Moire in Backlit Autumn Leaf Shot

So, in processing more of my pictures from my recent Western Maine trip, I discovered yesterday that one of my favorite shots had significant Moire issues in the brook water and in some areas of the yellow leaves in the trees.  I had bracketed shots originally, and the most Moire was found in the most accurately exposed one.  In the underexposed shot, fortunately, there was little enough that I was able to use the ACR Moire removal brush to get it outta there, as you'll see in the full shot I'm posting below, but I'll show what the moire looked like in the worst shot in 200% crops, after the original shot.

I've never had this problem before, because I never had a camera without a Moire filter, so it was a huge surprise to me and it looked creepy, like the Matrix had gone on the fritz in my world!

Anyone else had this problem with the K3II yet?  Of course, there is an in-camera moire filter with three varying strengths one can turn on.  So, now I will be checking shots like this, that could cause a moire issue to crop up, and if I see it, I will know to try out the in-camera filter!

The completed shot:

Major moire in the specular highlights of the brook:

The Matrix Reloaded in the trees;

Was this a pixel shift shot? those abrasions look like areas of movement during pixel shift.

They also remind me of Bibble labs raw converter (now Corel aftershot) converting my K10 shots on the water, gave the same abrasions, when silkypix did not.

So, how was the processesed? what software did you use?

+1 on pixel shift.

M

What other RAW editors do you suggest?  The only one I use is ACR and PS. . .

MightyMike wrote:

F16 is a bit mushy on APS-C and 1/15th sec will most certainly allow for subject blur especially with leaves and water. I can't say I'm seeing moire, i see blurry leaves and some form of optical aberration in the reflection in the water.

EDIT ADD: ok I had a much closer look and i saw the scan line effect you're calling moire, I'm not convinced its moire, I think its how the RAW editor is dealing with high contrast highlight areas... please try another RAW editor and see if the same effect shows up.

It didn't look exactly like Moire to me, either, but it was the only thing I could think it was, short of my camera being on the fritz somehow!  I don't have anything wider, aperture-wise, no.  I was on a tripod and wanted to get the greatest DOF possible, but you're probably right, that I could easily have done f/8. . .  I wish I could magically go back there and try some other shots, but I'm sure all those leaves are gone now--sigh. . .

Mako2011 wrote:

Cynthia FarrWeinfeld wrote:

So, in processing more of my pictures from my recent Western Maine trip, I discovered yesterday that one of my favorite shots had significant Moire issues in the brook water and in some areas of the yellow leaves in the trees. I had bracketed shots originally, and the most Moire was found in the most accurately exposed one. In the underexposed shot, fortunately, there was little enough that I was able to use the ACR Moire removal brush to get it outta there, as you'll see in the full shot I'm posting below, but I'll show what the moire looked like in the worst shot in 200% crops, after the original shot.

I've never had this problem before, because I never had a camera without a Moire filter, so it was a huge surprise to me and it looked creepy, like the Matrix had gone on the fritz in my world!

Anyone else had this problem with the K3II yet? Of course, there is an in-camera moire filter with three varying strengths one can turn on. So, now I will be checking shots like this, that could cause a moire issue to crop up, and if I see it, I will know to try out the in-camera filter!

The completed shot:

Major moire in the specular highlights of the brook:

The Matrix Reloaded in the trees;

Love the composition. You might be making the issue worse by using f16 and pushing the lens capabilities when not needed. If a faster shutter speed was OK, in terms of composition, I think you could have shot at f8 and kept DoF in the same practical range while lessening the moire like affect. Do you have any wider aperture shots that show less of the issue? If shooting RAW, does the effect look worse before processing? Just curious as this just doesn't look like moire I'm used to seeing.

I wonder if you have hit on the problem?!  It WAS pixel shift shot, yes!  It was on a tripod of course, because even though it doesn't look like it, it was very low light, being in a forested clearing on a brook.  I was using ACR as a RAW converter.  I've not had this happen with pixel shift before at all, but you have?  Very interesting!  Cindy

brew1brew wrote:

Was this a pixel shift shot? those abrasions look like areas of movement during pixel shift.

