New App for Sony Cameras: Min Shutter Speed

Started Nov 14, 2015 | Discussions
Piafinho Forum Member • Posts: 91
New App for Sony Cameras: Min Shutter Speed
4

So,

It seems that it is in fact possible to define a Minimum Shutter Speed in Sony cameras.

There is a new app in http://psafs.pixub.com that allows Sony users to set it.

It is not perfect as:

- you can only adjust it via the app itself

- The setting goes away once you turn the camera off.

But, it is possible to do it

By the way, did any of you Full Frame Users had the change to try out the Bracket App?

If so, do you know if it does save the files in Uncompressed/14 bit mode?

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ninjapimp Contributing Member • Posts: 524
Re: New App for Sony Cameras: Min Shutter Speed
3

ya, good luck with that

- I cannot guaranty that there are no side effects of using the applications.

totally flaky website...why not just put camera in S mode so you can control speed, no need for an app.

this sounds like a really bad idea it might brick your camera.

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Tristimulus Veteran Member • Posts: 9,454
Re: New App for Sony Cameras: Min Shutter Speed

Piafinho wrote:

So,

It seems that it is in fact possible to define a Minimum Shutter Speed in Sony cameras.

There is a new app in http://psafs.pixub.com that allows Sony users to set it.

It is not perfect as:

- you can only adjust it via the app itself

- The setting goes away once you turn the camera off.

But, it is possible to do it

By the way, did any of you Full Frame Users had the change to try out the Bracket App?

If so, do you know if it does save the files in Uncompressed/14 bit mode?

If the idea is to use the camera for photography then using this app sounds like taking five steps backwards. Not exactly a seamless procedure.

Not exactly the dream app made for me... 

kelstertx Veteran Member • Posts: 5,292
Re: New App for Sony Cameras: Min Shutter Speed

Piafinho wrote:

So,

It seems that it is in fact possible to define a Minimum Shutter Speed in Sony cameras.

There is a new app in http://psafs.pixub.com that allows Sony users to set it.

It is not perfect as:

- you can only adjust it via the app itself

- The setting goes away once you turn the camera off.

But, it is possible to do it

By the way, did any of you Full Frame Users had the change to try out the Bracket App?

If so, do you know if it does save the files in Uncompressed/14 bit mode?

This is interesting.  I hadn't thought of using an app.

And if this site can come up with one by reverse engineering, it seems like it would be trivial for Sony to come up with an official app in the app store...

-Kelly

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OP Piafinho Forum Member • Posts: 91
Re: New App for Sony Cameras: Min Shutter Speed

Trollmannx wrote:

Piafinho wrote:

So,

It seems that it is in fact possible to define a Minimum Shutter Speed in Sony cameras.

There is a new app in http://psafs.pixub.com that allows Sony users to set it.

It is not perfect as:

- you can only adjust it via the app itself

- The setting goes away once you turn the camera off.

But, it is possible to do it

By the way, did any of you Full Frame Users had the change to try out the Bracket App?

If so, do you know if it does save the files in Uncompressed/14 bit mode?

If the idea is to use the camera for photography then using this app sounds like taking five steps backwards. Not exactly a seamless procedure.

Not exactly the dream app made for me...

By default the camera will always default to a min shutter that is too low if we have moving subjects. If the light conditions can change quite fast between each shot, it is hard to get the right exposure using Manual Mode or Shutter Priority.

For sure that on > 99% of my shots I wouldn't use of it.  On the other hand I had a few times where I'm sure I would have enabled it I had the chance.

But maybe that is me and my lousy skills. I must confess I'm not a big fan of shutter priority.

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OP Piafinho Forum Member • Posts: 91
Re: New App for Sony Cameras: Min Shutter Speed

ninjapimp wrote:

ya, good luck with that

- I cannot guaranty that there are no side effects of using the applications.

totally flaky website...why not just put camera in S mode so you can control speed, no need for an app.

this sounds like a really bad idea it might brick your camera.

These are Android Apps. I expect them to have the same chance of brick the camera as installing an app on a Android mobile. Or at least, the same as the Sony Apps that are available.

