LR CC 2015.6 and Photoshop CC 2015.5 print bug (Mac)

Started Jul 1, 2016 | Discussions
(unknown member) Forum Pro • Posts: 13,189
LR CC 2015.6 and Photoshop CC 2015.5 print bug (Mac)

Over on the Adobe forums (https://forums.adobe.com/message/8848998#8848998), reports of both new versions of PS/LR are not printing correctly. I'm seeing this on my end too. I got confirmation this is indeed a 'bug' from (Adobe? Apple? Epson?) we've seen this all before but it's been some years. Got confirmations this is the issue: Apple killed the old CMProfileRef ColorSync APIs. So beware.

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Andrew Rodney
Author: Color Management for Photographers
The Digital Dog
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OP (unknown member) Forum Pro • Posts: 13,189
Re: LR CC 2015.6 and Photoshop CC 2015.5 print bug (Mac)

How to roll back a version (assuming you're on a Mac and want to print):https://blog.conradchavez.com/2014/06/30/how-to-install-earlier-versions-of-creative-cloud-applications/

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Andrew Rodney
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The Digital Dog
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Billiam29 Senior Member • Posts: 1,159
Re: LR CC 2015.6 and Photoshop CC 2015.5 print bug (Mac)

digidog wrote:

I got confirmation this is indeed a 'bug' from (Adobe? Apple? Epson?) we've seen this all before but it's been some years. Got confirmations this is the issue: Apple killed the old CMProfileRef ColorSync APIs. So beware.

Hi Andrew,

Are you saying that you've been informed Apple killing off CMProfileRef is the cause of the current issue or that it was the source of the problems you mentioned from years ago? I'm just confused as to why the issue would rear its head with updates from Adobe and not a new OS X version or update. Also, this page at Apple seems to imply that the API has been deprecated since the release of Lion but perhaps I'm not interpreting the page correctly.

FWIW, I'm asking/mentioning these things purely out of personal curiosity. Even though I'm currently out of the IT business, my inner nerd still flares up every now and then.

A-Frame Regular Member • Posts: 353
Re: LR CC 2015.6 and Photoshop CC 2015.5 print bug (Mac)

I'm having a similar problem with Photoshop CC 2015.5. We're using custom ICC profiles and after updating to 2015.5 our Epson 3800 started printing darker with a heavy magenta cast. We have no problems with this printer and ICC profiles under Windows. Disappointing.

OP (unknown member) Forum Pro • Posts: 13,189
Re: LR CC 2015.6 and Photoshop CC 2015.5 print bug (Mac)

Billiam29 wrote:

digidog wrote:

I got confirmation this is indeed a 'bug' from (Adobe? Apple? Epson?) we've seen this all before but it's been some years. Got confirmations this is the issue: Apple killed the old CMProfileRef ColorSync APIs. So beware.

Hi Andrew,

Are you saying that you've been informed Apple killing off CMProfileRef is the cause of the current issue or that it was the source of the problems you mentioned from years ago?

The Adobe people I talked to state it's got to do with the change in the API and then something about a bug in drivers that reflect the change. I'm waiting to hear from Epson. Whatever, it's broken and someone, somewhere needs to fix this.

I'm just confused as to why the issue would rear its head with updates from Adobe and not a new OS X version or update. Also, this page at Apple seems to imply that the API has been deprecated since the release of Lion but perhaps I'm not interpreting the page correctly.

I'm confused too because this is much like the finger pointing we saw 5-6 years ago or so when printing on the Mac with Epson and Adobe caused numerous and different issues. Each company was updating their products and breaking other's in the process.

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Andrew Rodney
Author: Color Management for Photographers
The Digital Dog
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bmoag Senior Member • Posts: 1,900
Re: LR CC 2015.6 and Photoshop CC 2015.5 print bug (Mac)

What was that about color management being superior in OSX?

Those so inclined should try running OSX and Windows on the same hardware, Apple or not, for color managed printing. Particularly if you go the non-Apple route that forces you to learn what OSX is and most importantly what it is not. From the video drivers, to the printer drivers to the calibration drivers there are BIG problems in OSX that do not exist in Windows (Windows has its own issues) that never seem to change presumably because of Apple's business model. We'll just toss in memory management for good measure and the decrepit OSX file system (Apple says they are going to change that but I will assume that will go the way of the "metal" initiative for video drivers).

The problems noted in this thread are being seen in one way or another across the range of Adobe products in El Capitan. Blame Adobe? Blame Apple?

Writes he in El Capitan--we will all keep soldiering to Cupertino's drum beat.

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OP (unknown member) Forum Pro • Posts: 13,189
Re: LR CC 2015.6 and Photoshop CC 2015.5 print bug (Mac)

bmoag wrote:

What was that about color management being superior in OSX?

BEFORE you go there, you need some evidence that this is indeed an issue with the OS and that Apple did NOT provide info to Epson, Canon, and Adobe about this.

Frankly, what Adobe is telling us via the one web page doesn't wash IMHO. They state it's only an Epson 3880 issue, that isn't correct.

They state it's a bug in the driver that became active due to the changes in the OS. Maybe.

How this was released from Adobe without knowing this issue seems to me to be an Adobe issue to some degree too.

Those so inclined should try running OSX and Windows on the same hardware, Apple or not, for color managed printing.

Much easier to simply roll back a version or more of CC.

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Andrew Rodney
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The Digital Dog
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John_Hoffman
John_Hoffman Senior Member • Posts: 1,498
Re: LR CC 2015.6 and Photoshop CC 2015.5 print bug (Mac)

MacBook Air, El Capitan, latest LR and PS - no problem printing to Canon PRO-100.

