Memes and Trolling

Started Feb 20, 2014 | Discussions
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(unknown member) Contributing Member • Posts: 578
Re: Memes and Trolling

nixda wrote:

LWS2013 wrote:

nixda wrote:

flbrit wrote:

michelowski wrote:

Oh god, my X-T1 is broken I see nothing when I use flash... Oh god, is my X-Pro1 going to die, it got hit by a raindrop and it's not weather sealed... Oh god I've got the orbs... Oh god I took a picture of leaves and now they look like green makkaroni - - Is that what you mean?

Yep, that's what I meme. Plus the dreaded skin disorder.

I am really worried about the 86,000 PDAF pixels that critically impair the color reproduction capabilities of the latest sensors.

Also, we all know that raw converters cannot process X-Trans files.

Seriously, though, many of these 'issues' are simply based on ignorance. But it is a bit frightening that they are oftentimes presented by people coming from other systems and looking at the Fuji cameras for the first time. There is a lot of misconceptions floating around on the Interweb, but it's no different for any other camera system.

If those 'issues' are simply based on ignorance then why do you see them raised time and again only in the Fuji forum, also are you saying that Fuji user are ignorant?

When I was using a Canon as my primary camera, I saw plenty of similar behavior there. When I check into something about our D7000, I see plenty of trollish or ignorant behavior in the Nikon forum. I do not think the Fuji forum is any different.

yes you do get trolls in other forums there is much more of it in here, there is also a lot of exaggerations made and this constant need to pit the Fuji's against FF DSLR's or the A7/R, no other forum does that.

seems to be a lot of little brother envy so it's hardly a surprise that you get people posting comments that you don't agree with, however just because you don't agree with these people doesn't mean what their saying is any less valid

nixda Veteran Member • Posts: 4,908
Re: I'm a JPEG shooter
2

taz98spin wrote:

nixda wrote:

taz98spin wrote:

nixda wrote:

DocetLector wrote:

agree 100% ! Just recently a guy opened up a thread about waxy skin tones, showing a photo which was out of focus, way off WB and badly exposed. I would really like to know if those people do have Fuji gear because it is so easy to open up a new thread in another forum, claiming I have a camera this or that brand. Who can verify ? May be just trolls!

There are trollish topics, for sure, but that one isn't one of them. The plasticky skin rendition is a well-known flaw in the JPEG engine of the newer cameras. Whether it's blown out of proportion is another matter, but for JPEG shooters it is a legitimate problem.

I'm a JPEG shooter. Even for weddings, engagements, and studio sessions, I use JPEGs only.

I have deadlines to meet for my clients, and a full time job outside of photography, so I try to get everything right in camera, so I can spend minimum time in photoshop.

However, I've never had issues with plasticky skin as bad as the other thread showed. It looks like the photo was out of focus, and he adjusted the clarity setting to the extreme.

Besides, if waxy skin is a such a well-known issue, shoulnd't owners of the Fuji cameras should avoid high ISO or shoot RAW or use a flash?

That is better discussed in the other threads that deal with the subject, but yes, your suggestion is quite valid. However, a lot of people are ticked off by the fact that the X-Pro1 and the X-E1 do not show that behavior nearly as bad (if at all) as the X-E2. It has less to do with shooting technique than with Fuji's implementation of the JPEG engine. They as much as admitted that they render images to satisfy certain markets, which might not satisfy other markets.

Didn't know about that fact. Well, I'm Asian, so maybe that's why I like the JPEGS?

Film makers always had different versions for different markets. It's not surprising that this notion carried over to the digital world. IMO, though, it doesn't make any sense in this modern day and age.

But than again, my clients are Caucasian and they don't have issues with images.. humm.

It seems you are more careful about your high-ISO images then. Perhaps more constructive would be to educate the person (as others have done in that thread) instead of chastising him/her. Sometimes, as I mentioned above, it's simply honest ignorance that's the problem. I tend to give people the benefit of the doubt until a pattern emerges that may make me rethink my attitude.

