A conversation

Started Apr 11, 2013 | Discussions
OP deleted080512 Regular Member • Posts: 205
Re: A conversation

Agreed. The people I meet and who have hired me just want a record of events by somebody unconnected with the organization. They don't want "art"; just a record.

As far as I am concerned, I'd be happy to do a wedding for $150 and just hand over a USB memory stick of the images with in-camera JPEGs and in-Camera RAW images - no photo editing.

Hulamike
Hulamike Senior Member • Posts: 2,810
Re: construction is dead?

The genie's out of the bottle penguin. There's a new paradigm in place. Wishing for old models to resurrect is somewhat foolish with respect to commercial photography.

Hulamike
Hulamike Senior Member • Posts: 2,810
Party Pix

Traditional wedding photography (excluding the Tier I market) is one of the largest money pits in photography, and it's getting worse, but it is a great deal for young (pretty competent) newbie photographer who wants to make a quick $1,500 via turn-n-burn business model shooting clients who couldn't care less about a $400-600 photo album.  18k per annum is decent money for a kid living at home saving for college. It sure beats slinging burgers or waitressing.  Universities routinely hire amateur photographers as well- $150 here, $300 there... basically 2 hours of easy work for students living off loans and student aid = a good gig.  That's a common reality today in photography- the little guy being hired instead of the seasoned professional for such work because the results are commonly too close to quibble over or care about.

It gets even worse than that. I shoot a lot of marathons here. I realize they are grunt jobs, low pay but they used to make it worth your while to get up at 3:30am on a Sunday to shoot. The vendors, ASI, Marathon Foto, Finisher Pix, etc. used to pay a flat fee of around $450 for the event. Over the past several years that has diminished to, get this, $50/hr (6-7 hour event) then 17 CENTS a bib shot! Do the math. Even their Craigslist adds have gone from soliciting working photographers to this, I kid you not; "if you can shoot party pix we can use you. No experience required". That alone should illustrate where this industry's heading, where its at.

Graham Snook
Graham Snook Senior Member • Posts: 2,007
Re: A conversation
1

Machine Gun Kelly wrote:

It doesn't really matter. I've decided to get out of photography anyway.

So you thought you could make an easy living, and could make it pay, now it's photography's fault.

I the several years I tried (and I tried everything) I couldn't make it pay. I hear people claiming online that it does. I have no proof of this - you could all be genuine or you could all be 12 year olds having a laugh.

Yup I've been posting on here for 10 years I started on here at two, my grammar and spelling was advanced for my age You  can probably still find evidence of my images with Getty in 97/98/99 and I have been the staff photographer for 14 years, making a living out of photography. Sorry to disappoint you, But I am a genuine photographer.

You can download my PDF folio from Grahamsnook.com if you feel the urge.

Unless you think I had the forethought 10 years ago to sign up on here using the name Graham Snook, in the hope that one day someone called Graham Snook would come along and put some pretty pictures of boats on a website.

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dholl
dholl Veteran Member • Posts: 3,239
Re: A conversation

Stilograph wrote:

But sadly, these days adequate photos are enough, and the really high-end stuff is something that only a few can live by.

Why sadly?  It's true what you say, but I wouldn't call it sad.  DSLR's-for-everyone has empowered many people, photographers and recipients (the latter can now afford the former).

For those who want masterful work, they can still get it...but such photographers cost a lot more than I do.

Hulamike
Hulamike Senior Member • Posts: 2,810
The Math

To equal $450, the prior flat rate, it works out to 7.35 composed photographs a minute, no more than 2 per runner allowed, all fast moving action in front of you. Try doing that for 6-7 hours straight with no breaks. That's what 17 cents a shot gets ya. Pathetic. The Party Shooters can have it.

Hulamike
Hulamike Senior Member • Posts: 2,810
Hunch

If my hunch is right, he is well known here under no less than 100 aliases. He comes and goes. Stirs things up for awhile then disappears only to come back. His MO in the past matches this guy's sudden appearance. No name, zero previous posts followed by a barrage of posts all designed to stir things up. He's the ultimate troll sometimes hailing from Australia, Canada, USA. He's being pretty well behaved this time but give it awhile. Things will disintegrate.

If I'm hallucinating, I apologize but all the telltales are there. Maybe I need a life.  

