NEX-6 major design flaw

Started Jun 2, 2013 | Discussions
franzel Contributing Member • Posts: 797
Re: Mike - It's not a 'flaw' but I agree with you...

kaiser soze wrote:

franzel wrote:

kaiser soze wrote:

Why is this behavior annoying? Why can't you just switch it to MF ?

Sorry mate, but that is a bit silly, even if your Nex model has an AF/MF switch .

Many times, one will not remember that AF is disabled, not notice a slight blur on the display or VF, and happily take blurry pictures .

Now where did I read this: If Focus Peaking is enabled, highlighting will be visible only if MF or DMF is selected. If the AF Illuminator is set to Auto, then assuming a shooting mode where the AF Illuminator is allowed to be used, you can cause the AF illuminator indication to appear on the display by placing your hand over the lens. This indication reveals that either AF or DMF is selected. If you see this indication simultaneously with the highlighting, you know that DMF is selected.

Not to suggest that this is a perfect solution.

It's not a solution, period .

This is an amateur forum, with few members who are familiar with the requirements for using a camera  efficiently . Hence, susggestions like this one come up .

Yes, and if everyone gave their lists of wants, and Sony gave everyone what they wanted, the menus would get even more complex, and then everyone would complain about that, which they already do at many opportunities.

The Nex menues and UI are not complex, only very poorly designed .

Within 30 minutes, any experienced photogh could transform the Nex software into something usable, if an editor was provided .

James Sherman
James Sherman Senior Member • Posts: 2,480
Re: NEX-6 major design flaw

kaiser soze wrote:

I assume the NEX-6 has an AF/MF button..

Mine does NOT.  You know what they say about assume.

And besides, what is the big deal anyway?

As soon as you aim the camera away from your prime interest, by intention or accident, it happily decides to focus on whatever is there.  Not useful if you're walking along shooting at distant moving things (birds, cars, planes, etc.) with the dratted lens constantly trying to focus on your foot or whatever takes its' fancy.  When you see something you do want to shoot, the lens has to rack focus all the way out (or worse, goes the wrong way first) and you miss the shot.  Works the same way with anything moving, it always seems to have picked something far from the distance you want to shoot - and then you (at best) wait.  For something like a car race, the only choice you have is to disable AF, pre-focus and pray.

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wblink
wblink Regular Member • Posts: 229
Re: NEX-6 major design flaw

Mike Sivcevic wrote:

baltimorecaesar wrote:

have you tried switching to MF?

Yes, but that's not the point. I do want the auto-focus, just not all the time

The camera should have the option to turn off the pre-focusing if the user wishes so.

You can leave the camera "on", using power, not only for foucussing, or turn the power off after a shot when you're not sure to take the next 1 in short time.. I shut it off almost after every shot. Prefocus doens't work when the camera is hanging on my wrist.

If you do like it, need it or want it: buy some extra batteries. I always have 3: 1 in the camera, 1 spare, 1 loading.

And ehhhh, I didn't even know about prefocus, Turning off is just a habit.

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Willem.
Sony NEX-6

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wblink
wblink Regular Member • Posts: 229
Re: NEX-6 major design flaw

Lightshow wrote:

The only real solution will have to come from Sony, contact them and explain the issues with per focus and birding, and the requirement for menus toggle for this "feature".

HaHa,

Sony and menu's for photographers? No way! Have you seen a "whishlist" or any reaction for that sake from Sony?

I don't think they don't WANT, I think thay CANNOT.

I am still happy with my NEX-6, but it took and takes a lot of time to find the right parameters in the "spaghetti-menu".

If they would only add presets .... sigh.

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Willem.
Sony NEX-6

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GaryW Veteran Member • Posts: 8,541
Re: Ha! I was right.

Mike Sivcevic wrote:

Sorry to rain on your parade, but I have just tried exactly that and no luck, it's already focused, i.e. it's still pre-focusing.

Maybe someone else should try it.  I cycled to different distances -- down the hall, objects on a shelf, back to another room, etc.  Nearly every time I put my eye to it, it was not focused correctly and "bobbled" a bit to get back in focus.

Why would it focus if it has no view turned on?  It makes sense to me.  I'll need to try it again with a noisier lens; the PZ is too quiet.  Then again, all of them focus quietly.  Oh well.

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Gary W.

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RedSkiesAtNight Regular Member • Posts: 236
Your post is the best one here

Thanks.  My opinion is Sony should fix it with firmware too.

