Nikon D7100 left focus issue

Started Apr 19, 2013 | Discussions
Mako2011
MOD Mako2011 Forum Pro • Posts: 25,044
good info

fireplace33 wrote:

lock wrote:

I read post on various Nikon forums. I therefore know there are more flies on the cake.

Nevertheless, Nikonman09 documented it well. In the same thread, TurboBB also showed pictures, although some could not see it. But it is there alright. Check his full sized pictures in the gallery with the sigma and the Nikon at F3.5. You will see that the lens that focusses widest (the Sigma at 2.8) suffers from a BF, whereas the Nikon 16-85 shows no such problems. So that's two with pictures I know of without searching. Then there is fireplace33. No pictures, but who am I to not trust him not reporting it correctly? We know about Lordbeau, but he did not show samples either. Than we have Gabe7, who returned two D7100. He showed pictures of the second, although he was slated as a newby that did not know what he was doing. According to his tests the third one was ok.

There will be more for sure, but you may have to surch for it. The D7100 isn't going like crazy here. So the numbers of bad bodies may be too limited to create hysteric scenes. However, there are bodies suffering from the same issue the D800 had. Probably a lower percentage (hope so), but it actually should have been solved by now.

lock

Thanks lock,  for your implied trust!
My report was made in good faith.

I didn't post images, because of the effort needed to prepare such a detailed report and then make posts back and forth to "prove" that I did it right and possibly even then suffer the onslaught of objections. But I will make the effort in this case and post some images a bit later.  Please be a bit patient. It's raining this weekend so maybe I'll get a chance.

No worries at all. New information always brings attention. Most see it as simply that. No one should be bothered by it in any regard. Good luck and let us know what you find. Those that can use the information well...will. It's just a forum after all. Good Luck

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My opinions are my own and not those of DPR or its administration. They carry no 'special' value (except to me and Lacie of course)

OP SaturnN New Member • Posts: 17
Re: Yep! Troll alert.
2

Look, for you and other who insult me as a troll. I cannot post photos because i am away for weekend. And even i could, whay would i? I don't ask or need a confirmation that my camera has a problems, i know it has i tested it. I was just making simple question if this kind of problems are usually a matter of calibration or hardware fault. I am not stupid or blind to not be able to see how good my focus is. I have been able to focus properly for 10 years with different cameras and sudenly i am not able to focus with left wide of d7100? Come on! And yes i created account because of this problem that i have. Why is this strange? Why did you open yours, to insult other  people?

toomanycanons Forum Pro • Posts: 12,353
Re: Yep! Troll alert.
1

SaturnN wrote:

Look, for you and other who insult me as a troll. I cannot post photos because i am away for weekend. And even i could, whay would i? I don't ask or need a confirmation that my camera has a problems, i know it has i tested it. I was just making simple question if this kind of problems are usually a matter of calibration or hardware fault. I am not stupid or blind to not be able to see how good my focus is. I have been able to focus properly for 10 years with different cameras and sudenly i am not able to focus with left wide of d7100? Come on! And yes i created account because of this problem that i have. Why is this strange? Why did you open yours, to insult other  people?

Man, why post this at all?  What do you hope to accomplish?  Did you do no searching of these forums before you decided to bring some "new troubling issue" to light?  This "issue" has been discussed endlessly already.  The thousands of satisfied D7100 owners don't post here about how much they love their camera...as much as the few with "issues".  it's just getting tiresome is all.  You create a new account to just rant.  Great.  Just great.  It's troll-like even though you deny that you are a troll.  OK.

Mako2011
MOD Mako2011 Forum Pro • Posts: 25,044
Not so much
5

toomanycanons wrote:

SaturnN wrote:

Look, for you and other who insult me as a troll. I cannot post photos because i am away for weekend. And even i could, whay would i? I don't ask or need a confirmation that my camera has a problems, i know it has i tested it. I was just making simple question if this kind of problems are usually a matter of calibration or hardware fault. I am not stupid or blind to not be able to see how good my focus is. I have been able to focus properly for 10 years with different cameras and sudenly i am not able to focus with left wide of d7100? Come on! And yes i created account because of this problem that i have. Why is this strange? Why did you open yours, to insult other  people?

