Feedback: EF 85 mm f/1.8 USM sharpness for handheld shots

Michael Thomas Mitchell wrote:

pilou1253 wrote:

Yes, I've read about this purple fringing, I already have the same problem with the 28mm f/1.8.

I need to lear how to get rid of that in post.

The first thing to know is that is generally occurs most severe in bright, contrasty areas at wide open apertures.

With Adobe Capture Raw (and, I would presume, Lightroom, though with some variation), you open the "Lens Correction" section, and then choose the "Color" tab. After that, it's pretty straightforward.

I encountered some of the worst fringing I've ever encountered last year with an outdoor wedding on a bright, cloudless April afternoon. There were some moments where I really, really wanted that beautiful bokeh that the 85/1.8 can achieve when it's wide open and the subject isn't too far away. About 95% of it corrected just fine in ACR, with no objectionable artifacts in the slightest.

The 85/1.8 is a well-respected lens that performs beyond some of the comments in these forums.

So, as I wrote in other posts, I got mine today and yes, I could indeed see that this purple fringing thing is not a myth... Pretty as ugly as the one I get on my 28 mm f/1.8.

Thanks for the tips with ACR. However, I don't think I will spend much money on post software. Can DPP do the trick as well or...? Until now I only tried to play with "Noise Chrominance" or smthg like that, but that did not help much. I am shooting RAW by the way.

pilou1253 wrote:

Michael Thomas Mitchell wrote:

pilou1253 wrote:

Yes, I've read about this purple fringing, I already have the same problem with the 28mm f/1.8.

I need to lear how to get rid of that in post.

The first thing to know is that is generally occurs most severe in bright, contrasty areas at wide open apertures.

With Adobe Capture Raw (and, I would presume, Lightroom, though with some variation), you open the "Lens Correction" section, and then choose the "Color" tab. After that, it's pretty straightforward.

I encountered some of the worst fringing I've ever encountered last year with an outdoor wedding on a bright, cloudless April afternoon. There were some moments where I really, really wanted that beautiful bokeh that the 85/1.8 can achieve when it's wide open and the subject isn't too far away. About 95% of it corrected just fine in ACR, with no objectionable artifacts in the slightest.

The 85/1.8 is a well-respected lens that performs beyond some of the comments in these forums.

So, as I wrote in other posts, I got mine today and yes, I could indeed see that this purple fringing thing is not a myth... Pretty as ugly as the one I get on my 28 mm f/1.8.

Thanks for the tips with ACR. However, I don't think I will spend much money on post software. Can DPP do the trick as well or...? Until now I only tried to play with "Noise Chrominance" or smthg like that, but that did not help much. I am shooting RAW by the way.

It's been a while since I last loaded up DPP. Canon's earliest raw software was EXTREMELY limited, and many of us early folks looked elsewhere to third-party options that offered a bit more functionality. Bibble. Scott Professional. Capture One. Even Adobe's first few versions of ACR left a bit to be desired. But I finally climbed on board sometime around 2009 or so when Capture One radically changed its interface with one that left me cold. I already had Photoshop, so moving over to ACR/Bridge was natural.

ACR and Lightroom (they both offer similar output, and are based upon the same algorithms, but LR includes a lot of cataloging features) are both terrific packages that really make raw files shine. Even old raw files from outdated cameras improve can look better than ever when re-approached with these applications. About a year ago, after a bit of grumbling on the matter, I took the plunge and subscribed to Adobe Creative Cloud. I'm glad I did. Ten bucks a month for the best photo editing software out there, AND it's always up to date! I've seen photographers around here loose hundreds swapping lenses and gear in and out, yet they complain about spending $10 a month on industry-leading software. It's just a good bargain, period.

Michael Thomas Mitchell wrote:

pilou1253 wrote:

Michael Thomas Mitchell wrote:

pilou1253 wrote:

Yes, I've read about this purple fringing, I already have the same problem with the 28mm f/1.8.

I need to lear how to get rid of that in post.

The first thing to know is that is generally occurs most severe in bright, contrasty areas at wide open apertures.

With Adobe Capture Raw (and, I would presume, Lightroom, though with some variation), you open the "Lens Correction" section, and then choose the "Color" tab. After that, it's pretty straightforward.

I encountered some of the worst fringing I've ever encountered last year with an outdoor wedding on a bright, cloudless April afternoon. There were some moments where I really, really wanted that beautiful bokeh that the 85/1.8 can achieve when it's wide open and the subject isn't too far away. About 95% of it corrected just fine in ACR, with no objectionable artifacts in the slightest.

The 85/1.8 is a well-respected lens that performs beyond some of the comments in these forums.

So, as I wrote in other posts, I got mine today and yes, I could indeed see that this purple fringing thing is not a myth... Pretty as ugly as the one I get on my 28 mm f/1.8.