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cheng li Forum Member • Posts: 79
Re: New App for Sony Cameras: Min Shutter Speed
1

Would be nice if there is something like min shutterspeed = 1/(focus length lens X parameter setting).

VLreviews
VLreviews Regular Member • Posts: 248
Re: New App for Sony Cameras: Min Shutter Speed
2

OK, so I quickly tried this app on an A7II. Summary: It works as advertised!

In Detail: You install it using Internet Explorer (Firefox does not work) and the original Sony Play Memories App Loader. After installing, you can start the app right away. It allows you to clear or set the desired min. shutter speed between 1/15 and 1/4000 of a second by using any of the three wheels on the camera. This value is then the absolute minimum shutter speed - not a threshold. If you set it to 1/15 s, the camera still tries to get the shutter speed down to the regular threshold (which pedends on the lens) as usual. If it cannot get to the threshold, it falls below it until it hits the set minimum. If this is still not enough, it will underexpose the image. You can't even go below your self chosen minimum in M or S mode - which is logical, but may not be the desired reaction. If you shut down the camera, the set minimum is lost and you have to restart the app.

All in all, that's a very nice first step in custom app development and, for me, a pretty useful feature.

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Zenjitsuman Contributing Member • Posts: 793
Re: New App for Sony Cameras: Min Shutter Speed

In some cameras for auto ISO you set the Max ISO and the camera sets the 1 over shutter speed for you as the minimum shutter speed.  So for example a 50mm lens, camera sets 1/50 th sec.

A 200mm lens camera sets `1/200 th sec.  and Auto ISO can move sensitivity from base ISO to max ISO you set say ISO 6400.

Does this app allow auto ISO and lens definitions?

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OP Piafinho Forum Member • Posts: 91
Re: New App for Sony Cameras: Min Shutter Speed

Zenjitsuman wrote:

In some cameras for auto ISO you set the Max ISO and the camera sets the 1 over shutter speed for you as the minimum shutter speed. So for example a 50mm lens, camera sets 1/50 th sec.

A 200mm lens camera sets `1/200 th sec. and Auto ISO can move sensitivity from base ISO to max ISO you set say ISO 6400.

Does this app allow auto ISO and lens definitions?

Like mentioned above, the app set an absolute minimum. But the camera continue to work like before in regards to expected base shutter speed and AUTO ISO range.

Scenario 1:

Let's say that with 1/50 you would get a ISO 3200. But you might get blur with it. So you want to set something higher than that.

If you set the minimum to 1/100 then AUTO ISO would go up to 6400.

However if you set it to 1/200, then AUTO ISO would need to go up to 12800. But it can't as you set a maximum of 6400. So it will take the picture at 1/200, ISO 6400 with -1EV exposure.

Scenario 2:

Let's say that with 1/50 you would need a ISO 12800. Since you have a max AUTO ISO of 3200 the camera will set itself to 3200 and use 1/13 instead of the expected 1/50th of the lens.

That can lead to blur so you, taking in account the situation and maybe IBIS you wanted to force an absolute minimum of 1/25. To do so you set the minimum shutter speed to 1/25.

The camera now cannot drop below 1/25. So instead of 1/13 it will expose with 1/25 and ISO 3200. Leading to a -1 EV.

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Robgo2 Veteran Member • Posts: 5,467
Re: New App for Sony Cameras: Min Shutter Speed

Piafinho wrote:

Zenjitsuman wrote:

In some cameras for auto ISO you set the Max ISO and the camera sets the 1 over shutter speed for you as the minimum shutter speed. So for example a 50mm lens, camera sets 1/50 th sec.

A 200mm lens camera sets `1/200 th sec. and Auto ISO can move sensitivity from base ISO to max ISO you set say ISO 6400.

Does this app allow auto ISO and lens definitions?

Like mentioned above, the app set an absolute minimum. But the camera continue to work like before in regards to expected base shutter speed and AUTO ISO range.

Scenario 1:

Let's say that with 1/50 you would get a ISO 3200. But you might get blur with it. So you want to set something higher than that.

If you set the minimum to 1/100 then AUTO ISO would go up to 6400.

