RX10/100v1 .. worthwhile to shoot RAW?

Started Mar 11, 2014 | Discussions
Jogger
Jogger Veteran Member • Posts: 8,441
RX10/100v1 .. worthwhile to shoot RAW?
1

I finally picked up LightRoom and can now process RAW files from these cameras.. but, its it worth the trouble?? Ive had the RX100 since launch and most of my photos have one of the funky filters applied.. its really my go everywhere camera. The RX10 is used 83% of the time for video, but, i will take photos with it if its the only camera i have on me.

 Jogger's gear list:Jogger's gear list
Sony RX100 Sony Cyber-shot DSC-RX10 Nikon D700 Nikon Df Nikon AF-S Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8G ED VR +4 more
Sony Cyber-shot DSC-RX10 Sony RX100
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cchen2
cchen2 Senior Member • Posts: 1,095
Re: RX10/100v1 .. worthwhile to shoot RAW?

Good question.  I have been thinking about this myself.  I do like the flexibility with color and WB that I get with RAW, but the files are huge and the work flow with LR5 is not very smooth, compared to Picasa with JPG.  I think what I'm going to do is shoot with JPG's most of the time and if I am not pleased with the colors that I'm getting, I'll switch to RAW.  I don't like the way that LR handles importing files either.  I think if you're not a professional looking to maximize every single pixel you have, JPG is perfectly fine.  Something I'm trying to do is playing around with shooting in "vivid" mode when I want more "pop" in my images.

Curious to see what some of the others, especially non-professionals, have thought about possibly moving from Picasa to Lightroom.

 cchen2's gear list:cchen2's gear list
Sony Cyber-shot DSC-RX10 Sony a6000 Sony E 50mm F1.8 OSS Sony E PZ 18-105mm F4 G OSS Samyang 12mm F2 NCS CS
Ron AKA Veteran Member • Posts: 4,875
Re: RX10/100v1 .. worthwhile to shoot RAW?
1

If you want my frank opinion, the answer is likely "no". It does not sound like you are a very serious photographer, and you appear to be mostly interested in video and quickie snap shots. Learning to use Lightroom and then actually using it properly takes some learning and time. If you are not willing to do that, then it is probably a waste of time.

 Ron AKA's gear list:Ron AKA's gear list
Sony RX100 Epson Stylus Photo R3000 +1 more
Jogger
OP Jogger Veteran Member • Posts: 8,441
Re: RX10/100v1 .. worthwhile to shoot RAW?

Ron AKA wrote:

If you want my frank opinion, the answer is likely "no". It does not sound like you are a very serious photographer, and you appear to be mostly interested in video and quickie snap shots. Learning to use Lightroom and then actually using it properly takes some learning and time. If you are not willing to do that, then it is probably a waste of time.

Well, for the RX100.. i only use it for random casual photos and such. So, you are prob. right that its not worth it. Ive managed without it for so long.. but, was just wondering if i was missing out on some amazing revelation that RAW processing would produce (e.g. an additional stop of DR!!).

That said, i actually bought LR since im now dual shooting a D700/Df for paid work.. I was able to get away with CNX before with the D700.. but, the 2 camera set-up requires a better sw solution. Im still learning it, but so far im loving it.

 Jogger's gear list:Jogger's gear list
Sony RX100 Sony Cyber-shot DSC-RX10 Nikon D700 Nikon Df Nikon AF-S Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8G ED VR +4 more
Digital Nigel Veteran Member • Posts: 5,728
Re: RX10/100v1 .. worthwhile to shoot RAW?
3

I can't speak for you, but for me, it's definitely worth shooting RAW. In no particular order, here are my reasons:

1. Shooting is quicker and easier, as I don't have to worry about WB or getting the exposure and other shooting parameters exactly right. It's great to extra quality and flexibility with less effort.

2. RAW has much better dynamic range, so high contrast scenes are handled better. You can recover highlights and shadows that aren't possible with JPEGs.

3. Much higher ISOs are usable because of the superior NR available in post-processing. I use DxO, with Prime NR for high ISO shots. I find that even ISO 3200 is usable if needed, with 6400 being just about usable in extreme cases. This lets me use higher shutter speeds for handheld shots in poor light.