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nixda Veteran Member • Posts: 4,908
Re: Memes and Trolling
1

LWS2013 wrote:

nixda wrote:

LWS2013 wrote:

nixda wrote:

flbrit wrote:

michelowski wrote:

Oh god, my X-T1 is broken I see nothing when I use flash... Oh god, is my X-Pro1 going to die, it got hit by a raindrop and it's not weather sealed... Oh god I've got the orbs... Oh god I took a picture of leaves and now they look like green makkaroni - - Is that what you mean?

Yep, that's what I meme. Plus the dreaded skin disorder.

I am really worried about the 86,000 PDAF pixels that critically impair the color reproduction capabilities of the latest sensors.

Also, we all know that raw converters cannot process X-Trans files.

Seriously, though, many of these 'issues' are simply based on ignorance. But it is a bit frightening that they are oftentimes presented by people coming from other systems and looking at the Fuji cameras for the first time. There is a lot of misconceptions floating around on the Interweb, but it's no different for any other camera system.

If those 'issues' are simply based on ignorance then why do you see them raised time and again only in the Fuji forum, also are you saying that Fuji user are ignorant?

When I was using a Canon as my primary camera, I saw plenty of similar behavior there. When I check into something about our D7000, I see plenty of trollish or ignorant behavior in the Nikon forum. I do not think the Fuji forum is any different.

yes you do get trolls in other forums there is much more of it in here, there is also a lot of exaggerations made and this constant need to pit the Fuji's against FF DSLR's or the A7/R, no other forum does that.

That is in fact partly Fuji's own fault. They started out with the X-Pro1 claiming that it's 'as good as FF'. Subsequently, a lot of people investigated that claim, leading to a ton of very heated discussions. I remember those days...

 nixda's gear list:nixda's gear list
Fujifilm X-E1 Fujifilm XF 14mm F2.8 R Fujifilm XF 18-55mm F2.8-4 R LM OIS Fujifilm XF 55-200mm F3.5-4.8 R LM OIS Fujifilm XF 27mm F2.8 +1 more
bigpigbig Senior Member • Posts: 1,721
Re: Memes and Trolling

nixda wrote:

LWS2013 wrote:

nixda wrote:

LWS2013 wrote:

nixda wrote:

flbrit wrote:

michelowski wrote:

Oh god, my X-T1 is broken I see nothing when I use flash... Oh god, is my X-Pro1 going to die, it got hit by a raindrop and it's not weather sealed... Oh god I've got the orbs... Oh god I took a picture of leaves and now they look like green makkaroni - - Is that what you mean?

Yep, that's what I meme. Plus the dreaded skin disorder.

I am really worried about the 86,000 PDAF pixels that critically impair the color reproduction capabilities of the latest sensors.

Also, we all know that raw converters cannot process X-Trans files.

Seriously, though, many of these 'issues' are simply based on ignorance. But it is a bit frightening that they are oftentimes presented by people coming from other systems and looking at the Fuji cameras for the first time. There is a lot of misconceptions floating around on the Interweb, but it's no different for any other camera system.

If those 'issues' are simply based on ignorance then why do you see them raised time and again only in the Fuji forum, also are you saying that Fuji user are ignorant?

When I was using a Canon as my primary camera, I saw plenty of similar behavior there. When I check into something about our D7000, I see plenty of trollish or ignorant behavior in the Nikon forum. I do not think the Fuji forum is any different.

yes you do get trolls in other forums there is much more of it in here, there is also a lot of exaggerations made and this constant need to pit the Fuji's against FF DSLR's or the A7/R, no other forum does that.

That is in fact partly Fuji's own fault. They started out with the X-Pro1 claiming that it's 'as good as FF'. Subsequently, a lot of people investigated that claim, leading to a ton of very heated discussions. I remember those days...

Hmmm, not sure about al that. I for one, dream of the day that a FF camera becomes unnecessary for what I do. The X-T1 is the closest yet. It is exciting to me. I am happy to see it close the gap in AF ability.

This is a gear forum. Isn't comparing gear part and parcel of what is "supposed" to happen here?

