XT1 - Truly Superior IQ

Started Mar 29, 2014 | Discussions
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Photo-Wiz Senior Member • Posts: 1,582
XT1 - Truly Superior IQ
9

After reading several favorable reviews I recently bought a Panasonic GX7 thinking it might stack up well to the Fuji X series cameras. I was partly influenced by Luminous Landscape review of the XT1 by Mr. Reichmann in which he wrote "Now, in early 2014, I don't believe that there are significant differences in image quality between major cameras and camera brands with roughly similar MP count sensors."

Turns out that is completely wrong.  I compared pictures of the GX7 with my XT1 with similar settings.  In every case, the XT1 pictures were visibly superior.  Better sharpness and better color rendition.  My experience with the GX7, much like my experience of a year ago with the Oly EM5 was that it has trouble taking truly sharp pictures.  I don't know if that is because of shuttershock or something else.  I even tried the Electronic Shutter option.  But it made little difference.   None of the pictures approached the IQ of the XT1.  So I returned the GX7.

Fuji, it looks like I'm here to stay. Love my XT1.

Fujifilm X-T1 Panasonic Lumix DMC-GX7
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fotophool Veteran Member • Posts: 4,174
Re: XT1 - Truly Superior IQ
11

Photo-Wiz wrote:

After reading several favorable reviews I recently bought a Panasonic GX7 thinking it might stack up well to the Fuji X series cameras. I was partly influenced by Luminous Landscape review of the XT1 by Mr. Reichmann in which he wrote "Now, in early 2014, I don't believe that there are significant differences in image quality between major cameras and camera brands with roughly similar MP count sensors."

Turns out that is completely wrong. I compared pictures of the GX7 with my XT1 with similar settings. In every case, the XT1 pictures were visibly superior. Better sharpness and better color rendition. My experience with the GX7, much like my experience of a year ago with the Oly EM5 was that it has trouble taking truly sharp pictures. I don't know if that is because of shuttershock or something else. I even tried the Electronic Shutter option. But it made little difference. None of the pictures approached the IQ of the XT1. So I returned the GX7.

Fuji, it looks like I'm here to stay. Love my XT1.

User error?

https://www.flickr.com/groups/2289564@N22/

fotophool

My Flickr Pics

ryan2007 Forum Pro • Posts: 12,001
Re: XT1 - Truly Superior IQ
2

The larger sensor matters.

4054 Regular Member • Posts: 147
Re: XT1 - Truly Superior IQ

Congrats, and welcome!

dannybgoode Contributing Member • Posts: 829
Re: XT1 - Truly Superior IQ
1

I am a lucky person.  I have just bought an X Pro 1 and an Oly E-M10 and when using primes on both there is very little in the IQ.

I prefer the X Pro marginally and it is the camera I like using the most but I love the O-M10 - it is jewel like in its appearance.

If push came to shove and I had a choice I would keep the Fuji but if someone else decided an left me with the Oly I could quite easily cope.

Enjoy the X-T1 and shame you couldn't keep the GX7 as well so you could have the best of both worlds

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Dave Chilvers
Dave Chilvers Veteran Member • Posts: 3,392
Re: XT1 - Truly Superior IQ

After buying the 23 lens this week I went out in good light today, I already knew that my xpro and xe1 were very good with the other fuji primes but the 23 is a cut above the rest. I`m not boasting but have had a lot of the very best cameras and lenses over the years but These fuji`s have just got a knack of producing corner to corner sharpness, Yes! sometimes post process is a bit touchy but when you get it all right the image IQ is superb. (and they don`t break the camels back)

Dave

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Photo-Wiz OP Senior Member • Posts: 1,582
Re: XT1 - Truly Superior IQ
1

fotophool wrote:

User error?

https://www.flickr.com/groups/2289564@N22/

fotophool

My Flickr Pics

No doubt many of these photographs are beautiful.  I'm not implying one can't take great pictures with a GX7.  I just think you'll have an easier time doing so with the XT1 (at least between the two samples I was comparing).  Take a look at the Wet Dog on the Hill picture.  I think if it was taken with the XT1, it might have been sharper.

historianx Senior Member • Posts: 2,354
Re: XT1 - Truly Superior IQ

Photo-Wiz wrote:

After reading several favorable reviews I recently bought a Panasonic GX7 thinking it might stack up well to the Fuji X series cameras. I was partly influenced by Luminous Landscape review of the XT1 by Mr. Reichmann in which he wrote "Now, in early 2014, I don't believe that there are significant differences in image quality between major cameras and camera brands with roughly similar MP count sensors."

