairly close though and the NX1 flattens it in a number of other ways.

What do you mean with your comment about the AF (sorry, no native speaker here!)?

I mean that I was hoping the auto focus would be better.  Having tried the live view of the 80D I was thinking that would extend to the M5 and longer glass.  But I think the scene analysis is too slow so when it gets the magnified image of a longer lens with the viewfinder shake causing more image to image variations, it really fails for tracking the quicker BIF with my long lenses.  The initial impression of Dual Pixel was very good, and indeed the AF is good for slower targets with wider focal length lenses.  Trying it in store was really promising.   Alas, it couldn't stand up to the pigeon test and struggles a lot with the full test.

I was referring to an English saying, "all bark and no bite."  This means the dog seems fierce from all the barking, but is actually harmless.  All of the hype around Dual Pixel was the bark I heard, but it didn't turn out to deliver a strong performance after all for this use.

flip 21 wrote:

I love technology, I love brands that push the envelope, therefore I hate Canon.... I hate them!!!!!!

Anyone else with anti-flicker shooting?  I still think they do push the envelope now and then, just a bit more subtly.

I think it is echoing the 5D and 6D.  Maybe I must wait for the M1.   ;P

flip 21 wrote:

ttbek wrote:

flip 21 wrote:

I love technology, I love brands that push the envelope, therefore I hate Canon.... I hate them!!!!!!

Anyone else with anti-flicker shooting? I still think they do push the envelope now and then, just a bit more subtly.

Like I said, if Canon was alone in the Market, we would be stuck to the same old crap for years, and decades to come...Brands should gives us a glimpse of the future... for me Canon is just sayng: look we produce crappy and outdated cameras, but people buy them, because we are CANON. We rule baby

The problem is not Canon, the brand, is the dumb people that buy canon cameras...

Ah, my bad..... so what should I be buying?

For me canon is just calling me ignorant, when they released such an outdated product... In fact, I feel insulted by Canon...

It's really not aimed you, that's kind of like being insulted by a Toyota Camry, if you find it insulting, then it wasn't for you to begin with.

I hope they burn in mirrorless cameras hell, if there is one

The same saying is popular in Italy as well It's a small world, hehe

Bellende Hunde beißen nicht. Same in German language.

Somewhere, years ago, i read that NX1 was developed with Canon 5D in mind (the so called Classic or Mark I ), the idea was to produce a crop sensor that could compete with that FF camera. And they did it. MarkII has a small edge in iso but NX1 has a small edge in DR. Then thay push all the specs and feature as far they could go and added adequate lenses . They push on everything but marketing, in fact.

If you look at ISO performance, since NX1 there is no crop sensor with a noticeable difference in better. I think that Samsung was very close to a limit of the APSC sensor (unless you introduce something new in the receipe).

We, here, have discussed many times "where to go from NX", EOS M was my long term option but, as many, i did not expect that the 2017 would be year of the surpass.

M6 is a product for the EOS M audience, not for the NX audience. Not yet. Do not expect to push features to gain a market that they already own.

But if you ask me, the real discussion here is the lens development. Canon will (luckyly) come out with a new EOSM lens every year or two (and that is already good, they are pretty busy, also upgrading lenses for the other 2 system etc etc). It will take time to have a complete lineup. Yes, you can adapt EF and EFS lenses, but it is not the same. A mirrorless system needs its own lenses to work at its best. And i dont think that the equivalent of the 16-50 2.0-2.8 is coming any soon.

mordor_74 wrote:

Somewhere, years ago, i read that NX1 was developed with Canon 5D in mind (the so called Classic or Mark I ), the idea was to produce a crop sensor that could compete with that FF camera. And they did it. MarkII has a small edge in iso but NX1 has a small edge in DR. Then thay push all the specs and feature as far they could go and added adequate lenses . They push on everything but marketing, in fact.

If you look at ISO performance, since NX1 there is no crop sensor with a noticeable difference in better. I think that Samsung was very close to a limit of the APSC sensor (unless you introduce something new in the receipe).

We, here, have discussed many times "where to go from NX", EOS M was my long term option but, as many, i did not expect that the 2017 would be year of the surpass.

M6 is a product for the EOS M audience, not for the NX audience. Not yet. Do not expect to push features to gain a market that they already own.

But if you ask me, the real discussion here is the lens development. Canon will (luckyly) come out with a new EOSM lens every year or two (and that is already good, they are pretty busy, also upgrading lenses for the other 2 system etc etc). It will take time to have a complete lineup. Yes, you can adapt EF and EFS lenses, but it is not the same.

In that case Canon had better drop the EF moniker..... but it actually is the same.

A mirrorless system needs its own lenses to work at its best. And i dont think that the equivalent of the 16-50 2.0-2.8 is coming any soon.

That much is true, they're glued to anemic 6.3 long end for EF-M lenses.

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