Oldies; but goodies

Why am I writing this?  Well, it because of the "newer is better" syndrome.  Upgrade, upgrade, upgrade!  Yet, I find that several older and "obsolete" models provide excellent images.

For example, the S90 or S95, the G11, G12, and G15, the ELPH 330HS, the SX230HS, the SD950IS, and a host of others.  Picking one of the good ones from the past gets one into very good image quality for a fraction of the cost of a new model.

For example, I just picked up a very nice used Canon S90.  I'd had one in the past, and liked it a lot; but at some point, I decided to "upgrade" to the S95.  Pretty much, I found I had gone sideways, and in the process lost something.  Ergonomics were better controls worked a little better, the size and weight were virtually the same, and my Franiec grip fit the S95 perfectly.  Yet, the S90 returns a little better looking JPEG image if you set the internal settings to best advantage.  A small difference; but visible.  Those two models are from 2009 & 2010; but I'm hard pressed to find anything better in the same size and weight range that goes to at least 100 mm.

Other cameras that stood out for me are the SD950IS, G15, SX230HS, S3IS/S5IS, and the ELPH 330HS.  Other really good cameras from the past (at least 4 years since introduction) are the Panasonic FZ150 & FZ200, Canon's SX50HS, the Panasonic LX5 & LX7, the Olympus XZ2, and the Fuji X10 & X20.  I'm sure there are more that I haven't experienced.

We're being sold a bunch of cameras with 1" sensors which are larger, heavier, and a lot more expensive.  Yes, the best of them are better at ISO 1600; but how often do we need that?  The S90 in JPEG makes really good borderless 8.5" x 11" prints with some cropping at ISO 800 - do I really need more?

Somehow, I managed to get along in the 70's, 80's and 90's with ISO 100, 200, & 400 print film with an occasional roll of ISO 800.  Today; we seem to feel we have to have a tack sharp, noise free ISO 1600.

Sorry for the long rant.  I have several newer models (an FZ1000 at the top); but I'm finding that selected older ones give me some excellent images, and newer models are compromised by market "demands".

Jerry, you are so right on here.  My oldest was an S2.  Not very saleable these days with a relatively short zoom range, a relatively small LCD and EVF but it produced some very good images at base ISO.  Of course my present SX50 is a better more versatile camera but my older SX series can often match it on IQ.   I still hope that 2017 model will wow me as I am a bit of a sucker for the latest even if it's all marketing hype. 

Don,

I still have an S3IS.  Not used in a while; but good memories.  I also had an SX50HS, and traded it to my grown daughter to get my Pro 1 back.  And yes, I am waiting for Canon's SX70HS, as the SX60 was a disappointment - just like Panasonics FZ100 and FZ70.  That's still a popular sales area; so there is hope that we might see an improved Canon.   Meanwhile, I'm using a late production Panasonic FZ200 which had an unannounced mid life upgrade.

I agree with you about the oldies but goodies. As someone who used cameras back in the 1960's I am simply amazed by cameras even just a few years ago as to what they are capable of compared to the old film days when we had to set the shutter speed and aperture using the guidelines on the film box, or a separate light meter. I am amazed by all the whining and ranting about how this camera or that one falls short in some area in this day and age. I love my Canon G12 as a camera to grab when head out the door. It is simply amazing to me as to its capabilities given its size. I also have a Canon G3X when I want more reach and a larger sensor. I still fondly remember the Canon G2 as being a fantastic little camera as well. Each to their own, but you are quite correct when it comes to the oldies (5 or 6 years old now) in my experience.

GeraldW wrote:

Why am I writing this? Well, it because of the "newer is better" syndrome. Upgrade, upgrade, upgrade! Yet, I find that several older and "obsolete" models provide excellent images....

Agree. Have no interest in replacing my S110 with G9 X or my G15 with the G5 X. My wife still uses the A710 IS.

... We're being sold a bunch of cameras with 1" sensors which are larger, heavier, and a lot more expensive. Yes, the best of them are better at ISO 1600; but how often do we need that?...

All depends on the type(s) of photog one does, and max aperture of lenses. I like taking pics at various museums, indoor exhibits and shows that require 800 - 1600 ISO (EXIF Data in images) ....

800 ISO

1600 ISO

1600 ISO

Also take quite a few pics for various church events that can require 800 - 3200+ ISO..

3200 ISO

2000 ISO

1600 ISO

3200 ISO

... Somehow, I managed to get along in the 70's, 80's and 90's with ISO 100, 200, & 400 print film with an occasional roll of ISO 800....

Ditto. Though did shoot quite a bit of Kodachrome 25/ 64 for vacations.   For some family pics/ portraits used my Minolta Autocord TLR.

...Today; we seem to feel we have to have a tack sharp, noise free ISO 1600....

"Tack" sharp, no; not a 100% pixie pixel peeper.  If image looks good on my display at 50% be more than good enough for print sizes I do to hang on wall.

Noise generally not a problem unless in low light/ high ISO lighting conditions; just shoot RAW for optimum IQ.

Cheers,
Jon

Beautiful indeed.

Tri-X!  Now that brings back some memories.  I got my first 35 mm camera in 1955, and shortly after that got a dark room set up in the basement.  So naturally, I had to get some Tri-X and push it.

Your S110 has the DIGIC 5 processor and a 1/1.7" sensor.  Together, they do a great job.  But if you go to one of the comparitors and compare the S110 to the newer S120; you'll see the S120 is noticeably softer and with lower contrast.  I blame that on the DIGIC 6 processor, which Canon engineers have admitted didn't have enough processing power for all they were asking of it.  The DIGIC 7 in the G7X II has 14x the power and if you compare the G7X to the G7X II you can see how much difference it has made.  For people shooting mostly stills, the older models were better.