However if you set it to 1/200, then AUTO ISO would need to go up to 12800. But it can't as you set a maximum of 6400. So it will take the picture at 1/200, ISO 6400 with -1EV exposure.

Scenario 2:

Let's say that with 1/50 you would need a ISO 12800. Since you have a max AUTO ISO of 3200 the camera will set itself to 3200 and use 1/13 instead of the expected 1/50th of the lens.

That can lead to blur so you, taking in account the situation and maybe IBIS you wanted to force an absolute minimum of 1/25. To do so you set the minimum shutter speed to 1/25.

The camera now cannot drop below 1/25. So instead of 1/13 it will expose with 1/25 and ISO 3200. Leading to a -1 EV.

And how is this preferable to switching to Shutter Priority mode and setting the shutter speed where you want it? Though such a technique requires some forethought, it is still possible to do photography in a way that is not fully automatic. I realize that this may be a hard concept for many to accept, but it is true nonetheless. 

Rob

OP Piafinho Forum Member • Posts: 91
Re: New App for Sony Cameras: Min Shutter Speed

Robgo2 wrote:

Piafinho wrote:

Zenjitsuman wrote:

In some cameras for auto ISO you set the Max ISO and the camera sets the 1 over shutter speed for you as the minimum shutter speed. So for example a 50mm lens, camera sets 1/50 th sec.

A 200mm lens camera sets `1/200 th sec. and Auto ISO can move sensitivity from base ISO to max ISO you set say ISO 6400.

Does this app allow auto ISO and lens definitions?

Like mentioned above, the app set an absolute minimum. But the camera continue to work like before in regards to expected base shutter speed and AUTO ISO range.

Scenario 1:

Let's say that with 1/50 you would get a ISO 3200. But you might get blur with it. So you want to set something higher than that.

If you set the minimum to 1/100 then AUTO ISO would go up to 6400.

However if you set it to 1/200, then AUTO ISO would need to go up to 12800. But it can't as you set a maximum of 6400. So it will take the picture at 1/200, ISO 6400 with -1EV exposure.

Scenario 2:

Let's say that with 1/50 you would need a ISO 12800. Since you have a max AUTO ISO of 3200 the camera will set itself to 3200 and use 1/13 instead of the expected 1/50th of the lens.

That can lead to blur so you, taking in account the situation and maybe IBIS you wanted to force an absolute minimum of 1/25. To do so you set the minimum shutter speed to 1/25.

The camera now cannot drop below 1/25. So instead of 1/13 it will expose with 1/25 and ISO 3200. Leading to a -1 EV.

And how is this preferable to switching to Shutter Priority mode and setting the shutter speed where you want it? Though such a technique requires some forethought, it is still possible to do photography in a way that is not fully automatic. I realize that this may be a hard concept for many to accept, but it is true nonetheless.

Rob

I recall seeing in the past this same discussion over and over: Min Shutter Speed vs Shutter Priority. Don't know who have won it

For sure there are far more experience guys that can share there thoughts. But I can give you an example on what happened to me when I wanted this feature on my camera:

I want to do a close up with isolation of a moving subject. So wanted an aperture wide open and some minimum shutter speed at least of 1/250.

Shutter Priority = 1/250 and there I go.

However, the subject keeps moves from shade to sun. So, to keep aperture open, I constantly needed to change shutter speed from 1/250 to 1/2000 or something like that..

So I spent my time trying to adjust the exposure than getting the right shot.

If I used aperture mode and set a minimum shutter speed of 1/250 I keep the same settings when my subject moves from shade to sun. So I just focus on catching the right moment.

I only remember 2 times I really wanted to use it. but on those times I didn't manage to take a single picture worthwhile.

But I admit my technic is far from good. So all could be just lack of practice

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JunzInc Regular Member • Posts: 472
Re: New App for Sony Cameras: Min Shutter Speed

Robgo2 wrote:

Piafinho wrote:

Zenjitsuman wrote:

In some cameras for auto ISO you set the Max ISO and the camera sets the 1 over shutter speed for you as the minimum shutter speed. So for example a 50mm lens, camera sets 1/50 th sec.

A 200mm lens camera sets `1/200 th sec. and Auto ISO can move sensitivity from base ISO to max ISO you set say ISO 6400.