Man, why post this at all?  What do you hope to accomplish?  Did you do no searching of these forums before you decided to bring some "new troubling issue" to light?  This "issue" has been discussed endlessly already.  The thousands of satisfied D7100 owners don't post here about how much they love their camera...as much as the few with "issues".  it's just getting tiresome is all.  You create a new account to just rant.  Great.  Just great.  It's troll-like even though you deny that you are a troll.  OK.

Not really the case at all. His post was civil and pointed to an issue some have had. Accusing without evidence is where the less than civil tone began. I personally want to know and look forward to any additional info and any corrective action that might help others.  Jumping on a new member without provocation...is a form of trolling itself.

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My opinions are my own and not those of DPR or its administration. They carry no 'special' value (except to me and Lacie of course)

herbymel Veteran Member • Posts: 6,153
Re: Yep! Troll alert.
1

I'd be more at issue with the way it was tested, the lenses used, and his checking into what the basis of the original problem was rather than just saying it's a left focus issue. A good deal of what you're reporting doesn't match with what the original problem was at all. It's going to get some people riled up and then with no real posting history and no one knowing who or what you're about it's going to raise suspicion. Granted you may have a good deal of experience with cameras, but since these have hit the streets pretty much no one has any experience with an aps-c camera with this resolution and can't really tell how it's going to behave, especially with the lenses available.

As for the troll issue and closing down the thread..seems overblown. If it were me though, I wouldn't be getting a new camera, running a few tests and jumping on a forum declaring the camera a lemon and sending it back in a few days after getting it.

 herbymel's gear list:herbymel's gear list
Nikon D750 Nikon D500 Nikon AF-S Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8G ED VR II Nikon AF Nikkor 105mm f/2D DC Nikon AF-S Nikkor 500mm f/4D ED-IF II +6 more
BillD7000 Contributing Member • Posts: 879
Re: You're presuming.

Well, that would be assuming that after the D800, other cameras with the same focus module suffered from the same defect. That is not the case.

So far, on DPReview, there have been two posts claiming the "left focus" issue for the D7100.

Yep...  If one can "test" and post, why can't they post EXIF loaded images?  That's a lot easier than accurately testing focus.

Troll?  I think so.

 BillD7000's gear list:BillD7000's gear list
Nikon D7200 Nikon AF-S Nikkor 300mm f/4D ED-IF Sigma 8-16mm F4.5-5.6 DC HSM Sigma 105mm F2.8 EX DG OS HSM Nikon 85mm F1.8G +2 more
BillD7000 Contributing Member • Posts: 879
Re: another Troll

FTH wrote:

and moderators will keep saying that he isn't one. The "author" just made a new account to complain about fake issues. Is it a game to bring more traffic in dpreview or just a way to bash Nikon so-that those fake "issues" come up in google when someone is looking to buy a camera ?...

Yes, indeed.  Posting with EXIF is as easy as testing...

A real consumer, if convinced of an issue would just get an exchange or a refund...

Transposing D800 issues (made in a different factory) onto a new release made elsewhere is a nice try.  But, please....

 BillD7000's gear list:BillD7000's gear list
Nikon D7200 Nikon AF-S Nikkor 300mm f/4D ED-IF Sigma 8-16mm F4.5-5.6 DC HSM Sigma 105mm F2.8 EX DG OS HSM Nikon 85mm F1.8G +2 more
BillD7000 Contributing Member • Posts: 879
Re: No reason
1

Dear Mako, with all due respect, you should seriously investigate more on those "NEW MEMBER/TROLLS FAKE ISSUE POSTERS" - what other evidence do you exactly need to realize that those magical new members create accounts to bash a brand with obvious thread subjects sot-hat any person who looks for D7100 issues on google is brought here.

Magically, those new members never or rarely post a single answer and disappear right after.

This is one reason why DPReview forums aren't taken seriously...

 BillD7000's gear list:BillD7000's gear list
Nikon D7200 Nikon AF-S Nikkor 300mm f/4D ED-IF Sigma 8-16mm F4.5-5.6 DC HSM Sigma 105mm F2.8 EX DG OS HSM Nikon 85mm F1.8G +2 more
amobi
amobi Veteran Member • Posts: 3,116
Re: Yep! Troll alert.
1

SaturnN wrote:

Look, for you and other who insult me as a troll. I cannot post photos because i am away for weekend. And even i could, whay would i? I don't ask or need a confirmation that my camera has a problems, i know it has i tested it. I was just making simple question if this kind of problems are usually a matter of calibration or hardware fault. I am not stupid or blind to not be able to see how good my focus is. I have been able to focus properly for 10 years with different cameras and sudenly i am not able to focus with left wide of d7100? Come on! And yes i created account because of this problem that i have. Why is this strange? Why did you open yours, to insult other  people?

