Entry into M43 - Panny GX85 12-32

wembley1966 wrote:

New member here planning an entry into the world of small cameras and thinking M43.

My work camera is a Nikon D3s with the 14-24 attached nearly all the time. Real Estate Photographer and occasional event photographer. This would still be my go to work equipment and I absolutely love it. Also Own the Nikon AFS trinity.

My travel camera (back-up work camera) is a D700 usually with a 24-70 on it and the 17-35 and 70-200 in the bag.

I want to enter the world of small for travel and can get a Panny GX85 with the 12-32 brand new for $630.

Would this be a good entrance point for M43 to test the waters?

Not been a video shooter but interested in the ibis 4k video option for travel. Like the idea of touchscreen, wifi capability and quality of the gx85.

After many years of being a telephoto shooter (graduating to a 400 f2.8 afs) I have been shooting UWA and the 14-24 is my fav Nikon lens.

But traveling quite a lot at the moment and like a grab shot camera as well as the occasional 'serious' imaging too and tired of dragging the DSLR. Have liked shooting the wife's D5300 and 18-140.

So this is what I'm looking at to start with:

GX85 with pancake 12-32 $630 new

Oly 9-18 f4-5.3 M Zuiko $250 used (locally)

possibly oly 17 f1.8 or pany equivalent for low light stuff if i can get used to such a small system and learning a whole new set-up.

If i like the M43 system would also add a panny or oly 12-35 or 12-40 f2.8 and maybe a 40-150 f2.8 (based on images i've seen that show an image quality I'd be happy to compare with my current equipment).

Does this make sense and most importantly will someone who on a daily basis uses the D3s and 14-24mm be happy with the results knowing full well at probably 1/4 of the size and weight it will not be like for like.

Cheers

Wembley

I think you'll be surprised at how much you'll enjoy your M43 kit...

wembley1966 wrote:

New member here planning an entry into the world of small cameras and thinking M43.

My work camera is a Nikon D3s with the 14-24 attached nearly all the time. Real Estate Photographer and occasional event photographer. This would still be my go to work equipment and I absolutely love it. Also Own the Nikon AFS trinity.

My travel camera (back-up work camera) is a D700 usually with a 24-70 on it and the 17-35 and 70-200 in the bag.

I want to enter the world of small for travel and can get a Panny GX85 with the 12-32 brand new for $630.

Would this be a good entrance point for M43 to test the waters?

Not been a video shooter but interested in the ibis 4k video option for travel. Like the idea of touchscreen, wifi capability and quality of the gx85.

After many years of being a telephoto shooter (graduating to a 400 f2.8 afs) I have been shooting UWA and the 14-24 is my fav Nikon lens.

But traveling quite a lot at the moment and like a grab shot camera as well as the occasional 'serious' imaging too and tired of dragging the DSLR. Have liked shooting the wife's D5300 and 18-140.

So this is what I'm looking at to start with:

GX85 with pancake 12-32 $630 new

Oly 9-18 f4-5.3 M Zuiko $250 used (locally)

possibly oly 17 f1.8 or pany equivalent for low light stuff if i can get used to such a small system and learning a whole new set-up.

If i like the M43 system would also add a panny or oly 12-35 or 12-40 f2.8 and maybe a 40-150 f2.8 (based on images i've seen that show an image quality I'd be happy to compare with my current equipment).

Does this make sense and most importantly will someone who on a daily basis uses the D3s and 14-24mm be happy with the results knowing full well at probably 1/4 of the size and weight it will not be like for like.

Cheers

Wembley

man, wasting your time on the gx85, just get the g80/85

The GX85 is fantastic - for me. I much prefer a flip-up screen, so it suits me very well. And I have no issue with the EVF. There are bigger and better EVF's out there, but I find it works extremely well. I love the camera's ergonomics and Panasonic has the touch-screen implementation down cold.

The 12-32 is a surprise lens - it shouldn't be so sharp for something so light and small.

IMO you chose wisely.

wembley1966 wrote:

New member here planning an entry into the world of small cameras and thinking M43.

I want to enter the world of small for travel and can get a Panny GX85 with the 12-32 brand new for $630.

Would this be a good entrance point for M43 to test the waters?

Yes.

Not been a video shooter but interested in the ibis 4k video option for travel. Like the idea of touchscreen, wifi capability and quality of the gx85.

After many years of being a telephoto shooter (graduating to a 400 f2.8 afs) I have been shooting UWA and the 14-24 is my fav Nikon lens.

But traveling quite a lot at the moment and like a grab shot camera as well as the occasional 'serious' imaging too and tired of dragging the DSLR. Have liked shooting the wife's D5300 and 18-140.