Byron S Forum Member • Posts: 67
Re: NEX-6 major design flaw
1

Of course, you can set the AEL button to act as AF/MF toggle, as I did. Problem solved.

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AllMankind
AllMankind Contributing Member • Posts: 564
Re: NEX-6 major design flaw

kaiser soze wrote:

In general it is valid to argue that the user of any device should be given the option to disable anything that they do not like. The exceptions are (1.) it would cost too much, and (2.) when there already exists a perfectly good way to do the same thing. The question thus becomes why you have an issue with simply switching to MF when you want the camera to not do this. How would that be any less convenient, or any different in effect, from a selection within the menus?

Using the menu I leave it off PERMENANTLY.  No guesswork, it's always OFF.

The AF/MF switch means I must check the AF/MF setting EVERY time I want to use the camera.  Inconvenient, to say the least.

And besides, what is the big deal anyway?

It's the little things that irritate the most.

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wansai Regular Member • Posts: 378
Re: NEX-6 major design flaw

I hadn't ever noticed this to be a problem. with some care and consideration, you should be able to extend your battery life well beyond the rated shot count.

Particularly, I don't use the LCD unless it's a shot I can't get using an EVF. I also have auto-review switched off. Don't really need it. I also power toggle off in between shots. In this way, it's possible to get well over 750 shots on a single charge. In some cases, in the 1000 shot range.

You can also set the camera to sleep after however many seconds.

I'm just not seeing how this can be seen as a problem tbh.

Helen
Helen Veteran Member • Posts: 5,400
Re: NEX-6 major design flaw

wansai wrote:

I hadn't ever noticed this to be a problem. with some care and consideration, you should be able to extend your battery life well beyond the rated shot count.

Particularly, I don't use the LCD unless it's a shot I can't get using an EVF. I also have auto-review switched off. Don't really need it. I also power toggle off in between shots. In this way, it's possible to get well over 750 shots on a single charge. In some cases, in the 1000 shot range.

You can also set the camera to sleep after however many seconds.

I'm just not seeing how this can be seen as a problem tbh.

I don't find it a huge problem since I typically turn the camera off between shots, but some people do like to keep the camera on, and if they are used to almost any other make, they will miss the option of turning off the prefocus, as it will discharge the battery quite rapidly.  It's odd that Sony have always omitted this option since it would probably be very simple for them to implement.  It's worth noting that other makes invariably state in their instructions about prefocus something to the effect of "please note: turning prefocus on will have a detrimental effect on battery life between charges".

Dirk W Senior Member • Posts: 2,651
Let's settle on "minor design flaw" :-)

I agree, it could be addressed by Sony but is not a big issue. Major design flaw? Neeeeah.....

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GaryW Veteran Member • Posts: 8,541
Re: Ha! I was right.

GaryW wrote:

Mike Sivcevic wrote:

Sorry to rain on your parade, but I have just tried exactly that and no luck, it's already focused, i.e. it's still pre-focusing.

OK, I played with it some more, and I guess you're right -- it still pre-focuses even if the LCD isn't showing you a live view.  Even so, it's a lazy operation and probably not the largest waste of energy -- probably the LCD is.  I'd say turn the LCD off and just use the EVF, but when I have the camera dangling around my neck, the eye-sensor thinks I'm looking into it and keeps the camera turned on and using the EVF!  Ugh.  Not sure of an easy way around that.  That weird way the Nex-5 dangled lens-down actually would be better in this case.  Oh well.

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Gary W.

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aeonsim Junior Member • Posts: 48
Re: NEX-6 major design flaw

So I noticed this with the original Nex-5 I'd be walking around with the camera hanging around my neck and would notice it was prefocusing on the ground with each step as I walked.

For the Nex-5 at least the solution I found was simple, bring up the menu.

If you set the sleep timer to a short interval, and then when ever your finished taking photos you press the menu key. This of course switches you to a static view rather than the live view and on my Nex-5 stops the prefocusing. After the sleep period is run out it switches off the screen and all is good. If you then wake it with the Shutter button it drops you straight back into live view and starts focusing again.

You save a fair bit of energy I think, one your not prefocusing, two the Menu is a static image so the sensor doesn't need to constantly stream the live view to the screen so less sensor activity and less image processor activity.

With my original Nex-5 and the original battery I tend to get 450+ shots per charge with a mix of panoramas and HDR in there. Walking around Ghent last weekend I took ~960 images from a 70% full battery and part of a full one.