4. The wide end of the lens is closer to 25mm equiv, rather than 28, as DxO can uncover extra information at the sides of the image that OOC JPEGs lose.

All-in-all, it's like having a huge hardware upgrade to the camera. However, unlike you, I never use the funky in-camera filters. If I wanted those sort of effects, I'd rather apply them in post-processing, as that's reversible.

 Digital Nigel's gear list:Digital Nigel's gear list
Sony RX100 Panasonic FZ1000 Canon PowerShot G7 X Nikon Coolpix P900 Panasonic ZS100 +13 more
Ron AKA Veteran Member • Posts: 4,875
Re: RX10/100v1 .. worthwhile to shoot RAW?
2

Jogger wrote:

Ron AKA wrote:

If you want my frank opinion, the answer is likely "no". It does not sound like you are a very serious photographer, and you appear to be mostly interested in video and quickie snap shots. Learning to use Lightroom and then actually using it properly takes some learning and time. If you are not willing to do that, then it is probably a waste of time.

Well, for the RX100.. i only use it for random casual photos and such. So, you are prob. right that its not worth it. Ive managed without it for so long.. but, was just wondering if i was missing out on some amazing revelation that RAW processing would produce (e.g. an additional stop of DR!!).

That said, i actually bought LR since im now dual shooting a D700/Df for paid work.. I was able to get away with CNX before with the D700.. but, the 2 camera set-up requires a better sw solution. Im still learning it, but so far im loving it.

My standard advice is that if you are going to post process, then shoot RAW with good focus and exposure. If you are not going to PP, then shoot JPEG and learn to use all the bells and whistle tricks on the camera. PP will produce better results, but for many it is not worth the effort.

 Ron AKA's gear list:Ron AKA's gear list
Sony RX100 Epson Stylus Photo R3000 +1 more
Digital Nigel Veteran Member • Posts: 5,728
Re: RX10/100v1 .. worthwhile to shoot RAW?

Ron AKA wrote:

Jogger wrote:

Ron AKA wrote:

If you want my frank opinion, the answer is likely "no". It does not sound like you are a very serious photographer, and you appear to be mostly interested in video and quickie snap shots. Learning to use Lightroom and then actually using it properly takes some learning and time. If you are not willing to do that, then it is probably a waste of time.

Well, for the RX100.. i only use it for random casual photos and such. So, you are prob. right that its not worth it. Ive managed without it for so long.. but, was just wondering if i was missing out on some amazing revelation that RAW processing would produce (e.g. an additional stop of DR!!).

That said, i actually bought LR since im now dual shooting a D700/Df for paid work.. I was able to get away with CNX before with the D700.. but, the 2 camera set-up requires a better sw solution. Im still learning it, but so far im loving it.

My standard advice is that if you are going to post process, then shoot RAW with good focus and exposure. If you are not going to PP, then shoot JPEG and learn to use all the bells and whistle tricks on the camera. PP will produce better results, but for many it is not worth the effort.

Yes, very good advice.

 Digital Nigel's gear list:Digital Nigel's gear list
Sony RX100 Panasonic FZ1000 Canon PowerShot G7 X Nikon Coolpix P900 Panasonic ZS100 +13 more
jonrobertp Forum Pro • Posts: 12,856
Re: RX10/100v1 .. worthwhile to shoot RAW?
1

Shoot jpg and process in PSE using camera raw. EV and colors are very adjustable. I have prints to 20x30 to back this up.

 jonrobertp's gear list:jonrobertp's gear list
Canon PowerShot G7 X Canon G3 X Panasonic ZS100 Canon EOS 70D
Ron AKA Veteran Member • Posts: 4,875
Re: RX10/100v1 .. worthwhile to shoot RAW?

Jogger wrote:

but, was just wondering if i was missing out on some amazing revelation that RAW processing would produce (e.g. an additional stop of DR!!).

The article at this link explains the technical benefits of using the RAW file for post processing.