Turns out that is completely wrong. I compared pictures of the GX7 with my XT1 with similar settings. In every case, the XT1 pictures were visibly superior. Better sharpness and better color rendition. My experience with the GX7, much like my experience of a year ago with the Oly EM5 was that it has trouble taking truly sharp pictures. I don't know if that is because of shuttershock or something else. I even tried the Electronic Shutter option. But it made little difference. None of the pictures approached the IQ of the XT1. So I returned the GX7.

Fuji, it looks like I'm here to stay. Love my XT1.

Coming from 4/3 i couldnt agree more.  Theres a clarity the larger sensor and no olpf  delivers that 4/3 cant.  When i do a studio shoot with both formats the Fuji files are vastly superior; i notice the difference.

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kewlguy Senior Member • Posts: 1,792
same here
1

I was a 4/3 and m4/3 user, shadow noise (at low iso) and details are just not the same with the smaller sensor. I'm happy with both Canon and Fuji now

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guitarjeff Senior Member • Posts: 1,148
Re: same here
1

Welcome Photo W.  You got a wonderful camera.  X trans photos simply have a unique look and feel that transcends the sum of it's parts (or charts).  There are a few here who have a problem with X trans for whatever reasons.  But like many, when you see the photos you perceive those unique qualities, a mixture of the colors and sharpness, the way it captures the actual environment.  Some may not perceive it, others may perceive it and don't like it anyway.

Watch out for those who say they are Fuji fans in a big way.  Ask them specifically if they like X trans, the very direction of the company they say they love.

Now, if you want to be blown away, head over to Fliker and search groups for X trans, and get ready for tens of thousands of incredible shots.  Search the XF 23mm, the XF 14, the 35, the 55-200 lenses.  These thousands of photos clearly prove what a special too Fuji has created, and you have seen this for yourself in your own photos already.

It truly is an X trans universe, and I am proud to be a fanboy.  It's okay to be a fanboy if your object of desire is the best.

SaltLakeGuy Forum Pro • Posts: 11,530
They made me walk the plank
2

here on this forum for my slamming of the mft stuff when I converted over from a EM1 to the X-T1. I'm sorry but frankly I don't consider them equal on ANY level. They want to call me a fanboy go right ahead. I feel comfortable backing it up all day long. Better IQ across the board PERIOD. Better high speed tracking and I prefer the layout. Oh well......

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Fuji X-T1 Camera, Fuji 18-55 f2.8-f4 Lens, Fuji 55-200 f4-f5.6 Lens, Fuji 23mm f1.4 Lens, Fuji 56mm f1.2R Lens, Fuji EF-42 Flash, Picturecode PhotoNinja

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fotophool Veteran Member • Posts: 4,174
Re: They made me walk the plank
6

SaltLakeGuy wrote:

here on this forum for my slamming of the mft stuff when I converted over from a EM1 to the X-T1. I'm sorry but frankly I don't consider them equal on ANY level.

Flash, video? Really?

They want to call me a fanboy go right ahead. I feel comfortable backing it up all day long.

Pictures are worth a thousand words, you know.

Which is what I find so funny about the two most vocal fanboys here -- you and guitarjeff.

You'd think that if the Fuji was truly the greatest camera ever invented that the both of you would be endlessly bombarding us on a daily basis with pics that any other camera or system could only dream about. After all, you "feel comfortable backing it up all day long."

Instead, we get mostly...verbiage. The same verbiage, I might add, over and over and over.

Ray Sachs has a perspective on this stuff. It might behoove you and guitarjeff to get one, too.

And he takes better pictures than the two of you, too.

And my apologies to Ray for dragging him into this.

Better IQ across the board PERIOD. Better high speed tracking and I prefer the layout. Oh well......

-- hide signature --

Fuji X-T1 Camera, Fuji 18-55 f2.8-f4 Lens, Fuji 55-200 f4-f5.6 Lens, Fuji 23mm f1.4 Lens, Fuji 56mm f1.2R Lens, Fuji EF-42 Flash, Picturecode PhotoNinja

Oh, well, indeed.

fotophool

My Flickr Pics

Ger Horgan Regular Member • Posts: 260
Re: XT1 - Truly Superior IQ
1

Photo-Wiz wrote:

In every case, the XT1 pictures were visibly superior. Better sharpness and better color rendition. My experience with the GX7, much like my experience of a year ago with the Oly EM5 was that it has trouble taking truly sharp pictures. I don't know if that is because of shuttershock or something else. I even tried the Electronic Shutter option. But it made little difference. None of the pictures approached the IQ of the XT1. So I returned the GX7.

