LF1 has NON-STANDARD USB port!

My LF1 just arrived, and I wanted to fully charge it before trying it out, so I went to plug my "normal" micro-USB cable into it, and it turns out that Panasonic has decided to use a non-standard USB port.  For me this is probably a deal killer.  I HATE carrying around multiple cables, chargers, etc.

Just when the world is coming around to agreeing on a standard battery charging connector, Panasonic decides to strike out on their own.  Ouch.

-barry

My FZ200 and LX7 both use the same USB cable and they plug into a standard USB port.  There are actually a few different USB jacks that are industry standard.  There are two versions of mini and at least two of micro USB.  That's nothing new.

John,

That's good news.  I had looked for one earlier and couldn't find one.  I always carry a spare battery, and having to charge in-camera is a problem for me as it ties up the camera.  My view is the opposite of the OP.

Now, all I need is a few reviews on the major sites, and a few user reviews, and I'll go for one.

Barry Margolius wrote:

Ronomy wrote:

My FZ200 and LX7 both use the same USB cable and they plug into a standard USB port. There are actually a few different USB jacks that are industry standard. There are two versions of mini and at least two of micro USB. That's nothing new.

That's good news.

My definition of standard is "can you walk into Radio Shack and buy one?" Do you think the Panasonic LF1 cable is "standard" by that definition? I'll try it tomorrow, but my suspicion is no.

-barry

I just looked at the lf1 manual and it appears to be the same connector as on my LX7 and FZ200.  More searching online and it seems to be standard among many camera manufacturers although Panasonic says only use a Panasonic cable.

Barry Margolius wrote:

Ronomy wrote:

My FZ200 and LX7 both use the same USB cable and they plug into a standard USB port. There are actually a few different USB jacks that are industry standard. There are two versions of mini and at least two of micro USB. That's nothing new.

That's good news.

My definition of standard is "can you walk into Radio Shack and buy one?" Do you think the Panasonic LF1 cable is "standard" by that definition? I'll try it tomorrow, but my suspicion is no.

-barry

The cable is different or has a slightly different model number.  Its either longer or includes power wires where the LX7 and FZ200 do not.  The last two numbers are different.

Barry Margolius wrote:

Ronomy wrote:

My FZ200 and LX7 both use the same USB cable and they plug into a standard USB port. There are actually a few different USB jacks that are industry standard. There are two versions of mini and at least two of micro USB. That's nothing new.

Your mention of the LX7 was the clue. A quick Google search tells me that this is a Panasonic proprietary USB port, not a standard one, and that annoys me no end.

As incredible as this may sound to those of you who dislike in-camera charging, this might actually be enough of a drawback that I'll return the camera. I really HATE non-standard charging cables. Pity, though, because otherwise it seems like a nice camera.

-barry

The end that plugs into the charger will be standard USB so you can charge multiple devices with a charger that can handle multiple devices.  You still need a cable for each device.

It looks like Canon and several other manufacturers do the same with the non standard USB port.

Barry Margolius wrote:

Ronomy wrote:

My FZ200 and LX7 both use the same USB cable and they plug into a standard USB port. There are actually a few different USB jacks that are industry standard. There are two versions of mini and at least two of micro USB. That's nothing new.

Your mention of the LX7 was the clue. A quick Google search tells me that this is a Panasonic proprietary USB port, not a standard one, and that annoys me no end.

As incredible as this may sound to those of you who dislike in-camera charging, this might actually be enough of a drawback that I'll return the camera. I really HATE non-standard charging cables. Pity, though, because otherwise it seems like a nice camera.

-barry

Seems they use the usb port for standard audio visual output too.  Not HDMI.  So the pin out would probably require a special cable.  They should be standard with all Panasonic cameras tho.

Ronomy wrote:

My FZ200 and LX7 both use the same USB cable and they plug into a standard USB port.  There are actually a few different USB jacks that are industry standard.  There are two versions of mini and at least two of micro USB.  That's nothing new.