People talk about FF and APS-C being apples and oranges, but it is just not the case. The only difference is about 33% smaller sensor. Otherwise it is apples and apples.

Go Fuji, Go!

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daddyman Regular Member • Posts: 181
Re: Memes and Trolling

While some of this is obviously trolling (you can typically tell by the tone of the discussion), I think some of it is people who will always see the glass half empty instead of half full. There will always be people who intensely look for (and fixate on) the negatives of a product instead of enjoying it's virtues.

Mike

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taz98spin Contributing Member • Posts: 533
Re: I'm a JPEG shooter

nixda wrote:

taz98spin wrote:

nixda wrote:

taz98spin wrote:

nixda wrote:

DocetLector wrote:

agree 100% ! Just recently a guy opened up a thread about waxy skin tones, showing a photo which was out of focus, way off WB and badly exposed. I would really like to know if those people do have Fuji gear because it is so easy to open up a new thread in another forum, claiming I have a camera this or that brand. Who can verify ? May be just trolls!

There are trollish topics, for sure, but that one isn't one of them. The plasticky skin rendition is a well-known flaw in the JPEG engine of the newer cameras. Whether it's blown out of proportion is another matter, but for JPEG shooters it is a legitimate problem.

I'm a JPEG shooter. Even for weddings, engagements, and studio sessions, I use JPEGs only.

I have deadlines to meet for my clients, and a full time job outside of photography, so I try to get everything right in camera, so I can spend minimum time in photoshop.

However, I've never had issues with plasticky skin as bad as the other thread showed. It looks like the photo was out of focus, and he adjusted the clarity setting to the extreme.

Besides, if waxy skin is a such a well-known issue, shoulnd't owners of the Fuji cameras should avoid high ISO or shoot RAW or use a flash?

That is better discussed in the other threads that deal with the subject, but yes, your suggestion is quite valid. However, a lot of people are ticked off by the fact that the X-Pro1 and the X-E1 do not show that behavior nearly as bad (if at all) as the X-E2. It has less to do with shooting technique than with Fuji's implementation of the JPEG engine. They as much as admitted that they render images to satisfy certain markets, which might not satisfy other markets.

Didn't know about that fact. Well, I'm Asian, so maybe that's why I like the JPEGS?

Film makers always had different versions for different markets. It's not surprising that this notion carried over to the digital world. IMO, though, it doesn't make any sense in this modern day and age.

But than again, my clients are Caucasian and they don't have issues with images.. humm.

It seems you are more careful about your high-ISO images then. Perhaps more constructive would be to educate the person (as others have done in that thread) instead of chastising him/her. Sometimes, as I mentioned above, it's simply honest ignorance that's the problem. I tend to give people the benefit of the doubt until a pattern emerges that may make me rethink my attitude.

I totally agree and even liked your comment!

However, I went over to his flickr account and he/she has no information or even a self explanation about his profile had me doubting.

-- hide signature --
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flbrit OP Veteran Member • Posts: 3,780
Re: Memes and Trolling
2

nixda wrote:

There are trollish topics, for sure, but that one isn't one of them. The plasticky skin rendition is a well-known flaw in the JPEG engine of the newer cameras. Whether it's blown out of proportion is another matter, but for JPEG shooters it is a legitimate problem.

I agree that there are issues. All systems have them. I am also sure that this forum has helped improve the system in that Fuji do watch what is going on. Valid comments about performance are needed.

An example. One issue is presented as 'plastic' and that is the catch phrase that has caught on. As you rightly say, the real id of the issue is that some/many people complain about what they consider excessive noise reduction at high iso in the jpg engine. Processing from RAW or shooting at lower iso does not cause this.

There are many other threads along these lines.

Relative newcomers to the forum seeking info on the system then latch on to the catch phrases.

I am not saying these topics should not be discussed, just the tone/content seems way off from some people.

I came here as an experienced DSLR shooter and had to really sort out the wheat from the chaff. I'm glad I did as its a great system. But then I had the experience to be able to do that.

On Edit, I do believe this problem is worse here than in some of the other forums.