Thanks for the tips with ACR. However, I don't think I will spend much money on post software. Can DPP do the trick as well or...? Until now I only tried to play with "Noise Chrominance" or smthg like that, but that did not help much. I am shooting RAW by the way.

It's been a while since I last loaded up DPP. Canon's earliest raw software was EXTREMELY limited, and many of us early folks looked elsewhere to third-party options that offered a bit more functionality. Bibble. Scott Professional. Capture One. Even Adobe's first few versions of ACR left a bit to be desired. But I finally climbed on board sometime around 2009 or so when Capture One radically changed its interface with one that left me cold. I already had Photoshop, so moving over to ACR/Bridge was natural.

ACR and Lightroom (they both offer similar output, and are based upon the same algorithms, but LR includes a lot of cataloging features) are both terrific packages that really make raw files shine. Even old raw files from outdated cameras improve can look better than ever when re-approached with these applications. About a year ago, after a bit of grumbling on the matter, I took the plunge and subscribed to Adobe Creative Cloud. I'm glad I did. Ten bucks a month for the best photo editing software out there, AND it's always up to date! I've seen photographers around here loose hundreds swapping lenses and gear in and out, yet they complain about spending $10 a month on industry-leading software. It's just a good bargain, period.

Thanks for these precisions. As I am only an amateur, occasional protographer, I will not spend a lot of money of software. I will make sure that I can explore and use the main part of DPP's functionalities first, and if I feel limited, maybe get a license of one of those programs you mention. Sure can people get a license without subsribing to their CC-thing?

But from the use I have of DPP, I feel like it is limited to classical post processing tasks such as exposure, white balance, constrast and so on, plus some colour filters. If I am right, what are the things that can be improved with ACR / LR?

Sorry if the topic changes prograssively to smthg not really lenses related anymore... !

EduPortas wrote:

Oops, never heard of the three contact points thing? Can you please explain a bit more?

Yes of course, my friend. Contact point 1: the OVF of your camera firmly pressed against your eye and eyebrow region of your face. 2. Preferably, try to lean against a very solid object; a wall, a tree, etc, whilst taking your picture. 3. Pay attention to your feet and your center of gravity. Try to keep one feet in front of the next and reasonably apart from each other, as if you were holding a rifle and "leaning" into your subject.

This will definitely help with the 85/100 primes.

THANKS!

Same goes for video, where using a tripod is a must for this lens.

I don't think I will ever shoot videos... And even if I change my mind, I think I would rather use the 28 or 50 mm for that.

The 85/100 will give you beautiful head shots for interviews! Give it a try! Bokeh all the way.

Humm, I am not a journalist yet, but I will give it try if I feel so!

I am using a 85 1.8 USM with a T5I and I'm getting what I think is out of focus images pretty regular. I used center point focus straight to the face. I'm not sure what to do. I'm pretty frustrated with the lens and camera. Both of these were purchased directly from canon as refurbished. Does the metering have anything to do with this? It was set on evaluating metering. Does the lens need MFA? I called canon and spoke to them and there is a big hefty charge for adjusting. Not sure if this would be covered under warranty. Out of about 10 shots only two were just O.K. Please help anyone.

Alastair Norcross wrote:

I have had the 85 F1.8 for about nine years, and used it on the 20D, 50D, 7D, and 7DII, all crop cameras. It's a very sharp lens, and great for portraits. I find I need to use at least 1/125 to have a good chance of avoiding camera shake, and preferably 1/200 or faster. Outdoors, that's easy. Indoors, without flash, you might need to crank up the ISO a bit, but the 70D has good low light performance, so that shouldn't be a problem. As someone else said, if you shoot fairly wide open (F1.8-F2.2), you'll have a very narrow depth of field, which is really the point of a lens like this, but it also takes good focusing technique. In particular, try to place the chosen focus point over the closer eye, and don't use focus and recompose, which can shift the plane of focus.

As for the purple fringing, which can be annoying on high contrast edges at wide open apertures, that's fairy easy to correct in a program like Lightroom, if you shoot RAW.

I am using a 85 1.8 USM with a T5I and I'm getting what I think is out of focus images pretty regular. I used center point focus straight to the face. I'm not sure what to do. I'm pretty frustrated with the lens and camera. Both of these were purchased directly from canon as refurbished. Does the metering have anything to do with this? It was set on evaluating metering. Does the lens need MFA? I called canon and spoke to them and there is a big hefty charge for adjusting. Not sure if this would be covered under warranty. Out of about 10 shots only two were just O.K. Please help anyone.