Fuji, it looks like I'm here to stay. Love my XT1.

Good for you but I have no trouble taking truly sharp pictures with the GX7

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trueview Regular Member • Posts: 180
Re: same here
1

guitarjeff wrote:

Welcome Photo W. You got a wonderful camera. X trans photos simply have a unique look and feel that transcends the sum of it's parts (or charts). There are a few here who have a problem with X trans for whatever reasons. But like many, when you see the photos you perceive those unique qualities, a mixture of the colors and sharpness, the way it captures the actual environment. Some may not perceive it, others may perceive it and don't like it anyway.

Watch out for those who say they are Fuji fans in a big way. Ask them specifically if they like X trans, the very direction of the company they say they love.

Now, if you want to be blown away, head over to Fliker and search groups for X trans, and get ready for tens of thousands of incredible shots. Search the XF 23mm, the XF 14, the 35, the 55-200 lenses. These thousands of photos clearly prove what a special too Fuji has created, and you have seen this for yourself in your own photos already.

It truly is an X trans universe, and I am proud to be a fanboy. It's okay to be a fanboy if your object of desire is the best.

Maybe a slight loss of sense of perspective here ?

I mean, I'm thoroughly satisfied with the xtrans sensor: the x pro 1 for me has become the digital equivalent of my Leica M6, since digital Leica prices are vastly out of my range.

The size-weight / IQ ratio of the x pro one is nothing short of stunning. But come on, I also get amazing results from my 5DIII. I also got to use a D800 a few times : can this camera also deliver in terms of IQ !

Fuji cameras are truly excellent, and with ergonomics I'm particularly fond of. But unique ?

In my opinion, uniqueness has more to do with what is in front of the camera and who is behind the camera, than the camera itself...

Dave Chilvers
Dave Chilvers Veteran Member • Posts: 3,392
Re: XT1 - Truly Superior IQ

There are two kinds of testing, out and out testing cameras and lenses, tripod, cable release and mirror up against maybe a flat brick wall.

The there is taking that camera out in the field and shooting real world images either hand held or tripod. I don`t use a tripod anymore but for sure some cameras lend themselves to being hand held where as others don`t. For what ever reason, size and shape of hands and fingers make a big difference even the action of the shutter release has a bearing. The there is to fit a grip and thumbs up or not all makes a difference so you must try to set up things for you and your shape. I`ve mentioned before but no one remarked that I have fitted  a small 12mm round rubber foot 4mm thick( those things you stick on items to stop them moving on your desktop) and as a thumb rest that keeps it away from the rear buttons, it works a treat. It might not work for some with different hands. (you could buy them commercially made for the X10 as I remember)

You need to test a camera at the places that you know and can judge against other cameras shooting the same subject, even choosing the same light makes a difference. Only you can tell with YOUR images, shot with your hands and viewed on your computer processed the way you process images.

Under those conditions mentioned above for me the x trans sensors shine, they might not suit everyone like cars that are very personal but if they do then you will be in for a pleasant surprise walking around with new found freedom from weight.

Dave

-- hide signature --

I feel so much better now that I've given up Hope
http://www.pbase.com/davechilvers/latest_images

 Dave Chilvers's gear list:Dave Chilvers's gear list
Canon EOS 6D Panasonic Lumix DMC-G7 Canon EF 85mm f/1.8 USM Panasonic Leica Summilux DG 25mm F1.4 Panasonic 12-35mm F2.8 +14 more
guitarjeff Senior Member • Posts: 1,148
Re: They made me walk the plank
1

fotophool wrote:

SaltLakeGuy wrote:

here on this forum for my slamming of the mft stuff when I converted over from a EM1 to the X-T1. I'm sorry but frankly I don't consider them equal on ANY level.

Flash, video? Really?

They want to call me a fanboy go right ahead. I feel comfortable backing it up all day long.

Pictures are worth a thousand words, you know.

Which is what I find so funny about the two most vocal fanboys here -- you and guitarjeff.