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Dusty0505 New Member • Posts: 1
Re: NEX-6 major design flaw
1

As a new owner of an NEX-6 (for the second time) I've been paging through all the facts and conjecture about low battery life on the NEX-6. Fact is, the camera is designed to kill the battery sooner than it needs to. Sony went the point-and-shoot route with this camera in that they leave the LCD on all the time. The only thing that turns it off is you putting your eye up to the viewfinder. Take you eye down, LCD is back on. I realize that there is a menu item to do viewfinder only but then you lose the review capability on the LCD, the review will occur in the viewfinder which means you lose fast shot to shot capability. (Let's not mention the fact that if you go viewfinder only, the only way out is to navigate the horrendous menus in the viewfinder to go back to LCD or AUTO)

None of this was necessary.

All Sony had to do was do was what good SLRs (ie: EOS 7D) have been doing all along that is leave the LCD off except to turn it on briefly after a shot for review. Also, they have the eye sensor capability so the viewfinder itself shouldn't be turned on until your eye shows up. For those that like to shoot using the LCD as their viewfinder, how about a little button like the SLRs have for live view. The LCD should have been controllable.

Another fun thing...you set your camera to sleep after 10 seconds. Unfortunately it's not going to sleep because the camera is hanging on it's strap and it thinks your belly is your eye so it keeps the camera on, maybe all day!

No getting around it here, forget all the auto focus hocus pokus, some serious design problems here with the way the LCD and viewfinder are managed.

tnonline New Member • Posts: 19
Re: NEX-6 major design flaw (agree!)

Agree with OP about annoying and inefficient pre-focus. This usually makes focusing slower, in may cases, much much slower unless you keep your camera pointing to your subject all the time. When the camera leave the subject, it pre-focus to somewhere else; and when you go back to the subject, the camera need to focus for scratch. Not mention it consumes battery.

I used to think that the focus slowly is the nature of mirroless camera (comparing to DSLR), but now find out that the pre-focus contribute a lot in this slowness. It not only forces NEX camera to work all the time (the worse), but also make the camera focus from scratch most of the cases (the worst). I would call it "a major design flaw", too. Sony should allow us to turn it off.

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CameraCarl Veteran Member • Posts: 5,452
Re: NEX-6 major design flaw (agree!)

This apparently was fixed in the a6000 and, as much as many of us would like to see it incorporated in the NEX-6, a firmware update is unlikely.  But thanks for resurrecting this thread.  I have been wondering why many of my first shots taken after walking for a bit were woefully out of focus. I'll have to try out some of the suggestions above.

akositric
akositric Regular Member • Posts: 143
Re: NEX-6 major design flaw (agree!)

Pre-Focus OFF is now a6000 (1st feature I use when I got my A6k). One of the many reason I replaced my NEX-6 to an A6000. The A6000 really did tamed the Touit. But as always Something got to give -- WB seems different with the A6000 esp in low-light, indoors. How this gets fixed in the next firmware update.
I wish I stayed with the NEX-6 and lived with the 'Design Flaws' rather than having to fix the WB every now and then. WB is the NEX-6 is not really perfect, but I find it better than the A6000 (Personal Opinion)

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Euell Senior Member • Posts: 2,323
Re: Oh yeah, it's a design flaw

How do we know it's a flaw? Because Sony fixed the problem in the NEX 6 successor, the A6000, by letting you turn off pre-focus, which I suspect most do.  The pre-focus is particularly annoying with lenses that hunt, such as the Zeiss touit series.

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ghengii Regular Member • Posts: 195
Re: NEX-6 major design flaw

the camera was like that when you bought it,it's the way it is manufactured.

"caveat emptor" or should I say, "understand what you are buying before you part with your dosh"

SQLGuy Veteran Member • Posts: 5,506
Re: NEX-6 major design flaw
1

ghengii wrote:

the camera was like that when you bought it,it's the way it is manufactured.

"caveat emptor" or should I say, "understand what you are buying before you part with your dosh"

I don't agree with this answer.

A) The buyer shouldn't have to be aware of and understand every subtle limitation or latent issue that might exist with a product before buying it. Would you say the same thing to people affected by Toyota's unintended acelleration issues or GM's car dies for no reason issues?

B) The manufacturer won't be aware of all issues when they ship a product either. That's why they do, and should, make firmware updates to correct things that can be corrected with software. Sony should have backported this enhancement to previous models.

I say "enhancement" rather than "fix" because I'm not convinced how much of an issue this really is, and I'm also not sure that it's not a problem in the Zeiss lenses (and possibly their firmware) vs. the Sony body. If it were definitively a Sony body problem, it should affect all AF lenses when used on that body.

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