Hulamike
Hulamike Senior Member • Posts: 2,810
Kit?

To MGK: Aussies and Brits say "kit". Americans say "gear". So you're from the southern US huh?

Marty4650
Marty4650 Forum Pro • Posts: 15,795
Anyone can be a professional photographer
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OP deleted080512 Regular Member • Posts: 205
Re: Hunch

LOL. Just a bit paranoid, are we? Maybe you need to step away from the computer for a while?

Research has shown that more than 5 hours computer use a day leads to depression amongst other things. There is, however, a cure for this - a good few hours in the sunshine.

Hulamike
Hulamike Senior Member • Posts: 2,810
Re: Hunch

Alrighty then, you get a bye for the moment.

If you're not who I think you are, you're doing a pretty good impersonation. Here's the thing that keeps me wondering. You've said you authored two photo books that are doing well. Why won't you identify them here on an international photo list? You claim to want to make money in photography and we're the perfect captive audience and market. Doesn't make sense Doug.

Robert Hoy Senior Member • Posts: 1,572
skills vs. business ability

Machine Gun Kelly wrote:.

Now, what does that tell you about the market? He has a very nice website with lots of very nice photos. He's capable and has an eye for a photo plus years and years of experience.

The greatest carpenter that does not have the ability to market himself or charge an appropriate amount will go out of business.  Having good skills does not mean you will necessarily be a success in business!  Business education first, then learn a skill!

OP deleted080512 Regular Member • Posts: 205
Re: skills vs. business ability

Since the guy has been around since 1989 and in business since then, I'd imagine he knows his stuff. The problem is - he had a single product (photography) and couldn't diversify in order to cope with the unexpected.

CraigBennett
CraigBennett Contributing Member • Posts: 699
Re: Hunch

Hulamike wrote:

If my hunch is right, he is well known here under no less than 100 aliases. He comes and goes. Stirs things up for awhile then disappears only to come back. His MO in the past matches this guy's sudden appearance. No name, zero previous posts followed by a barrage of posts all designed to stir things up. He's the ultimate troll sometimes hailing from Australia, Canada, USA. He's being pretty well behaved this time but give it awhile. Things will disintegrate.

If I'm hallucinating, I apologize but all the telltales are there. Maybe I need a life.  

You hunch is well founded  New member but in business for 7 years as a photographer?  Works this forum like an old timer.  How many of you know how to break up a quote and insert your comments (in black text)?

Machine Gun Kelly....really, what a handle.  You like machine gunning people down with comment and controversy?  Why do folks hide behind anonymity and yet want people to take their comments serious.

Supposedly written two books, but will not name them.  Can name local photographers that have had homes repo'd, but doesn't specify where local is?  Has lot's of comments on value of website, FB and other social media, but does not share his information.

Has all this equipment, but does not list his gear...oh "kit"?

Give me a break...this guy has started several controversial threads and we keep on biting.  Well, not me, no not me.

Regards,

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OP deleted080512 Regular Member • Posts: 205
Re: Hunch

CraigBennett wrote:

You hunch is well founded  New member but in business for 7 years as a photographer?  Works this forum like an old timer.  How many of you know how to break up a quote and insert your comments (in black text)?

Simple... I saw somebody had done it and tried. It's easy enough.

Machine Gun Kelly....really, what a handle.  You like machine gunning people down with comment and controversy?  Why do folks hide behind anonymity and yet want people to take their comments serious.

I have had internet psychopaths after me in real life. I do not wish to have any confrontations with people who're deranged. The internet attracts deranged people.

Supposedly written two books, but will not name them.  Can name local photographers that have had homes repo'd, but doesn't specify where local is?  Has lot's of comments on value of website, FB and other social media, but does not share his information.

See previous comment

Has all this equipment, but does not list his gear...oh "kit"?

So what? I don't list my stuff because it's irrelevant. Also, if some psychopath works out where I live, I'd rather not have them know what I possess.

Give me a break...this guy has started several controversial threads and we keep on biting.  Well, not me, no not me.

Good. I find your whole attitude to be objectionable and question whether you are in fact one of the people that I stringently seek to avoid.

Regards,

-- hide signature --

Is that signature is actually you or somebody else and you're posing as them? Who knows? Who even cares? This is just an internet forum.

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