Swapping EM1 for A7

Started Oct 17, 2013 | Discussions
Daniel Lauring
Daniel Lauring Veteran Member • Posts: 9,342
Re: A7 is very mature

captura wrote:

I believe the RX cameras were only the test mule for the A7 and A7r. High priced and no advantage.

Not necessarily.  There is always a place for fixed lens cameras, like the RX1, Fuji X100, Leica X2, Sigma Merrill, etc.

jalywol
jalywol Veteran Member • Posts: 9,314
Uh, no, the GX7 and GM1 sensors are made by Panasonic.

Harold66 wrote:

GX7 sensor is also a Sony , most likely the same one as in the Em-5

Harold

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There is a lot of info about the technology in it floating around out there, including larger photodiodes and different microlenses, and Panasonic has said they are the designer and manufacturer of this particular sensor. (I think 43Rumors has info in this somewhere in one of its posts).  It is NOT a Sony sensor.

-J

Moti Veteran Member • Posts: 8,159
Swapping too but a bit differently...

From EM5 to EM1 so if you sell your, I might be a buyer providing the price is good.

Moti

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Moti Veteran Member • Posts: 8,159
Congratulations...
1

sigala1 wrote:

Considering that you can only shoot with one lens on the camera at a time, five lenses is four more than you really need.

You have just made your way up to the final judgement of the dumbest post of the year award.

Congratulations

Moti

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Ag_Paladin Contributing Member • Posts: 683
Re: Swapping EM1 for A7

GX7 sensor is also a Sony , most likely the same one as in the Em-5

Harold

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Wrong. It's panasonic. The only sony sensor used by panasonic is the one in the gh3. Look at the dxo scores and you will see

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captura Forum Pro • Posts: 24,619
Re: A7 is very mature

Daniel Lauring wrote:

captura wrote:

I believe the RX cameras were only the test mule for the A7 and A7r. High priced and no advantage.

Not necessarily. There is always a place for fixed lens cameras, like the RX1, Fuji X100, Leica X2, Sigma Merrill, etc.

But are there any advantages of the RX1 over the A7? In other words, why should anyone buy the RX1 now that the A7 is out?

(one possibility is that the RX1 lens is very superior to, say, the Zeiss FE 35/2.8 lens. Maybe?)

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gotompoes Regular Member • Posts: 498
Re: Swapping EM1 for A7

Daniel Lauring wrote:

Quite different cameras.

The E-M1 is the fastest, most reliable focussing mirror less available. Early reviews suggest the A7r and unfortunately, even the A7 are on par with the R1 and R1r, which aren't renowned for their focus performance.

There are less lenses available for the new Sony mount and the fast zooms and primes coming out are going to be pro level expensive. Of course the lenses will be 3 times larger than the m43 counterparts which will make an especially big difference with long glass.

The Sony A's will get you a couple stops worth of light though...ditto for DOF and FOV.

The AF on the Fuji X camera's is not very good but still it became a cult system.

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Daniel Lauring
Daniel Lauring Veteran Member • Posts: 9,342
Re: Swapping EM1 for A7

gotompoes wrote:

Daniel Lauring wrote:

Quite different cameras.

The E-M1 is the fastest, most reliable focussing mirror less available. Early reviews suggest the A7r and unfortunately, even the A7 are on par with the R1 and R1r, which aren't renowned for their focus performance.

The AF on the Fuji X camera's is not very good but still it became a cult system.

Ditto for the R1 and R1r.  Something to keep in mind however, when choosing the new A's.

Speaking of Fuji, I bought an X-E1 almost a year ago.  I also have an E-M5.  I was constantly frustrated by the X-E1's unreliable focus vs. the E-M5 and ended up shelving it...until recently when I actually got it back out to clean up and sell.  Updated the X-E1's firmware and the focus performance went from unreliable to pretty good...though still no match for the E-M5.

Ulric Veteran Member • Posts: 4,532
Re: A7 is very mature

captura wrote:

All NEX development has been cancelled and Sony has dropped the NEX name for new models. Leaving all NEX owners including me, high and dry. A7 and NEX share the e-mount, but if you run the crop NEX lens on the A7 you get only 10 mp.

Where Nikon and Canon give their APS-C bodies FF hand-me-downs, Sony go for hand-me-ups.

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Daniel Lauring
Daniel Lauring Veteran Member • Posts: 9,342
Re: A7 is very mature

captura wrote:

But are there any advantages of the RX1 over the A7? In other words, why should anyone buy the RX1 now that the A7 is out?