Brian

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gskolenda
gskolenda Senior Member • Posts: 1,053
Re: Memes and Trolling
2

flbrit wrote:

Just be careful forum. It starts off as fun then gains traction and can do damage.

Not saying some 'facts' exist but the framing of the discussion and continual misrepresentation will damage the brand.

Brian

It's our job to differentiate the facts, stated in any Review, Public Forum, or Blog. If you start to control what you want said, then the freedom of expression will be tainted. Not good, leave well enough alone and let us as members or frequent guests sort out the facts.

When I find a place that I converse in and it's controlled or there are too many Forum Nazi'z, I'm pretty much done with it because now it's lost it's freedom of speech and trust.

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Sony RX10 III
57LowRider Senior Member • Posts: 3,862
Re: Memes and Trolling
3

It's unfortunate that there are a number of threads started which are along the lines of "This camera is no good, it doesn't do XYZ" when in fact, that title should be "Please help, I haven't bothered to read the manual and I don't know how to use this camera". Because people skim thread titles, a completely wrong impression can be given.

I set this aside from genuine issues, btw, where a manufacturer's claim clearly isn't being fulfilled.

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Graham Hill Senior Member • Posts: 1,355
Re: Memes and Trolling
1

gskolenda wrote:

flbrit wrote:

Just be careful forum. It starts off as fun then gains traction and can do damage.

Not saying some 'facts' exist but the framing of the discussion and continual misrepresentation will damage the brand.

Brian

It's our job to differentiate the facts, stated in any Review, Public Forum, or Blog. If you start to control what you want said, then the freedom of expression will be tainted. Not good, leave well enough alone and let us as members or frequent guests sort out the facts.

When I find a place that I converse in and it's controlled or there are too many Forum Nazi'z, I'm pretty much done with it because now it's lost it's freedom of speech and trust.

Best post I've read in a LOOOOONG time.

Alohaman Contributing Member • Posts: 576
Re: Memes and Trolling

flbrit wrote:

Just be careful forum. It starts off as fun then gains traction and can do damage.

Not saying some 'facts' exist but the framing of the discussion and continual misrepresentation will damage the brand.

Brian

I'm happy with the Canon, Sony and Fuji I have! I can't stand it! Got to buy a Hasselblad Lunar to get into the right frame of mind.

 Alohaman's gear list:Alohaman's gear list
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Joel Stern
Joel Stern Forum Pro • Posts: 10,925
Re: Memes and Trolling

taz98spin wrote:

DocetLector wrote:

agree 100% ! Just recently a guy opened up a thread about waxy skin tones, showing a photo which was out of focus, way off WB and badly exposed. I would really like to know if those people do have Fuji gear because it is so easy to open up a new thread in another forum, claiming I have a camera this or that brand. Who can verify ? May be just trolls!

I know.. I thought my internet browser was acting up, because I couldn't verify where the focus was and couldn't see the EXIF data.

-- hide signature --

On the m43 forum, due to images posted on DPR in comparing cameras, there is a belief that fuji applies NR to RAW.  Yes, it is all over, I even bought into thst one when viewing the DPR images.

-- hide signature --

If i am typing on my iPad, please excuse any typos.

Joel Stern
Joel Stern Forum Pro • Posts: 10,925
Re: I'm a JPEG shooter

nixda wrote:

taz98spin wrote:

nixda wrote:

DocetLector wrote:

agree 100% ! Just recently a guy opened up a thread about waxy skin tones, showing a photo which was out of focus, way off WB and badly exposed. I would really like to know if those people do have Fuji gear because it is so easy to open up a new thread in another forum, claiming I have a camera this or that brand. Who can verify ? May be just trolls!

There are trollish topics, for sure, but that one isn't one of them. The plasticky skin rendition is a well-known flaw in the JPEG engine of the newer cameras. Whether it's blown out of proportion is another matter, but for JPEG shooters it is a legitimate problem.

I'm a JPEG shooter. Even for weddings, engagements, and studio sessions, I use JPEGs only.