 Ron AKA's gear list:Ron AKA's gear list
Sony RX100 Epson Stylus Photo R3000 +1 more
Ron AKA Veteran Member • Posts: 4,875
Re: RX10/100v1 .. worthwhile to shoot RAW?
2

jonrobertp wrote:

Shoot jpg and process in PSE using camera raw. EV and colors are very adjustable. I have prints to 20x30 to back this up

Post processing is time consuming. Here is a good article explaining what you are missing by using JPEG's for the basis of post processing. It makes sense to me to start with the best data if you are going to expend that effort. File size with the low cost and large sizes of memory has become a non issue.

 Ron AKA's gear list:Ron AKA's gear list
Sony RX100 Epson Stylus Photo R3000 +1 more
Michael Fritzen Veteran Member • Posts: 5,246
Re: RX10/100v1 .. worthwhile to shoot RAW?

Hi,

complex question. For an instance compare it to supermarket ready-pizza vs. making one all by your own of individually bought ingredients. And I wouldn't like to stress in this comparison too much the quality aspect - which may be there but relevant to what amount and relevant to the quality demands of whom? In part, for sure, it's about convenience. Then again it's about liking or not of the "workflow" as a whole from the start to the end result. Who likes to cook or not. Who has the time available or not. Who likes to spend the time doing certain things or not and closely related, to spend the amount of time with certain things or not. To fuss about subtilities which go from hardly noticeable for ones while for others it's about worlds apart. It's about compromises and decisions and consequences which the decision have. Hardly right or wrong.

-- hide signature --

Cheers,
Michael Fritzen

cchen2
cchen2 Senior Member • Posts: 1,095
Re: RX10/100v1 .. worthwhile to shoot RAW?
1

Holy cow, this is new information to me (the comment on editing JPG's w/ Camera RAW). Thank you soooooo much. I had no idea that this was even an option!! This is so fantastic- I can't wait to get home to try it on my home computer!

 cchen2's gear list:cchen2's gear list
Sony Cyber-shot DSC-RX10 Sony a6000 Sony E 50mm F1.8 OSS Sony E PZ 18-105mm F4 G OSS Samyang 12mm F2 NCS CS
Ron AKA Veteran Member • Posts: 4,875
Re: RX10/100v1 .. worthwhile to shoot RAW?

cchen2 wrote:

Holy cow, this is new information to me (the comment on editing JPG's w/ Camera RAW). Thank you soooooo much. I had no idea that this was even an option!! This is so fantastic- I can't wait to get home to try it on my home computer!

You need software on your computer that can open and edit your RAW files. Sony provides a free download of Image Data Converter which does this task. However, it is very slow and as a result difficult to use. If you just want to test it, I would suggest downloading a free trial of Photoshop Elements 12. In the Photo Editor you will have to go to Help, Update Software, and download the latest version of the Adobe Camera RAW plug-in. With that installed it should open your RX10 files and you can determine if you like it. Some basic instructions on how to use Adobe Camera RAW plug in can be found in these video links.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ncyIyMBVJw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d5MoEox8GMc

 Ron AKA's gear list:Ron AKA's gear list
Sony RX100 Epson Stylus Photo R3000 +1 more
cchen2
cchen2 Senior Member • Posts: 1,095
Re: RX10/100v1 .. worthwhile to shoot RAW?
1

thanks, I have PSE 10 and now Lightroom 5.  Hopefully that will be enough.  If true, that will give me most of what I'm using Raw for now.

 cchen2's gear list:cchen2's gear list
Sony Cyber-shot DSC-RX10 Sony a6000 Sony E 50mm F1.8 OSS Sony E PZ 18-105mm F4 G OSS Samyang 12mm F2 NCS CS
DavidFromPhila Regular Member • Posts: 155
Re: RX10/100v1 .. worthwhile to shoot RAW?
1

For me it boils down to the type of shooting I'm doing. If I am just doing family snapshots, then jpg is fine. But if there's any possibility that I could be going for more, then I shoot RAW. What's amazing about the RX100 is how great the RAW files are... so there is the potential with a pocket camera to get a truly great image.

Wilhelm Senior Member • Posts: 1,086
RAW is just a three letter word for pretention.

They think that they're better than us Point and Clickers.

But the proof is how good the prints are, not what it looks like at 1:1 on the magic screen.