So this is what I'm looking at to start with:

GX85 with pancake 12-32 $630 new

The 12-32mm is a wonderful kit lens. It has some barrel distortion (that's easily corrected in PP) at the wide end, but it punches far, far, above its weight.

Oly 9-18 f4-5.3 M Zuiko $250 used (locally)

Decent wide lens. I never warmed to it myself, and both the Oly and Panasonic 7-14mm lenses are better, however they are much more expensive and a lot bigger.

possibly oly 17 f1.8 or pany equivalent for low light stuff if i can get used to such a small system and learning a whole new set-up.

As others have said, the 15mm f1.7 Panasonic would be the way to go. If you want to go wider, the 12mm f2.0 Oly is a gem, but it's expensive and you have to watch that you get a good copy.

If i like the M43 system would also add a panny or oly 12-35 or 12-40 f2.8 and maybe a 40-150 f2.8 (based on images i've seen that show an image quality I'd be happy to compare with my current equipment).

The Panasonic 12-35mm f2.8 is an excellent lens that really adds punch to especially the 16MP sensor. The Oly is a great lens, with the only drawbacks that it is larger and more front heavy than the 12-35mm, and you can't take advantage of the Dual IS that Panasonic is using that combines body IBIS with the lens OIS. I've had both lenses, and I prefer using the 12-35mm on the smaller bodies, as the size does make a difference to me on them.

I would also suggest that you pick up the "plastic fantastic" Oly 40-150mm f 4-5.6 You can get it, when they have sales on it a few times a year, for $99, and it is a great lens. No, it's not going to best the pro versions, but it is one of those lenses that just consistently produces good output, in spite of its cheapness. Everyone who gets one is surprised by it (in a good way).

I'd also recommend the Panasonic 35-100mm f4-5.6. This is not the f 2.8 pro lens of that focal range (which, according to everyone, is a fantastic lens), but it is the diminutive version that is designed for portability. (The 12-32mm and this 35-100m were designed to match their GM1 and GM5 bodies, so they are truly tiny). This 35-100mm has surprisingly good contrast, edge performance, and low CA, and is quite sharp. If you are looking for small size for your travel kit, this is one you should consider.

Does this make sense and most importantly will someone who on a daily basis uses the D3s and 14-24mm be happy with the results knowing full well at probably 1/4 of the size and weight it will not be like for like.

There are a few things you need to keep in mind.

In terms of format differences:

1. M43 is not going to give you deep shadow recovery like you are used to. So, you can't be really sloppy about exposure settings, especially in darker situations. Keep your ISO as low as you can if optimal sharpness and detail are the goal. Also, highlights recover better than shadows with that sensor, from my own experience, so bear that in mind.
2. Similarly, M43 is not going to be the king of shallow DOF effects. Coming from a FF, getting used to that and the crop factor will take a little bit of time.

In terms of usage:

1. There are a lot functions of the camera that will be a bit different than you are used to (touch screen, constant live view, for instance). These are actually wonderful, and will spoil you, once you get accustomed to them. They make the photographic experience easy and very spontaneous.
2. Consult the board here about settings optimization. People on this board have a LOT of collective experience working with this format, so we can guide you if you run into something that you can't figure out.
3. Once you have experienced the joy of carrying a small, yet competent, system, don't be surprised to find yourself reaching for it more often and finding ways to leave the big gear home. M43 is very enjoyable to shoot with, and I personally find I do better work with it than larger gear because of this (YMMV).
4. Consider the long zooms if you want to get back into that aspect of photography. The PL 100-400mm is a heck of a lens, and on the crop sensor it gives you a 200-800mm equivalent focal range at only 2lbs. If you want a consumer grade zoom the 100-300mm mk II (not first gen) will do quite well for moderate use at just over 1lb and about $600, which is amazingly cheap for a long zoom.
5. And, last but not least: Try out the camera body first if you can. The only real weak spot to the GX85 is the EVF. Some people have a problem with it, some do not. (I found it difficult, but many others have zero problems with it) If you do, then you may want to look at the options that Oly has, or the GX8, or the G85 from Panasonic, both of which have very good EVFs (BTW, the GX8 and the Pen F have the newer 20mp sensor, which I find does better in a number of ways than the 16MP, although the 16MP is no slouch)
6. Enjoy!

-J

Personally I wouldn't consider the 12-32mm because of the manual focusing issue.

MFT generally focuses fast and accurately but there are occasions when it'll fail to lock on or focus on the wrong thing... when shooting through glass, when the subject is slightly obstructed or complex etc... and when that happens with a lens with a focus ring manual intervention is much less of a faff on.

If you want a small standard range zoom I'd recommend you take a look at the Panny 14-42mm Mega OIS. I acquired one as a part of a camera and lens kit and I'm actually quite impressed with it as it's compact and sharp from wide open.