Alastair Norcross wrote:

I have had the 85 F1.8 for about nine years, and used it on the 20D, 50D, 7D, and 7DII, all crop cameras. It's a very sharp lens, and great for portraits. I find I need to use at least 1/125 to have a good chance of avoiding camera shake, and preferably 1/200 or faster. Outdoors, that's easy. Indoors, without flash, you might need to crank up the ISO a bit, but the 70D has good low light performance, so that shouldn't be a problem. As someone else said, if you shoot fairly wide open (F1.8-F2.2), you'll have a very narrow depth of field, which is really the point of a lens like this, but it also takes good focusing technique. In particular, try to place the chosen focus point over the closer eye, and don't use focus and recompose, which can shift the plane of focus.

As for the purple fringing, which can be annoying on high contrast edges at wide open apertures, that's fairy easy to correct in a program like Lightroom, if you shoot RAW.

Lots of possibilities. Are the people moving? 1.8 is quite shallow so any movement could put them out of focus in a split second. Try a brick wall on a tripod and see how it fares.

diness wrote:

I am using a 85 1.8 USM with a T5I and I'm getting what I think is out of focus images pretty regular. I used center point focus straight to the face. I'm not sure what to do. I'm pretty frustrated with the lens and camera. Both of these were purchased directly from canon as refurbished. Does the metering have anything to do with this? It was set on evaluating metering. Does the lens need MFA? I called canon and spoke to them and there is a big hefty charge for adjusting. Not sure if this would be covered under warranty. Out of about 10 shots only two were just O.K. Please help anyone.

Alastair Norcross wrote:

I have had the 85 F1.8 for about nine years, and used it on the 20D, 50D, 7D, and 7DII, all crop cameras. It's a very sharp lens, and great for portraits. I find I need to use at least 1/125 to have a good chance of avoiding camera shake, and preferably 1/200 or faster. Outdoors, that's easy. Indoors, without flash, you might need to crank up the ISO a bit, but the 70D has good low light performance, so that shouldn't be a problem. As someone else said, if you shoot fairly wide open (F1.8-F2.2), you'll have a very narrow depth of field, which is really the point of a lens like this, but it also takes good focusing technique. In particular, try to place the chosen focus point over the closer eye, and don't use focus and recompose, which can shift the plane of focus.

As for the purple fringing, which can be annoying on high contrast edges at wide open apertures, that's fairy easy to correct in a program like Lightroom, if you shoot RAW.

Lots of possibilities. Are the people moving? 1.8 is quite shallow so any movement could put them out of focus in a split second. Try a brick wall on a tripod and see how it fares.

Yes, in this one she was moving. Even on the first with no movement it looks the same.

bigd3030 wrote:

I am using a 85 1.8 USM with a T5I and I'm getting what I think is out of focus images pretty regular. I used center point focus straight to the face. I'm not sure what to do. I'm pretty frustrated with the lens and camera. Both of these were purchased directly from canon as refurbished. Does the metering have anything to do with this? It was set on evaluating metering. Does the lens need MFA? I called canon and spoke to them and there is a big hefty charge for adjusting. Not sure if this would be covered under warranty. Out of about 10 shots only two were just O.K. Please help anyone.

Alastair Norcross wrote:

I have had the 85 F1.8 for about nine years, and used it on the 20D, 50D, 7D, and 7DII, all crop cameras. It's a very sharp lens, and great for portraits. I find I need to use at least 1/125 to have a good chance of avoiding camera shake, and preferably 1/200 or faster. Outdoors, that's easy. Indoors, without flash, you might need to crank up the ISO a bit, but the 70D has good low light performance, so that shouldn't be a problem. As someone else said, if you shoot fairly wide open (F1.8-F2.2), you'll have a very narrow depth of field, which is really the point of a lens like this, but it also takes good focusing technique. In particular, try to place the chosen focus point over the closer eye, and don't use focus and recompose, which can shift the plane of focus.

As for the purple fringing, which can be annoying on high contrast edges at wide open apertures, that's fairy easy to correct in a program like Lightroom, if you shoot RAW.

Unfortunately these lenses often need in camera MFA. Paying the hefty fee to canon to adjust the lens doesnt always fix the problem (I found that out from painful experience).

Its worth reading the 70d review on this site. They show examples of AF with lens and the need to MFA in camera.

Im stuck with the same problem with my 100mm f2. The only real way to  fix is buy a camera with MFA.

Maybe you can push Canon to replace you lens and hopefully get a more accurate copy.

bigd3030 wrote:

I am using a 85 1.8 USM with a T5I and I'm getting what I think is out of focus images pretty regular. I used center point focus straight to the face.

I don't see a problem with the focus in this image... what's the problem?

You don't.. I don't think it's sharp enough. This is my opinion. Does it look sharp on your screen ? I did change the setting to spot metering and found they were better. Didn't have enough time to take some more. Mosquitos were eating us up. Maybe I'm expecting too much...... I took some indoor sports shots yesterday and they are not what I want. So I'm sitting here ready to box up this camera and send it back. If MFA is needed. Canon will charge 149.00 I have spoken to them about this. Maybe the lens has a problem. Seems inconsistent. I know if I hold the shutter to focus, I can hear and feel the motor moving. Is this normal for this lens?

