infolithium protocol ?

Started Jan 27, 2003 | Discussions
frugalbrutus New Member • Posts: 9
infolithium protocol ?

Does anyone know how to talk to a Sony Infolithium battery? (What protocol, or what chipset to use?) I would like to make a gadget to talk to the batteries and determine state of charge...
thanks!

OP frugalbrutus New Member • Posts: 9
Re: infolithium protocol ?

I opened one up and there is a small circuit board with the following IC's:
Sharp 68011 (can't find doc's, must be a uC)
2029 - clock chip, i think
1388A - can't find doc's
many misc. SM components.

Looks like a 0.1 ohm resistor is measuring the current draw, not just "dumb" voltage measurements.

Apparently Sony wrote their own protocol and put it in a privately branded microcontroller... ?

I have looked at the datastream with an o'scope, copied some of it, sent it to a battery, and I get "something" in return. Don't know what I'm asking, and don't know what I'm receiving...
Anyone try this yet? Or know where I can look?

frugalbrutus wrote:

Does anyone know how to talk to a Sony Infolithium battery? (What
protocol, or what chipset to use?) I would like to make a gadget
to talk to the batteries and determine state of charge...
thanks!

OP frugalbrutus New Member • Posts: 9
Re: infolithium protocol ?

Now that the search engine works, I found the old threads where "Ivo" posted the pic's of the cam to batt communications. They match what I am seeing, except the cam to bat data is a little different. If I send what Ivo spells out in byte 1,2, and 3, I do not get a reply from my battery. If I send what I observed from my cam to bat comm's (NP-F330 and MVC-FD83) then I get a reply from the battery. I don't know what it means yet, but it is progress... I think...

Ivo, have you made any more progress?!?

Evil Eggplant Veteran Member • Posts: 8,755
look at it this way

You don't need to talk to the battery. What you do need it the discharge curve of the battery under load. For the camera to estimate remaining battery life it must know the discharge behavior of the battery under load. You can do the same thing with that information without the need to talk to the battery.

Once you have this informtion things become simple. I would use a PIC or Basic Stamp with a cheap 8 bit serial ADC. The basic stamp will directly drive a surplus LCD and read the ADC with ease. Check out http://www.parallax.com ; for information about the Bssic Stamp. They are a bit pricey, but they are sooo easy to use.

Program the stamp to display the actual voltage as well as estimated time remaining. The stamp can also output serial to your PC, or with the ADC act as a stand alone intelligent charger.

If you haven't yet played around with the Basic Stamp microcontroller this seems like a great place to start.

It would be nice to know the sony serial protocol. I would like to built a hot shoe adapter and wireless remote trigger. Owell, someday..

frugalbrutus wrote:

Now that the search engine works, I found the old threads where
"Ivo" posted the pic's of the cam to batt communications. They
match what I am seeing, except the cam to bat data is a little
different. If I send what Ivo spells out in byte 1,2, and 3, I do
not get a reply from my battery. If I send what I observed from my
cam to bat comm's (NP-F330 and MVC-FD83) then I get a reply from
the battery. I don't know what it means yet, but it is progress...
I think...

Ivo, have you made any more progress?!?

-- hide signature --

rich
c-7oo, d-51O, DSC-F7O7
'it's not having what you want, it's wanting what you got'
http://www.pbase.com/iceninevt

DCC Regular Member • Posts: 194
Re: look at it this way

this maybe useful
http://www.digital-camera-battery.com
it has a cluster of links of re-structure the power protocol

iceninevt wrote:
You don't need to talk to the battery. What you do need it the
discharge curve of the battery under load. For the camera to
estimate remaining battery life it must know the discharge behavior
of the battery under load. You can do the same thing with that
information without the need to talk to the battery.

Once you have this informtion things become simple. I would use a
PIC or Basic Stamp with a cheap 8 bit serial ADC. The basic stamp
will directly drive a surplus LCD and read the ADC with ease. Check
out http://www.parallax.com ; for information about the Bssic Stamp.
They are a bit pricey, but they are sooo easy to use.

Program the stamp to display the actual voltage as well as
estimated time remaining. The stamp can also output serial to your
PC, or with the ADC act as a stand alone intelligent charger.

If you haven't yet played around with the Basic Stamp
microcontroller this seems like a great place to start.

It would be nice to know the sony serial protocol. I would like to
built a hot shoe adapter and wireless remote trigger. Owell,
someday..

frugalbrutus wrote:

Now that the search engine works, I found the old threads where
"Ivo" posted the pic's of the cam to batt communications. They
match what I am seeing, except the cam to bat data is a little
different. If I send what Ivo spells out in byte 1,2, and 3, I do
not get a reply from my battery. If I send what I observed from my
cam to bat comm's (NP-F330 and MVC-FD83) then I get a reply from
the battery. I don't know what it means yet, but it is progress...
I think...