They also remind me of Bibble labs raw converter (now Corel aftershot) converting my K10 shots on the water, gave the same abrasions, when silkypix did not.

So, how was the processesed? what software did you use?

So do you both think that pixel shift had trouble dealing with the movement of the leaves and the water trickling in other words?

MJSfoto1956 wrote:

+1 on pixel shift.

M

Hahaha!  No, I'm not all that picky--the finished shot I showed was one that had little to none of that effect, whether it was moire or pixel shift resolution, as two other folks here have suggested.  The one I selected the 200% crops of was from the one that looked hideous even WITH the moire filter correction in ACR. . .    Thanks for the article!

SBS wrote:

You are pickier than I am, but here is a link about Moiré that might be helpful:

https://photographylife.com/how-to-remove-moire-in-photoshop

Cynthia FarrWeinfeld wrote:

So, in processing more of my pictures from my recent Western Maine trip, I discovered yesterday that one of my favorite shots had significant Moire issues in the brook water and in some areas of the yellow leaves in the trees. I had bracketed shots originally, and the most Moire was found in the most accurately exposed one. In the underexposed shot, fortunately, there was little enough that I was able to use the ACR Moire removal brush to get it outta there, as you'll see in the full shot I'm posting below, but I'll show what the moire looked like in the worst shot in 200% crops, after the original shot.

I've never had this problem before, because I never had a camera without a Moire filter, so it was a huge surprise to me and it looked creepy, like the Matrix had gone on the fritz in my world!

Anyone else had this problem with the K3II yet? Of course, there is an in-camera moire filter with three varying strengths one can turn on. So, now I will be checking shots like this, that could cause a moire issue to crop up, and if I see it, I will know to try out the in-camera filter!

The completed shot:

Major moire in the specular highlights of the brook:

The Matrix Reloaded in the trees;

As other have mentioned the problem here is pixel shift. You can work around this pretty easily. The pixel shift actually takes 4 pictures and you can access each individually using silkypix. Take one of the individual shots and import it into photoshop. Then import the pixel shifted image. Now create a layer mask with the second image and remove the parts where you can see the artifacts.

Cynthia FarrWeinfeld wrote:

I wonder if you have hit on the problem?! It WAS pixel shift shot, yes! It was on a tripod of course, because even though it doesn't look like it, it was very low light, being in a forested clearing on a brook. I was using ACR as a RAW converter. I've not had this happen with pixel shift before at all, but you have? Very interesting! Cindy

brew1brew wrote:

Was this a pixel shift shot? those abrasions look like areas of movement during pixel shift.

They also remind me of Bibble labs raw converter (now Corel aftershot) converting my K10 shots on the water, gave the same abrasions, when silkypix did not.

So, how was the processesed? what software did you use?

It has been clearly documented on here, DPR did a pixel shift review that shows water and leaf movement causing this issue. There is suppose to be a setting on the camera that is suppose to reduce the movement issue, in area's that have movement the camera is suppose to take one of the four shots and use it to prevent the abrasions.

Thank you!  I didn't know you could separate them!  I guess I need to download Silkypix, huh?    Cindy

AwesomeIan wrote:

Cynthia FarrWeinfeld wrote:

So, in processing more of my pictures from my recent Western Maine trip, I discovered yesterday that one of my favorite shots had significant Moire issues in the brook water and in some areas of the yellow leaves in the trees. I had bracketed shots originally, and the most Moire was found in the most accurately exposed one. In the underexposed shot, fortunately, there was little enough that I was able to use the ACR Moire removal brush to get it outta there, as you'll see in the full shot I'm posting below, but I'll show what the moire looked like in the worst shot in 200% crops, after the original shot.

I've never had this problem before, because I never had a camera without a Moire filter, so it was a huge surprise to me and it looked creepy, like the Matrix had gone on the fritz in my world!

Anyone else had this problem with the K3II yet? Of course, there is an in-camera moire filter with three varying strengths one can turn on. So, now I will be checking shots like this, that could cause a moire issue to crop up, and if I see it, I will know to try out the in-camera filter!