(one possibility is that the RX1 lens is very superior to, say, the Zeiss FE 35/2.8 lens. Maybe?)

A combination of size, simplicity and lens quality.  I doubt there will be native lens equal to the size and quality of the one on the RX1 that will be as small.

Daniel Lauring
Daniel Lauring Veteran Member • Posts: 9,342
Re: A7 is very mature

captura wrote:

All NEX development has been cancelled and Sony has dropped the NEX name for new models. Leaving all NEX owners including me, high and dry. A7 and NEX share the e-mount, but if you run the crop NEX lens on the A7 you get only 10 mp.

P.S.  It isn't NEX that is dead, it is the Alpha mount.  Sony is going down the same path of Canon and Nikon, offering one mount (NEX) for both FF and APSC (with the difference being Sony is doing it with a "universal" mirrorless mount.)  Sony will continue to sell both APSC and FF, and aftermarket lens companies will continue to offer their lenses in the NEX mount for both.  Of course, all the older native Sony NEX lenses were only designed for APSC so we'll have to wait for the new FF ones to roll out and for Sigma, Tamron and Tokina to start migrating all their lenses to the NEX mount.

Keep in mind, when this happens they will be BIG FF lenses and the savings in size, will only be for the body.  From a handling perspective, one might prefer to have a big old FF SLR body...especially with the longer and larger lenses.

(unknown member) Veteran Member • Posts: 6,192
Re: Swapping EM1 for A7

Isn't it funny how when Sony brought out the 1" sensor Rx100 it was the only camera you would need and large sensor cameras were obsolete. Now they have brought out a full frame camera and now that apparently s the only camera you will ever need. I wish they would make their minds up.

I suspect that people will continue to buy all sorts of different cameras for all sorts of reasons.

ianbrown wrote:

Well just my luck only had the EM1 for a week and Sony bring a FF compact system camera out!!!!

Dont get me wrong I really like the EM1, BUT, before I invest in quality lenses for the EM1 I will stick it up for sale.

At least I shouldn't loose too much as the body is difficult to get at the moment

Any one else thinking of swapping?

Ok before anyone says it I have had a few cameras, but like many the A7 is the one I have been waiting for!

Ian

maljo@inreach.com Veteran Member • Posts: 7,517
Interesting decision...

...I have no interest in the full frame Sony.

I have an EM5 and just ordered an EM1 and another lens.

maljo

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captura Forum Pro • Posts: 24,619
Re: A7 is very mature

Daniel Lauring wrote:

captura wrote:

I believe the RX cameras were only the test mule for the A7 and A7r. High priced and no advantage.

Not necessarily. There is always a place for fixed lens cameras, like the RX1, Fuji X100, Leica X2, Sigma Merrill, etc.

Yes, but if the price of the RX1 cameras is as high as the A7/A7r, then there is no advantage for most buyers to get the RX1.

BTW you had mentioned that early reports of the A7/A7r said these were slow focusing.  A later pre-production A7 which I just recently tried was faster focusing, including indoors in low light. Production versions may be better still.

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captura Forum Pro • Posts: 24,619
Re: Uh, no, the GX7 and GM1 sensors are made by Panasonic.

jalywol wrote:

Harold66 wrote:

GX7 sensor is also a Sony , most likely the same one as in the Em-5

Harold

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There is a lot of info about the technology in it floating around out there, including larger photodiodes and different microlenses, and Panasonic has said they are the designer and manufacturer of this particular sensor. (I think 43Rumors has info in this somewhere in one of its posts). It is NOT a Sony sensor.

-J

Thanks, but there were some reports, including by forum members, that this was not a Sony sensor.

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captura Forum Pro • Posts: 24,619
Re: Swapping EM1 for A7

Winston Loo wrote:

GX7 sensor is also a Sony , most likely the same one as in the Em-5

Harold

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Wrong. It's panasonic. The only sony sensor used by panasonic is the one in the gh3. Look at the dxo scores and you will see

I'd heard that. Any speculation on why Pana. can't get or won't use the Sony sensors?

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captura Forum Pro • Posts: 24,619
Re: A7 is very mature

Daniel Lauring wrote:

captura wrote:

But are there any advantages of the RX1 over the A7? In other words, why should anyone buy the RX1 now that the A7 is out?

(one possibility is that the RX1 lens is very superior to, say, the Zeiss FE 35/2.8 lens. Maybe?)

A combination of size, simplicity and lens quality. I doubt there will be native lens equal to the size and quality of the one on the RX1 that will be as small.