Ron AKA Veteran Member • Posts: 4,875
Re: RX10/100v1 .. worthwhile to shoot RAW?

cchen2 wrote:

thanks, I have PSE 10 and now Lightroom 5. Hopefully that will be enough. If true, that will give me most of what I'm using Raw for now.

PSE 10 will not open your RX10 RAW files, but with the most recent update (5.3?), your Lr 5 will. Once you convert to a JPEG or TIFF then you can export to PSE 10 for further pixel editing. But the Adobe Camera RAW part of PSE 10 is too old to open the RAW file directly.

 Ron AKA's gear list:Ron AKA's gear list
Sony RX100 Epson Stylus Photo R3000 +1 more
jonrobertp Forum Pro • Posts: 12,856
Re: RX10/100v1 .. worthwhile to shoot RAW?

cchen2 wrote:

Holy cow, this is new information to me (the comment on editing JPG's w/ Camera RAW). Thank you soooooo much. I had no idea that this was even an option!! This is so fantastic- I can't wait to get home to try it on my home computer!

You're welcome. It works very well.  On your PSE, at the bottom, there are options to check off.  Pick Camera Raw, and a new window opens...which has much to offer, without having to do the whole raw thing.  I've done raw, and I've done this...more often now, this.  Have fun !

 jonrobertp's gear list:jonrobertp's gear list
Canon PowerShot G7 X Canon G3 X Panasonic ZS100 Canon EOS 70D
Digital Nigel Veteran Member • Posts: 5,728
Re: RX10/100v1 .. worthwhile to shoot RAW?

jonrobertp wrote:

cchen2 wrote:

Holy cow, this is new information to me (the comment on editing JPG's w/ Camera RAW). Thank you soooooo much. I had no idea that this was even an option!! This is so fantastic- I can't wait to get home to try it on my home computer!

You're welcome. It works very well. On your PSE, at the bottom, there are options to check off. Pick Camera Raw, and a new window opens...which has much to offer, without having to do the whole raw thing. I've done raw, and I've done this...more often now, this. Have fun !

Why is it better than starting with an actual RAW image?  It seems like the same amount of effort, but with an inferior input. Why not get the extra advantages that using a RAW file brings, such as more dynamic range, better shadow/highlight recovery, more WB flexibility, more scope to recover badly exposed shots?  JPEGs are fine if you don't like post-processing, but if you're going to post-process anyway, start with the best possible raw material.

 Digital Nigel's gear list:Digital Nigel's gear list
Sony RX100 Panasonic FZ1000 Canon PowerShot G7 X Nikon Coolpix P900 Panasonic ZS100 +13 more
jonrobertp Forum Pro • Posts: 12,856
Go camera raw and remain happy. :)
1

Digital Nigel wrote:

jonrobertp wrote:

cchen2 wrote:

Holy cow, this is new information to me (the comment on editing JPG's w/ Camera RAW). Thank you soooooo much. I had no idea that this was even an option!! This is so fantastic- I can't wait to get home to try it on my home computer!

You're welcome. It works very well. On your PSE, at the bottom, there are options to check off. Pick Camera Raw, and a new window opens...which has much to offer, without having to do the whole raw thing. I've done raw, and I've done this...more often now, this. Have fun !

Why is it better than starting with an actual RAW image? It seems like the same amount of effort, but with an inferior input. Why not get the extra advantages that using a RAW file brings, such as more dynamic range, better shadow/highlight recovery, more WB flexibility, more scope to recover badly exposed shots? JPEGs are fine if you don't like post-processing, but if you're going to post-process anyway, start with the best possible raw material.

Seems you missed the point. Who said raw didn't offer more ??

To repeat : camera raw is a great thing to use if you don't want to collect huge raw files and be forced into tedious computer work just to get the last wee bit of DR out of a regular image. Less hassle, fewer programs to learn, less space needed in camera and on computer, and most of the benefits. And before posting or printing, every image resorts back to yet another jpg. Always. I ask you, how many raw files have you sold, and how many jpgs ?

 jonrobertp's gear list:jonrobertp's gear list
Canon PowerShot G7 X Canon G3 X Panasonic ZS100 Canon EOS 70D
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