Don't worry about some of these folks. I returned my first copy for left AF issue. Waiting on the second copy. Some D7100 has left AF issues like D800 but it can be fixed. My D800 was fixed.

So you can exchanged it where you bought it or send it in to Nikon. I returned mine because I did not want to deal with Nikon.

Don't ever post pictures because they will find a way to criticize your. It is not so hard to figure it out.

BillD7000 Contributing Member • Posts: 879
Re: Yep! Troll alert.

It is not so hard to figure it out.

Indeed.  Trolling does have its characteristics.

 BillD7000's gear list:BillD7000's gear list
Nikon D7200 Nikon AF-S Nikkor 300mm f/4D ED-IF Sigma 8-16mm F4.5-5.6 DC HSM Sigma 105mm F2.8 EX DG OS HSM Nikon 85mm F1.8G +2 more
rembart79 Junior Member • Posts: 28
Re: Nikon D7100 left focus issue

If you are testing with 35mm F1.8G

It will be hard to check the accurate result.

Because D7100s megapixel is so high that some Nikkor lenses cannot keep up with it

And unfortunately 35mm F1.8G is one of them

If other fast lenses like 50.8G or 85.8G doesn't have left focus issue with your D7100

There is a big chance of 35mm F1.8G not being good enough for D7100

Mako2011
MOD Mako2011 Forum Pro • Posts: 25,044
big if
1

rembart79 wrote:

If you are testing with 35mm F1.8G

It will be hard to check the accurate result.

Because D7100s megapixel is so high that some Nikkor lenses cannot keep up with it

And unfortunately 35mm F1.8G is one of them

If other fast lenses like 50.8G or 85.8G doesn't have left focus issue with your D7100

There is a big chance of 35mm F1.8G not being good enough for D7100

If that were actually the case...then the right side would be off as well. He might have a decentered lens if all others are fine wide open. Not uncommon with the 35dx lens. That particular lens was the bane of many a new D7K owner.

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Patco Forum Pro • Posts: 13,687
Re: You're presuming.

PepsiCan wrote:

If you Google for the left focus issue, I found only hits that point to the D800. There is nothing for any other Nikon camera. In other words, these are both bogus posts meant to stir up more gossip and flame wars.

Google does seem to find a few D7100 left focus issue posts:

http://www.google.ca/search?num=100&safe=off&q=%22left+focus%22+d7100&oq=%22left+focus%22+d7100&gs_l=serp.12...66158.67348.0.71158.6.6.0.0.0.0.96.457.6.6.0...0.0...1c.1.9.serp.a_LydqWeEVY

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Patco
A photograph is more than a bunch of pixels

OP SaturnN New Member • Posts: 17
Re: Yep! Troll alert.

amobi wrote:

SaturnN wrote:

Look, for you and other who insult me as a troll. I cannot post photos because i am away for weekend. And even i could, whay would i? I don't ask or need a confirmation that my camera has a problems, i know it has i tested it. I was just making simple question if this kind of problems are usually a matter of calibration or hardware fault. I am not stupid or blind to not be able to see how good my focus is. I have been able to focus properly for 10 years with different cameras and sudenly i am not able to focus with left wide of d7100? Come on! And yes i created account because of this problem that i have. Why is this strange? Why did you open yours, to insult other  people?

Don't worry about some of these folks. I returned my first copy for left AF issue. Waiting on the second copy. Some D7100 has left AF issues like D800 but it can be fixed. My D800 was fixed.

So you can exchanged it where you bought it or send it in to Nikon. I returned mine because I did not want to deal with Nikon.

Don't ever post pictures because they will find a way to criticize your. It is not so hard to figure it out.

Thank you for answer! I will not demand an exchange i will send the camera to calibration because otherwise it is everithing ok with it and there is no guarantee that new piece would not have the same problem or something other. With calibration done it will be perfect camera.