The completed shot:

Major moire in the specular highlights of the brook:

The Matrix Reloaded in the trees;

As other have mentioned the problem here is pixel shift. You can work around this pretty easily. The pixel shift actually takes 4 pictures and you can access each individually using silkypix. Take one of the individual shots and import it into photoshop. Then import the pixel shifted image. Now create a layer mask with the second image and remove the parts where you can see the artifacts.

Thank you Les!  I appreciate it and it makes so much sense that this would happen!  Cindy

brew1brew wrote:

Cynthia FarrWeinfeld wrote:

I wonder if you have hit on the problem?! It WAS pixel shift shot, yes! It was on a tripod of course, because even though it doesn't look like it, it was very low light, being in a forested clearing on a brook. I was using ACR as a RAW converter. I've not had this happen with pixel shift before at all, but you have? Very interesting! Cindy

brew1brew wrote:

Was this a pixel shift shot? those abrasions look like areas of movement during pixel shift.

They also remind me of Bibble labs raw converter (now Corel aftershot) converting my K10 shots on the water, gave the same abrasions, when silkypix did not.

So, how was the processesed? what software did you use?

It has been clearly documented on here, DPR did a pixel shift review that shows water and leaf movement causing this issue. There is suppose to be a setting on the camera that is suppose to reduce the movement issue, in area's that have movement the camera is suppose to take one of the four shots and use it to prevent the abrasions.

Thanks Mako!  I was going to upload the original image, but it is over 100mb, being a pixel shifty thing, and as everyone has made a very good case for it being the fact of movement within a pixel shift compo, I think we have our answer--moire no more!  Haha!  Cindy

Mako2011 wrote:

Cynthia FarrWeinfeld wrote:

It didn't look exactly like Moire to me, either, but it was the only thing I could think it was, short of my camera being on the fritz somehow! I don't have anything wider, aperture-wise, no. I was on a tripod and wanted to get the greatest DOF possible, but you're probably right, that I could easily have done f/8. . . I wish I could magically go back there and try some other shots, but I'm sure all those leaves are gone now--sigh. . .

Still a very nice composition and image. I'd love to have been there with my camera as well. Set your alarm for that time in 2017 and give me a months heads up

Still, I think you need not worry about it being a camera hardware issue. More and more likely a processing issue, combines with a light situation, and maybe an exposure choice ...all come together to produce the effect. Can you thorough up the image from the RAW file with zero processing done...just default conversion using the Camera standard profile (is using Adobe). I'm thinking that will give us more clues

Cynthia FarrWeinfeld wrote:

Thank you! I didn't know you could separate them! I guess I need to download Silkypix, huh? Cindy

AwesomeIan wrote:

Cynthia FarrWeinfeld wrote:

So, in processing more of my pictures from my recent Western Maine trip, I discovered yesterday that one of my favorite shots had significant Moire issues in the brook water and in some areas of the yellow leaves in the trees. I had bracketed shots originally, and the most Moire was found in the most accurately exposed one. In the underexposed shot, fortunately, there was little enough that I was able to use the ACR Moire removal brush to get it outta there, as you'll see in the full shot I'm posting below, but I'll show what the moire looked like in the worst shot in 200% crops, after the original shot.

I've never had this problem before, because I never had a camera without a Moire filter, so it was a huge surprise to me and it looked creepy, like the Matrix had gone on the fritz in my world!

Anyone else had this problem with the K3II yet? Of course, there is an in-camera moire filter with three varying strengths one can turn on. So, now I will be checking shots like this, that could cause a moire issue to crop up, and if I see it, I will know to try out the in-camera filter!

The completed shot:

Major moire in the specular highlights of the brook:

The Matrix Reloaded in the trees;

As other have mentioned the problem here is pixel shift. You can work around this pretty easily. The pixel shift actually takes 4 pictures and you can access each individually using silkypix. Take one of the individual shots and import it into photoshop. Then import the pixel shifted image. Now create a layer mask with the second image and remove the parts where you can see the artifacts.

You can separate but I only know how to do this with silkpix. Alternatively, take a pixel shift image and a non pixel shift image. I mean you are already on a tripod anyways so its no big deal. Good luck and very nice picture!

Looks like PS to me.