Yes I guess that if one hasn't been into Digital photography since the early days and/or doesn't own any of the older cameras it may be a surprise that something as "geriatric" as 6 years old is still capable of making a decent image in favourable conditions.

I say favourable conditions as there is no doubt in my mind that recent improvements in sensors and lenses have made a positive contribution to low light and high speed photography.

Sadly as manufacturers are squeezed out of the low end of the market by smartphones they need to push larger sensors and with that comes increased cost, size and some compromises.

What I don't appreciate however is the ever growing number of "features" that these electronic devices (which is effectively what they have become) offer. I've recently read through the manuals for the Panasonic FZ1000, Nikon Coolpix A and Canon G7X and am amazed how configurable and capable they are. But do I really want to be able to change the direction of the zebra stripes, for example?

To be honest I would be happy to live with far fewer of these "features" and have a simpler to operate camera. I believe that the inclusion of video to these still cameras has not helped in this regard. So I usually end up setting most things once only and then it's usually to the default.

I guess no one here is going to say that my Kodak DC210 can make as good an image as my FZ1000 but I still have my Canon SX260 as it makes totally acceptable images (at least to me) for general round-and-about/travel in sunny climes when I don't want to lug a larger camera about.To my mind the replacements of the SX260 had more features but poorer IQ.

The good news is that we have never had so much choice and the best choice we have is whether to keep what we have or replace it with something that pleases us more.

davesurrey wrote:

Yes I guess that if one hasn't been into Digital photography since the early days and/or doesn't own any of the older cameras it may be a surprise that something as "geriatric" as 6 years old is still capable of making a decent image in favourable conditions.

My oldest camera is the Canon S3IS.  It is still the record holder for the best squirrel shot.

I say favourable conditions as there is no doubt in my mind that recent improvements in sensors and lenses have made a positive contribution to low light and high speed photography.

The best examples are quite remarkable; unfortunately, not all models share that goodness.

Sadly as manufacturers are squeezed out of the low end of the market by smartphones they need to push larger sensors and with that comes increased cost, size and some compromises.

What I don't appreciate however is the ever growing number of "features" that these electronic devices (which is effectively what they have become) offer. I've recently read through the manuals for the Panasonic FZ1000, Nikon Coolpix A and Canon G7X and am amazed how configurable and capable they are. But do I really want to be able to change the direction of the zebra stripes, for example?

To be honest I would be happy to live with far fewer of these "features" and have a simpler to operate camera. I believe that the inclusion of video to these still cameras has not helped in this regard. So I usually end up setting most things once only and then it's usually to the default.

I'm with you on the video as a negative influence.  In some cases, the advancements in video have actually set back the image quality in stills.

I guess no one here is going to say that my Kodak DC210 can make as good an image as my FZ1000 but I still have my Canon SX260 as it makes totally acceptable images (at least to me) for general round-and-about/travel in sunny climes when I don't want to lug a larger camera about.To my mind the replacements of the SX260 had more features but poorer IQ.

I certainly can't match the DC210; but my pocket walking around camera is an SX230HS, and given decent light, it does very well.  It has a number of ideosyncracies that Canon fixed in the SX260HS; but I'm resigned to live with them as I think the SX230 has the better lens, a victim of the need to go wider and longer.

The good news is that we have never had so much choice and the best choice we have is whether to keep what we have or replace it with something that pleases us more.

PhotoRaw wrote:

I was happy for years with a Canon AE-1P/A-1 and ISO 100, 1000. I love noise on Tri-X 400 black and white film.

Oh, yes.  Tri-X!  Many fond memories.

Those memories mark me, and you, as oldies, and I hope we're at least somewhat goodies.

I was pleased as a seal in a fish tank with my S95, shot thousands of images with it, many of which I printed in 11x14 photo books.  Great detail!  Great color!  Terrific dynamic range!  Small!  Unobtrusive!  Goes anywhere!

But then my beloved S95 gave up, with a "lens error."   After shedding a tear or two, I got a G9X.  I love the G9X, too.

But the S95 was, and still is, a fine, fine camera, in its own right.  An amazing instrument.  I have many images to prove the point.  Yes, an oldie, but very definitely a goodie.   The S line cameras are wonderful still, and are a big bargain in today's market.

toomanycanons wrote:

Even some DSLR shots thrown in for good measure. Was that what the OPs intent was on this thread?

If you thoroughly read my post its very obvious my reply was to OP's comments as to the need for 1600 ISO (which I included in my reply):

Yes none of images are from PowerShot (which I've owned/ own eight - see my Gear), simply for the reason for low light conditions requiring 1600 - 3200 ISO (which I do a lot of), a 1/2.3" or 1/1.7" sensor cameras are not the correct camera to be using.

"...none of which were done with some venerable Canon"

Though not a 'PowerShot', I would consider the 60D as a venerable Canon camera. A camera like any other tool -- use the tool that's the best for the job.

Cheers,
Jon

You've certainly made some excellent points here. I'm still quite happy with my current collection of point-and-shoot cameras. In fact, I'm enjoying my second Canon SX50 as the first failed after many years of excellent service.

Wishing you happiness and success with any camera you decide to keep or purchase!

Tony

Tony Britton Photography

My wife and I make the perfect point-and-shoot photography team. She points and I shoot!

I kept my first digicam (remember when that is what they called them?) a Powershot S10 that is 2.1MP and made me happy for a long time. Waited for the SD400 5MP and still like it as well. Latest Powershot for me is a G1X 1st model that is lots of fun to use. It is my "newest" camera, hated by some, but I really like mine. If we jump on the latest and greatest bandwagon it is too easy to think that it will make us happy...... for a while.  But what do I know, I still like the sound of tube powered audio.