I'd definitely rather have that lens than the 12-32mm even if it makes for a slightly bulkier package, but it is still a compact lens.  Other than that I'd recommend the Olympus 17mm f1.8.

Regarding the GX85 I'd recommend you try before you buy. I'm not a lover of the IMO under par EVF and IMO the buttons are too flush and difficult to find and push with the camera to your eye.

I've had for a long time a D2Hs and D700. No D3s but I see how it is.

Now I have a GX85 so I can compare.

1-digit-D (and to some extent D700) are built like tanks. They have all the possible controls with dedicated buttons/levers/switches, and that's amazing. I can tell you already that you gonna miss that. Going with a GX85 can be a little brutal and I'm afraid you will be frustrated. I strongly suggest to go for something with more controls like GX8, G85 or Oly EM1.

Beside that, MFT offers a lot of amazing features that you can't even dream of with your DSLRs. Face/eye AF, focus peaking, AF points all across the frame, focus bracketing... The latest Panasonics also have a better low light AF than those Nikons (although they where the best of the world at the time of their release). So beside price and weight, feature-wise you will gain a lot with MFT.

Now the most important: IQ.

Resolution-wise, any 16 or 20 mpx MFT camera will easily beat your Nikons at low ISO. The 12-32mm has an impressive center sharpness even wide open, it's a good lens to start with. BTW if you want a fast wide prime, I suggest the PL 15mm f1.7. Small, fast, sharp and excellent contrast. If you want wider, the Oly 12mm f2 is extremely sharp across the frame wide open.

So at low ISO, advantage to Panasonic. But beyond 1600 ISO, the old 12mp Nikon sensor paired with a good lens and a little PP can still beat MFT, being able to better retain some small details... Subjectively, I also find that the files from the Nikon have a better color gradation. I have found that skin tones, for example, can be tuned more precisely (when shooting RAW). For architecture and real estate, though, I'd take Panasonic over Nikon without hesitation. For events, unless you have very high expectations on skin tones rendering, MFT will do the job as well.

I use MFT 90% of the time (because most of my pictures don't need extreme color accuracy and are only published online), it's so small that I can carry it anywhere and I really have fun using it. For more serious works, I use a Sony A7II who combines the features of a mirrorless camera with the IQ of FF. But it's noticeably heavier and bigger than MFT and much more expensive...

If you have any specific question, feel free to ask.

1st of all thank you for all the responses. Some great and detailed info.

I'm excited about the options and benefits of M43 and your responses will really help in creating a nice small kit.

I usually buy used but as i can't get my hands on the camera locally will buy new and quickly check to see if it is for me or i'll return it.

I'm looking forward to trying this out and I'm sure I'll really enjoy it as much as many of your testimonials clearly show your enjoyment of it.

cheers

Oboyle wrote:

As far as your lens choices it is worth it to do a little research on Panasonic DFD autofocus and what lenses are compatible. I don't think the oly 17mm is unfortunately and neither us the 9-18 (though that is a solid price you found for that one) .

I read a couple of reviews for UWA lenses and the mentioned the Oly M. Zuiko 9-18 on a GX85.

Here is one link http://bestmirrorlessblogs.com/buying-guide/best-lenses-for-panasonic-gx85-gx80/

cheers

jalywol wrote:

In terms of format differences:

1. M43 is not going to give you deep shadow recovery like you are used to. So, you can't be really sloppy about exposure settings, especially in darker situations. Keep your ISO as low as you can if optimal sharpness and detail are the goal. Also, highlights recover better than shadows with that sensor, from my own experience, so bear that in mind.

In terms of usage:

1. There are a lot functions of the camera that will be a bit different than you are used to (touch screen, constant live view, for instance). These are actually wonderful, and will spoil you, once you get accustomed to them. They make the photographic experience easy and very spontaneous

Good to know about how the sensor works.

And I am excited by some of the new functions like the touch screen, wifi, constant live view that i'll get to work with.

Probably won't be used to having to carry multiple batteries, but those are small. Charging multiple batteries might be an issue when traveling though 

cheers

wembley1966 wrote:

1st of all thank you for all the responses. Some great and detailed info.

I'm excited about the options and benefits of M43 and your responses will really help in creating a nice small kit.

I usually buy used but as i can't get my hands on the camera locally will buy new and quickly check to see if it is for me or i'll return it.

I'm looking forward to trying this out and I'm sure I'll really enjoy it as much as many of your testimonials clearly show your enjoyment of it.

Check back here with your feelings on the setup after you've gotten a feel for it. If you reply to this post - instead of starting a new one, those who subscribe to the thread updates will know you posted - and it's easier to catch up. Good luck.