You'd think that if the Fuji was truly the greatest camera ever invented that the both of you would be endlessly bombarding us on a daily basis with pics that any other camera or system could only dream about. After all, you "feel comfortable backing it up all day long."

Instead, we get mostly...verbiage. The same verbiage, I might add, over and over and over.

Ray Sachs has a perspective on this stuff. It might behoove you and guitarjeff to get one, too.

And he takes better pictures than the two of you, too.

And my apologies to Ray for dragging him into this.

Ridiculous. To begin with you say you don't see any special character or have any unique feel for X trans photos, so what good would it be for you to see ANY x trans shots?  Secondly, as a thread was just posted recently about how many shots are shown here and most agree this is an equipment talk forum, so what was it you said, we should be "Bombarding this place with photos"?  LAUGHABLE!!

Third, I have been posting photos, try looking in the appropriate weekly thread the moderator puts up.

Fourth, you should not want to see great X trans photos like the TENS OF THOUSANDS of fabulous photos on the various X trans groups on Fliker.  You see you claim that X trans is nothing special, artifacts and all kinds of nasties, so TENS OF THOUSANDS of great shots DIRECTLY contradicts your silly claims about X trans.  No wonder you had some kind of mental meltdown when I posted links to the various XF lens Flikre groups, those photos show how silly your contentions about X trans are.

Here are a few I have added to the appropriate photo threads without bombarding the forum. But again, meaningless since your mental hangup is with x trans, not individual photogs, right?

guitarjeff Senior Member • Posts: 1,148
Re: They made me walk the plank
1

guitarjeff wrote:

fotophool wrote:

SaltLakeGuy wrote:

here on this forum for my slamming of the mft stuff when I converted over from a EM1 to the X-T1. I'm sorry but frankly I don't consider them equal on ANY level.

Flash, video? Really?

They want to call me a fanboy go right ahead. I feel comfortable backing it up all day long.

Pictures are worth a thousand words, you know.

Which is what I find so funny about the two most vocal fanboys here -- you and guitarjeff.

You'd think that if the Fuji was truly the greatest camera ever invented that the both of you would be endlessly bombarding us on a daily basis with pics that any other camera or system could only dream about. After all, you "feel comfortable backing it up all day long."

Instead, we get mostly...verbiage. The same verbiage, I might add, over and over and over.

Ray Sachs has a perspective on this stuff. It might behoove you and guitarjeff to get one, too.

And he takes better pictures than the two of you, too.

And my apologies to Ray for dragging him into this.

Ridiculous. To begin with you say you don't see any special character or have any unique feel for X trans photos, so what good would it be for you to see ANY x trans shots? Secondly, as a thread was just posted recently about how many shots are shown here and most agree this is an equipment talk forum, so what was it you said, we should be "Bombarding this place with photos"? LAUGHABLE!!

Third, I have been posting photos, try looking in the appropriate weekly thread the moderator puts up.

Fourth, you should not want to see great X trans photos like the TENS OF THOUSANDS of fabulous photos on the various X trans groups on Fliker. You see you claim that X trans is nothing special, artifacts and all kinds of nasties, so TENS OF THOUSANDS of great shots DIRECTLY contradicts your silly claims about X trans. No wonder you had some kind of mental meltdown when I posted links to the various XF lens Flikre groups, those photos show how silly your contentions about X trans are.

Here are a few I have added to the appropriate photo threads without bombarding the forum. But again, meaningless since your mental hangup is with x trans, not individual photogs, right?

And one just for phool, I had a dream the X trans haters were coming to get me, I found the perfect representation of the X trans hater.

Now, if you would like to head over to Fliker together we can go through a few thousand great X trans photos together and maybe I can teach you to perceive their unique qualities that you presently can't seem to see.  And by the way, I see you mainly posting pics in the FUJI forum from other cameras, and rarely any FUJI photos.  why are you in the forum again?  Oh yeah, your agenda against X trans, I forgot for a moment.

guitarjeff Senior Member • Posts: 1,148
Re: same here

trueview wrote:

guitarjeff wrote:

Welcome Photo W. You got a wonderful camera. X trans photos simply have a unique look and feel that transcends the sum of it's parts (or charts). There are a few here who have a problem with X trans for whatever reasons. But like many, when you see the photos you perceive those unique qualities, a mixture of the colors and sharpness, the way it captures the actual environment. Some may not perceive it, others may perceive it and don't like it anyway.