That's the great thing about standards - there are so many to choose from!

Yeah, Canon used mini USB for transfers for years too... But they've all had models with a proprietary port at one time or another. Apparently Nikon and Panasonic are more prone to it. Whatever Panny is using atm isn't any kind of USB standard. It's not mini (A nor B) and it's not micro, just because they translate to a USB pin output at the other end doesn't mean it's any kind of standardized USB port on the camera's end.

At least the cables are cheap enough, now if only I could find a very short one... I gotta admit I was pretty disappointed with this too, but I'll still take the option for in camera charging even with a proprietary cable over having to use an external charger (which also remains an option, so in effect I'm simply in favor of having as many charging options as possible).

It's one more cable to carry but the one included in the box is short enough to not be a nuisance in my bag, just gotta remember to pack it. I'll probably buy a 6ft one for home and leave this one permanently in my messenger bag. Being able to charge in the car or off an external USB battery pack is a real boon, almost eliminates the need for a spare battery for me. The cable still takes up less space than an external charger too.

My only other disappointment with the LF1's build is the port door (battery one feels solid enough). It doesn't click into place or anything, I'm afraid the spring will start to give eventually, particularly if I'm flipping it open often for charging... Almost makes me wanna get that external charger after all, but I'll probably get a M43 camera soon and I don't wanna bother with two separate external battery chargers.

What's with the price of Panasonic's retractable cable on Amazon btw, $20 seems rather steep and I don't with think they even sell it themselves do they?

Adorama and B&H have the Panasonic retractable USB cable (DMW-USBC1) in stock, for US$14.95.

Panasonic lists that cable for over US$20, but also specifies cable # K1HY08YY0034 as compatible, which it lists for only US$4.02. It has this cable (in the US) "Back-ordered ETA: 07/24/13".

I believe Monoprice has a compatible cable for US$1.50:
http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=103&cp_id=10303&cs_id=1030314&p_id=2735&seq=1&format=2

Monoprice sells good quality cables for low prices.  Ive have been happy with them in the past. I just ordered one of these cables (above) and will post whether it works on my LF1 when I receive it.

Barry Margolius wrote:

Ronomy wrote:

My FZ200 and LX7 both use the same USB cable and they plug into a standard USB port. There are actually a few different USB jacks that are industry standard. There are two versions of mini and at least two of micro USB. That's nothing new.

That's good news.

My definition of standard is "can you walk into Radio Shack and buy one?" Do you think the Panasonic LF1 cable is "standard" by that definition? I'll try it tomorrow, but my suspicion is no.

All three cameras use the same standard cable USB connectors and likely follow the USB standards, but I'd surmise that the LF1 cable includes the power supply lines that are required for battery charging.  The FZ200 and LX7 cables will likely work on the LF1 for data transfers but not for charging.

Most cell phones and smart phones now use the same style of connectors as well and also require in-phone charging capability - I find it hard to believe that Radio Shack has no Micro-USB cable that doesn't include all end-to-end connections.

MichaelKz wrote:

Adorama and B&H have the Panasonic retractable USB cable (DMW-USBC1) in stock, for US$14.95.

Panasonic lists that cable for over US$20, but also specifies cable # K1HY08YY0034 as compatible, which it lists for only US$4.02. It has this cable (in the US) "Back-ordered ETA: 07/24/13".

I believe Monoprice has a compatible cable for US$1.50:
http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=103&cp_id=10303&cs_id=1030314&p_id=2735&seq=1&format=2

Monoprice sells good quality cables for low prices. Ive have been happy with them in the past. I just ordered one of these cables (above) and will post whether it works on my LF1 when I receive it.

That looks like a standard mini-B connector (which matches my FZ19 and FZ200). Is there anything unusual about it?

I bought a Wasabi battery and charger for each of my cameras. That lets me charge one battery while I'm using the other.   USB charging is "cute" but I don't find it terribly practical.