I have deadlines to meet for my clients, and a full time job outside of photography, so I try to get everything right in camera, so I can spend minimum time in photoshop.

However, I've never had issues with plasticky skin as bad as the other thread showed. It looks like the photo was out of focus, and he adjusted the clarity setting to the extreme.

Besides, if waxy skin is a such a well-known issue, shoulnd't owners of the Fuji cameras should avoid high ISO or shoot RAW or use a flash?

That is better discussed in the other threads that deal with the subject, but yes, your suggestion is quite valid. However, a lot of people are ticked off by the fact that the X-Pro1 and the X-E1 do not show that behavior nearly as bad (if at all) as the X-E2. It has less to do with shooting technique than with Fuji's implementation of the JPEG engine. They as much as admitted that they render images to satisfy certain markets, which might not satisfy other markets.

And people hated the 100s vs the 100

-- hide signature --

If i am typing on my iPad, please excuse any typos.

flbrit OP Veteran Member • Posts: 3,780
Re: Memes and Trolling

gskolenda wrote:

flbrit wrote:

Just be careful forum. It starts off as fun then gains traction and can do damage.

Not saying some 'facts' exist but the framing of the discussion and continual misrepresentation will damage the brand.

Brian

It's our job to differentiate the facts, stated in any Review, Public Forum, or Blog. If you start to control what you want said, then the freedom of expression will be tainted. Not good, leave well enough alone and let us as members or frequent guests sort out the facts.

When I find a place that I converse in and it's controlled or there are too many Forum Nazi'z, I'm pretty much done with it because now it's lost it's freedom of speech and trust.

WOW! Nazi! Really!

LOL

Brian

 flbrit's gear list:flbrit's gear list
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Graham Hill Senior Member • Posts: 1,355
Re: Memes and Trolling
1

flbrit wrote:

gskolenda wrote:

flbrit wrote:

Just be careful forum. It starts off as fun then gains traction and can do damage.

Not saying some 'facts' exist but the framing of the discussion and continual misrepresentation will damage the brand.

Brian

It's our job to differentiate the facts, stated in any Review, Public Forum, or Blog. If you start to control what you want said, then the freedom of expression will be tainted. Not good, leave well enough alone and let us as members or frequent guests sort out the facts.

When I find a place that I converse in and it's controlled or there are too many Forum Nazi'z, I'm pretty much done with it because now it's lost it's freedom of speech and trust.

WOW! Nazi! Really!

LOL

Brian

We are not surprised that you fail to understand.

Alohaman Contributing Member • Posts: 576
Re: Memes and Trolling
1

Graham Hill wrote:

flbrit wrote:

gskolenda wrote:

flbrit wrote:

Just be careful forum. It starts off as fun then gains traction and can do damage.

Not saying some 'facts' exist but the framing of the discussion and continual misrepresentation will damage the brand.

Brian

It's our job to differentiate the facts, stated in any Review, Public Forum, or Blog. If you start to control what you want said, then the freedom of expression will be tainted. Not good, leave well enough alone and let us as members or frequent guests sort out the facts.

When I find a place that I converse in and it's controlled or there are too many Forum Nazi'z, I'm pretty much done with it because now it's lost it's freedom of speech and trust.

WOW! Nazi! Really!

LOL

Brian

We are not surprised that you fail to understand.

I some wise person said that whoever uses the "Nazi-card" first usually looses the argument.

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57LowRider Senior Member • Posts: 3,862
Godwin's Law
1

Alohaman wrote:

Graham Hill wrote:

flbrit wrote:

gskolenda wrote:

flbrit wrote:

Just be careful forum. It starts off as fun then gains traction and can do damage.

Not saying some 'facts' exist but the framing of the discussion and continual misrepresentation will damage the brand.

Brian

It's our job to differentiate the facts, stated in any Review, Public Forum, or Blog. If you start to control what you want said, then the freedom of expression will be tainted. Not good, leave well enough alone and let us as members or frequent guests sort out the facts.

When I find a place that I converse in and it's controlled or there are too many Forum Nazi'z, I'm pretty much done with it because now it's lost it's freedom of speech and trust.