Watch out for those who say they are Fuji fans in a big way. Ask them specifically if they like X trans, the very direction of the company they say they love.

Now, if you want to be blown away, head over to Fliker and search groups for X trans, and get ready for tens of thousands of incredible shots. Search the XF 23mm, the XF 14, the 35, the 55-200 lenses. These thousands of photos clearly prove what a special too Fuji has created, and you have seen this for yourself in your own photos already.

It truly is an X trans universe, and I am proud to be a fanboy. It's okay to be a fanboy if your object of desire is the best.

Maybe a slight loss of sense of perspective here ?

I mean, I'm thoroughly satisfied with the xtrans sensor: the x pro 1 for me has become the digital equivalent of my Leica M6, since digital Leica prices are vastly out of my range.

The size-weight / IQ ratio of the x pro one is nothing short of stunning. But come on, I also get amazing results from my 5DIII. I also got to use a D800 a few times : can this camera also deliver in terms of IQ !

Fuji cameras are truly excellent, and with ergonomics I'm particularly fond of. But unique ?

In my opinion, uniqueness has more to do with what is in front of the camera and who is behind the camera, than the camera itself...

Oh yeah, very unique to me and many others.  The colors ALONE make them unique to me and many.  And yeah, somewhat overblown because it fun to toy with the X trans haters.

guitarjeff Senior Member • Posts: 1,148
Re: XT1 - Truly Superior IQ

Ger Horgan wrote:

Photo-Wiz wrote:

In every case, the XT1 pictures were visibly superior. Better sharpness and better color rendition. My experience with the GX7, much like my experience of a year ago with the Oly EM5 was that it has trouble taking truly sharp pictures. I don't know if that is because of shuttershock or something else. I even tried the Electronic Shutter option. But it made little difference. None of the pictures approached the IQ of the XT1. So I returned the GX7.

Fuji, it looks like I'm here to stay. Love my XT1.

Good for you but I have no trouble taking truly sharp pictures with the GX7

-- hide signature --

Nice, but I prefer X trans photos, the colors alone make them unique, they render a bit differently.  That doesn't mean other cams take bad photos, it just means that X trans lovers see something a little different and unique in the shots, that why many bought the system.

nixda Veteran Member • Posts: 3,946
Re: XT1 - Truly Superior IQ
4

Dave Chilvers wrote:

There are two kinds of testing, out and out testing cameras and lenses, tripod, cable release and mirror up against maybe a flat brick wall.

The there is taking that camera out in the field and shooting real world images either hand held or tripod. I don`t use a tripod anymore but for sure some cameras lend themselves to being hand held where as others don`t. For what ever reason, size and shape of hands and fingers make a big difference even the action of the shutter release has a bearing. The there is to fit a grip and thumbs up or not all makes a difference so you must try to set up things for you and your shape. I`ve mentioned before but no one remarked that I have fitted a small 12mm round rubber foot 4mm thick( those things you stick on items to stop them moving on your desktop) and as a thumb rest that keeps it away from the rear buttons, it works a treat. It might not work for some with different hands. (you could buy them commercially made for the X10 as I remember)

You need to test a camera at the places that you know and can judge against other cameras shooting the same subject, even choosing the same light makes a difference. Only you can tell with YOUR images, shot with your hands and viewed on your computer processed the way you process images.

Under those conditions mentioned above for me the x trans sensors shine, they might not suit everyone like cars that are very personal but if they do then you will be in for a pleasant surprise walking around with new found freedom from weight.

Dave

You are absolutely correct in everything you're saying here.

However, my issue is that the OP has not demonstrated, nor is there any sign of even remotely trying to find out, where exactly the problem lies. Color rendition could be due to so many things about the in-camera raw processor. For all we know, he could have taken B&W images with the GX7 and Velvia shots with the Fuji, and then complained about color rendition. Bottom line is that he hasn't divulged how the images were created.

Same thing about sharpness. Was it camera shake that's responsible? Was there something wrong with the camera? Did the lenses used have different inherent sharpness? What were the in-camera sharpness settings? How did he print/view the images? Did he present any examples of what he was talking about?

A catchy heading for the OP, but no details to back it all up. One should expect rigorous methods to get to the bottom of things, otherwise one cannot assess whether the OP's notion is valid or not.

Threads like these just leave a sour taste as they throw the kind of absolutist statements out into the wild that are fodder for trolls and a source of confusion for innocent bystanders who are seeking useful information.

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