Ivo, have you made any more progress?!?

Evil Eggplant Veteran Member • Posts: 8,755
Re: look at it this way

Doggonit, the link to sony doesn't work. Thanks anyway.

DCC wrote:
this maybe useful
http://www.digital-camera-battery.com
it has a cluster of links of re-structure the power protocol

iceninevt wrote:
You don't need to talk to the battery. What you do need it the
discharge curve of the battery under load. For the camera to
estimate remaining battery life it must know the discharge behavior
of the battery under load. You can do the same thing with that
information without the need to talk to the battery.

Once you have this informtion things become simple. I would use a
PIC or Basic Stamp with a cheap 8 bit serial ADC. The basic stamp
will directly drive a surplus LCD and read the ADC with ease. Check
out http://www.parallax.com ; for information about the Bssic Stamp.
They are a bit pricey, but they are sooo easy to use.

Program the stamp to display the actual voltage as well as
estimated time remaining. The stamp can also output serial to your
PC, or with the ADC act as a stand alone intelligent charger.

If you haven't yet played around with the Basic Stamp
microcontroller this seems like a great place to start.

It would be nice to know the sony serial protocol. I would like to
built a hot shoe adapter and wireless remote trigger. Owell,
someday..

frugalbrutus wrote:

Now that the search engine works, I found the old threads where
"Ivo" posted the pic's of the cam to batt communications. They
match what I am seeing, except the cam to bat data is a little
different. If I send what Ivo spells out in byte 1,2, and 3, I do
not get a reply from my battery. If I send what I observed from my
cam to bat comm's (NP-F330 and MVC-FD83) then I get a reply from
the battery. I don't know what it means yet, but it is progress...
I think...

Ivo, have you made any more progress?!?

-- hide signature --

rich
c-7oo, d-51O, DSC-F7O7
'it's not having what you want, it's wanting what you got'
http://www.pbase.com/iceninevt

DCC Regular Member • Posts: 194
Re: look at it this way

DCC wrote:
this maybe useful
http://www.digital-camera-battery.com
it has a cluster of links of re-structure the power protocol

iceninevt wrote:
You don't need to talk to the battery. What you do need it the
discharge curve of the battery under load. For the camera to
estimate remaining battery life it must know the discharge behavior
of the battery under load. You can do the same thing with that
information without the need to talk to the battery.

Once you have this informtion things become simple. I would use a
PIC or Basic Stamp with a cheap 8 bit serial ADC. The basic stamp
will directly drive a surplus LCD and read the ADC with ease. Check
out http://www.parallax.com ; for information about the Bssic Stamp.
They are a bit pricey, but they are sooo easy to use.

Program the stamp to display the actual voltage as well as
estimated time remaining. The stamp can also output serial to your
PC, or with the ADC act as a stand alone intelligent charger.

If you haven't yet played around with the Basic Stamp
microcontroller this seems like a great place to start.

It would be nice to know the sony serial protocol. I would like to
built a hot shoe adapter and wireless remote trigger. Owell,
someday..

frugalbrutus wrote:

Now that the search engine works, I found the old threads where
"Ivo" posted the pic's of the cam to batt communications. They
match what I am seeing, except the cam to bat data is a little
different. If I send what Ivo spells out in byte 1,2, and 3, I do
not get a reply from my battery. If I send what I observed from my
cam to bat comm's (NP-F330 and MVC-FD83) then I get a reply from
the battery. I don't know what it means yet, but it is progress...
I think...

Ivo, have you made any more progress?!?

OP frugalbrutus New Member • Posts: 9
Re: look at it this way

Several of the links on that page had a few "br"'s stuck at the end of the address. To make the link work, right click on the link, Copy Shortcut, then past the link into your browser address bar, then delete the br's along with the greater than/less than brackets, then hit the Enter key. This worked for me. I didn't find anything explaing gas gauge protocol, but one fellow made a nifty circuit for a home brew external battery pack.
thanks for the links.

iceninevt wrote:
Doggonit, the link to sony doesn't work. Thanks anyway.

DCC wrote:

this maybe useful
http://www.digital-camera-battery.com
it has a cluster of links of re-structure the power protocol

Markus Lenggenhager New Member • Posts: 7
Re: infolithium protocol ?

1-2 years ago I was in contact with Ivo (you will find many of his postings in this forum). He reverse engineered the communication between the F505 and the NP-FS11. I still have Ivo's protocol description here if you're interested.

Myself I gave up the idea of building a "simulator", but have successfully done the approach described by Manfred at
http://members.fortunecity.de/kapmfs/e-liakku01.htm

I have more than enough "18650" type LiIon cells around, recycled from dead notebook battery packs. These are working great. The more operating time I need, the more cells I connect in parallel. HTH!

Markus

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