Well crap.. The image looks better on a different monitor. One more thing should I hear or feel any kind of movement inside this lens when the shutter is pressed half way on anticipating a shot ?

clark321 wrote:

bigd3030 wrote:

I am using a 85 1.8 USM with a T5I and I'm getting what I think is out of focus images pretty regular. I used center point focus straight to the face. I'm not sure what to do. I'm pretty frustrated with the lens and camera. Both of these were purchased directly from canon as refurbished. Does the metering have anything to do with this? It was set on evaluating metering. Does the lens need MFA? I called canon and spoke to them and there is a big hefty charge for adjusting. Not sure if this would be covered under warranty. Out of about 10 shots only two were just O.K. Please help anyone.

Alastair Norcross wrote:

I have had the 85 F1.8 for about nine years, and used it on the 20D, 50D, 7D, and 7DII, all crop cameras. It's a very sharp lens, and great for portraits. I find I need to use at least 1/125 to have a good chance of avoiding camera shake, and preferably 1/200 or faster. Outdoors, that's easy. Indoors, without flash, you might need to crank up the ISO a bit, but the 70D has good low light performance, so that shouldn't be a problem. As someone else said, if you shoot fairly wide open (F1.8-F2.2), you'll have a very narrow depth of field, which is really the point of a lens like this, but it also takes good focusing technique. In particular, try to place the chosen focus point over the closer eye, and don't use focus and recompose, which can shift the plane of focus.

As for the purple fringing, which can be annoying on high contrast edges at wide open apertures, that's fairy easy to correct in a program like Lightroom, if you shoot RAW.

Unfortunately these lenses often need in camera MFA. Paying the hefty fee to canon to adjust the lens doesnt always fix the problem (I found that out from painful experience).

Its worth reading the 70d review on this site. They show examples of AF with lens and the need to MFA in camera.

Im stuck with the same problem with my 100mm f2. The only real way to fix is buy a camera with MFA.

Maybe you can push Canon to replace you lens and hopefully get a more accurate copy.

Well, I spoke to Canon and the support guy said they would check it and calibrate it to body under warranty.  Does your lens make any kind of movement or noise with shutter pressed halfway. Like for anticipation shots. I still have a day or two to send Rebel back if I really want the 70D.

bigd3030 wrote:

You don't.. I don't think it's sharp enough. This is my opinion. Does it look sharp on your screen ?

It looks as sharp as I would expect under the conditions. I don't see any focus error, so I am guessing any lack of sharpness you are seeing is not due to that.

I did change the setting to spot metering and found they were better. Didn't have enough time to take some more. Mosquitos were eating us up. Maybe I'm expecting too much...... I took some indoor sports shots yesterday and they are not what I want. So I'm sitting here ready to box up this camera and send it back. If MFA is needed.

This image is meant to be an example of the focus error you see? I don't think that's your problem. As you suggested in your later post, the problem you're seeing might be more to do with how you are viewing the image. What other lenses are you comparing this one with?

Canon will charge 149.00 I have spoken to them about this. Maybe the lens has a problem. Seems inconsistent. I know if I hold the shutter to focus, I can hear and feel the motor moving. Is this normal for this lens?

That's what autofocus lenses do!   I can't comment on the 85/1.8 compared to others.

Hi again!

I made some first shots with my new lens, see one example below.

I am satisfied with the results so far, but I wanted to share this example with you guys in order to check with other owners what's your opinion regarding sharpness.

Focus is made on the character's left eye, point-AF. Av f/2.8. Tv 1/1250 s. ISO 100. Handheld (of course).

Any comments?

Cheers!

PL

pilou1253 wrote:

Hi again!

Sharpness looks good, it is front focused slightly but you can see the hair is very sharp.  This lens at f2.8 will perform well for quite reasonable money.  Obviously with a 1/1250 shutter speed you won't have any camera shake issues there.  As others have mentioned most primes don't have IS anyway, so you are not really missing out there if you like wide aperture lenses.  People have successfully hand held lenses at 85mm without IS for portraits for decades, it shouldn't be a problem.

Try some indoor stuff and see how it goes.  I always say there is no lens or camera that will make up for good lighting though.  People tend to not want to think about lighting and hope that some magical combination exists that can make that result in stellar photographs, but you really have to deal with lighting to get the most out of an image.  If you end up unhappy with the results from the prime indoors consider a bounce flash.

Thanks for your comments!

I have been shooting with it today and I suspect that the lens has a tendance to front focusing, especially when the subject is located 5 m or more from the camera.

I am starting a new thread about this issue.

PL