Does this app allow auto ISO and lens definitions?

Like mentioned above, the app set an absolute minimum. But the camera continue to work like before in regards to expected base shutter speed and AUTO ISO range.

Scenario 1:

Let's say that with 1/50 you would get a ISO 3200. But you might get blur with it. So you want to set something higher than that.

If you set the minimum to 1/100 then AUTO ISO would go up to 6400.

However if you set it to 1/200, then AUTO ISO would need to go up to 12800. But it can't as you set a maximum of 6400. So it will take the picture at 1/200, ISO 6400 with -1EV exposure.

Scenario 2:

Let's say that with 1/50 you would need a ISO 12800. Since you have a max AUTO ISO of 3200 the camera will set itself to 3200 and use 1/13 instead of the expected 1/50th of the lens.

That can lead to blur so you, taking in account the situation and maybe IBIS you wanted to force an absolute minimum of 1/25. To do so you set the minimum shutter speed to 1/25.

The camera now cannot drop below 1/25. So instead of 1/13 it will expose with 1/25 and ISO 3200. Leading to a -1 EV.

And how is this preferable to switching to Shutter Priority mode and setting the shutter speed where you want it? Though such a technique requires some forethought, it is still possible to do photography in a way that is not fully automatic. I realize that this may be a hard concept for many to accept, but it is true nonetheless.

Rob

I think minimum shutter speed is very useful for me when for e.g I am taking a picture of my active Toddler, and I want to use F2 always. I have a feeling that I need atleast 1/500 to freeze his motion.

So If I am in Shutter Priority and I put 1/250, depending on the available light the Camera may decide to use F4 or F5.6 because that is enough to give the correct exposure but that is not what I wanted to get the required background separation. So what I can do is to switch to M Mode and Put F2 and Shutter Speed 1/250 on Auto ISO and now depending on the light the Camera may Overexpose because even at ISO 100 it may be too bright. So I may have to keep adjusting my Shutter Speed. The best solution here for me is to set a minimum Shutter speed in Aperture Priority. So the Camera will always stay at F2 and will always use Shutter speeds > 1/250 and knows to increase the ISO if need be to remain at 1/250

Regards

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AlphaPhotography
AlphaPhotography Senior Member • Posts: 1,974
Re: New App for Sony Cameras: Min Shutter Speed

Thank you for posting this. I have been waiting for this functionality for almost a year now. While it is not a perfect solution, I am very happy with its performance in the brief test I just did. I will likely be using this frequently.

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Robgo2 Veteran Member • Posts: 5,467
Re: New App for Sony Cameras: Min Shutter Speed

JunzInc wrote:

Robgo2 wrote:

Piafinho wrote:

Zenjitsuman wrote:

In some cameras for auto ISO you set the Max ISO and the camera sets the 1 over shutter speed for you as the minimum shutter speed. So for example a 50mm lens, camera sets 1/50 th sec.

A 200mm lens camera sets `1/200 th sec. and Auto ISO can move sensitivity from base ISO to max ISO you set say ISO 6400.

Does this app allow auto ISO and lens definitions?

Like mentioned above, the app set an absolute minimum. But the camera continue to work like before in regards to expected base shutter speed and AUTO ISO range.

Scenario 1:

Let's say that with 1/50 you would get a ISO 3200. But you might get blur with it. So you want to set something higher than that.

If you set the minimum to 1/100 then AUTO ISO would go up to 6400.

However if you set it to 1/200, then AUTO ISO would need to go up to 12800. But it can't as you set a maximum of 6400. So it will take the picture at 1/200, ISO 6400 with -1EV exposure.

Scenario 2:

Let's say that with 1/50 you would need a ISO 12800. Since you have a max AUTO ISO of 3200 the camera will set itself to 3200 and use 1/13 instead of the expected 1/50th of the lens.

That can lead to blur so you, taking in account the situation and maybe IBIS you wanted to force an absolute minimum of 1/25. To do so you set the minimum shutter speed to 1/25.

The camera now cannot drop below 1/25. So instead of 1/13 it will expose with 1/25 and ISO 3200. Leading to a -1 EV.