WOW! Nazi! Really!

LOL

Brian

We are not surprised that you fail to understand.

I some wise person said that whoever uses the "Nazi-card" first usually looses the argument.

Nothing about winning or losing an argument, everything about thread length and probability

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law

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flbrit OP Veteran Member • Posts: 3,780
Re: Godwin's Law

Well, go to the foot of our stairs! Another learning experience. Thanks.

Brian

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n3eg
n3eg Senior Member • Posts: 1,894
Re: Memes and Trolling

flbrit wrote:

Just be careful forum. It starts off as fun then gains traction and can do damage.

Not saying some 'facts' exist but the framing of the discussion and continual misrepresentation will damage the brand.

Brian

My favorite:  "My camera has shutter shock."

More like:  "My camera, under certain conditions, can exhibit shutter shock."

I once held my camera by the end of a long telephoto lens and produced the most unbelievably horrible shutter shock image ever, just for fun.  It was so bad you could see it on the LCD.  Some would say that it's the camera's fault and the manufacturer is evil for not fixing it.

-- hide signature --

It ain't easy being me, but someone's gotta do it.

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LaFonte Senior Member • Posts: 2,757
Re: Memes and Trolling

bigpigbig wrote:

nixda wrote:

LWS2013 wrote:

nixda wrote:

LWS2013 wrote:

nixda wrote:

flbrit wrote:

michelowski wrote:

Oh god, my X-T1 is broken I see nothing when I use flash... Oh god, is my X-Pro1 going to die, it got hit by a raindrop and it's not weather sealed... Oh god I've got the orbs... Oh god I took a picture of leaves and now they look like green makkaroni - - Is that what you mean?

Yep, that's what I meme. Plus the dreaded skin disorder.

I am really worried about the 86,000 PDAF pixels that critically impair the color reproduction capabilities of the latest sensors.

Also, we all know that raw converters cannot process X-Trans files.

Seriously, though, many of these 'issues' are simply based on ignorance. But it is a bit frightening that they are oftentimes presented by people coming from other systems and looking at the Fuji cameras for the first time. There is a lot of misconceptions floating around on the Interweb, but it's no different for any other camera system.

If those 'issues' are simply based on ignorance then why do you see them raised time and again only in the Fuji forum, also are you saying that Fuji user are ignorant?

When I was using a Canon as my primary camera, I saw plenty of similar behavior there. When I check into something about our D7000, I see plenty of trollish or ignorant behavior in the Nikon forum. I do not think the Fuji forum is any different.

yes you do get trolls in other forums there is much more of it in here, there is also a lot of exaggerations made and this constant need to pit the Fuji's against FF DSLR's or the A7/R, no other forum does that.

That is in fact partly Fuji's own fault. They started out with the X-Pro1 claiming that it's 'as good as FF'. Subsequently, a lot of people investigated that claim, leading to a ton of very heated discussions. I remember those days...

Hmmm, not sure about al that. I for one, dream of the day that a FF camera becomes unnecessary for what I do. The X-T1 is the closest yet. It is exciting to me. I am happy to see it close the gap in AF ability.

This is a gear forum. Isn't comparing gear part and parcel of what is "supposed" to happen here?

People talk about FF and APS-C being apples and oranges, but it is just not the case. The only difference is about 33% smaller sensor. Otherwise it is apples and apples.

Go Fuji, Go!

Fuji was also telling us about xpro1 as being fastest focusing camera with 0.005 s lag. This was also deceiving as it is using one real number (lag) to give impression of something else in this particular case the speed of auto focus.  So no wonder people would complain that their world fastest focusing camera is somehow not that fast.

And don't forget that the goal of consumers is to consume, go and buy. Repeatedly. We have very little to say about anything else so if a camera is hyped and it doesn't live to its hype then there are complains.

I think Fuji should start selling the cameras in more professional manner (the old canon.Nikon way) not the apple way. Bring up the real strengths, don't try to invent names and hyped technologies for the smallest least important things and for our sake stop the bs about world fastest, best or prettiest.

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