OP SaturnN New Member • Posts: 17
Re: Yep! Troll alert.

toomanycanons wrote:

SaturnN wrote:

Look, for you and other who insult me as a troll. I cannot post photos because i am away for weekend. And even i could, whay would i? I don't ask or need a confirmation that my camera has a problems, i know it has i tested it. I was just making simple question if this kind of problems are usually a matter of calibration or hardware fault. I am not stupid or blind to not be able to see how good my focus is. I have been able to focus properly for 10 years with different cameras and sudenly i am not able to focus with left wide of d7100? Come on! And yes i created account because of this problem that i have. Why is this strange? Why did you open yours, to insult other  people?

Man, why post this at all?  What do you hope to accomplish?

Why? Because i wantet some information to help me deciding between returning camera and sending it to calibration.

Did you do no searching of these forums before you decided to bring some "new troubling issue" to light?  This "issue" has been discussed endlessly already.

Yes i did but didnt find answer to my problem. Everybody just say: i have returned it.

The thousands of satisfied D7100 owners don't post here about how much they love their camera...as much as the few with "issues".  it's just getting tiresome is all.  You create a new account to just rant.  Great.  Just great.  It's troll-like even though you deny that you are a troll.  OK.

Why would they post to say that they love their camera?

My post was not a rant but a simple question at the end and short description what my problem is.

I only understand your reaction if you are somehow emotionally attached to d7100 like developer of camera or Nikon marketing guy or similiar,  but otherwise...

PepsiCan Contributing Member • Posts: 739
How to test for focus issues
2

One question not yet answered is "how do you test for left-/right-focus issues"? So, here it goes.

When your pictures are not sharp, there are a number of potential issues.

1) You're settings are wrong and they prevent the camera from acquiring focus on the target you intend. Examples are: shooting with shutter priority, which can cause the camera to fire before focus is acquired. Or having AF-area set to Auto-Area where the camera, not you, selects the focus point.

2) Something is up with your lens. It is decentered, has front or back focus and in the case of really fast lenses (f1.8 or faster) you can have focus shift where the lens will focus slightly differently when stopped down a little. Or you could have a case of field curvature (more prevalent in super wides) where the focal plan is not straight.

3) The camera's focus system is off. Or rather, the camera's Phase Detect Auto Focus is off (PDAF).

Now, how do you know which of the three issues it is (or combination of)? Enter Live View and Contrast Detect Auto Focus (CDAF). Let's first understand how the various focus types work. Every digital SLR has two focus systems build in. Phase detect and Contrast detect.

PDAF is a mechanical focus system where through a system of tiny mirrors two views of the same scene are made to overlap. It is fast, but there are small margins of error. If you would do the focus twice, there is a change that the second time round the PDAF system ends at a slightly, almost indistinguishable different setting.

CDAF is based on the principle that an image is sharp when you reach maximum contrast. So, the system moves the focus system along and compares the current view against the previous view for higher contrast. Once the contrast number starts to go down, go back to the previous position and the sharpest focus has been achieved. It is slower but more accurate than PDAF.

For the purpose of testing focus, it is important to understand that with PDAF and CDAF your camera has two different ways of focusing and therefore one can serve as a reference point for the other. We therefore now have a way forward to find out what type of issue we have with focus.

Let's assume we suspect a problem with the PDAF system. To establish that we'd need to compare the results of shots taken with PDAF against shots taken with CDAF. So, here is how this will work.

1) Get out your tripod.

2) Put a prime on your camera (or some other fast lens - f2.8 or faster) and set it to its widest aperture. The AF-S 50mm f1.8 G is popular lens for this. 35mm f1.8 DX should also work as it is the APS-C equivalent of 50mm (roughly)

3) Put the camera on the tripod and set up single-shot AF, Single point, matrix metering. Ensure the camera is set to Focus Priority. Consult your manual on how to do that. If you have a D5xxx or D3xxx, the fact that you use AF-S will force it into Focus Priority.

4) Ensure good light, normal iso and a rapid shutter speed (1 / (2x focal length)). Do not use VR. Do not use flash. Shoot RAW and ensure you are far enough away from your focus target (think 2x minimal focus length of the lens).