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John Hoffman
Conway, NH

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OP (unknown member) Forum Pro • Posts: 13,189
Re: LR CC 2015.6 and Photoshop CC 2015.5 print bug (Mac)

John_Hoffman wrote:

MacBook Air, El Capitan, latest LR and PS - no problem printing to Canon PRO-100.

With the driver or plug in? Also, can you print from the latest version and an older version assuming you have one installed. The big differences I'm seeing are in blues in this area of a Granger Rainbow:

Make two prints, one from CC, one from an older build and examine this area

The file is here: http://www.digitaldog.net/files/2014PrinterTestFileFlat.tif.zip

MANY colors are not at all different but blues are as illustrated below. I've sorted the largest color differences between CC and older versions:

Worst color matching between new and last version is in blues.

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Andrew Rodney
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The Digital Dog
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John_Hoffman
John_Hoffman Senior Member • Posts: 1,498
Re: LR CC 2015.6 and Photoshop CC 2015.5 print bug (Mac)

Not using Print Studio Pro. PS and LR manage colors - using ICC profile.

Do not have older version.

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John Hoffman
Conway, NH

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OP (unknown member) Forum Pro • Posts: 13,189
Re: LR CC 2015.6 and Photoshop CC 2015.5 print bug (Mac)

John_Hoffman wrote:

Not using Print Studio Pro. PS and LR manage colors - using ICC profile.

Do not have older version.

Thanks. Any other app's that are ICC aware you can print from? 
Some non Epson customers are reporting issues so I'd like to know if that's the reality or not. I've sent most of my day talking with and emailing both Epson and Adobe. As usual, it's kind of a blame game. If someone with a non Epson printer can confirm or deny that they see visual difference with the last update of either PS or LR versus another product, that would be super useful. Unfortunately all I have here is a 3880 and a clogged P600 that needs more ink! 

At least for the 3880, blues are most affected.

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Andrew Rodney
Author: Color Management for Photographers
The Digital Dog
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Leon Wittwer Forum Pro • Posts: 13,347
Re: LR CC 2015.6 and Photoshop CC 2015.5 print bug (Mac)

FWIW, my 2880 prints have changed slightly when going to the upgraded CC Photoshop with OS 10.11.5. The red seems to be slightly less.  My drivers are up to date.

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OP (unknown member) Forum Pro • Posts: 13,189
Re: LR CC 2015.6 and Photoshop CC 2015.5 print bug (Mac)

Leon Wittwer wrote:

FWIW, my 2880 prints have changed slightly when going to the upgraded CC Photoshop with OS 10.11.5. The red seems to be slightly less. My drivers are up to date.

Adobe has stated one might need to uninstall drivers, then reinstall them. I think that's nonsense but tried it and it didn't work. I'd encourage others to try that because it might work but if it doesn't, it's useful ammo to throw back at Adobe for the silly suggestion.

Uninstall can be done a simple way or one that's far more complex. The simple way is to delete the printer in Print/Fax, reinstall the driver, select it again in Print/Fax.

The harder way (and no, Adobe didn't suggest it) is the old Epson enema:

- Delete all instances of Epson printers from System Preferences>Print & Fax.

- Then go to /Library/Printers and toss the whole Epson folder.

- Toss LFP Remote Panel (IF you are using this utility for your printer).

- Then reinstall drivers from Epson and never Apple.

When you go back to Print & Fax to add the printer, on 10.X I had to wait almost a minute before the IP version of the printer showed up, whereas the Bonjour one shows up right away. Then add the IP instance of the printer. This is for printers on a network.

Then re-install LFP Remote Panel if you use it with this printer.

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Andrew Rodney
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The Digital Dog
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Carl Schofield Senior Member • Posts: 2,632
Re: LR CC 2015.6 and Photoshop CC 2015.5 print bug (Mac)
1

It would be refreshing if Adobe would acknowledge that they introduced a nasty bug in LR CC 2015.6 and 6.6 and then actually fix it with a new release - sooner rather than later.

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Isaac Allen Sandy
Isaac Allen Sandy New Member • Posts: 1
Re: LR CC 2015.6 and Photoshop CC 2015.5 print bug (Mac)

I have re-installed 3 versions back and I'm getting the same results, extremely dark and muddy printouts. I suppose I could try rolling back to El Cap or even prior if needed. Anyone find an actual fix yet?

My Setup Includes

  • Photoshop CC 2015.5
  • Print using Epson 7880, Epson orig inks (updated to the last 2014 driver as well, no improvements)
  • Hahnemuhle papers, Epson Premium Glossy, Ilford Glossy, Moab Lasal Glossy, all have same results (updates ICC's, same results)
  • Computer Specs
  • iMac (27-inch, Late 2013)
  • macOS Sierra v10.12
  • 3.5GHz Quad-core Intel Core i7
  • 16GB 1600MHz DDR3 SDRAM-2X8GB
  • NVIDIA GeForce GTX 775M 2GB GDDR5
  • 3TB Fusion Drive (for apps and data)
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OP (unknown member) Forum Pro • Posts: 13,189
Re: LR CC 2015.6 and Photoshop CC 2015.5 print bug (Mac)

Isaac Allen Sandy wrote:

I have re-installed 3 versions back and I'm getting the same results, extremely dark and muddy printouts. I suppose I could try rolling back to El Cap or even prior if needed. Anyone find an actual fix yet?

It's not Photoshop! That's all fixed and the issue with the bug wasn't anything to do with muddy prints (it was an error with blues). It's either your profile, how you've setup the profile for printing or user error.

Output a color reference file first!

http://www.digitaldog.net/files/2014PrinterTestFileFlat.tif.zip

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Andrew Rodney
Author: Color Management for Photographers
The Digital Dog
http://www.digitaldog.net

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