Right, the RX1-R lens scored 37 points out of a possible 40, one of the highest ratings ever achieved on DxO.

Speaking of which, I wonder if the DxO scoring system is unfairly biased in favor of the largest sensor cameras, and perhaps the ones with the largest lens-mounts. I didn't originate that idea. To illustrate this; the NIKON 1, a very fine performing system (I have one too) gets in my opinion unrealistically low test scores.

If this effect is true, then m43 should also achieve higher DxO test scores compared to the present, when measured against APS-C or FF.

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captura Forum Pro • Posts: 24,619
Re: A7 is very mature

Daniel Lauring wrote:

captura wrote:

All NEX development has been cancelled and Sony has dropped the NEX name for new models. Leaving all NEX owners including me, high and dry. A7 and NEX share the e-mount, but if you run the crop NEX lens on the A7 you get only 10 mp.

P.S. It isn't NEX that is dead, it is the Alpha mount. Sony is going down the same path of Canon and Nikon, offering one mount (NEX) for both FF and APSC (with the difference being Sony is doing it with a "universal" mirrorless mount.) Sony will continue to sell both APSC and FF, and aftermarket lens companies will continue to offer their lenses in the NEX mount for both. Of course, all the older native Sony NEX lenses were only designed for APSC so we'll have to wait for the new FF ones to roll out and for Sigma, Tamron and Tokina to start migrating all their lenses to the NEX mount.

Keep in mind, when this happens they will be BIG FF lenses and the savings in size, will only be for the body. From a handling perspective, one might prefer to have a big old FF SLR body...especially with the longer and larger lenses.

I spoke to a Sony rep at an A7/A7r presentation and he confirmed that all usage of the name 'NEX' has been cancelled.

So far, NEX has represented the small rangefinder cameras with an APS-C sensor and e-mount. There is no indication as the possible continuance of NEX-like APS-C rangefinder cameras from Sony. Not a hint. But a patent drawing surfaced showing a NEX-like camera with FF sensor and e-mount. So with the exception of the junky $400 A3000 model, it may be end-of-the-line.

Leaving the Panasonic GX7 and successors to dominate that body style?

"big old FF SLR body"... I've got one, a Canon Rebel with 6 mp. Works fine, always gets the picture. Don't really need 36 mp. But too heavy to carry around all day.

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captura Forum Pro • Posts: 24,619
Re: Swapping EM1 for A7

Greynerd wrote:

Isn't it funny how when Sony brought out the 1" sensor Rx100 it was the only camera you would need and large sensor cameras were obsolete. Now they have brought out a full frame camera and now that apparently s the only camera you will ever need. I wish they would make their minds up.

I suspect that people will continue to buy all sorts of different cameras for all sorts of reasons.

The RX100 and it's technology has spawned a whole bunch of new and different models built around that 1" sensor. The 2 smart-phone cams, and now the large Superzoom RX10. All very good fixed-lens cameras.

ianbrown wrote:

Well just my luck only had the EM1 for a week and Sony bring a FF compact system camera out!!!!

Dont get me wrong I really like the EM1, BUT, before I invest in quality lenses for the EM1 I will stick it up for sale.

At least I shouldn't loose too much as the body is difficult to get at the moment

Any one else thinking of swapping?

Ok before anyone says it I have had a few cameras, but like many the A7 is the one I have been waiting for!

Ian

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Donny out of Element here Contributing Member • Posts: 996
Re: A7 is very mature

Brian Caslis wrote:

sigala1 wrote:

Skeeterbytes wrote:

Nope.

Lenses, lenses, lenses. Our system is "mature" while the other is still in preschool.

Cheers,

Rick

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"Whiskey is for drinking, digicams are for fighting over."
—Mark Twain

This is not really a whole new product for Sony but an enhancement of their already excellent NEX and RX1 products.

And Sony has already announced a pretty large number of FE lenses.

And before the end of 2013 you will have exactly two native choices. The 28-70 kit zoom and the 35mm $800 price.

Ever notice they promised lots of lenses for NEX also? How's that going? Let me get my fast portrait prime for NEX. Hmmm, looks like they never delivered that along with many others.

Looks like they delivered it long time ago: SEL50mm f1.8 - enjoy.

I think a mirrorless FF camera is a good thing and the A7 might be the real deal. But until I see a real test (not a couple of youtube videos) I can't tell.

Plenty of them: http://sonyalphalab.com/2013/10/sony-a7-and-a7r-reviews-and-news-breakdown-camera-issues-lense-tests-and-more/

and even here: http://www.sonyalpharumors.com/

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