5) Your target must have a lot of contrast. Focus charts are good. Also, your target must be FLAT (so, no three batteries in a row stuff. It can confuse your focus) and your camera must be aimed at the target at 90 degrees! No sloping angles! Dead on frontal!

5) Use things like mirror up and remote releases (or timer) to ensure the mirror slap and/or pushing of the shutter button do not shake the camera

6) In PDAF (so, using the view finder), use the center focus point. Acquire focus and take your shot. Then repeat 2-4 more times.

7) Switch to the most left focus point. Repeat step 6. Then switch to most right point. Repeat step 6.

8) Switch to Live View. Focus. Take the 3-5 test shots when focus is acquired. Repeat for focus on the right side and left side.

9) In View NX do the following:

- Check the RAW files (View NX will by default load the embedded JPEG, but those will be biased because of applied picture controls and possible ADL)

- Check for Focus Point and confirm it is at the spot where you aimed at

- For each of the groups, compare the PDAF pictures between themselves (all the center shots for example) and compare the PDAF picture to their CDAF counterpart (live view center shot against view finder center shot)

There are now couple of possible outcomes.

PDAF = CDAF = in focus --> There is no issue

PDAF Center = CDAF center but either Right PDAF <> Right CDAF or Left PDAF <> Left CDAF. We have a problem with the PDAF system. Your center is sharp, in live view things are also sharp but the PDAF system cannot get sharp focus on the outer edges. This is the symptom that D800 users had and it is know as the left-focus issue. Basically, your PDAF system is miscalibrated and you need to send the camera in for a tune up.

The third possibility happens when both PDAF and CDAF do not give you sharp results. That points towards a problem with the lens rather than the camera. There may be some decentering if one side is weaker than the other. Or if left, right and center all show out-of-focus results, there may be front- or back focus. Which one it is, requires further testing.

I trust that helps somewhat.

 PepsiCan's gear list:PepsiCan's gear list
Canon PowerShot S95 Adobe Photoshop Lightroom 4 Nikon D7100 Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 16-85mm f/3.5-5.6G ED VR Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 35mm F1.8G +5 more
PepsiCan Contributing Member • Posts: 739
Nope, it doesn't
1

Patco wrote:

PepsiCan wrote:

If you Google for the left focus issue, I found only hits that point to the D800. There is nothing for any other Nikon camera. In other words, these are both bogus posts meant to stir up more gossip and flame wars.

Google does seem to find a few D7100 left focus issue posts:

http://www.google.ca/search?num=100&safe=off&q=%22left+focus%22+d7100&oq=%22left+focus%22+d7100&gs_l=serp.12...66158.67348.0.71158.6.6.0.0.0.0.96.457.6.6.0...0.0...1c.1.9.serp.a_LydqWeEVY

The first hit refers to one of the two DPReview threads. The other 5 of the first 6 all are questions about whether there is a problem. The responses to the questions all indicate that either there is no problem with the D7100 or that their D800s all got repaired by Nikon and you shouldn't worry about it. So...if there is an issue, the OP is the first to have found it.

 PepsiCan's gear list:PepsiCan's gear list
Canon PowerShot S95 Adobe Photoshop Lightroom 4 Nikon D7100 Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 16-85mm f/3.5-5.6G ED VR Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 35mm F1.8G +5 more
lock Veteran Member • Posts: 6,202
Take a pepsi before you start writing

Than read about the incidence of the left sensor af problem in relation to the maximal aperture of the lens, and find the difference between the sigma and the nikon.

Lock

lock Veteran Member • Posts: 6,202
Take your time. There's no deadline here.

Do not get upset too much if you get slammed because of the samples you will post.

Lock

PepsiCan Contributing Member • Posts: 739
Re: Look at my other post

If you look further down, you'll find a detailed explanation of how to test for focus problems.

The reason why you're accused of trolling is because you make a statement but show nothing and do nothing to convince us that you know what you're doing. We've hd a raft of people here clamping focus issues with all kinds of Nikon cameras. With the exception of the D800, most of those claims turned out to be user errors  or posts to stir up trouble. So, forgive us our suspicion and mistrust.

 PepsiCan's gear list:PepsiCan's gear list
Canon PowerShot S95 Adobe Photoshop Lightroom 4 Nikon D7100 Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 16-85mm f/3.5-5.6G ED VR Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 35mm F1.8G +5 more
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