Sherm

Micro USB and all other forms of USB have always included power and data pins... This isn't micro USB. It's also been possible for a while to adapt micro USB for AV out so that isn't an excuse. Panasonic is simply not using any standard USB port on the camera's end, and you more than likely won't find this cable at the Rat Shack...

Tho Nikon and Panasonic have both been using the connector for a while so there's a chance (may not necessarily work for both data and power tho). Availability isn't a big deal IMO tho, the cables are cheap enough on Amazon. OTOH Monoprice doesn't seem to carry it although they have some of the older Nikon, Panasonic, Fuji, etc cables.

The real annoyance is having to carry around a cable that isn't used by any modern phone, tablet, etc.

Umm, it actually doesn't look anything like micro USB A nor B... (micro cables have spring prongs and don't have that black square on the side) It does look like the special port your two FZ cameras use, but I'm not sure that particular Monoprice cable is compatible since the models listed are entirely different and much older than the usual models listed as compatible with the semi-recent recent cable used by the ZS series, LX, your FZs, and now the LF1.

I wouldn't go as far as saying USB charging is just a cute gimmick... It has very practical purposes IMO. Thanks to USB charging you can slip the camera into your pocket or bag alongside an external USB battery pack and charge it while away from an outlet, or you can use any phone car charger, so it does have merit. Panasonic just hampers some of that versatility by not using a universal connector on the camera.

Carrying an external battery charger and a spare is an option, but it'd always be an option unless they seal the battery in the body. At the end of the day I appreciate having BOTH options rather than just external charging, even despite the proprietary port.

Adorama and B&H have the Panasonic retractable USB cable (DMW-USBC1) in stock, for US$14.95.

Panasonic lists that cable for over US$20, but also specifies cable # K1HY08YY0034 as compatible, which it lists for only US$4.02. It has this cable (in the US) "Back-ordered ETA: 07/24/13".

I believe Monoprice has a compatible cable for US$1.50:
http://www.monoprice.com/products/product.asp?c_id=103&cp_id=10303&cs_id=1030314&p_id=2735&seq=1&format=2

Monoprice sells good quality cables for low prices.  Ive have been happy with them in the past. I just ordered one of these cables (above) and will post whether it works on my LF1 when I receive it.

Hmm, you're right, Adorama and B&H do sell the retractable one $5 cheaper (and Panasonic does sell it for the same equally steep $20 as Amazon)... Those two places also charge shipping tho so you only end up saving about $1-2, but hey, a buck's a buck. I might end up giving in and getting that one, nicer to pack in my bag and the LF1 should last me 2-3 years anyway.

Panasonic could do a much better job of branding and identifying these cables IMO, specially if they've been using a proprietary one for a while, if at least on their own site... B&H and several other places describe it as micro USB B or something when it's unequivocally NOT any of the two micro standards. The K1HY08YY0034 you mention (listed on the LF1 manual) also has no compatibility info whatsoever on Panasonic's own site and you have to go thru the more obscure parts department to get it. It's all kinda poorly managed IMO.

I use Monoprice a ton for audio/video/USB/ethernet cables too, I actually ordered a 6" micro HDMI male to full size HDMI female cable (PID 7603) off them in anticipation of the LF1, that way I can adapt any full size HDMI cable but since the large female plug is down the cable/adapter end it avoids the kludge of having a bulky adapter + cable connector hanging directly off the camera port. Wish I could find a similar one for my mini HDMI devices, Monoprice doesn't have a great solution for those (I got a hinged mini to female-full adapter elsewhere).

Anyway, I'm not sure that MP cable you pointed out is compatible... If you look at the camera model numbers listed, none of them seem to be listed on Panasonic's long list for the retractable DMW-USBC1... Maybe it's just coincidence and Monoprice only has some really really old models listed, but Panasonic HAS changed the cable they use in the past at least once thru the product line history (I think the plug's the same even, but the pins changed).

Let us know if it works! I'm always ordering stuff from MP, for $1.50 I'd just throw it into the next order regardless of what else I've bought.