And how is this preferable to switching to Shutter Priority mode and setting the shutter speed where you want it? Though such a technique requires some forethought, it is still possible to do photography in a way that is not fully automatic. I realize that this may be a hard concept for many to accept, but it is true nonetheless.

Rob

I think minimum shutter speed is very useful for me when for e.g I am taking a picture of my active Toddler, and I want to use F2 always. I have a feeling that I need atleast 1/500 to freeze his motion.

So If I am in Shutter Priority and I put 1/250, depending on the available light the Camera may decide to use F4 or F5.6 because that is enough to give the correct exposure but that is not what I wanted to get the required background separation. So what I can do is to switch to M Mode and Put F2 and Shutter Speed 1/250 on Auto ISO and now depending on the light the Camera may Overexpose because even at ISO 100 it may be too bright. So I may have to keep adjusting my Shutter Speed. The best solution here for me is to set a minimum Shutter speed in Aperture Priority. So the Camera will always stay at F2 and will always use Shutter speeds > 1/250 and knows to increase the ISO if need be to remain at 1/250

Regards

I don't want to be misunderstood on this subject. I very much would like for Sony to issue a firmware update that would allow one to set a minimum shutter speed. My suggestion for using shutter priority was in response to this new app that would seem to be more trouble than it is worth. But it is true that if you are shooting in M mode, you have to be more alert and involved in getting the settings on your camera right. I do not see that as a huge burden, but others might.

Rob

kelstertx Veteran Member • Posts: 5,292
Does it slow way down?

VLreviews wrote:

OK, so I quickly tried this app on an A7II. Summary: It works as advertised!

In Detail: You install it using Internet Explorer (Firefox does not work) and the original Sony Play Memories App Loader. After installing, you can start the app right away. It allows you to clear or set the desired min. shutter speed between 1/15 and 1/4000 of a second by using any of the three wheels on the camera. This value is then the absolute minimum shutter speed - not a threshold. If you set it to 1/15 s, the camera still tries to get the shutter speed down to the regular threshold (which pedends on the lens) as usual. If it cannot get to the threshold, it falls below it until it hits the set minimum. If this is still not enough, it will underexpose the image. You can't even go below your self chosen minimum in M or S mode - which is logical, but may not be the desired reaction. If you shut down the camera, the set minimum is lost and you have to restart the app.

All in all, that's a very nice first step in custom app development and, for me, a pretty useful feature.

All the apps I've tried make the camera horribly sluggish.  Is this that same kind of app that slows everything down, or is it a different kind of animal where the camera feels normal, except for the new invisible walls keeping the shutter speed up?

-Kelly

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VLreviews
VLreviews Regular Member • Posts: 248
Re: Does it slow way down?

As far as I can tell, the camera doesn't slow down. I don't notice at all when the app is running.

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kelstertx Veteran Member • Posts: 5,292
How did you even install it?

VLreviews wrote:

As far as I can tell, the camera doesn't slow down. I don't notice at all when the app is running.

How did you even get it installed? With IE8, I get errors on the page and can't get camera info. The details of the error refer to a .js piece that isn't available - the url is missing. Looks like Sony dismantled parts of the site. Prior to trying this, I downloaded the Sony plug-in from the "USB" link on the page referenced on the first post.

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lattesweden
lattesweden Veteran Member • Posts: 5,124
Re: New App for Sony Cameras: Min Shutter Speed

On A7RII: Camera Menu #5: ISO Auto Min SS.

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Rich O Regular Member • Posts: 421
Re: New App for Sony Cameras: Min Shutter Speed

Nice will give it a try.

How about a manual lens app.  One that a user can select a predefined set of lens and select the aperture and focal length using the dials and convince the camera that the lens is attached and relay that information to the attached flash.

I've been using the lens compensation app for this feature, but it has issues:

1. its slow

2 . You can't dynamically select the aperture and focal length.  You have to go back into the menu and change the focal length and aperture in the lens profile.  Not so easy to do when your using a zoom lens.

3.  It doesn't relay the focal length to the flash.  As far as the camera know there is still no lens attached and the auto-zoom function of the flash fails, even though your telling the camera the focal length to use for steady shot

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